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Code Jockey
Jan 24, 2006

69420 basic bytes free

Why in the gently caress don't you get detained for this, considering how retarded this country is for border security you'd think some idiot refusing to answer questions would be grounds for it

the taser video was funny as gently caress and always will be, this video is just annoying and makes me really sympathetic with the border cops that had to deal with that


e. yeah yeah I'm guessing the answer is basically what the idiot(s) in the video were saying, hurghhh duhhh constitution and MY RIGHTS

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Onkel Hedwig
Jun 27, 2007


Sovcits make me feel like we life in a cyber punk future. Not because of technology ("it's uploaded to the cloud, you know?"), but because there's a group of people with a very alien mindset that's radically opposed to the government.

There's a bunch of people like that in Germany too, but it is mostly disgruntled older people. America really has the best sovcits.

BrutalistMcDonalds
Oct 4, 2012


Lipstick Apathy

Code Jockey posted:

Why in the gently caress don't you get detained for this, considering how retarded this country is for border security you'd think some idiot refusing to answer questions would be grounds for it

the taser video was funny as gently caress and always will be, this video is just annoying and makes me really sympathetic with the border cops that had to deal with that


e. yeah yeah I'm guessing the answer is basically what the idiot(s) in the video were saying, hurghhh duhhh constitution and MY RIGHTS
it's a funny quirk. those are interior checkpoints not *at* the border but like a 50 miles inland, mostly in the southwest along the highways leading north.

they're border checkpoints but also not really

Bag
Oct 17, 2004

Onkel Hedwig posted:

There's a bunch of people like that in Germany too, but it is mostly disgruntled older people. America really has the best sovcits.

I'm a barrister in Hong Kong. There's a service performed by the office of the Duty Lawyer called the Free Legal Advice Scheme (as distinct from regular Duty Lawyer hours, which you get paid for).

Basically you sit in a little office in Wan Chai where the poorest and most vulnerable come to you for what rapid advice you can give. You'll handle about 20 cases in an evening. The cases run the gamut... often it's family or probate matters... sometimes it's something more serious in which case the best (only) advice you can give is to report the matter to the police.

Two weeks ago a Canadian client came in. He'd been arrested for careless driving. After an hour of rambling - along the same lines of what I've seen now in these videos - he left disappointed that I wasn't able to get the police to magically drop the charges. His parting words were "I'll just represent myself then!".

Buddy, best of luck. That said, you took up an hour of my time complaining about trivial bullshit. That's fine, as a barrister most of the time you're dealing with trivial bullshit. What's still pissing me off today is that most people wait up to a month to get an appointment for free legal advice, and ten people were turned away so you could go on your stupid spiel about sovereign rights.

gently caress you, and please try the same poo poo on the magistrate.

BigBadSteve
Apr 29, 2009

Crazyeyes posted:

I love sovereign citizen threads. That said listening to man-children scream as they are tased/beaten/arrested makes me very uncomfortable.

Keep clicking the youtube links itt, your discomfort will become laughter.

ColoradoCleric
Dec 26, 2012

by FactsAreUseless
Just found a great repository for this poo poo: https://www.reddit.com/r/Sovereigncitizen/

glowstick party tonight
Oct 4, 2003

by zen death robot
One of the most self-incriminating things you can do is plead the fifth at the wrong time

Cop: What's your name?

Retard: I PLEAD THE FIFTH

Cop: Uh...

Young Freud
Nov 26, 2006

Onkel Hedwig posted:

There's a bunch of people like that in Germany too, but it is mostly disgruntled older people. America really has the best sovcits.

Are you talking about autonoms? I remember that they were huge during the '80s. They were pretty much anti-authoritarian Marxists who squatted whole blocks, pretty much invented the term "Black Bloc" and took over a couple neighborhoods in Berlin after throwing out the police. I can see why they're disgruntled now, because Kreuzberg has become somewhat gentrified.

Top Hats Monthly
Jun 22, 2011


People are people so why should it be, that you and I should get along so awfully blink blink recall STOP IT YOU POSH LITTLE SHIT
Didn't a sovereign citizen end up shooting a few police officers a few years ago?

Antifreeze Head
Jun 6, 2005

It begins
Pillbug

Top Hats Monthly posted:

Didn't a sovereign citizen end up shooting a few police officers a few years ago?

Yeah. I know a police officer and he hates the freemen on the land/sovereign citizens because there are a few of them that are willing to go that extra step and really stake a claim at sovereignty like they were a nation.

You'd think some might have at least reached out to someone to acknowledge their statehood. Have the Iranian embassy in located in what you and I might just call the basement of some dude's house.

I guess most of them are aware that a real uprising like that has the potential to involve the military, and when your entire standing army is you, maybe you don't want to poke the bear quite so directly.

Or maybe just nobody has told them yet and we can soon look forward to YouTube videos of soldiers "brushing aside" someone that calls himself the King of this 40 Acres.

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

Antifreeze Head posted:

Yeah. I know a police officer and he hates the freemen on the land/sovereign citizens because there are a few of them that are willing to go that extra step and really stake a claim at sovereignty like they were a nation.

thats the critical point where sovereign citizen logic fails. you can not escape laws, you ether follow the laws of society, or the law of the jungle comes into effect.

i hope you have the biggest claws

Ahundredbux
Oct 25, 2007

The right to bear arms
waht is a sovereign citizen

like what is .. a sovereign citizen i dont understand ar ethey just people who wanna be ab ove the law?

CJacobs
Apr 17, 2011

Reach for the moon!

Ahundredbux posted:

waht is a sovereign citizen

like what is .. a sovereign citizen i dont understand ar ethey just people who wanna be ab ove the law?

Yes. And they also think the law is wrong and harms and fools the citizens by *mumble mumble mumble*

Ahundredbux
Oct 25, 2007

The right to bear arms
and they consider lawlessness to not be criminal but immunity to the law of the country they are in even though they have nothing to enforce their claims with or what

Ahundredbux
Oct 25, 2007

The right to bear arms
i mean it feels like a total lack of understanding of how a society works soemthing I learned as a child ??

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG
Basically if there is something you want and what you want is illegal, if you say the magic words "I DO NOT CONSENT" or "THAT FLAG HAS A GOLD FRINGE" then you can have what you want anyway, whether the thing you want is to avoid paying for a fishing license or vehicle registration or to drive while high or to steal someone else's house.

e: "Debt elimination" schemes and Accepted for Value are closely related and are also hilarious and fun to read about :

http://www.getoutofdebtfree.org/A4V

Dirt McGuirk
Oct 21, 2010

brave

&

strong

quote:

i have reason to believe that crime is afoot

:laffo:

i want that cop in my neighborhood

Darkhold
Feb 19, 2011

No Heart❤️
No Soul👻
No Service🙅

Ahundredbux posted:

waht is a sovereign citizen

like what is .. a sovereign citizen i dont understand ar ethey just people who wanna be ab ove the law?
If you want a more in-depth explanation they're people that believe (and there's slightly different flavors of it) that there's two sets of laws. Common law which is basically 'don't steal, don't murder' and commerce law which is every other goddamn thing under the sun. The entire government is bent on tricking you into accepting commerce law so they can enforce laws upon you. So Sovereigns do everything they can to separate the 'flesh' them from the 'corporation' them so they can do whatever the gently caress they want short of murder.

As I said the details and flavors vary from group to group but that's usually the bedrock.

Tupperwarez
Apr 4, 2004

"phphphphphphpht"? this is what you're going with?

you sure?
A lot of sovereign citizens sound like cargo-cult lawyers to me.

It's like, normal people realize that lawyers do their jobs by being familiar with technicalities, legal precedence, and being skilled at arguing/debating. But sovereign citizens, for whatever reason (poor education, wishful thinking, mental illness, etc.), think that lawyers use what amounts to ritual magic to bend the law to their will. So all of this poo poo like not consenting, or pointing out the gold fringe on a flag, is their way of aping that 'lawyer magic'.

Is that a thing in sovereign citizen circles? Treating the law as something that can only be mastered through secret knowledge? I wouldn't be surprised if they have elaborate theories about how law was invented by the Illuminati or some horseshit like that.

ashgromnies
Jun 19, 2004

Hobologist posted:

Basically. If minorities have trouble with the police they should try being more white.

But not like sovereign citizens. They're too white.

there are a lot of black sovs/freemen actually

Darkhold
Feb 19, 2011

No Heart❤️
No Soul👻
No Service🙅

Tupperwarez posted:

Is that a thing in sovereign citizen circles? Treating the law as something that can only be mastered through secret knowledge? I wouldn't be surprised if they have elaborate theories about how law was invented by the Illuminati or some horseshit like that.
As my post stated they believe that the government is hiding the big secret that you're not your corporate self and since you pretty much hosed up by being born and acting in society at all you have to learn a series of tricks to pull yourself out of the fire. It's also why all the endless failures roll off their backs because obviously that person made a mistake somewhere down the line and that's why the ritual failed.

It's kinda cargo cult in that a bunch of schizophrenics wrote rambling interpretations of the law and a bunch of con men took those ramblings and re-wrote it to make it tolerable enough for dissatisfied and mystified people take it as the truth because it's just arcane enough and promises just enough to be tempting.

Ahundredbux
Oct 25, 2007

The right to bear arms

Tupperwarez posted:

A lot of sovereign citizens sound like cargo-cult lawyers to me.

It's like, normal people realize that lawyers do their jobs by being familiar with technicalities, legal precedence, and being skilled at arguing/debating. But sovereign citizens, for whatever reason (poor education, wishful thinking, mental illness, etc.), think that lawyers use what amounts to ritual magic to bend the law to their will. So all of this poo poo like not consenting, or pointing out the gold fringe on a flag, is their way of aping that 'lawyer magic'.

Is that a thing in sovereign citizen circles? Treating the law as something that can only be mastered through secret knowledge? I wouldn't be surprised if they have elaborate theories about how law was invented by the Illuminati or some horseshit like that.

one thing I know for sure about lawyers is that they make up their own laws and rarely utilize precedence so thats what im gonna do to when those dump coppers try to bust me !!

ColoradoCleric
Dec 26, 2012

by FactsAreUseless
Where do their ideas that they can squat on other peoples property and take it over or charge people money for frivolous things come from?

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

ColoradoCleric posted:

Where do their ideas that they can squat on other peoples property and take it over or charge people money for frivolous things come from?

squatters rights is an actual thing. If you pay property tax for long enough without the owner evicting you the property becomes yours. This happens a lot in CA, especially with foreclosed homes

WAR CRIME GIGOLO fucked around with this message at 20:54 on Jul 18, 2015

Darkhold
Feb 19, 2011

No Heart❤️
No Soul👻
No Service🙅

ColoradoCleric posted:

Where do their ideas that they can squat on other peoples property and take it over or charge people money for frivolous things come from?
By separating their corporate self from their flesh and blood self. Flesh and blood me just happens to be living here. Go bug the corporate me for payment. Oh and corporate me is owed some money by the government because they took out a savings bond on my life when I was 'berthed' so you can collect against that.

Edit: LeoMarr please don't confuse actual law with what these people think they're doing. They sure aren't going to be paying property tax.

Darkhold fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jul 18, 2015

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

Darkhold posted:

By separating their corporate self from their flesh and blood self. Flesh and blood me just happens to be living here. Go bug the corporate me for payment. Oh and corporate me is owed some money by the government because they took out a savings bond on my life when I was 'berthed' so you can collect against that.

Edit: LeoMarr please don't confuse actual law with what these people think they're doing.

he asked where the squatters thing comes from, of course those squatters dont actually pay property tax and just think sitting there will gain ownership like its King of the Hill in Halo 3.

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

ColoradoCleric posted:

Where do their ideas that they can squat on other peoples property and take it over or charge people money for frivolous things come from?

200 years of the federal government doing just that

Darkhold
Feb 19, 2011

No Heart❤️
No Soul👻
No Service🙅

LeoMarr posted:

he asked where the squatters thing comes from, of course those squatters dont actually pay property tax and just think sitting there will gain ownership like its King of the Hill in Halo 3.
Yeah but they don't think they're gaining squatters rights in the slightest. They think they've tricked the system into offloading all their debts to a fictional creature while they get to keep the assets. They didn't read squatters rights and go off on a tangent they just made up 'free money from the government' and use that to pay for things.

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

Darkhold posted:

Yeah but they don't think they're gaining squatters rights in the slightest. They think they've tricked the system into offloading all their debts to a fictional creature while they get to keep the assets. They didn't read squatters rights and go off on a tangent they just made up 'free money from the government' and use that to pay for things.

lmfao

goatse.cx haver
Oct 17, 2010

precious metals

DeusExMachinima posted:

but we're not living in a third world country duder.

lol

Young Freud
Nov 26, 2006

Tupperwarez posted:

A lot of sovereign citizens sound like cargo-cult lawyers to me.

It's like, normal people realize that lawyers do their jobs by being familiar with technicalities, legal precedence, and being skilled at arguing/debating. But sovereign citizens, for whatever reason (poor education, wishful thinking, mental illness, etc.), think that lawyers use what amounts to ritual magic to bend the law to their will. So all of this poo poo like not consenting, or pointing out the gold fringe on a flag, is their way of aping that 'lawyer magic'.

Is that a thing in sovereign citizen circles? Treating the law as something that can only be mastered through secret knowledge? I wouldn't be surprised if they have elaborate theories about how law was invented by the Illuminati or some horseshit like that.

It really is. If you hear them talk about lawyers, usually derisively, they view them as if they were some sort of nobility.

Darkhold posted:

By separating their corporate self from their flesh and blood self. Flesh and blood me just happens to be living here. Go bug the corporate me for payment. Oh and corporate me is owed some money by the government because they took out a savings bond on my life when I was 'berthed' so you can collect against that.

The thing is that you can incorporate yourself or put all your financial dealings through a corporation so when the tax man comes, you technically don't have assets for them to collect, it's all the corporations. Or the corporation was operating at a loss, so no taxes this year from both me and my paper me. This was the gist behind John Kerry bringing up that George W. Bush was a timber concern during the 2004 election debates.

The difference is that it takes money and lawyers to do this. It doesn't matter if you're a Moor or a Freeman of the Land, you don't have the proper notorized filing and paid fees to claim your a corporation or the legal acumen of James Bakker behind you.

DeusExMachinima
Sep 2, 2012

:siren:This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!:siren:

Put this loser on ignore immediately!

Rutibex posted:

200 years of the federal government doing just that

v. hot take

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

Blood and Chrome was great.

blargruck
Aug 23, 2014

Top Hats Monthly posted:

Didn't a sovereign citizen end up shooting a few police officers a few years ago?

People operating under the sovereign citizen mindset have fired on and killed officers in the past, which is part of the reason why they are classified as domestic terrorists by the FBI. Many of the shootings occur when the SovCit is pulled over for a traffic offense, some extremists believe that as a SovCit the have the ability to travel unimpeded by "false arrests" and that such false arrests can be combated with lethal force.
They also do less lethal things like file liens against the homes of sheriffs, police officers, and court personnel, leading to the inability to sell homes without going into court and clearing the unfounded lien.
We had a SovCit case come through the court I was working in and we were advised to get some type of identity theft protection because of the liens and identity theft risks.

blargruck fucked around with this message at 01:15 on Jul 19, 2015

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

lol first result on google when looking up "Fake Liens"

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/08/24/us/citizens-without-a-country-wage-battle-with-liens.html?referrer=&_r=0

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG

Young Freud posted:

The thing is that you can incorporate yourself or put all your financial dealings through a corporation so when the tax man comes, you technically don't have assets for them to collect, it's all the corporations. Or the corporation was operating at a loss, so no taxes this year from both me and my paper me. This was the gist behind John Kerry bringing up that George W. Bush was a timber concern during the 2004 election debates.

The difference is that it takes money and lawyers to do this. It doesn't matter if you're a Moor or a Freeman of the Land, you don't have the proper notorized filing and paid fees to claim your a corporation or the legal acumen of James Bakker behind you.

No no, the big thing with "corporate self" moon logic is that this separation has already been done for you without your consent. Usually the form that Satan takes is your Social Security Number AKA your "incorporation number" or variations on the same. As you never consented to this you can freely opt out of it and all debts and legal responsibilities are nullified.

http://understandcontractlawandyouwin.com/a4v/

quote:

THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE ESTATE

Birth Certificate Estate A4V (Accepted for Value) Process Does It Still Work?To understand A4V or Accepted for Value, first you need to understand that the ALL CAPITAL LETTERS STRAWMAN “JOHN H DOE” is an ESTATE. One of the (hidden) Assets in this ESTATE is the Birth Certificate, which was transferred over to the (E)State that you were born in (which is just another ESTATE), and is being used by that state until the point where you claim your interest in your ESTATE back.

The birth certificate is the TITLE to your physical body, and whoever holds it has the right to collect (and enforce non-payment of) taxes, judgments, liens and etc against YOUR STRAWMAN. So, as you can tell, the profitability of you from all these payments over your lifetime is enormous. So, the “holder in due course” is originally the (E)STATE that you were born in, and they transferred it over to the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, or CANADA, THE COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA, or whatever entity that you think you reside in. The STATE’s in the USA gave up their assets to the UNITED STATES during the bankruptcy during the time of the Civil War; which is explained in a FREE 3-hour introductory course by Brandon Alexander Adams of Creditors in Commerce at this link. Check it out to understand the full history behind A4V and the USA bankruptcy and the bankruptcy of other countries around the world at the same time.

So, if the USA (or Canada/Australia/UK/etc) is the holder of the TITLE to you, then they have a valuable instrument. Think about it in terms of the holder of the note on a mortgage, or the holder of the Certificate of Title for the car (or the holder of the Legal Title or M.S.O. for the car)… the holder is the one with the right to enforce and has a security interest in the pledged collateral (the property, the car, or…in this case…YOU). That means they can SEIZE the collateral, whatever it is.

But now…the one holding the title can also trade and sell that title, or invest it; or, to pledge it to other parties in order to get lines of credit or loans. Similar to how you can get a mortgage or Home equity line of credit, and pledge the house as collateral for seizure if the “loan” goes into default and remains unpaid.

The best part of these dudes is how they poo poo all over each other when it doesn't work, the others get all smug "you did it wrong lol noob :smug:"

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

Flesh Forge posted:

No no, the big thing with "corporate self" moon logic is that this separation has already been done for you without your consent. Usually the form that Satan takes is your Social Security Number AKA your "incorporation number" or variations on the same. As you never consented to this you can freely opt out of it and all debts and legal responsibilities are nullified.

http://understandcontractlawandyouwin.com/a4v/


The best part of these dudes is how they poo poo all over each other when it doesn't work, the others get all smug "you did it wrong lol noob :smug:"

but i'm gay

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG
Are you sure your gay, maybe you're corporate self is actually the gay one

Madcosby
Mar 4, 2003

by FactsAreUseless
Are there videos of people telling the cops they dont understand and refusing to give the cops their info and what not and the cops letting htem go? Idont understand why they think this poo poo should work

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Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG

blargruck posted:

They also do less lethal things like file liens against the homes of sheriffs, police officers, and court personnel, leading to the inability to sell homes without going into court and clearing the unfounded lien.

Or just, y'know, random people and old ladies and poo poo

http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2013/12/09/sovereign-fail-man-indicted-in-cincinatti-for-stealing-houses/
http://www.cobbcounty.org/index.php...=281&Itemid=449
https://vimeo.com/35657409

e: ps yes they are a bit black in the last story

Madcosby posted:

Are there videos of people telling the cops they dont understand and refusing to give the cops their info and what not and the cops letting htem go? Idont understand why they think this poo poo should work

I've only seen like two where they're not thrown under the jail and that's when they've actually complied although when they post their dumb youtube vids they say "LOL SOVEREIGN OWNS POLICE"

Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 01:49 on Jul 19, 2015

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