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If you haven't been listening past the first episode how do you know it's not interesting? If it takes word of mouth, here's some. It's fascinating.
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Dec 25, 2015 18:27
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Can we all agree, at this point, that Adnan definitely did it?
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Dec 26, 2015 07:39
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I still have reasonable doubts based on the evidence presented.
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Dec 26, 2015 07:44
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Hat Thoughts posted:Can we all agree, at this point, that Adnan definitely did it? I think guy that shat his pants probably did it
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Dec 26, 2015 09:17
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Scylo posted:I think guy that shat his pants probably did it Mailkimp did it
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Dec 26, 2015 13:34
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I think my big problem with this season is that Bowe is a loving idiot, and even if his intentions were slightly noble his entire plan wasted millions of taxpayer dollars, put countless US soldiers lives in danger, and literally had 0 percent chance at succeeding. Like, I feel bad for the guy, but as I listen I cannot get how monumentally stupid this man is out of the back of my head.
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Dec 26, 2015 16:45
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The cool part about this podcast is that no one has any incentive to tell the actual truth and no one listening seems to give a poo poo about that.
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Dec 26, 2015 17:37
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Dear Sergio posted:The cool part about this podcast is that no one has any incentive to tell the actual truth and no one listening seems to give a poo poo about that. That is actually cool because it makes for a better story.
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Dec 26, 2015 18:32
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Paul Zuvella posted:I think my big problem with this season is that Bowe is a loving idiot, and even if his intentions were slightly noble his entire plan wasted millions of taxpayer dollars, put countless US soldiers lives in danger, and literally had 0 percent chance at succeeding. Eh again if he didn't "forget" to check his compass for 2 hours it's possible he could have made it to the FOB or at the very least been picked up by the US somewhere once the DUSTWUN was called. Who knows I guess. If we're to believe his initial story of why all this happened in the first place then he seemingly was an idiot for having illusions of grandeur and not just a complete all around idiot. My take at least. Granted those are really exaggerated quotes around the whole forgetting to check your only tool to get you to your location.
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Dec 26, 2015 19:35
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Hat Thoughts posted:Can we all agree, at this point, that Adnan definitely did it? Adnan did it.
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Dec 27, 2015 03:33
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Terrorist Fistbump posted:I still have reasonable doubts based on the evidence presented. I agree. There was pretty much no evidence presented at trial. The entire thing hinged on "this drug-dealer he knows says he did it." There were a lot of coincidences pointing his way, but nothing really overwhelming that would get me to vote for a conviction. Maybe in a civil case, where the standard is "preponderance of the evidence," but I don't see "beyond a reasonable doubt." Also, maybe I'm naive, but I find it hard to believe someone sticks to his story that flawlessly for over a decade and never slips up once.
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Dec 27, 2015 04:12
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ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:Adnan did it. Probably. But if you were a juror on that case and voted to convict on the evidence in the show, you're a bad person.
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Dec 27, 2015 04:20
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Hat Thoughts posted:Can we all agree, at this point, that Adnan definitely did it? Maybe, but Adnan wasn't proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, his trial was unconstitutional and he deserves to be fairly tried with proper legal representation.
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Dec 27, 2015 05:24
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for me this episode finally got into the meat of the story. i haven't followed the story beyond the basic "dude went off, was Taliban captive for five years", so this was the first i had heard about his actual captivity. just complete insanity, and this only covered the first year. as much as bowe's initial plan was lolbad, my impression so far of his captivity was that he really did make some effort in different ways to be unhelpful to the captors. my favorite part was where he made friends with that dog and it started sleeping next to him lol
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Dec 27, 2015 05:44
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Let's talk to a person who clearly has delusions of grandeur about their time in captivity. But because he doesn't want to talk to us, let's use the tapes in which he talked to a screenwriter about his story and let's just use that as facts. And I thought season 1 was shoddy journalism with a personal agenda.
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Dec 27, 2015 10:55
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Jurgan posted:I agree. There was pretty much no evidence presented at trial. The entire thing hinged on "this drug-dealer he knows says he did it." There were a lot of coincidences pointing his way, but nothing really overwhelming that would get me to vote for a conviction. Maybe in a civil case, where the standard is "preponderance of the evidence," but I don't see "beyond a reasonable doubt." Also, maybe I'm naive, but I find it hard to believe someone sticks to his story that flawlessly for over a decade and never slips up once. You are really misinformed here. There was plenty of very strong evidence at the trial.
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Dec 27, 2015 11:11
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The entire war was a waste of taxpayers money and the search for Bergdahl was a drop in the bucket lol.
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Dec 27, 2015 12:52
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African AIDS cum posted:You are really misinformed here. There was plenty of very strong evidence at the trial. Possibly. I'm not one of the internet detectives- I listened to the whole thing after it was already over, and it's entirely possible I missed something. But it sure sounded like the entire thing hinged on Jay's testimony.
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Dec 27, 2015 18:55
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Jurgan posted:Possibly. I'm not one of the internet detectives- I listened to the whole thing after it was already over, and it's entirely possible I missed something. But it sure sounded like the entire thing hinged on Jay's testimony. Yeah the something you missed is the part where he killed the girl.
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Dec 27, 2015 20:52
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All you serial season one people should leave. This is for discussions of army men making GBS threads themselves. When Bowe shits himself you post in this thread that he is stupid and or lying. When army men looking for Bowe poo poo themselves post that they are heroes.
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Dec 27, 2015 22:16
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Dear Sergio posted:Yeah the something you missed is the part where he killed the girl. Wow, you're an rear end.
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Dec 27, 2015 22:33
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go poo poo up the season 1 thread with your adnan  theories seriously we have a new goofball to sperg about
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Dec 28, 2015 02:41
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GaussianCopula posted:Let's talk to a person who clearly has delusions of grandeur about their time in captivity. But because he doesn't want to talk to us, let's use the tapes in which he talked to a screenwriter about his story and let's just use that as facts. you may want to stick to basic cable, if the assumption of available critical thinking faculties on the listener's part is too difficult a concept for you to grasp
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Dec 28, 2015 02:43
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Lutha Mahtin posted:go poo poo up the season 1 thread with your adnan Fair enough. Someone asked a question, and I answered. Now let's move on. Episode 2 really brought out why people were so hard on him. When I first heard about Bowe, I thought "desertion? Is that really such a big deal?" Knowing how much poo poo people went through trying to save him, it's understandable why they take it seriously. Episode 3 didn't add much, though. I guess it showed how painful his imprisonment was, and I liked the bits about him putting obvious lies into his propaganda videos to clue in his side that the videos were false. But a lot of it was just a detailed blow-by-blow of how he escaped, and I didn't care as much.
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Dec 28, 2015 04:57
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Jurgan posted:Fair enough. Someone asked a question, and I answered. Now let's move on. You get that this is exactly what Koenig is trying to do, right? She wants you to sympathize with Bowe, just like she had a whole episode devoted to making you sympathize with Adnan and showing him as a teenager like we all were at one point. She's got to make the listener give a gently caress about SOMETHING in this story, so she's trying to make you think he's really brave for not cracking, and then later she's probably going to try make you question your sympathies. Whether it's working or not, that's what is intended here.
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Dec 28, 2015 05:20
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Maybe she's making you feel like that but I don't detect any manipulation. And I certainly don't sympathise with him. He's an idiot and his explanations all sound like excuses he came up with after the fact.
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Dec 28, 2015 05:49
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Paul Zuvella posted:even if his intentions were slightly noble his entire plan wasted millions of taxpayer dollars, put countless US soldiers lives in danger, and literally had 0 percent chance at succeeding. You just described the entire military campaign he removed himself from.
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Dec 28, 2015 06:14
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Scudworth posted:You just described the entire military campaign he removed himself from. Except that "millions" would be drastically understating it.
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Dec 28, 2015 06:55
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rotinaj posted:The argument there is that the genre of story has changed so drastically, it's putting people off. Going from a mystery whodunit to a military test of character story is a far enough leap that it could easily alienate a big portion of the audience. Koenig specifically said that they didn't want to be known as a true crime podcast or do only true crime stories--if that's true then it's probably for the best that they let listeners know that ASAP. To some degree, season one grew into something way beyond their control (Koenig was definitely getting part of the blame for the fact that her listeners were overstepping boundaries trying to get more information, and for the perceived-to-be-distasteful way that a lot of people latched onto the story). I don't think they're particularly mad about the fact that the hype has died down and they get a chance to do something that'll be looked at as being less, uh, tawdry. Even if that means losing a few listeners. GaussianCopula posted:Let's talk to a person who clearly has delusions of grandeur about their time in captivity. But because he doesn't want to talk to us, let's use the tapes in which he talked to a screenwriter about his story and let's just use that as facts. Serial is not meant to be objective newspaper-style journalism. If it was, then Koenig wouldn't be inserting herself into the narrative the way she has. It's meant to be a way of telling stories that may or may not end up being true. (The framing device of Koenig telling the story of Boal talking to Bowe who's telling his own story is an explicitly literary device--Frankenstein, Wuthering Heights, etc.) The fact that she draws attention to the role she's playing--what she has to do to investigate her stories, how she feels about the subjects, etc.--is entirely purposeful. Everyone who is concerned with Koenig's lack of objectivity/credibility/etc. is missing the point by a mile. There's no hidden agenda here. There's an agenda, but she's never made an attempt to hide it for even a second. GutBomb posted:Maybe she's making you feel like that but I don't detect any manipulation. And I certainly don't sympathise with him. He's an idiot and his explanations all sound like excuses he came up with after the fact. I mean, it's obviously too early to tell yet, but the impression I get is that one of the central questions of season two won't be "Is Bowe 100 percent innocent of what he's being accused of?" the way it was with Adnan in season one--it's whether or not we can get to the point where we sympathize with Bowe despite recognizing that he is at least partially and maybe fully guilty of the things he's been accused of.
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Dec 28, 2015 11:19
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aslan posted:Koenig specifically said that they didn't want to be known as a true crime podcast or do only true crime stories--if that's true then it's probably for the best that they let listeners know that ASAP. Absolutely - season one had the internet detective dummies calling and harassing the key players, visiting Jay's grandmother's house and egging on Adnan's friends sister with her cries of his innocence on her blog. There is no chance in hell NPR wanted Serial to become infamous for that type of behavior. By choosing someone for S2 that is already infamous, they cut out of the bullshit background 'research' that the anonymity of the internet allows. And this is good - we can focus on the actual story.
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Dec 28, 2015 16:17
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GutBomb posted:Maybe she's making you feel like that but I don't detect any manipulation. And I certainly don't sympathise with him. He's an idiot and his explanations all sound like excuses he came up with after the fact. Serial is a piece of entertainment. She's trying to make her audience care about the story. I never said "manipulate". She's using basic entertainment principles to try to make a compelling narrative for her story. But seeing as you're biased against the whole thing from the start, you're never gonna let the storyteller do as she's intending to, so whatever, keep on hatin', dude. The basic story arc so far has been really, really obvious. She set up the backround, she did the capture, now she's done the first year of his captivity and his trauma/torture/neglect. She's probably gonna do another episode or three on the rest of his time since he was captured, then she'll do the immediate aftermath of the rescue, and probably an episode on the backlash against him.
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Dec 29, 2015 01:38
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rotinaj posted:Serial is a piece of entertainment. She's trying to make her audience care about the story. I never said "manipulate". She's using basic entertainment principles to try to make a compelling narrative for her story. But seeing as you're biased against the whole thing from the start, you're never gonna let the storyteller do as she's intending to, so whatever, keep on hatin', dude. The basic story arc so far has been really, really obvious. She set up the backround, she did the capture, now she's done the first year of his captivity and his trauma/torture/neglect. She's probably gonna do another episode or three on the rest of his time since he was captured, then she'll do the immediate aftermath of the rescue, and probably an episode on the backlash against him. I'm not biased against anything. I didn't even know much about this story before the show started airing other than John McCain being a dickhead about it. I understand it's entertainment but I'll deny that she's trying to get the listener to lean any specific way. She's presenting stories and facts and the opinion of the listener seems generally left to the listener to decide.
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Dec 29, 2015 05:33
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GutBomb posted:I'm not biased against anything. I didn't even know much about this story before the show started airing other than John McCain being a dickhead about it. I understand it's entertainment but I'll deny that she's trying to get the listener to lean any specific way. She's presenting stories and facts and the opinion of the listener seems generally left to the listener to decide. Everything has a bias, all news is framed to make you feel a certain way, sorry to break it to you, buddy.
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Dec 29, 2015 12:41
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rotinaj posted:Everything has a bias, all news is framed to make you feel a certain way, sorry to break it to you, buddy. I guess I'm just less susceptible to being influenced by media bias than you then, buddy.
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Dec 29, 2015 14:26
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GutBomb posted:I guess I'm just less susceptible to being influenced by media bias than you then, buddy. This, I propose, is ideology.
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Dec 29, 2015 14:58
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GutBomb posted:I guess I'm just less susceptible to being influenced by media bias than you then, buddy. You should probably get informed about media framing, narratives, and how information actually works, because you're not less susceptible, you just apparently can't see it when it happens. Just because you don't believe a legitimate thing is a thing, doesn't mean it's not there.
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Dec 29, 2015 17:09
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I don't hate season 2 but I don't love or even really like it. It's interesting enough to hold my attention and I look forward to it to spice up my week of podcasts. I can't imagine the drop off in serial listeners this season though. It must be insane.
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Dec 29, 2015 17:12
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I'm finding this season really fascinating, particularly the reactions other military people had to the search for Bergdahl. Those dudes that said they would kill him if they had been the ones to find him genuinely disturb me. Hopefully we'll more of this broader scope stuff later on. As far as Serial goes as a piece of media goes, it's not journalism and was never meant to be. It's closer to documentary films- Sarah Koenig's company would be people like Errol Morris and Werner Herzog, people big into the subjective nature of the genre. Raxivace fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Dec 29, 2015 |
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Dec 29, 2015 17:40
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I wonder if/when they'll bring up the email he sent to his parent before he went AWOL. Definitely shows how fed up he was of his command.http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/americas-last-prisoner-of-war-20120607 posted:mom, dad
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Dec 29, 2015 19:14
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Hat Thoughts posted:Can we all agree, at this point, that Adnan definitely did it? Mountain Dew did 9-11
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Dec 29, 2015 23:32
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