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Moridin920
Nov 15, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

PathAsc posted:

I don't disagree that recruiters do that poo poo, all headhunter types do in all parts of business. I don't see how my views are conservative rhetoric when they're my own personal beliefs that I've unfortunately had to come to terms with. I've been in the shithole, still had enough common sense not to get sniped for some bullshit.

Sweatshops are primarily staffed by abductees and kept from going anywhere, so their choice is keep working or suicide.

We should kill the rich and eat them, yes. Just don't act like willful ignorance is something that doesn't take place for this poo poo. There are people who legitimately don't know, but how many go into college thinking they're going to get paid? Do we need to talk about unpaid internships too?

Like I said, I agree that all the money made from sports is bullshit, but I also don't think that college athletes should get paid. From my perspective pro level players bitch and moan about the most menial poo poo, so gently caress them too. Maybe we should start paying all students in a Master's program too since they don't have time to work either, or even new students taking 15+ credit hours.

Goddammit, you got me to efforpost. Congrats. I'm not trying to get into a poo poo-slinging contest with you, just express my views. Namaste.


It's dumb conservative rhetoric to look at an exploitative labor situation and go 'well they had a choice just like everyone else there are no problems here.' That's all I meant. Whether it is minimum wage grind work that will never result in advancement or working in a sweatshop. Some things are worse than others but just because people in China are killing themselves at Foxxconn that doesn't mean we shouldn't give a poo poo about other exploitative situations closer to home.

Students in a master's program aren't on TV making the college money. No one is building a multi million dollar stadium complex for the grad students. That's the obvious difference; students pay for a service. Student Athletes do a job and are compensated in return. Their compensation is lacking.

And yeah unpaid internships are retarded, too. idk if you really want to be making the argument that they're fine.

I know they don't go into college expecting to get paid (because that's how it is now, if the NCAA paid then they'd presumably have an expectation of compensation) but they are also sold the whole song and dance of how a college degree will set them up for life and that's p obviously untrue in 2015, especially for a non-STEM degree.

I'm glad you have the common sense to not get sniped on some bullshit but dude that doesn't mean scammers and exploitative employers are in the right or that people who do fall for the tricks somehow deserve it.

Moridin920 fucked around with this message at 18:50 on Sep 11, 2015

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Hector Beerlioz
Jun 16, 2010

aw, hec
"Hello, my name is Kevin Ware"
*snaps ankle in two on television*

Moridin920
Nov 15, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Hector Beerlioz posted:

"Hello, my name is Kevin Ware"
*snaps ankle in two on television*

no worker's comp for you also we're dropping your scholarship have a good life come back if you want to play basketball again

Moridin920
Nov 15, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

quote:

Now Doughty felt blindsided again. Had his doctors at South Carolina misled him? Ignored his injuries? At 23, he had no job, no college degree, and no insurance. What was he going to do? After the injury was found, the Chiefs terminated his contract. Would the university pay for the surgery he needed?

The answer to the last question would be no.

"I was young," Doughty says. "I thought they knew what was good for me. I just listened to 'em. I trusted 'em"


if you think this is an okay state of affairs you're a dick.

quote:

There is also no provision in the Division I Manual to prohibit a coach from revoking a scholarship the year after a recruit gets hurt. For those from poor families and without coverage through a parent, this means that a young man or young woman can be enlisted on the promise of an education, get injured on the field, and lose his or her only source of medical insurance precisely when he or she needs it most. "There is no doubt there are horror stories out there about schools terminating scholarships," says Warren Zola, assistant dean for graduate programs in the Carroll School of Management at Boston College and a sports business expert. "It comes down to the ethos of particular schools."

Moridin920 fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Sep 11, 2015

Hector Beerlioz
Jun 16, 2010

aw, hec

Moridin920 posted:

no worker's comp for you also we're dropping your scholarship have a good life come back if you want to play basketball again

Is that what happened to him? :(

Moridin920
Nov 15, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Hector Beerlioz posted:

Is that what happened to him? :(

i think they paid for the medical bills since it was so high profile, and the injury itself wasn't that bad (i mean it looked gruesome sure but he was able to play a year later) but he's playing for a different school now iirc

but there's definitely tons of players who get injured and lose their scholarship + medical insurance because of it and are just stuck with lifelong medical bills.

millions of people watched that injury happen during a March Madness game and it sparked a national debate about the NCAA's policies but no one cares when some kid's spine gets snapped during practice.

Moridin920 fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Sep 11, 2015

PathAsc
Nov 15, 2011

Hail SS-18 Satan may he cleanse us with nuclear fire

PISS TAPE IS REAL

Moridin920 posted:

It's dumb conservative rhetoric to look at an exploitative labor situation and go 'well they had a choice just like everyone else there are no problems here.' That's all I meant. Whether it is minimum wage grind work that will never result in advancement or working in a sweatshop. Some things are worse than others but just because people in China are killing themselves at Foxxconn that doesn't mean we shouldn't give a poo poo about other exploitative situations closer to home.

Students in a master's program aren't on TV making the college money. No one is building a multi million dollar stadium complex for the grad students. That's the obvious difference; students pay for a service. Student Athletes do a job and are compensated in return. Their compensation is lacking.

And yeah unpaid internships are retarded, too. idk if you really want to be making the argument that they're fine.

I know they don't go into college expecting to get paid (because that's how it is now, if the NCAA paid then they'd presumably have an expectation of compensation) but they are also sold the whole song and dance of how a college degree will set them up for life and that's p obviously untrue in 2015, especially for a non-STEM degree.

I'm glad you have the common sense to not get sniped on some bullshit but dude that doesn't mean scammers and exploitative employers are in the right or that people who do fall for the tricks somehow deserve it.

Fair enough, I took the conservative thing out of context apparently. I can see how that would line up with their ideology, so my mistake on that, good catch.

Right, Master's students aren't on TV in the same way that athletes are. They may be in some commercials, or pass on the quality of their education via word of mouth and their performance in the community. I thought part of the argument was that athletes don't have time for jobs, which is why I brought up course loads.

I'm not making the argument that internships are fine, they're hosed. Again, they're a bullshit stepping stone that is shoved onto kids wanting to make it in the business world, I'll just leave that as an aside.

I wasn't talking about sweatshops overseas, I'm talking about the ones here in the states. They are a very real problem, just like the sex trade.

Honestly, college is a giant line of bullshit fed to people anyway because ~jobs~ and it's a terrible business environment now. Greed has hosed everything all to hell, and fixing that is nigh impossible.

I guess I'm spoiled on the idea that everyone has access to the wealth of information that is the internet, as well as the know-how to be able to look up information there. Such as the info on talent scouts and prospective colleges. Looking at it from an objective position, that's impossible.

I guess it really just boils down to I don't see the point of paying college athletes based on income to the school when they are compensated in ways regular students are. Obviously there's a huge disparity in the income they bring in for the school itself, I don't disagree there at all. For what it's worth, a lot of my opinions on this matter are based on the students I've come into contact with complaining about this. They whined excessively about pretty much everything, mostly about having to be in class and how they just wanted to get poo poo-hammered at some dive bar and then drive around. These same students who are provided all the equipment for their sport, transportation, personal tutelage that isn't available to everyone else, a free ride at whatever university, and other special treatment. Again, it doesn't touch the amount of cash they bring in, but I feel that the issue there is that we eat that poo poo up and throw our money at these sports and memorabilia, overpriced food at stadiums, pay-per-view specials. It's not going to change, and that does bother me greatly since humans are inherently greedy because it's yet another dick waving contest at who is the best at something.

Recruiters and scammers are scum, yes. The rich are mostly scum, and this whole country is now based on who can amass the most power and cash. You could say the whole college athlete thing is a symptom of the larger problem. In which case I stand by my stance that well performing students should be compensated in kind as the athletes are/would be. Everyone should have an incentive to do well in their prospective field, whether that's compensation or guaranteed access to jobs in their field in the future. My pipe dream would be that higher education be free if everything is so dependent on it, and going into stupid amounts of debt so you can get a job is lovely.

flerp
Feb 25, 2014
im a fit sociable person who nerds project their insecurities onto

Nooner
Mar 26, 2011

AN A+ OPSTER (:
my college didnt really have any good sports teams. I guess our womens track was pretty decent and our men's volleyball team won some championship one year i think but other than that not a whole lot going on

PathAsc
Nov 15, 2011

Hail SS-18 Satan may he cleanse us with nuclear fire

PISS TAPE IS REAL

I'm the guy on the rifle team who just can't grasp the concept of how to use iron sights.


I'm the guy playing football who watches Rudy every night.

Zombiepop
Mar 30, 2010
Moves from third world country to Barcelona at the age of nine, dad gets a job as a janitor at a local school. Doing good, getting into the B-team, playing in liga adelante. wooops got injured, dropped from the team. tries moving to poland to play for some bum gently caress team, hates it there, polish people are racist. dad getting depressed bein a poor lonely janitor in a foreign country. kills himself.

wilfredmerriweathr
Jul 11, 2005
Most people in grad programs for hard science are getting paid to be there

like my old classmates, they are all in phd programs for physics and get paid 25-40k a year AND get their tuition waved. my wife gets 25k and tuition waived to do chemistry

hell, my buddy's wife is getting 20k a year to do a social science masters

just an fyi

Robo Reagan
Feb 12, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
athletes are paid in experience and non-consenting 18 year old pussy

Lord of Pie
Mar 2, 2007


right in the pussy

Nooner
Mar 26, 2011

AN A+ OPSTER (:
*is one of top QBs in whole nation*
*turns down opportunity to enter draft junior year to finish degree*
*gets degree in architectural design from extremely prestigious university*
*is #1 draft pick to NFL, replacing one of the best quarterbacks to ever play the game*
*kicks rear end till foot hurts*
:swoon:

PathAsc
Nov 15, 2011

Hail SS-18 Satan may he cleanse us with nuclear fire

PISS TAPE IS REAL

wilfredmerriweathr posted:

Most people in grad programs for hard science are getting paid to be there

like my old classmates, they are all in phd programs for physics and get paid 25-40k a year AND get their tuition waved. my wife gets 25k and tuition waived to do chemistry

hell, my buddy's wife is getting 20k a year to do a social science masters

just an fyi

That's news to me, and I'm glad to hear it. Thanks for the info, I mean this completely unironically because it gives me some hope for higher education at not-poo poo universities. :unsmith:

Robo Reagan
Feb 12, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
dude that's standard for any university where you're not being scammed. like, you're actually doing work in labs and making discoveries at that point

PathAsc
Nov 15, 2011

Hail SS-18 Satan may he cleanse us with nuclear fire

PISS TAPE IS REAL

Robo Reagan posted:

dude that's standard for any university where you're not being scammed. like, you're actually doing work in labs and making discoveries at that point

That makes sense to me, but at that point wouldn't you be considered as working for the university as you are trying to make it more prestigious? I've obviously not been at that point in education, nor had a chance to be around those who have so I'd love to know more.

Gaunab
Feb 13, 2012
LUFTHANSA YOU FUCKING DICKWEASEL
I hosed up the game so I have to go into hiding for a while

Neukoln19
Oct 27, 2005
I am a college athlete

*prances around like a twink*

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Jackie D
May 27, 2009

Democracy is like a tambourine - not everyone can be trusted with it.


*gets forced out of my pre-med program because it conflicts with practice*

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