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I have been to the US once, 20 years ago and I saw Chicago and Washington, which was a lot of fun but at the time I was relying on public transport and I hadn't really planned my trip and I missed out on a lot of things. This time I would like it to go better, so I thought I'd post here and get some advice. I have just booked flights into Vancouver for the end of August and out of San Francisco for the 12th September - 2 weeks. My (me and the wife) plan is to drive down the west coast and stop along the way. This is my first question. I don't want to spend my entire holiday driving, so is the distance too far for a slow paced casual drive in 2 weeks? We have friends in Portland we will stay with but apart from that we don't have a set itinerary. I would like to spend some time in Vancouver, recovering from the flight mainly and then I thought I would get the train to Seattle and rent a car there - It seems a lot cheaper to rent a car in the US than Canada. Any advice on who to rent a car with, I guess I will have to pay more because I will drop it off at a different office to the one I picked it up in. Should I be hiring a Mustang or similar style US car? Is Seattle a place to stay for a few days. I don't particularly enjoy going to a city just to see a city, I prefer it if there is something there worth doing/looking at. We would like to drive along the coast, see Mt Saint Helen's and look at the Redwood tree's. Apart from that I am open to any advice.
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Jun 15, 2015 15:51
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The train station in Vancouver is a short walk from the Skytrain or a cheap cab ride from downtown and you're right that it's going to be cheaper to rent a car in the US. Crossing the border in a car is almost always a pain in the rear end and the lines can easily get upwards of 2 hours on a busy weekend. Taking the train will eliminate that. The drive itself from Seattle to SF should take somewhere around 12-15 hours which should leave plenty of time for sightseeing. You can drive from Seattle to Portland along the I-5 in about 3 hours and then cut west over to the coast and take the 101 South along the Pacific. I've never driven along the coast but I imagine that it's way more scenic than the I-5, but a little less direct. Either way, you should have plenty of time if you spend a day or two each in Vancouver, Seattle, Portland and SF while taking your time driving down the coast. There's lots to see in all of those cities so you won't be bored. If you have to pick one or two things to do in each city, I'd see Stanley Park and Chinatown in Vancouver, Pike Place in Seattle, Beer and Food Trucks in Portland, there's a cool weekend market downtown during the summer that should still be running in September and a chain called McMenamins that buys historic buildings like an old public school or an old farm and converts them into bars. They're pretty cool places to see if you've got friends in town. I've only spent about 5 hours in San Francisco and two of those were stuck in traffic on the bridge so I can't really offer much advice there.
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Jun 17, 2015 18:04
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Two weeks is plenty of time for a great relaxed drive with plenty of exploring. Hell, you can make the Vancouver to Tijuana (Mexico) run in under 24hrs of hard driving, so making it to the Bay Area in two weeks will be easy and chill. I'm not totally clear on what you're into (so walking around cities and just exploring isn't your thing?). Are you into foodie and drink stuff, being out in nature, historical sights, going to music events and festivals, public art or museums? If you describe broadly the kind of things you like to do on trips that'd help. And also if you prefer trips where you spend more time in just a few places, or like being in a different place every day or two. There are a number of smaller cities on your way that have points of interest. And in that season there might likely be music/art/drama festivals you can drop into. One option that jumps out at me: "the Islands". Puget Sound is full of small islands with some beautiful scenery and cute small towns. You can take ferryboat from downtown Seattle out to any number of islands, either on foot or with your car, and explore there. Similarly, out on the Olypic Peninsula, the sticking-out bit on the far west of Washington, there are some gorgeous rainforests to either hike in, or even just drive around in. If it happens to be your thing, note that marijuana is now completely legal in Washington, so if you like you can swing by a fancy shop full of all kinds of cannabis, and pick up some brownies or whatever to take back to the hotel and enjoy. You can't consume it in public (officially, often ignored in some neighborhoods) but private property is fine.
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Jun 18, 2015 11:08
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Thanks for the tips. History and scenery are really our thing but food (particularly sea food) is also a big interest, I live in the middle of Europe a long way from the sea. I would prefer not to be driving every day, so staying in places for 2 days or more is the ideal, although part of the fun will be the drive as well of course. I was looking at Crater Lake and wondering if we should make the detour inland or if it would be better to stick to the coast and just potter along stopping at some of the coastal towns. Any advice on places to overnight along the coast? Would it be better to carry on past San Francisco to Los Angeles, we didn't consider that at first because it looked like it would be too far to travel in 2 weeks but I get the feeling from the advice so far that 2 weeks is more than enough. The Olympic Peninsula, Victoria and Puget sound look great and have been added as places to see. Also food markets/any markets would also be good so thanks for those recommendations. I like seeing things that are more normal life in the US but perhaps aren't so common in other countries. I also dug out an article about road side attractions some of which seem just plain weird http://www.theguardian.com/travel/2013/may/25/top-10-portland-san-francisco-roadside-attractions The Oregan Vortex has piqued my interest and I had no idea the Spruce Goose was in Portland. I have also been told that a wine tour either around San Francisco or around Portland is a good idea, any recommendations there? PlantHead fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Jun 18, 2015 |
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Jun 18, 2015 14:35
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PlantHead posted:Would it be better to carry on past San Francisco to Los Angeles, we didn't consider that at first because it looked like it would be too far to travel in 2 weeks but I get the feeling from the advice so far that 2 weeks is more than enough. I'd take extra time in San Francisco over losing a day driving to L.A. personally. 4 cities and whatever miscellaneous stops in 2 weeks is a pretty action packed trip. I understand wanting to pack in as much as possible when you travel halfway across the world, I did the same thing on my last big trip but by the last few days, I was so burnt out that I really didn't care about what I was seeing and doing. Unless there's something that you really want to see or do in Los Angeles I wouldn't bother. You'll probably be sick of being in the car by the end of the trip and driving in California isn't the most relaxing thing in the world.
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Jun 18, 2015 20:13
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2 weeks is by no means a leisurely pace to go from Vancouver to SF. It's not too far to drive literally, but I agree that unless there's some reason you really want to go to LA, it'd be better to spend that time elsewhere.
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Jun 18, 2015 21:05
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Concur that LA would be way too much. It adds an extra 7 hours or so of drive-time... and then you get to deal with the horror of driving around the huge, hot, crowded sprawl that is LA. That won't be enjoyable to close out a long trip in the more relaxed areas of the Northwest. LA also has a zillion things to do and see, just at a point where you'll likely be getting burned out on touring. Time aside, I would submit that LA also wouldn't fit the overall "theme" of your trip. To draw a parallel, it'd be like spending 10 days touring through Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia... and then spending the last two days of your trip in Rome. It just culturally and environmentally is a sudden huge step away from what you've been seeing, right when you're trying to wind down. If you're doing any pre-trip reading to get into the spirit, I would strongly suggest reading up a little on "Cascadia". Cascadia is an unofficial "nation" of areas that are culturally and geographically related; it's kind of an inside joke to call it a separate country, but people are just a little bit serious about the idea. The smallest "borders" of Cascadia definitely include the western parts of British Columbia, Washington, and Oregon. At its largest extent it includes southern Alaska, the inland portions of said states, and varying amounts of Northern California with San Francisco being the absolutely furthest possible southern boundary arguable. The seminal novel that gave a name to this is the 1975 book Ecotopia, so would be a great read before you go. It basically takes all the hippie, environmental, progressive, tech culture stuff that was nascent in the region then and extrapolates it forward into a future imperfect-utopia. Just if you're interested in the abstract context of the region. Just off the top of my head, here's just one potential itinerary: * Day 1-2: arrive in and explore Vancouver; I haven't been in forever so have no advice, but it's an extremely international/cosmopolitan city * Day 3: drive south, spend the early afternoon in Victoria, then island-hop southeast through the San Juan and/or Orcas Islands, arrive in Seattle at night. * Day 4-5: Chill in Seattle, beautiful city. Suggested highlights: -- Pike Place market, famous covered marketplace, lots of fun snacks and right in the middle of downtown -- About 20m drive to Fremont, a small artsy neighborhood where there are tons of strange pieces of public art, including a Soviet surplus statue of Lenin (for artistic, not political reasons) and a enormous 5-meter statue of a troll emerging from under a bridge and crushing a Volkswagen in his hand. Not far from Fremont is Gasworks Park, beautiful waterside place to hang out and walk, maybe picnic -- The "Underground Seattle" tour is a popular tourist thing, kinda officially urbexing a whole layer of the city that was built over and abandoned. -- Depending on what's going on, it could be a fun Americana thing to take in a baseball game, either a minor-league one (there are several teams in the area), or go to the impressive Safeco field to see the Mariners play. Also right downtown. For the love of god don't drive to it, leave your car somewhere else and take a bus down. -- Lots of food things to do in Seattle! If you want a quick casual but local culture meal, Dick's Drive In is a famous burger joint, Seattle's equivalent of what In-N-Out is in California or Five Guys is in the Mid-Atlantic. Ivar's is another local chain that does clam chowder, fried clams, fried fish, etc. (if you go to Safeco Field, you can get chowder at their stand there for your meal at the game). The huge seafood thing is Seattle is salmon; not sure which of many places is best for that. * Day 6: get up early and drive south, get lunch in the state capital of Olympia, then go tour around Mt St Helens, get to Portland at night. * Day 7-8: chill in Portland. Suggested highlights: -- Food stuff: are you into beer or just wine? Note that in the Pacific Northwest especially, beer isn't just basic mass-produced pilsner crap, it's this huge serious artform, about as serious as wine is. If you're not adamantly way more into wine than beer, I'd consider a beer tour vice a wine tour (though of course you can do both). Also get lunch downtown at any of the several huge squares full of food trucks, very Portland thing and huge variety, tons of people milling around. -- Right close to the food truck areas is Powell's Books, the largest used book store on Earth. If you like books, drop in for at least a few minutes to marvel. -- Check around for local live music of whatever genre you're into -- If you're that kind of nerd, Ground Kontrol is a pub which is packed with new and vintage video and pinball games. -- Almost too cliche, but still fun, is Voodoo Doughnut. Famous local chain which became internationally famous, but they have some fun stuff like a donut with maple frosting and bacon. -- If you want something very American, Oregon has a number of shooting ranges where you can rent fully-automatic firearms. Google says there's one in Hillsboro, 30m from downtown Portland. It won't be a big serious shooting experience since you'll run out of ammo in literally minutes, but you can pay to pick out a machine gun and buy ammo, and then a staffer will walk you down to the firing line and supervise you while you blow through 20 rounds in a second. So a little silly, but could be a fun novelty if you want to be able to tell your friends that you shot a Tommy-gun in America. * Day 9: get up really early so that you can loop inland and see Crater Lake, and still get to the Oregon Vortex before it closes at 5pm. Drive another 3 hours down to the coast, maybe Crescent City, California, or thereabouts. * Day 10: from Crescent City you can drive through all kinds of Redwoods in various parks, down the famous Pacific Coast Highway, etc. It's 9 hours of straight driving from there to SF, plus whatever time you spend outside the car wandering around. So probably another good day to get going right as daylight starts to see all the nature stuff. Mendocino might be a good mid-point for a late lunch, supposed to be a really cute little coastal town. Get to SF late in the evening, turn in your car because driving and especially parking in SF sucks goat balls. * Day 11-12: dick around in San Francisco. A zillion things to do and I'm not the expert on that city, but it's drat gorgeous and culturally fascinating. Seafood, wine and cocktails, probably the most authentic Chinese food outside of China (SF is 21% ethnic Chinese with the nation's largest Chinatown), some very traditional Mexican food (iirc especially Sinaloan style, totally different from what Europeans think Mexican food is), great sushi, the (historically) hippie meccas of Haight-Ashbury and Berkeley, etc. If you're into literature, City Lights books is a famous store/publisher, and they have tons of tiny (but durable) paperbacks of poets they publish that are great mementos/gifts. If your trip is two weeks, that gives you a couple extra days to insert anywhere for whatever kind of intense excursions, and/or extra day in any given city. Off the top of my head, I'd suggest: - A horseback excursion in any of the big national/state parks (St Helens, Mendocino, Redwood, etc) - a kayak trip either in Puget Sound or on the Pacific Ocean - a wine tour (California, Napa Valley is legendary and just north of SF) or beer tour (Oregon, Willamette Valley is famous for growing hops for the best American microbrews, but also has wine tours, maybe combine?) - surfing lessons on the NorCal coast That's pretty much just off the top of my head with me sitting on the patio at a coffeeshop in Portugal using their wi-fi to refresh my memory on Google, so by no means authoritative. EDIT: as a broad note, Cascadia has a very moderate climate, so expect 15-20C during the time of year you're traveling, and be prepared for frequent rain. Though note that rain in the region tends to be a slow, light rain, not a downpour, so if you're mentally prepared for it even hiking in that kind of rain isn't bad. Anecdotally, I was back in Seattle for the first time in years and got "caught" out in the rain, and then realized that even after two hours of walking in constant rain my hair was only slightly damp and my clothes under a light jacket completely dry. When I moved out of Seattle as a young guy, I was shocked that I suddenly needed an umbrella elsewhere, since for literally five years in Seattle I literally never owned an umbrella, just wore a jacket and maybe a hood if it was raining and that was enough. So I would strongly suggest bringing a light and semi-water-resistant hooded jacket for those days. And note that despite being the furthest southern point of your trip, SF is one of the coldest place you'll be, more like 15C, because of weird stuff about the ocean and winds and all that. TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Jun 19, 2015 |
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Jun 19, 2015 00:00
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Thanks very much for the help - great stuff. Good, Los Angeles is off the list. I will save that for another time and combine it with Las Vegas. I would like to watch some live sport. I went to a baseball match in Toronto years ago and was underwhelmed. Was that just a bad game or should I look at watching some other sport - baseball or American football?, I know next to nothing about either but generally I pretty much like watching any sport live. We also drink beer. Although and this is clearly my ignorance speaking but American beer has a fairly awful reputation. I remember going to a craft beer festival in Washington (admitedly 20 years ago) and being handed a beer and told that if I didn't like that beer I would never like any American beers. Needless to say it made Budweiser look like a full flavoured nector of the gods. Our friend in Portland does brew beer though and has promised/threatened to take me on a tour - I look forward to having my opinions changed. Thanks for the weather advice and parking. I was planning on dropping the car off before going into SF, I have heard the traffic can be terrible. Also me and horses don't get on, I have been thrown off 3 and broken my arm once. Unfortunately my wife loves horse back riding, so it looks like I am destined to risk my life again as she has taken your advice and is researching horseback trips.
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Jun 24, 2015 12:31
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PlantHead posted:Thanks very much for the help - great stuff. Baseball in general is a pretty bad sport to watch live unless you actually care about the teams or players, but you're there at the right time of year. If you've already done it once and didn't like it, I wouldn't recommend it again. You're just a little bit too early for the football season, but maybe there will be preseason games somewhere? Basketball you're pretty far off season so there won't be anything. Maybe there will be MLS soccer games? I have no idea what their season is at all. I get bored out of my mind watching baseball live, but enjoy going to football and basketball games quite a bit even though I haven't followed any sports or teams since I graduated college. American beer is fantastic, I don't know what you've heard but it's wrong or very outdated if your last news was 20 years ago. There are literally thousands of microbreweries that have sprung up in the last 10-15 years, so there's a lot more now than Sam Adams, Sierra Nevada, and lovely Budweiser-style lagers. For me, only the Belgians are holding their own against American brewers. Saladman fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Jun 24, 2015 |
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Jun 24, 2015 13:18
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For sports, baseball is the big thing that time of year. I used to not be at all into watching baseball, but I tried it out again a Minor League game down in Savannah a couple months back, and actually enjoyed it, even though I don't know anything about AAA teams and their rivalries. Part of it was just accepting that it's a slow and relaxed game, having a couple beers, hanging out with a friend. It's a deliberate game with bursts of action, and it doesn't take much at all to learn the basics of the rules. So you could either give that a shot with the aim of it being a slow relaxing night, or conclude that the Toronto game was a good sampling and you're not into it. For other sports of that season, Minor League Soccer is on, though not sure when the Sounders are playing game in town. You're a few weeks too late for hydroplane boating since Seafar ends at the start of July. Hockey starts later. Of games, and American experiences, that are seasonal in July-August. - Car racing at the Skagit Speedway, Evergreen Speedway, etc. I think there may be some motorcycle events as well - There are a number of rodeos of various sizes in the area, including possibly some during the time you're there, if you want to see people riding on bucking broncos, roping cattle, and all that Yeah, American beer has changed a ton in the last 20 years, it's a pretty huge and varied industry. There's still plenty of American generic pisswater swill to be had, but especially in the Northwest all but the lowest-class of bars are going to have some decent beers, and there will be plenty of places that are extremely serious about good beer. Your Portland buddy can no doubt take you to some places where you can sample a wide variety. I'm fond of "tasting flights" where you get six or so small glasses to try out, and that's getting more common. It's a long story, but it's not that Americans are inherently bad at beer, but that a lot of mid-century hyper-capitalism resulted in a handful of huge companies buying up all the smaller breweries and making the cheapest generic product possible, and it wasn't until the 1990s or so that finally smaller brewers started to gain a lot of attention. Toronto and San Francisco are easy to get around in without a car, but the Seattle area is still American-enough of a city that a car is pretty helpful anywhere outside of downtown, and there are enough things to see in the larger area that a car is handy. We probably have some other (and much more recent) Seattle goons in the thread who can recommend areas of town to look at getting an AirBnB in, somewhere in a cool neighborhood where you can still find parking but can get to the streetcar for when you go to downtown, etc. If you're not thrilled about horses, you could always try to sell the wife on a kayak trip instead...
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Jun 24, 2015 20:39
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TapTheForwardAssist posted:Yeah, American beer has changed a ton in the last 20 years, it's a pretty huge and varied industry. There's still plenty of American generic pisswater swill to be had, but especially in the Northwest all but the lowest-class of bars are going to have some decent beers, and there will be plenty of places that are extremely serious about good beer. Your Portland buddy can no doubt take you to some places where you can sample a wide variety. I'm fond of "tasting flights" where you get six or so small glasses to try out, and that's getting more common. It's a long story, but it's not that Americans are inherently bad at beer, but that a lot of mid-century hyper-capitalism resulted in a handful of huge companies buying up all the smaller breweries and making the cheapest generic product possible, and it wasn't until the 1990s or so that finally smaller brewers started to gain a lot of attention.  American beer is in it's golden age right now--at least on the West Coast. The cheapest swillpiss that people drink is PBR or the ocassional redneck pulling a 64 pack of keystone on a raft down the river, and even very rarely. Although if only the drat IPA trend would die off 
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Jun 25, 2015 02:47
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Just remembered one chill and fun option in SF. Check out what they have right in the middle of the city at Golden Gate Park. Full archery range, free to use, and there's a bow shop a short walk away that'll rent you the gear to walk down there and shoot. Been a few times with friends, and it's a great way to enjoy the park, and doesn't eat up much of your day.
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Jul 1, 2015 00:11
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If you like beer, here's 5 NorCal spots that you can try, in order of importance: 1. Russian River Brewery - Santa Rosa (this is a must, they make Pliny the Elder which is on every single list of the top beers in America) 2. 21st Amendment - San Francisco 3. North Coast - Fort Bragg 4. Mendocino Brewing Co. - Ukiah 5. Anderson Valley Brewing - Boonville (there are many excellent wineries in this area as well, with complimentary tastings unlike Napa) #s 1 and 2 are on your route and places you should definitely stop. #s 3,4, and 5 may or may not be on your route depending on where you're going. I wouldn't make a detour for any of them, but if you end up in those towns they are excellent options for food and drink. And consider a San Francisco Giants game; they're playing at home from September 11-13. The ballpark is much, much more charming than the one in Toronto and the team is better too! 
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Jul 1, 2015 21:41
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Just chiming in to note that of those 3 cities, I would make sure to spend more time in Portland. You will be glad you did!
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Jul 14, 2015 03:01
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If you're into scenery I'd do a day trip from Vancouver up to Squamish/Whistler. It would be done most easily with your own car (but can be done by bus), but the scenery is phenomenal in the Sea to Sky. For Vancouver, if you had 3 days, this is how I'd do it: Day 1: wander around Stanley Park, drink some craft beer and eat good food Day 2: rent a car in the morning, drive up to Whistler (it's about 90 minutes from Vancouver), go up the mountain go back to Vancouver, drop the car off that night. Day 3: Buy picnic food, go up to the top of grouse mountain for sweet views of the city, have your picnic up there, then either take the ferry to Victoria or drive down to Seattle that evening.
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Jul 14, 2015 03:19
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Definitely check back in with the thread after you finish your trip, let us know how it worked out for you. It's a really cool region of the US/Canada that's not as commonly visited by Europeans as Southern California or the East Coast is, and it's a beautiful part of the world.
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Jul 16, 2015 13:14
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Just had a quick question about hotels. We have booked our first night and last night accommodation and then everything else we will just turn up and find a room - hotels in the US are a lot more expensive than I am used to or imagined. Are there certain types of hotels we should avoid. I guess I am asking if motels are generally ok places to spend the night - my view of them is pretty heavily influenced by Hollywood where they all seem to be seedy.
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Jul 16, 2015 13:47
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You won't be murdered by a crackhead if that's what you're wondering. Most of the motels along the highway may not be luxurious, but they're perfectly safe, clean places to sleep. As long as you're not looking for the cheapest hotels in the sketchiest parts of town and wandering around like a yokel you'll be fine. I don't like winging it with hotel reservations when I travel. Every morning you may at least want to look up a few hotels near where you plan to end your day and call ahead to make sure that they have vacancies. Driving around the middle of nowhere late at night looking for a place to sleep would suck.
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Jul 16, 2015 18:40
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Have you checked out AirBnB for those cities as well? Anywhere you're staying multiple nights that might turn up more affordable options. Especially since you have a car and driving 30 minutes away from downtown to a cheaper neighborhood isn't a big deal. Just looked at AirBnB for Seattle, and there are tons of listings for a private room in someone's home for like $60-90 per night, in nice family neighborhoods, and some of them are hip/artsy places. That might be way better than a hotel. I've had really good experiences with AirBnB in Colombia and Portugal, I'm a fan. The word "motel" isn't any big red flag; slightly sketchier in big cities, but in rural areas along the highway motels are generally pretty normal, especially in the part of the country you're in. I would definitely book your lodgings in the cities in advance, and bear in mind that San Francisco is simply an expensive city for housing, but for the legs between Portland and SF, personally I'd suggest keeping that more flexible so that if you end up really enjoying some area you can stay there longer and not have to rush because your hotel is three hours further south. That area gets enough tourists that there should be a good amount of lodging, but since you're late in the season it's less likely everything will be full. TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 01:51 on Jul 17, 2015 |
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Jul 17, 2015 01:47
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PlantHead posted:Just had a quick question about hotels. September 5-7 is Labor Day weekend, which is a big travel holiday and a reason why any hotel/motel rates you're looking at are sky high for that weekend. However, the rates for the days after that weekend should be super low since everyone is done with their summer vacations. If it were me, I'd try and stay in some cheap motels over the weekend and then stay somewhere nicer during the week. There are a ton of bed and breakfasts and inns all along the NorCal and Oregon coast, just look at TripAdvisor
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Jul 17, 2015 17:24
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Just recalled another drinking option: in the last few years Seattle has gotten big into craft cider, which makes sense since the state is famous for apples. I've been to Capitol Cider on Capitol Hill, but it has good reviews for cider but meh reviews for food. There's a newer one I haven't been to in Fremont (the artsy neighborhood with all the sculptures) that has 30 kinds of cider on tap. So if you and the wife like fermented apple juice, worth checking out: http://www.yelp.com/biz/schilling-cider-house-seattle
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Jul 24, 2015 09:38
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PlantHead posted:Good, Los Angeles is off the list. I will save that for another time and combine it with Las Vegas. edit: also lol @ someone from Zurich saying that anything in America is expensive. Cicero fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Jul 24, 2015 |
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Jul 24, 2015 19:24
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