|
Sebadoh Gigante posted:Speaking of stark terror, Iron Man is what would happen if Donald Trump had been a POW. And also a super scientist. It's not a perfect metaphor. Trump would be a douchier rusty venture if he was a super scientist
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 03:28 |
|
|
Mister Beeg posted:Just want to post this Pearls Before Swine comic, because it fits with this thread:  (BC was super Christian even though I think this comic is too clever for Hart to be a sick burn on Islam)
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:21
|
|
|
I think this is an interesting thread idea, but everybody please promise not to get weird. And maybe it should be widened to children's entertainment media in general, since both types of cartoons are already getting talked about.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:25
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:A self-made cartoon communist who wants to make everyone equal like they're out of an Ayn Rand novel. And no, that company is depicted as the rule, not that this one guy happens to be a poo poo. Unless you think his talking about profits is actually just something that they're suggesting exists only in that one office. In which case it completely fucks up the whole point, because instead of it being that Bob Parr is unable to let go of his need to be a hero to people and that being fundamentally incompatable with the 9/5 work style particularly in a modern capitalistic corporation, its just that he somehow had the bad luck to get a job with the bad insurance company, presumably instead of the nice insurance company across the street, and the entire thing would have been fixed by going to work somewhere else.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:32
|
|
|
Its almost as if writers, no matter if they write for children's televisions shows or for 4th grader picture books, inject a bit of their worldviews and biases both conscious and unconscious into their products.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:35
|
|
|
On another note, this thread shouldn't have left page 1 without this being posted https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Read_Donald_Duck
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:38
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:If our hero, the All-American Randian Superman (literally) started his own insurance company it would be a glorious one that brings a golden age of prosperity to everyone who touched it, simply because of his individual virtues. It's not systemic issues that produce the conditions in the world, it's the actions of individual people whose motivations and ethics are reduced to cartoonishly simplified binaries. The protag is good, the antag is evil, that's it. The insurance company he works for at first is bad 100% because the boss is a cartoon villain, it has literally nothing to do with the nature of insurance, finance, corporations, etc, etc And I'd like to quote a bit of his bosses dialogue. quote:I don't care about their coverage, Bob! Don't tell me about their coverage! Tell me how you're keeping Insuricare in the black! Tell me how that's *possible* with you writing checks to every Harry Hardluck and Sally Sobstory that gives you a phone call! Hell, that scene is literally him disregarding his own good to help total strangers who are in need, then getting chewed out and fired for it. Thats in keeping with Ayn Rands message how? Fulchrum fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Jul 24, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 06:42
|
|
|
I liked the episode of Tale Spin where Baloo had to put up with poo poo for working for a woman. Tale Spin was good.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:02
|
|
|
You want children's media with a hidden agenda? Read some loving Little Bill, like when Little Bill learns about rape, peer pressure, drug and pill usage, and appropriate touching.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:12
|
|
|
Fulchrum posted:And I'd like to quote a bit of his bosses dialogue. It's in keeping with the view of the individual as the center of the universe and capable of doing pretty much anything. Again, the insurance company guy is evil not because insurance company guys are evil in general, but because he specifically is evil. He's a Randian supervillain. Sure it doesn't explicitly poo poo on the poor and expound the virtue of wealth uber alles, but it's still a distinctly right-libertarian worldview. The lack of making GBS threads on the poor doesn't change that
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:18
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:It's in keeping with the view of the individual as the center of the universe and capable of doing pretty much anything. Again, the insurance company guy is evil not because insurance company guys are evil in general, but because he specifically is evil. And even leaving that aside, if the company is so huggy-buggy lovable and he's the real monster, why eactly was he still employed, let alone the superior to the guy who by according to Randian philosophy should have been rewarded for sharing the comapnies values and promoted. quote:He's a Randian supervillain. Sure it doesn't explicitly poo poo on the poor and expound the virtue of wealth uber alles, but it's still a distinctly right-libertarian worldview. The lack of making GBS threads on the poor doesn't change that
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:26
|
|
|
Guys, can we drop the animated movies for now? Focus on politics in comics and graphic novels (Should probably hold off on the manga). So what happened to Superman, anyway? Was there a gradual decline in his socialist tendencies? Was there a significant period where he claimed 'The champions of industry are who I fight for!'?
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:34
|
|
|
WarpedNaba posted:Guys, can we drop the animated movies for now? Focus on politics in comics and graphic novels (Should probably hold off on the manga). The holocaust happened, that's what.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:35
|
|
|
Nah, he still fought for that good stuff in WW2, even if it came along with the whole "slap a jap" thing. What happened to Superman was what happened to everything created before the 50's - the Red Scare.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:37
|
|
|
Wasn't the Comics Code in the 50s? Do that affects Superman in any way? I mean it's hard to imagine, but who knows
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:55
|
|
|
Really the biggest thing was the popularity of superhero stuff dropping precipitously after the war, since they spent years having stories revolving around that and people had gotten tired of it. If anything the Comics Code is what brought them back because they were the only "safe" comics that could be printed when the horror stories and crime drama comics and similar competition was swiftly killed by the code. It's just, yeah, in the process the assorted requirements of the code basically mandated a heavy obedience towards authority (a prominent example being a requirement for police to never be shown in a bad light, even indirectly) that sort of finished off whatever lingering anti-authoritarian roots that still existed after the years of patriotic war stories.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:59
|
|
|
Fulchrum posted:Nah, he still fought for that good stuff in WW2, even if it came along with the whole "slap a jap" thing. What happened to Superman was what happened to everything created before the 50's - the Red Scare. You're underestimating the magnitude of which the horrors of the holocaust hardened the man of steel.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 07:59
|
|
|
My Imaginary GF posted:You're underestimating the magnitude of which the horrors of the holocaust hardened the man of steel.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 08:02
|
|
|
Fulchrum posted:As I recall, Superman couldn't get near Germany cause Hitler had a ton of magic artifacts to keep Superheroes away.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 08:14
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sI0vtqxoG1k The Question and a lot of stuff in Justice League Unlimited was pretty clearly written over the heads of kids. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYMBwqtMht0 If you want the backstory here, there is an alternate dimension Justice League called the "Justice Lords". Instead of being pro-democratic and so on they are totalitarian fascists who have taken over the world. Their world is extremely peaceful, but rigid and people are basically sent to death camps for minor infractions. Batman and Justice Lord Batman have a debate about their ideals and when this scene was being written out they were going to have the good Batman win the debate, but couldn't think of any rebuttal that would be consistent with his characterization.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 08:43
|
|
|
Do outright parodies count? Are we being surprised that children's cartoons sometimes contained commentary their parents would be interested in, or are we looking for something more subtle? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BxDXNCSjBQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPI7SX8C0iU Maybe not so much a political message, but it's clear there were certain perceptions of cops and cop-types that have been around a while. Either way I have a flimsy excuse to show off my favorite cartoon!
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 08:45
|
|
|
Fulchrum posted:And no, that company is depicted as the rule, not that this one guy happens to be a poo poo. Unless you think his talking about profits is actually just something that they're suggesting exists only in that one office. In which case it completely fucks up the whole point, because instead of it being that Bob Parr is unable to let go of his need to be a hero to people and that being fundamentally incompatable with the 9/5 work style particularly in a modern capitalistic corporation, its just that he somehow had the bad luck to get a job with the bad insurance company, presumably instead of the nice insurance company across the street, and the entire thing would have been fixed by going to work somewhere else. If I recall correctly, it's implied that they've actually moved several times already: wasn't Helen in contact with a suit responsible for their new lives?? icantfindaname posted:It's in keeping with the view of the individual as the center of the universe and capable of doing pretty much anything. This is as serious a misreading as I can imagine, because the movie is about family. When Bob Parr is going astray, the movie takes an individualist viewpoint, where he's happy because he can live 'freely'. His victories are illusory, even when he discovers the truth he's captured. The movie then focuses on Helen and the kids to show their family unit being rehabilitated. I think it's a rather mixed movie, in that it's so easily misread. E: Frozone complains about being whitewashed BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 09:04 on Jul 24, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 08:56
|
|
|
If you want subtle, then Yakko's World (which I'm not going to link because YouTube is Right There) lists Palestine as a country, which I imagine would have pissed off particular people if they caught wind of it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 09:00
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:If I recall correctly, it's implied that they've actually moved several times already: wasn't Helen in contact with a suit responsible for their new lives?? Yeah, the government relocation said that this had already happened about 7 times. Heroism and capitalism are that incompatible, and the government needs to protect the Supermen from themselves and the consequences of their actions. Again, real Randian.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 12:07
|
|
|
Here's another cartoon aimed at children that is obviously political in nature: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YP6mMCyXFsk This map shows the Kuril islands as Japanese territory:  Our own soldiers are, naturally, solely a force for good:  Though real-life F-15Js are normally painted light grey, in this cartoon they are stark white, like IJN naval aviation back in the day:  The intrepid Japanese pilots have to chase away completely unmarked "unidentified aircraft" of indeterminate origin: 
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 12:16
|
|
|
Fulchrum posted:Nah, he still fought for that good stuff in WW2, even if it came along with the whole "slap a jap" thing. What happened to Superman was what happened to everything created before the 50's - the Red Scare. There was an anti-communist captain america in the 50s who was later retconned into being a paranoid maniac. There's a great set of cap pages where the real cap confronts him with a big speech about justice etc and some guy goes "that's him, that's the real cap!" E: drat I forgot how good this speech is  
Phoon fucked around with this message at 14:25 on Jul 24, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 14:20
|
|
|
Phoon posted:There was an anti-communist captain america in the 50s who was later retconned into being a paranoid maniac. There's a great set of cap pages where the real cap confronts him with a big speech about justice etc and some guy goes "that's him, that's the real cap!" Fun fact: the actual comic that came from was originally published in 1984. Unfortunately, the writer didn't know it would be and was thus unable to use that in the comic's title.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 14:32
|
|
|
This forum has become a caricature of itself. Amazing. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 15:05
|
|
|
Fulchrum posted:Remember that time Scrooge hired thugs to drive the natives off land he wanted to turn into a rubber plantation? Yes, and he got his commuphens for that(someone sent a zombie after him) It was a story about the lowest thing he ever did, as he got older he started loosing hi ideals about hard work and fair play. TheLovablePlutonis posted:This forum has become a caricature of itself. Amazing. Shush. murphyslaw posted:I agree, discussing different interpretations of things is terrible and a waste of time. Well...since we already have the Gamer Gate poo poo in here... 54.4 crowns fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Jul 24, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 15:55
|
|
|
*double post*
54.4 crowns fucked around with this message at 15:59 on Jul 24, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 15:56
|
|
|
TheLovablePlutonis posted:This forum has become a caricature of itself. Amazing. I agree, discussing different interpretations of things is terrible and a waste of time.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:00
|
|
|
54.4 crowns posted:It was a story about the lowest thing he ever did, as he got older he started loosing hi ideals about hard work and fair play. In the original Carl Barks story it was a story about how he scored a major victory and faced no consequences whatsoever (the zombie went after Donald instead), he even laughed while telling the story.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:03
|
|
|
Asimo posted:If anything the Comics Code is what brought them back because they were the only "safe" comics that could be printed when the horror stories and crime drama comics and similar competition was swiftly killed by the code. This was deliberate by the way. The code was deliberately structured in such a way as to kill off horror and crime books because companies like EC were starting to overtake DC et al Let's talk about Steve Ditko being an objectivist dipshit. Steve Ditko was an objectivist dipshit. Mr. A is literally a reference to A=A and murders every criminal he meets. Also the best Captain America story is the one about investigating the shadow government and finding out the president (who totally wasn't Nixon when editorial asked before the book went to press, but as soon as it was on stands the writer went "yeah it's nixon) was behind it, followed by the president blowing his brains out.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:11
|
|
|
murphyslaw posted:I agree, discussing different interpretations of things is terrible and a waste of time. If you want to post on how Batman, Steven Universe, The Muppets Movie and Kill la Kill were pretty fuckin' in accordance with feminism, there are subforums for that, while D&D at least can pretend it's serious.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:26
|
|
|
Jumping in from the poltoons thread with a duck question: I'm pretty sure the first appearance of Huey Dewey and Louie on film indicated that their mom's name was Dumbella. Did the film cartoon predate the Carl Barks Duck geneology naming her Della or vice versa?
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:32
|
|
|
TheLovablePlutonis posted:If you want to post on how Batman, Steven Universe, The Muppets Movie and Kill la Kill were pretty fuckin' in accordance with feminism, there are subforums for that, while D&D at least can pretend it's serious. This is a subforum that has a thread dedicated to mocking political cartoons and at least one dedicated to mocking stormfront/chain letters/whatever. "Discuss the political ideology of mass media" is probably closer to serious than those threads. (Though it probably would fit as well in CD.)
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:39
|
|
|
TheLovablePlutonis posted:while D&D at least can pretend it's serious. This is the Something Awful forums.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:40
|
|
|
people who think D&D takes itself seriously are just mad that they aren't included in the smart kids club that talks about marxist cartoons inshallah anyway adventure time is Good and Subversive
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 16:42
|
|
|
Captain Planet was an environmentalist show, no question. Though there was an episode where Captain Planet fought Hitler, who used the power of hate. There was also that one Sonic cartoon where Robotnik/Eggman was turning everything and everyone into machines, that was definately environmentalist. Also, Rocko's Modern life was critical of consumer culture in a nihilistic, cynical Nut not overbearing kind of way. Come to think of it shows in the 90's were way more overt about the messages from what I can remember, but my viewpoint is probably colored by how I stopped consuming most children's media back in '02 and the only kids show I ever watch these days is the occasional episode of Regular Show. Then there was the Super Mario Brothers Super show, which showed that you could get away with airing a show that wasn't actually finished so long as you had Captain Lou Albano and a familiar mascot. So there's episodes where the foregrounds aren't drawn in and one of the characters doesn't have a face. To any of the many people lurking this thread to laugh at the sincere over analysis of children's media should check out Pooh and the Millenium. It's a short book consisting of a pretentious and absurd analysis of Winnie-the-Pooh, though unlike this thread it's pretty tongue in cheek. TheLovablePlutonis posted:If you want to post on how Batman, Steven Universe, The Muppets Movie and Kill la Kill were pretty fuckin' in accordance with feminism, there are subforums for that, while D&D at least can pretend it's serious. D&D can absolutely continue to take itself seriously in this thread and I very much hope it does, now stop ruining things for those of us in the peanut gallery Bifner McDoogle fucked around with this message at 17:03 on Jul 24, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 17:00
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 03:28 |
|
|
Bifner McDoogle posted:Captain Planet was an environmentalist show, no question. uh
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2015 17:01
|
|