Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
CityMidnightJunky
May 11, 2013

by Smythe

OldTennisCourt posted:

Unforgiven 1999

The lead up to this was Boss Man kidnapping Al Snow's dog and KILLING IT AND FEEDING IT TO AL. I contend that there has never been a heel act more monstrous in the history of this company.


It isn't even the most monstrous act by the Big Boss Man.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhSh35ryueA

This was only two months later by the way. You just don't get heels like that anymore. What a man.

CityMidnightJunky fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Jan 26, 2016

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Name Change
Oct 9, 2005


Gavok posted:

Yeah, back in the 2008 tournament they did this bit where the team Los Ice Creams didn't have a third partner so they kept picking names out of a hat. Names of people who obviously weren't going to be there (ie. "Ice Man" King Parson). After some "no shows," they mentioned Glacier, which seemed like a fakeout, but then he showed up after all in full armor. The crowd ate it up and it made sense that in the year after, there would be a Glacier-based team to follow on that.


See, there's one thing HulkaMatt is completely underselling. In 2009, Chikara went all out on King of Trios. They tend to bring in a handful of interesting names every year, but this time they went and brought in a kind of crazy roster. Bryan Danielson, Johnny Saint, Kota Ibushi, Austin Aries, Young Bucks, El Generico, Necro Butcher and so on. The core Chikara roster was really great at the time too and there were some entertaining semi-regulars in there like Da Soul Touchaz and the F1rst Family. They even had a young Simon Gotch mixed in there.

Having guys like Glacier and Al Snow show up with added D'Lo Brown sounded like a fun novelty, sure. The UnStable were the worst Chikara team involved, but they were all at least passable (especially Gerard, who was part of the company's best match in 2008). So why they decided to put two of the worst teams in the tournament against each other as the main event of a show overflowing with talent and give them nearly a half hour is beyond me outside of TV star power.

It really does all come down to Snow, though. D'Lo was okay and Glacier was Glacier, but they both looked like they wanted to be there. Snow sleepwalked through the whole thing and it was just sad. The part that sticks out the most is Snow doing a standing hot tag. He couldn't put forth the effort of crawling or anything. He just stood a foot away from his partners, wobbled around and then did the dramatic tag.

Surprisingly, he was never invited back.

This is somehow made better by Snow being a "Only other workers have the right to judge each others' ringwork! gently caress dirtsheetz!" guy.

OldTennisCourt
Sep 11, 2011

by VideoGames
Another match to consider would be the Hardcore Battle Royale at Mania 2000. The match itself is just dumb 24/7 Hardcore stuff. Nothing awful., the gimmick being whoever gets the final pin at the end of the time limit is the champ. What sets it apart is a botched finish, possibly one of the only major hosed up finishes in Mania history. Basically Hardcore pins Crash with seconds to go. What was meant to happen was time runs out JUST before the three count.

The problem is the crowd is counting down and it looks like the ref hosed up the count with that and hits three, giving the title to Hardcore and loving up the correct finish.

This is also the match where Hardcore calls Cole a little shithead in a post match interview, Cole mumbles a fearful response while JR calls Hardcore classless and apologizes.

Hell Mania 2000's also has a poo poo match with Al Snow (this is looking like a pattern) and a pretty poo poo main event as well.

Name Change
Oct 9, 2005


OldTennisCourt posted:

Another match to consider would be the Hardcore Battle Royale at Mania 2000. The match itself is just dumb 24/7 Hardcore stuff. Nothing awful., the gimmick being whoever gets the final pin at the end of the time limit is the champ. What sets it apart is a botched finish, possibly one of the only major hosed up finishes in Mania history. Basically Hardcore pins Crash with seconds to go. What was meant to happen was time runs out JUST before the three count.

The problem is the crowd is counting down and it looks like the ref hosed up the count with that and hits three, giving the title to Hardcore and loving up the correct finish.

This is also the match where Hardcore calls Cole a little shithead in a post match interview, Cole mumbles a fearful response while JR calls Hardcore classless and apologizes.

Hell Mania 2000's also has a poo poo match with Al Snow (this is looking like a pattern) and a pretty poo poo main event as well.

Wrestlemania 16 outside of 1 or 2 matches tops is a very long episode of Raw. Wrestling was still so hot that it didn't really matter what they booked.

mariooncrack
Dec 27, 2008


Using Al's criteria for a good match, he's never had a good match.

OldTennisCourt
Sep 11, 2011

by VideoGames

OneThousandMonkeys posted:

Wrestlemania 16 outside of 1 or 2 matches tops is a very long episode of Raw. Wrestling was still so hot that it didn't really matter what they booked.

I was teetering on calling it a garbage Mania overall, but the Benoit/Jericho/Angle match is really good and the ladder match is spectacular.

Name Change
Oct 9, 2005


OldTennisCourt posted:

I was teetering on calling it a garbage Mania overall, but the Benoit/Jericho/Angle match is really good and the ladder match is spectacular.

People call 2000 the best year of WWF TV but I don't think it has poo poo on 2001. That's a whole other discussion though.

Gavok
Oct 10, 2005

Brock! Oh, man, I'm sorry about your...

...tooth?


OneThousandMonkeys posted:

This is somehow made better by Snow being a "Only other workers have the right to judge each others' ringwork! gently caress dirtsheetz!" guy.

Also his big thing about how wrestlers on the undercard shouldn't put on fantastic matches because the main event is what's supposed to get huge pops. So good going on that one, Al.

mariooncrack posted:



Using Al's criteria for a good match, he's never had a good match.

Look at Glacier! Look at him give a drat! I really wish he was a good performer because he is so into it and seemed to really love wrestling in a promotion where fans actually celebrated his stupid gimmick.

El Generico
Feb 3, 2009

Nobody outrules the Marquise de Cat!

Gavok posted:

Look at Glacier! Look at him give a drat! I really wish he was a good performer because he is so into it and seemed to really love wrestling in a promotion where fans actually celebrated his stupid gimmick.

Live Audio Wrestling podcast Keep It 100 did an interview with Glacier on their first episode and it sounded like he genuinely gave a gently caress his whole WCW run too. He seemed really cool.

Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005

OldTennisCourt posted:

Another match to consider would be the Hardcore Battle Royale at Mania 2000. The match itself is just dumb 24/7 Hardcore stuff. Nothing awful., the gimmick being whoever gets the final pin at the end of the time limit is the champ. What sets it apart is a botched finish, possibly one of the only major hosed up finishes in Mania history. Basically Hardcore pins Crash with seconds to go. What was meant to happen was time runs out JUST before the three count.

The problem is the crowd is counting down and it looks like the ref hosed up the count with that and hits three, giving the title to Hardcore and loving up the correct finish.

This is also the match where Hardcore calls Cole a little shithead in a post match interview, Cole mumbles a fearful response while JR calls Hardcore classless and apologizes.

Hell Mania 2000's also has a poo poo match with Al Snow (this is looking like a pattern) and a pretty poo poo main event as well.

For the purposes of this thread, I don't think this match even comes close to being one of the worst matches.

rare Magic card l00k
Jan 3, 2011


Any match that ends with the winner insulting Cole is good.

Beef Jerky Robot
Sep 20, 2009

"And the DICK?"

mariooncrack posted:



Using Al's criteria for a good match, he's never had a good match.

God Al Snow sucks

Gavok
Oct 10, 2005

Brock! Oh, man, I'm sorry about your...

...tooth?


El Generico posted:

Live Audio Wrestling podcast Keep It 100 did an interview with Glacier on their first episode and it sounded like he genuinely gave a gently caress his whole WCW run too. He seemed really cool.

I got to talk to him during intermission at one of the shows and he really was a nice guy. He was telling me about how Norman Smiley is a great guy and way more hard-working and badass than people realize. But being that we were at a Chikara show and knowing what I now know, in retrospect, he was probably thinking of Sara Del Rey the whole time.

Name Change
Oct 9, 2005


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=455JJ4CSjT8

To me this is in my top 5 Michael Cole moments because I hate him so much.

OldTennisCourt
Sep 11, 2011

by VideoGames

OneThousandMonkeys posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=455JJ4CSjT8

To me this is in my top 5 Michael Cole moments because I hate him so much.

It's the little "Well...I...ah....uhh..." from Cole that sells it.

OJ MIST 2 THE DICK
Sep 11, 2008

Anytime I need to see your face I just close my eyes
And I am taken to a place
Where your crystal minds and magenta feelings
Take up shelter in the base of my spine
Sweet like a chica cherry cola

-Cheap Trick

Nap Ghost

Gavok posted:

Also his big thing about how wrestlers on the undercard shouldn't put on fantastic matches because the main event is what's supposed to get huge pops. So good going on that one, Al.


Look at Glacier! Look at him give a drat! I really wish he was a good performer because he is so into it and seemed to really love wrestling in a promotion where fans actually celebrated his stupid gimmick.

I think what probably killed Glacier more than anything was Bischoff wanting a sweet karate mortal kombat guy and not realizing just how terrible that would work out in execution.

EugeneJ
Feb 5, 2012

by FactsAreUseless

Gavok posted:

Yeah, back in the 2008 tournament they did this bit where the team Los Ice Creams didn't have a third partner so they kept picking names out of a hat. Names of people who obviously weren't going to be there (ie. "Ice Man" King Parson). After some "no shows," they mentioned Glacier, which seemed like a fakeout, but then he showed up after all in full armor. The crowd ate it up and it made sense that in the year after, there would be a Glacier-based team to follow on that.

Glacier's surprise debut at King of Trios 2008 is what got me to buy my first CHIKARA DVD

Mystery Opponent
Sep 27, 2006

but u was a real nigga
i could sense it in u

El Generico posted:

He seemed really cool.

That was his gimmick, yo

Anyone knows if big dave ever rated this :
https://youtu.be/P4zYfaTBLk0

Because holy poo poo it's terrible

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010
I actually think Glacier's an okay wrestler. No better than "okay" but far worse wrestlers than he have gotten far bigger pushes.

Basic Chunnel
Sep 21, 2010

Jesus! Jesus Christ! Say his name! Jesus! Jesus! Come down now!

Rodney the Piper posted:

Hardy vs. Sting counts, it was a match.
Did Dave never rate it? It's the only explanation for why it's not on his list

oatgan
Jan 15, 2009

Yep. There's a whole bunch of matches that are godawful that Dave didn't even bother rating

OJ MIST 2 THE DICK
Sep 11, 2008

Anytime I need to see your face I just close my eyes
And I am taken to a place
Where your crystal minds and magenta feelings
Take up shelter in the base of my spine
Sweet like a chica cherry cola

-Cheap Trick

Nap Ghost

Basic Chunnel posted:

Did Dave never rate it? It's the only explanation for why it's not on his list

He gave it minus one star

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010
Presumably it was over quick enough that he only gave it the minus one

That DICK!
Sep 28, 2010

The minus star system confuses and enrages me

Benne
Sep 2, 2011

STOP DOING HEROIN
Dave used to be way more liberal with negative star ratings than he is today

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Setter is Better.
I think you were more likely to get an absolute garbage match on TV/PPV back then too. Was re-watching some Nitros and there was this insanely awful 15+ minute Public Enemy/Nastys match with absolutely no storytelling, botched spots all over the place, and an awful finish that Dave gave a -* to. That match was so much worse than any RAW match I've seen in like forever

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007




Grimey Drawer

OneThousandMonkeys posted:

Goons were ironically liking NWA Mountain State for about a full year or so, and got one of their wrestlers to post on here.

The sheer cardio on display in that ring. Business is about to pick up.

There were occasionally legit good matches in MSW, and I think the one iPPV type deal they had was legitimately worth the money. But the thing with MSW is that it was/is a lot of why we love wrestling with no pretense, and through a goofy-rear end, low budget, West Virginia lens.

coconono
Aug 11, 2004

KISS ME KRIS

Alain Post posted:

I think you were more likely to get an absolute garbage match on TV/PPV back then too. Was re-watching some Nitros and there was this insanely awful 15+ minute Public Enemy/Nastys match with absolutely no storytelling, botched spots all over the place, and an awful finish that Dave gave a -* to. That match was so much worse than any RAW match I've seen in like forever

i loved those series of matches. we need more of those than alberto and sheamus wandering through rest holds

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Setter is Better.
that match was so loving boring, that was the worst part. It felt like 30 minutes.


now a few months prior to that, there was a Nastys/Road Warriors/Steiners match which pretty much entirely consisted of everyone doing really sloppy, dangerous looking botches and it was loving awesome.

Benne
Sep 2, 2011

STOP DOING HEROIN
I'll take Sheamus and Orton trading chinlocks for 15 minutes over whatever the gently caress Public Enemy and Nasty Boys were trying to do

coconono
Aug 11, 2004

KISS ME KRIS

Benne posted:

I'll take Sheamus and Orton trading chinlocks for 15 minutes over whatever the gently caress Public Enemy and Nasty Boys were trying to do

kill each other. thats what they were trying to do. Nasty Boys won.

OldTennisCourt
Sep 11, 2011

by VideoGames
Considering Rumble's, which one was the one that had an absurd amount of old guys and random rear end people showing up because the roster was hosed? I think it was 2012 because I recall seeing a clip where all three commentators went in as well as like 5 old guys and then Karma showed up for that match and then disappeared.

Edit: That Rumble also gave us Sheamus going to Mania that year and beating Bryan in 18 seconds making the Rumble seem like an even bigger waste of time.

OldTennisCourt fucked around with this message at 16:33 on Jan 27, 2016

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010

coconono posted:

kill each other. thats what they were trying to do. Nasty Boys won.

:golfclap:

britishbornandbread
Jul 8, 2000

You'll stumble in my footsteps

Rusty Shackelford posted:

For the purposes of this thread, I don't think this match even comes close to being one of the worst matches.

You are probably right, but I am halfway through watching WM2000 for the first time on the network and the battle royale is truly awful. You have spots taking place all over the place around the outside of the ring that no one except the people in good seats can see and the production truck can barely keep up with the action. The concept doesn't really work, even in kayfabe, as why would anyone want to win early put a bullseye on their back?

Not the worst ever, but a bit of a train wreck.

OldTennisCourt
Sep 11, 2011

by VideoGames

britishbornandbread posted:

You are probably right, but I am halfway through watching WM2000 for the first time on the network and the battle royale is truly awful. You have spots taking place all over the place around the outside of the ring that no one except the people in good seats can see and the production truck can barely keep up with the action. The concept doesn't really work, even in kayfabe, as why would anyone want to win early put a bullseye on their back?

Not the worst ever, but a bit of a train wreck.

The biggest issue for me in that Battle Royale was probably the realization that it was as far as Tazz was ever going to go on the card as an active wrestler. Sure he got the tag belts with Spike (what the gently caress?) but he never got the push he deserved to get.

Mania 15 has a really really poo poo match as well: The infamous Taker and Boss Man Cell match that ends with Boss Man getting hung in the middle of the ring after a garbage match. It was heel vs heel too, a really tough dynamic to work with,

Aesop Poprock
Oct 21, 2008


Grimey Drawer
So what's the deal with AL Snow? Didn't he used to be a competent if not exactly stellar wrestler? Did Mick Foley just completely destroy his soul by making him a punchline? He comes off like the most miserable gently caress in all of wrestling next to the honky tonk man now

sticklefifer
Nov 11, 2003

by VideoGames

OldTennisCourt posted:

Sure he got the tag belts with Spike (what the gently caress?)
ECW fandom was a much more powerful thing at the time.

HOTLANTA MAN
Jul 4, 2010

by Hand Knit
Lipstick Apathy

Aesop Poprock posted:

So what's the deal with AL Snow? Didn't he used to be a competent if not exactly stellar wrestler? Did Mick Foley just completely destroy his soul by making him a punchline? He comes off like the most miserable gently caress in all of wrestling next to the honky tonk man now

Al Snow always sucked IMO. I watched him/Gangrel at capital carnage 98 yesterday on the network and he made loving Gangrel look like the greatest worker ever.

Al Snow was loving poo poo.

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Setter is Better.
Al Snow was supposedly good in SMW and IMO he wasn't bad in the Bodydonnas. But yeah he fell off a cliff after that.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Cool Buff Man
Jul 30, 2006

bitch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LY4YcbyDxJw&t=60s

  • Locked thread