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IronClaymore
Jun 30, 2010

by Athanatos

Alan Smithee posted:

How close is Turkey to India? I feel like you can't have a thanksgviing turkey until a lot of Indians are killed

Well, you're firing things eastward of course, so you get a bonus. Meh, I say you could do it with a skud, but you might fall short and hit Pakistan.

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Convergence
Apr 9, 2005

IronClaymore posted:

If modern military action has taught us anything, it's that that taxpayer is willing to pay certain costs, for certain illusions of security.

Really, what are Hellfire missiles made of? Steel Aluminium, nitric acid, dimethyl hydrazine, explosive, and a circuit board. It costs what, $20, maybe $30 in raw materials? I dunno, but it isn't very much. But if it isn't much right now they already ramp up the costs. So if there was a cost-cutting measure they wouldn't pass it on to the consumer, ie the military (and the military of all other countries that buy the equipment). drat, engineers working for these places have probably discovered ways to cut costs down dramatically, it's what engineers DO! So much of military hardware in use is old tech and is probably costs a fraction to produce now in real terms, but you're still charged the same amount to buy it. So the savings are never passed on.

If anything, the introduction of blimps will make them charge even more.

the unit cost of a hellfire is $70,000 to $110,000 depending on who you ask. it's a lot more than 30 dollars in raw materials- at least a couple thousand for the optics, especially

missles that actually hit things and don't blow up randomly are hard

crabcakes66
May 24, 2012

by exmarx

IronClaymore posted:

Really, what are Hellfire missiles made of? Steel Aluminium, nitric acid, dimethyl hydrazine, explosive, and a circuit board. It costs what, $20, maybe $30 in raw materials?

So you are saying all of the design, engineering, refining, manufacture of components, assembly of components, testing, training and transport should in no way be factored into the cost of something?

Robo Reagan
Feb 12, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
can't we get some half retarded taiwanese child to make them?

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Enjoy every sandwich.

Smellrose

Robo Reagan posted:

can't we get some half retarded taiwanese child to make them?

if you want something vaguely shaped like a missile that doesn't work, sure

EXTREME INSERTION
Jun 4, 2011

by LadyAmbien

Fat Lowtax posted:

Happy Thanksgiving!

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Enjoy every sandwich.

Smellrose

IronClaymore posted:

If modern military action has taught us anything, it's that that taxpayer is willing to pay certain costs, for certain illusions of security.

Really, what are Hellfire missiles made of? Steel Aluminium, nitric acid, dimethyl hydrazine, explosive, and a circuit board. It costs what, $20, maybe $30 in raw materials? I dunno, but it isn't very much. But if it isn't much right now they already ramp up the costs. So if there was a cost-cutting measure they wouldn't pass it on to the consumer, ie the military (and the military of all other countries that buy the equipment). drat, engineers working for these places have probably discovered ways to cut costs down dramatically, it's what engineers DO! So much of military hardware in use is old tech and is probably costs a fraction to produce now in real terms, but you're still charged the same amount to buy it. So the savings are never passed on.

If anything, the introduction of blimps will make them charge even more.

seriously you are one goddamned stupid motherfucker

Beef Turret
Jul 9, 2009

by Lowtax
How come prostitutes are so expensive when our bodies are just bags of calcium, water and amino acids probably priced at around 20 cents in raw material?

Robo Reagan
Feb 12, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:

if you want something vaguely shaped like a missile that doesn't work, sure

well we have something vaguely shaped like a plane that doesn't work and we've spent 35 billion on that so why not

Edgar Allan Pwned
Apr 4, 2011

Quoth the Raven "I love the power glove. It's so bad..."
I'm going to need a breakdown.

Kurds are attacking ISIS, so that's good for US?
But Turks are attacking Kurds? Are they against ISIS and want it done separately from the Kurds?
How does the US feel about Turkey and Russia? How does everyone else feel about them?
Don't a lot of people want Russia to do the murder work of fighting ISIS?

IronClaymore
Jun 30, 2010

by Athanatos

Convergence posted:

the unit cost of a hellfire is $70,000 to $110,000 depending on who you ask. it's a lot more than 30 dollars in raw materials- at least a couple thousand for the optics, especially

missles that actually hit things and don't blow up randomly are hard

I love that they can charge so much for precision optics. I'd have a quip for this if I was still a Marxist, and an even ruder quip if I was still a classical capitalist, but now I simply find it amusing. No really, I'm sure they are excellent electronics and optics, I don't doubt that.

The costs do add up of course. And yes for reasons of vaguely defined security excuses we can't look too deeply into the finances of the companies that manufacture devices that the public demand are used to kill people we suspect to be villains. [No pacifist slight intended, that was pure legalese.] But is the work really worth that much? A $500 phone is ridiculously more complicated and sophisticated than any missile from the 80s, and the Chinese manufacturers of those phones are still making good profits, so the raw materials can't be much. Most of the rest of a missile is cheap metal and chemicals, you're right though maybe it does have a little bit of precision optics.

I'd love to be the CEO of the company that assembles the thing. Are the optics seriously going to cost a year's pay? I'd assemble the thing myself, make a bundle.

old beast lunatic
Nov 3, 2004

by Hand Knit
CNN just showed a video of a bunch of guys screaming allah akbar and shooting at the parachutes. I really wish they'd occasionally scream something else, its getting old.

Fojar38
Sep 2, 2011


Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia


also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->
i dont get why cars are so expensive its just a bunch of metal and rubber parts that you pour gas in and stick a battery into

i could build one in an afternoon i bet and save myself thousands of dollars

ethanol
Jul 13, 2007



InterFaced posted:

CNN just showed a video of a bunch of guys screaming allah akbar and shooting at the parachutes. I really wish they'd occasionally scream something else, its getting old.

So what is the Kurds on the turkey border diplomatic status with turkey? In terms of civ5 please

crabcakes66
May 24, 2012

by exmarx

IronClaymore posted:

I love that they can charge so much for precision optics. I'd have a quip for this if I was still a Marxist, and an even ruder quip if I was still a classical capitalist, but now I simply find it amusing. No really, I'm sure they are excellent electronics and optics, I don't doubt that.

The costs do add up of course. And yes for reasons of vaguely defined security excuses we can't look too deeply into the finances of the companies that manufacture devices that the public demand are used to kill people we suspect to be villains. [No pacifist slight intended, that was pure legalese.] But is the work really worth that much? A $500 phone is ridiculously more complicated and sophisticated than any missile from the 80s, and the Chinese manufacturers of those phones are still making good profits, so the raw materials can't be much. Most of the rest of a missile is cheap metal and chemicals, you're right though maybe it does have a little bit of precision optics.

I'd love to be the CEO of the company that assembles the thing. Are the optics seriously going to cost a year's pay? I'd assemble the thing myself, make a bundle.



ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:

seriously you are one goddamned stupid motherfucker

IronClaymore
Jun 30, 2010

by Athanatos

InterFaced posted:

CNN just showed a video of a bunch of guys screaming allah akbar and shooting at the parachutes. I really wish they'd occasionally scream something else, its getting old.

I think it's a meme. They only scream that when they know they're being recorded. Otherwise they're silent.

ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:

seriously you are one goddamned stupid motherfucker

Yeah...you know, it'd be nice to be less stupid. It's fun to be left in the dark because of genuine reasons, like what the actual reducing agent is in a tactical missile because my source is from the 70s and what they use now is a trade secret. It's cool in a more general sense to live in a place where the government cares enough to have classified poo poo going on.

But more practically it'd be nice to know how much biologics medicine is being deprived of people because we're shooting missiles at other people. Just as a thing, you know. Like, if they said, "Ok, we can drop this JDAM on a suspected fuel truck, probably empty and driven by teenagers forced at gunpoint to drive it, or we can spend the same amount of money on saving these two guys dying of cancer, what do you want?"

IronClaymore fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Nov 24, 2015

ChrisHansen
Oct 28, 2014

Suck my damn balls.
Lipstick Apathy
It's a good thing I've been binge watching doomsday preppers lately.

Fojar38
Sep 2, 2011


Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia


also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

ethanol posted:

So what is the Kurds on the turkey border diplomatic status with turkey? In terms of civ5 please

the ottomans have open borders with the kurds b/c they allied with america 60 turns ago

Robo Reagan
Feb 12, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

IronClaymore posted:

I think it's a meme. They only scream that when they know they're being recorded. Otherwise they're silent.

muslims have a pretty abusive relationship with allah basically like christians i was watching a docu and this sniper guy fighting assad's dudes said every time he fired and the bullet hit someone it was allah firing the gun and not him so if that's true why doesnt allah just murder gently caress all those guys or maybe not put those guys in that situation in the first place

someone should write a strongly worded letter

Grem
Mar 29, 2004

It's how her species communicates

The pilot who shot the plane down must feel baller. It's the first air to air combat since what, Korea?

ethanol
Jul 13, 2007



Grem posted:

The pilot who shot the plane down must feel baller. It's the first air to air combat since what, Korea?

It don't count when it's a team kill

Robo Reagan
Feb 12, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Grem posted:

The pilot who shot the plane down must feel baller. It's the first air to air combat since what, Korea?

depends, is turkey one of those muslim countries where you can get hella laid or is another durka durka we're mad all the time no fun allowed muslim countries?

Nelson Mandingo
Mar 27, 2005



Robo Reagan posted:

depends, is turkey one of those muslim countries where you can get hella laid or is another durka durka we're mad all the time no fun allowed muslim countries?

Turkey's internal debate is between being a secular country and being a repressive shithole. So it really depends on where you are in the country.

soy
Jul 7, 2003

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Robo Reagan posted:

depends, is turkey one of those muslim countries where you can get hella laid or is another durka durka we're mad all the time no fun allowed muslim countries?

I see a lot of hot bitches on periscope there who aren't wearing durka burkas so I think you can get your jerka twerka'd

Rime
Nov 2, 2011

by Games Forum
I can confirm that dominantly kurdish eastern Anatolia is awesome, anywhere west / populated by actual Turks is a shithole of monumental proportions.

gently caress the Turks. :colbert:

kikkelivelho
Aug 27, 2015

Erdogan wants to bring back the Caliphate of the Ottoman Empire and all the like-minded eligible for aid. At the same time Russia seeks to restore its influence in the world and the USA, and Western European leaders, led constructed in the EU federal state. China is also seeking more aggressively to expand its influence.

Democratic is more or less break in the world, if some have yet been detected. Media full of propaganda and investigative journalism abolished by running media houses plight. History reading can draw conclusions on the future ...

ethanol
Jul 13, 2007



Rime posted:



gently caress the Turks. :colbert:

Indeed

Moridin920
Nov 15, 2007

by FactsAreUseless
Why is Turkey constantly being fuckass agitators?

Like constantly nonstop? gently caress those guys kick them out of NATO imo.

Grem
Mar 29, 2004

It's how her species communicates

Wow I was way wrong, planes have been lost in air to air combat alot since Korea.

Bamford Brownstone
Jul 21, 2010
This is nobody's business but the Turks. :smug:

corpuscollossus
Apr 19, 2007
Pretty much shot the pilot to shreds as he floated to the ground. this must feel bad

:nms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IZ-TALZtGw

Moridin920
Nov 15, 2007

by FactsAreUseless
Also that dude is right it's called economies of scale and poo poo idiots.

If they've been making a missile since the 80s there's no way it still costs the same amount of money to manufacture today than it did when they were first run. That's just basic. If you ever find yourself on the side of an argument going 'nah the military-industrial complex isn't price gouging' then check yourself because lmao.

dZPnJOm8QwUAseApNj
Apr 15, 2002

arf bark woof
They also shot one of the helicopters sent in to rescue:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IschF-ihjS0

edit - as previously mentioned but not posted

dZPnJOm8QwUAseApNj fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Nov 24, 2015

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Fargo Fukes posted:

It's worth pointing out here that for once the West didn't actually cause the mess in Syria. Our, good, strong, secular, friendly dictator Assad managed to gently caress the whole country up into endless civil war himself through greed, stupidity and corruption. You can hardly shrug your shoulders and say he's mean but he's probably the best person to rule the place. He caused this.

*barges around spreading destabilization everywhere, overthrowing multiple regimes and opening giant power vacuums*

*watches as the chain of chaos spreads to areas not directly touched by bumbling interventions*

Urkel voice: "oops! Did I do that?"

Ambrose Burnside
Aug 30, 2007

pensive

Robo Reagan posted:

i hope russia threatens turkey with economic sanctions lol

they cut off the gas supply and suspended all commercial flights to turkey almost immediately, soo

old beast lunatic
Nov 3, 2004

by Hand Knit
I know ISIS has been doing its thing for a little while but this 2015 realtime youtube war coverage just never stops being weird to me.

dZPnJOm8QwUAseApNj
Apr 15, 2002

arf bark woof

InterFaced posted:

I know ISIS has been doing its thing for a little while but this 2015 realtime youtube war coverage just never stops being weird to me.

warporn will define the 21st century

IronClaymore
Jun 30, 2010

by Athanatos

Klyith posted:

*barges around spreading destabilization everywhere, overthrowing multiple regimes and opening giant power vacuums*

*watches as the chain of chaos spreads to areas not directly touched by bumbling interventions*

Urkel voice: "oops! Did I do that?"

Well, no dictator is perfect. We can't expect another Saddam, nor did we prop up another Saudi. Things can just fall apart for those others.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
I mean obviously Assad was not the best ruler, but why don't you ask the 4 to 9 million syrians who have fled the country what they think?

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General Dog
Apr 26, 2008

Everybody's working for the weekend

Nelson Mandingo posted:

Turkey's internal debate is between being a secular country and being a repressive shithole. So it really depends on where you are in the country.

Makes me feel blessed to live in a country that's learned to walk that line so well.

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