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Over the past two days things have taken an ugly turn in the world of Dave Matthews Band and their fans. It began with Tuesday night's show in Rogers, AR. Two things about this show brought the feelings of the so-called "hardcores" of the fan base to a boiling point. One is a lack of diversity in the song selection of sets, particularly in the acoustic set. The other is the return of the Lovely Ladies. Song selection has been an issue that has really become a hot topic over the past few years. What has brought this issue to the forefront is the fact that as the catalog of DMBs songs has grown most fans are expecting wider and more diverse setlists. What has actually happened is that setlists have grown more predictable and repetitive. A fine example of this was the last three weekends of the 2014 summer tour. On successive weekends (Berkeley, The Gorge, and the final show of the tour in Irvine, CA) the encore closer was Shake Me Like a Monkey. Is Shake Me Like a Monkey as bad a song as it has been made out to be? No, absolutely not. However, when it is overplayed to a fan base that is known for going to multiple shows every year, and then when that song closes out three of the biggest weekends of the tour (on three consecutive weekends mind you) it begins to get reviled by the fans. When this band was in its younger years a hardcore fan was commonly asked why they would see the same band so many times. The common answer was always "Because every show is different, you never know what you're going to get." Alas, every show is still different, but that feeling that you never know what you're going to get is gone. The setlists have descended into what almost seems like a set rotation, even though that isn't quite accurate. The acoustic sets have been a particular area that has received a lot of criticism. Last year everyone was excited when they first heard about the acoustic sets. People were genuinely excited to hear songs played differently and get new life. The reality of what occurred over the summer did a great disservice to everyone. The songs that were played acoustically got repetitive because there weren't enough different songs attempted, and the ones that were played were played almost exactly the same as they would be played in the electric set. I expected different arrangements and stripped down versions of the songs, something that would be exciting. If one were given a recording of Tripping Billies from last year it was hard to discern which of the two sets it was from, there was very little difference between the acoustic version and the electric version. Sadly, the band had a real opportunity to do something exciting, and it was squandered to the point where fans were not excited to see the return of the acoustic set. I think a lot of this has to do with either fear or laziness, or possibly both, I am not sure which. This is a band that used to take risks. Today you seem very risk averse. There used to musical pieces and interludes where the band would take the fan on a musical journey and we never know where we would end up. We just enjoyed going along for the ride, and the journey was magical. Think of things like Heartbeat, or Doobie Thing from the old days, or one of the multitude of times where it seemed the band was just jamming before or after a song and something special was happening on stage. Today things rarely exist and if they do they seem much more formulaic and rigid. That free flow of ideas between talented musicians either isn't there, or it is difficult to recognize today. You no longer see the band on stage trying things and taking risks. In the past sometimes those risks worked, and sometimes they didn't, but you always appreciated that they were trying. Even the jams during songs like Two Step and Jimi Thing feel like they are being played the same way over and over again. They used to be a lot less structured and the performances varied a lot. You needed to hear every performance of Two Step because you wanted to know which version was the best, now there is no need to hear every performance of the song because they don't vary all that greatly. What happened to the spontaneity and the musical adventure that used to happen much more frequently when you were at a Dave Matthews Band show? There is a sense that some of the repetitiveness of songs has to do with lack of wanting to put in the work to revisit other material and make it sound good. Stefan condescendingly responded to a tweet by the Twitter account of this website yesterday by saying that he was "Off to run through our total catalog, you know, just in case, I like to be ready." What Stefan fails to grasp is - would it be nice if you could play any song at any time? Sure. That, however, we know is unrealistic. What is realistic though, with your large catalog, is that the band could easily dust off one or two songs a night – every night - that could inject some excitement into these shows. Might it take some practice and some work? Yes, it would, but last I checked Dave Matthews Band is a professional band, practicing the craft is part of the job. This is preferable to trotting out the same songs over and over and over again that the band could likely play in their sleep if they had to. (I'm looking at you Seven, among others.) I think the band challenging itself to play songs like The Dreaming Tree, The Last Stop, or Spoon three or four times a tour would be a worthwhile endeavor for everyone. It will make the band better, and it will please the fans. It will take effort to make that happen, and I am not sure that the band is willing to put in that effort. Stefan, be sure that we are not asking you for the world, indeed we are asking you to throw us a bone from time to time. Is that really too much to ask for? Now to the second part of what brought everything to a boil the other night, the return of the Lovely Ladies. The Ladies have been quite polarizing. No one doubts that they are fantastic singers, they are indeed quite talented. The problem with the Ladies is that they don't particularly fit with the band other than in a few particular spots. They make sense on Stay, I like them on Long Black Veil, but on other songs such as You & Me and Drunken Soldier, they just get in the way. In both of these cases the Ladies parts become filler during musical parts of the song. Their parts get repetitive, don't go anywhere, and get boring. Incessant repeating of "You, me" and "That's not a star that's a satellite" is not adding anything to the songs, it is unnecessary and a big part of the reason why the Lovely Ladies are so reviled. Stefan can say all he wants that the people on his Twitter feed love the Lovely Ladies, but if the Lovely Ladies were so great for this band then why were they not advertised in promotional materials? We know when Bela Fleck is going to show up, we know when Emmylou Harris will be guesting. If the Lovely Ladies are not a problem for this band then why were they not advertised? The reality is that if they were advertised in advance they would have a negative impact on ticket sales, and that is bad news for a band that has had a growing problem selling tickets. Shows no longer sell out like they used to. In fact, it is pretty easy to get tickets to a show these days. Tickets are regularly available for under face value on message boards, and can still be bought straight from the source up until the day of the show in most cases. This is a band that used to sell out multi-night runs in cities all over the country. Now places that are traditional strongholds for this band have been seeing less shows and decreased attendance. One of the earliest centers for this band was the northeast of the United States. This band regularly sold out Veterans Stadium in Philadelphia, Giants Stadium in East Rutherford, NJ, and Foxboro Stadium in Foxborough, MA. Multiple nights in giant stadiums packed to the gills in the northeast were the norm. To see what has become of the northeast for Dave Matthews Band is sad. Until recently Mansfield had two sold out shows; it's now down to a single show. Hartford used to sell out three shows; it is down to one show. Not to mention all the changes throughout New York. How did it come to this? How is it that the biggest stronghold of this band is now barely selling out single amphitheatre shows? This is what has happened by thumbing your nose at your hardcore fan base. The hardcores traveled, went to as many of these shows within their driving distance as they could, and made Dave Matthews Band a priority of their summer. The band has made it so that the hardcores no longer must see as much DMB as they possibly can. The band can continue thumbing their nose at the hardcore set of their fan base, but the numbers don't lie. The current state of DMBs live show fandom is what the result is. Fortunately, I believe there isn't a lot that has to be done to reignite the enthusiasm within the hardcore fan base, and to get us buying tickets again for multiple shows, and traveling. The unfortunate thing is that the ways to fix this are not ways that the band is interested in taking. We get accused of "well if you don't like it don't go" and "why are you still a fan if you hate what they do?" The reality is that many people have either cut back their show attendance either dramatically or completely. The reality is also that many of these people are willing, and clamoring to come back, if they felt like they were getting even a semblance of what they expect out of this band. We are not asking for the band to do anything that you are incapable of. We are not demanding that you cure cancer and solve world peace and play Let You Down all in the same night. What we are demanding are things that we know this band is capable of because you have done it in the past. You set your own high bar with your past performances, it is a shame that you no longer strive to live up to that standard. This band is truly at a crossroads, you can continue down the path you're on, and with the current trajectory regular summer touring and amphitheatre style venues will certainly go by the wayside sooner rather than later, or you can alter course and see how your hardcore fans respond. Make no mistake about it Dave Matthews Band and Stefan, we are not being cranky and negative because we want to be. We are trying to get you to re-realize your greatness. The unfortunate thing, and the thing that you really need to sit down and ask yourselves is, are you looking at things through the prism of reality, or are you looking at things through rose colored glasses? Retweeting people that say you can do nothing wrong, and they'd be happy no matter what you played is not helping your situation. Is it reasonable that there are other sections of the fan base that should be heard too? Of course, that is understandable. Should you ignore your hardcore fan base that has been dwindling of late, because of your lack of doing anything at all to appease them? Do so at your own risk. Ticket sales have floundered for a reason. There are fewer shows in hotbed areas for a reason. Do you care that your band is losing the popularity that is once had, and that is still within reach? Maybe you don't. What happened to that guy that begged Dave to bring back Minarets only to have it spurned for Dream Girl? What happened to the guy that would poll the fans to ask what songs we wanted to hear, only to have most of it disregarded anyway? We know you deep down get it, Stefan. However, surrounding yourself with sycophants, only being interested in the messages that positive people message you, looking only as far as the pit so you only seeing the people in there who are having the time of their lives while you ignore that there are an awful lot of empty seats at the back of the pavilion, and that the lawn is a lot more sparse than it used to be is serving whom? All it is doing is shielding yourself from reality and telling you that everything is just fine while Rome burns around you. Are you willing to look at what's going on and do something about it, or are you going to continue to myopically avoid reality only to look back years from now and wonder why it all fell apart? Make no mistake, Dave Matthews Band is bringing this upon itself, there are ways to fix it and there is still time to change course. I bring these issues to your attention not because I am negative or because I dislike the band, on the contrary, I bring them to your attention because I love this band and want to see you have continued success and be on the level where you can be, and deserve to be.
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May 22, 2015 14:21
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I'm not one to make threads terribly often in DMBc, but for some reason I feel compelled to. I've been, by and large, a for the vast majority of how long I've been a fan of this band. I'll be turning 25 in August, and I bought my first DMB album in 2002. That means that I have listened to and adored this band for longer than I HAVEN'T listened to and adored this band. Today was the day I think that might have pushed a major part of my life over the edge. It's not just about last night's set (which I'll get to in a bit) but about something else that happened today. Faith No More released their first album in 18 years on May 19th, 2015 (Sol Invictus. It's really good. Go buy it. Now. Right now.). The band broke up in 1998, and eventually got back together in 2009. They toured semi-frequently, mixing up setlists (while still playing standards that EVERYONE wants to see if they're seeing FNM) and giving great performances night in and night out. To see a band that far into their work come out with an album that showed how much they truly cared really pointed out to me how lovely it is that DMB seemingly doesn't care that much anymore at all. For DMB, it seems that they're touring and making music because they feel they have to as opposed to wanting to, so they do the things that make them feel better to get through their job...even if it doesn't actually make them better at it. Kind of like only keeping your job because the free food they give you is good. Tonight's set list shows that Dave doesn't have his finger on the pulse of his fanbase at all. Not just the setlist, though. I can accept that every now and again something like that will happen. Just a collection of stuff that didn't really work. But to bring back the Lovely Ladies who nobody wants back is a slap in the face. Dave's not a dumb guy, he has to know that they're musical stylings are not appreciated by the fanbase at large. This is not to say that the LL's aren't talented, they are. They also don't work with this band. Two good things together won't always be good. If DMB doesn't care, why should I? I'll still give it a bit, but I'm at the end of my rope. It's just not fun anymore.
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May 22, 2015 16:19
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The reason for this bands dwindling is Dave Matthews. He's lazy, stubborn, and old. This band was once great bc their energies and passions were 100% focused on their craft and artistry. Now, their attention is far from the band. Dave is so creative in his ladder years that he draws inspiration from child lullabies
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May 22, 2015 16:37
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Y'ever wonder why, every year, critics write articles about how "Saturday Night Live" is dead? Every year (save for a couple of golden years where a great cast sticks around, the writers are sharp and in the zeitgeist, and they invite John Goodman to be chubby and lovable as host), people write about how the show has gone downhill, and it's all over. But, Saturday Night Live does fine every year-- people watch it, and people love it. As of the writing of this, Dave Matthews Band is seven shows into a summer-long tour (which will be followed by a European tour). In those seven shows, Dave and company have: 1) busted out four guests (with Bela Fleck and Emmylou Harris scheduled and publicized for later), 2) introduced two new songs, 3) played fifteen of the top twenty DMB songs (according to AntsMarching.org's 2010 countdown and fan poll), and 4) whipped out some crowd pleasing never-overplayed gems (for my money, Raven, Beach Ball, and Best Of What's Around are always welcome in a setlist). So, why is everyone talking about how it's all downhill for Dave and crew this summer? It's because it's easy. It's easy to talk about how "Saturday Night Live" is ruined because they don't have a Bill Murray or a Dana Carvey anymore. It's easy to talk about how Seth Meyers isn't as funny as Jimmy Fallon, who wasn't as funny as Conan, who wasn't as funny as Letterman as the host of "Late Night." It's easy to talk about how Dave Matthews Band isn't as good as they were in 2008, which wasn't as good as they were in 1997, which wasn't as good as they were in 1994. It's easy to complain about good things when they've had a history of being great. But it's easy because it's lazy and disingenuous and (more often than not) untrue. To borrow a Wilco quote: "Every generation thinks it's the last." We complain because, "Man, it's not as great as it used to be. Everything's going downhill. And these damned kids are always on my lawn!!!" The big complaint of this summer's tour has been setlist diversity (which isn't helped by the presence of three women who are, in fact, quite lovely). Of course, we'd all like (and by "we," I mean nerds, like me, who love the band so much they visit fan sites like this) to see some great rarities and fan favorites. No one would complain if Shotgun was pulled out (which is usually not how people react when shotguns are being pulled out). But, maybe this tour isn't the one for that. It's just like "Saturday Night Live." Some years, the writers love writing "Coneheads" or "Celebrity Jeopardy" or "The Target Lady" every single week. And, some years, the writers throw out all old formulas and try new things. Either way, people complain-- either the show is too repetitive or it's too unfamiliar. Because every generation thinks it's the last. The Lovely Ladies are our Chris Kattan. Some people like him-- but many do not. Either way, the writers at "Saturday Night Live" loved the guy and kept putting him in front of that camera. And critics wrote, as they always do, that "Saturday Night Live" was dead. And then other people said, "Well, if you don't like the show, then stop watching." And then other people said, "I'm just trying to make the show better by giving them suggestions." ...and y'know what happened? "Saturday Night Live" was fine. People watched it, and people loved it. So, even though this website is full of people who love to nitpick and bicker (and why not-- that's part of the joy of being a "hardcore fan"), let's all just take a second to put some perspective to all of this. Dave and company have only played seven shows this tour-- so let's take a breath. The Dave Matthews Band is four of the most talented musicians in the world (with some incredible auxiliary musicians-- including the Lovely Ladies), and they've been entertaining for over 20 years. Everyone reading this loves them. The concerts will still be good, even if you don't think they're great anymore. But, you must trust them. They're "Saturday Night Live." They'll be around, they'll be loved, and they'll be worth seeing every chance you get.
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May 30, 2015 02:32
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I agree the lyrics are atrocious and the derka derka doo doos sound EXACTLY like if SNL tried to parody every Dave Matthews song or something. The Lovely Ladies add nothing, but I don't think they make the song any worse than it is. I also think the song got more of a bad wrap simply BECAUSE the Ladies were on it for its debut. All that being said, musically this song is SO MUCH BETTER than people are giving credit for. I'm not saying it's top tier, or even mid-tier, but it does NOT deserve to be trashed as much as it has (again, MUSICALLY). I think many people jump on the bandwagon here. And they're also afraid to say anything positive in fear of being ridiculed or laughed at. Bad vibes lately... But anyway, the horns are on point, it goes some interesting places (that building part is fun), the guitar riff is pulled straight from ASTB at parts which I personally like. All I'm saying is this song is like the Y2K for the DMB. Everyone's getting out their "The End Is Near" signs but guess what... The band's gonna go on just fine. Just my humble opinion.
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Jun 1, 2015 23:32
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Dmb vs the rest of the music world DMB vs. the rest of the music world Anyone spending the time to read this is more than just an avid fan but a hardcore fan enough to care to read about blogs from it’s own fanatic alike. That being said it’s safe to say that we all love DMB and have in one form or another a certain expectation. However that might’ve changed over the course of our love, intimate and personal kinship with it’s members, the music and the power it has had in our lives. I personally have had the great opportunity to see them in a variety of stages and locations over the decades from their heart of C’Ville to WBP, Alpine, SPAC and the first Caravan in Atlantic City. Though more hardcore fans can consider me still a newbie compared to the 90’s original lovers, I like so many of you have read every review per night, love the live setlist and crave the next climb up the expectation ladder every tour year. Which is why I have arrived at my point for writing this. I am sure many of you have been reading the personal letters from fans placed front and center on the antmarching.org home page and have felt inclined to write in your view as well because deep down we all care at our core that our voice feels a need to be heard whether to agree or conjure another point of view. I liked their songs both studio and live recorded but I became an instant fanatic from my first concert. I get it, I do, that love like a drug that you crave to get the same high you did from that first take. That’s why we all love DMB because for the longest time we felt every year there was this climbing need from the band to one up themselves whether it was harder more intense jams, sick improvs, or just a total blind side Last Stop or the likes of. It was this crazy excitement you got from the moment you packed up the truck or car with your buddies and headed out for the tailgate so many of us have come to love almost as much as the actual night of fun. It was an experience you looked forward to, give you something amazing to look forward to and then look back and reminisce about. But then it was as if we as a fan base hit a wall. Sure there was always criticism but overall we knew we were more than happy to come back and love it all over again. My personal goal was to checklist off as many songs as I could over the years as if it were a bucket list. I had my subtle fears the year before a two setlist concert came that DMB felt they were beginning to grasp at straws both for their own personal love of it all and their losing of how they could please their fans as much as they use to as they went almost too beyond to please. That year they played Halloween two nights in a row, both amazing from a transition and Watchtower to Halloween was epic but to me it was it they were trying so hard to go all out that they were losing sight of what made it so much fun for them. This is all culminating to my title for this piece in that DMB is unlike most any other band that has come before it and still in the game. Dave Matthews as well as the rest of the band are an incredibly talented, creative, and heartfelt group of people. Despite what Dave will say he does give a poo poo about what he plays, how he plays it and the order to the chaos upon which it is played. But he is also human and the current setlists are also describing how he feels about his place in life and the leader of an amazing band that he ingeniously sought out to create and still create with. The man truly loves what he does and it shows even in the acoustic setlists even if everyone else has checked out to ‘stolen away’. This is not the first time the band has been in a critical position. Before LeRoy died he had gone to Dave and said that basically if he doesn’t start leading this band he is going to lose it. LeRoy dying re-ignited Dave and the band and we got some truly emotional moments and music from DMB. But now once again they are in what might seem to most like autopilot and it infuriates us. We can all say a night at DMB is better than any day at work but we all the same know that this band is holding themselves back. Having said that we must, if not painfully so, make a point and fact to how different this band is to the rest of the music world. I recently had the pleasure of seeing the Beatles ‘Love’ at the Mirage in Las Vegas and I must say without a shadow of a doubt it was one of the most moving pieces of theater I have seen. But besides the beautifully choreographed tapestry and storyline infused with their music it was their music that I still keep hearing in my head. It actually was what motivated me to write this. The Beatles are iconic. They’ve motivated our boys as well as the rest of the world and their lyrics and progressions can still be heard subtly and definitively throughout the music world today. But our boys are not the Beatles. Led Zeppelin is one of the most powerful bands to grace this world with music people could not help but not just notice but be moved by. There is not a year that goes by that at least one of their songs is used in a movie or commercial to keep them heard. They have written some of the most diverse and eloquently delivered music and it can still be loved generation after generation. It transcends genres much like the Beatles. Dave loves their music and wishes he could cover them with the same skill they made seem so graceful. But our boys are not Led Zeppelin. There are dozens of other bands with immense talents and have made their mark on the music scene in such astounding ways. Climbed radio charts to No. 1 or like U2 and could literally play only radio played songs for three hours and no one could complain. But that’s not our boys either. Nor is DMB a John Butler Band or on the other spectrum a Coldplay. I know each and every one of us smile every time we hear a DMB song in a reception office even if it’s Mercy because to us we feel our kinship to it yet another part of us hoping it might strike a chord in a non-fan to maybe take their shazam app out and then get interested. Everyone knows who Coldplay is yet DMB has just as loyal fan base but like trekies are made fun of for it. Yes perhaps Coldplay can be our Star Wars reference lol. Yet if you ask any of your friends who John Butler is yet alone one song he’s played more often than not they’ve never heard of him. Heck you can make the point with Damien Rice who is an exceptional artist and lyrist that except for blower’s daughter no everyday person would’ve ever heard his music. This is how I’ve come to this medium and point I want all of you to take away from this or at the very least think about for even a moment and perhaps re-evaulate DMB with. With one last tangent I was raised uniquely and was heavily exposed to Neil Diamond; one of the best writers of both lyrics and music. To me he most closely relates to my love of DMB. He has kept the same band over the decades, reinvents his music, can’t ever stop creating and has a true affinity and love for wanting people to love his music. That being said he has a very specific style all on to his own and reaching outside of it usually doesn’t play out well. We have different expectations with DMB because we truly love them. They aren’t a reunion tour to play the hits or a chart topper to get their nut and enjoy the fame. They love music plain and simple and even if we disagree how they play it we still deep down love them. I hate to have to say this but I know you’d all listen to a bunch of poo poo DMB songs for a concert if Dave died before you got to see him just one more time. It happened with LeRoy so don’t think fate can’t take another close friend. Maybe it’s time we stop expecting them to one up it every tour. They still love playing for you and they show it with the joy in how they play it not which song it is they’re playing. You can’t expect them to be as enthralled with the thrill of it all in their forties like they were in their twenties. Most of us forget coz we want each experience to be so intimate but they have to bring it for every show not just our ticket stub. I’m not saying I wouldn’t love some muster and tenacity to change it up but if they want to feel comfortable to keep playing year to year I’d prefer that than to lose my summer DMB fix altogether. We need to know when as a fan base to pull back the lashings coz we are such a very unique group to love such an equally unique band. Take that into serious consideration the next time you want to throw the next stone at a band you ultimately love.
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Jun 11, 2015 03:59
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| # ¿ Apr 29, 2024 16:11 |
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This might be old news and may even be a debunked internet rumor. But I was tailgating at Holmdel and my friends boss told me that his wifes best friend met Dave at a bar in Boston back in the late 90's (I know I know it's already a he said she said.) So they went back to his hotel room and Dave straight up tells her he wants to take a poo poo on her. Says he has been with so many women that this is what gets him going these days. I laugh so hard at this that I spit my dogfish 90 minute all over some girl next to me. After about 10 minutes of questions that the guy can't answer like "did she let him do it?" the topic gets dropped and we head into the show to watch a 30 minute version of Can't Stop which pissed me off so much I almost couldn't enjoy Cotrtez. The next day I wake up with my standard DMB concert hangover and I remember that story. I decide to do some deep internet digging and actually find a few things that might corroborate the guys story. Obviosuly you can't believe what you read on the internet but it seems as if this is at least a known joke/rumor about Dave. Here are a few things I found: 1) On a "who slept with who" celebrity site - "No spicy stories from myself, but I have a trustworthy friend who hooked up with Dave Matthews in the 90s. He started talking about scat play and she noped on out of there." 2) I’ve actually heard the DM thing before - more than once. (In the business) 3) I went on a date with a girl who said “her friend” gave Dave Matthews a blumpkin back in college. 4) “My cousin slept with him, and said he is super gross” 5)“After a concert with a world famous band…me and my sister got the chance to hang out backstage. Dont know how, but we ended up eating at a restaurant nearby where the singer of the group lit up a joint. We headed back to my parents’ house where I fell asleep while some…activity took place right next to my room. Basically, my [sister] probably hosed the singer while this other random nerdy girl lost her virginity to the fat saxophonist with the dreadlocks. Next morning a condom was ducktaped near the entrance of my building with a note saying something like ” blah blah..who the gently caress did this please dont”. Most importantly…a pair of underpants full of poo poo as well was ejected from my balcony. 6) I can for real almost buy the Dave thing. Back when my high school hormones had a rabid crush on him, I remember reading an interview in which he implied that his tastes were of the super-kink persuasion. Also, I remember a quote was “ I wish I had a nose on the end of my willy,” which skeeved young me out a bit. Anyway, this brings flashbacks of the Chicago River poo poo dumping tour bus incident. If you didn’t have the image in your head of Dave jerking it to the sight of a tour boat full of people covered in 800 pounds of poo poo, you do now. Not even sure why I posted this. It's hysterical to me if it's true but I'm thinking a lot his female fans my be turned off, which is also hysterical to me. I thought back to many interviews I've watched with Dave and he does seem to have a fascination with poo poo. I'm thinking its not true but if it is maybe "belly jelly refers to something else. mjg9578 is offline
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Jun 14, 2015 20:20
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