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Applewhite posted:I must be the only person who read The Dark Tower that wasn't bothered by King's cameo. It's uninventive and crude. Didn't they have to save him to keep the world from crumbling ala Never Ending Story? It's been a long time so I'm mostly going on my anger about it when I read it. The ending, by itself, I could excuse. It technically fits. But the whole arc of them going back to save King was unnecessary, as I remember it, shoehorned in. And sure, other writers have expressed the same idea. But other writers didn't write themselves in. We deride writers for making their Mary Sue's too obvious. Roland is not really a Mary Sue. Hell, King isn't a Mary Sue either, because he needs saving... if writers did that more often we'd have a term for it. But writers don't do it, because it's loving vanity and hubris.
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Feb 9, 2016 21:21
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DiHK posted:It's uninventive and crude. Didn't they have to save him to keep the world from crumbling ala Never Ending Story? It's been a long time so I'm mostly going on my anger about it when I read it. Besides, auto-rhetoric asphyxiation kills.
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Feb 9, 2016 21:26
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DiHK posted:It's uninventive and crude. Didn't they have to save him to keep the world from crumbling ala Never Ending Story? It's been a long time so I'm mostly going on my anger about it when I read it. "Hubris" is gilding the lily a little. I doubt King is going to be fatally undone by inserting himself into his story. Anyway, I don't think it's out of line for a fictional character who is supposedly entering "reality" to confront their creator. If King had invented a fictional author who had created an in-universe novel that featured the heroes as characters, I doubt there would be as much objection. But the fact is they only have one real author and it's King and if poo poo's going to get really really real they're gonna have to confront him at some point and if he dies, then their story ends. Anyway, wasn't them "rescuing" him just a metaphor for how his passion for working on the Dark Tower series motivated him to clean up his life?
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Feb 9, 2016 21:32
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shame that clint eastwood is too old to play roland. wonder how theyre gonna handle all the "drat honky" talk from susanna when roland is black himself. they could just reverse roles and make her a crazy racist white lady instead i guess. should be interesting to see how it turns out.
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Feb 9, 2016 22:38
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DiHK posted:No... The roont village was cute but only the first book was the only actually good. It's like Dune IMO, descending in quality until King took a big poo poo on it when he wrote himself in. although it's more of a spinoff wind in the keyhole was cool aswell imo
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Feb 9, 2016 22:43
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Applewhite posted:"Hubris" is gilding the lily a little. I doubt King is going to be fatally undone by inserting himself into his story. I think you are granting King WAY too much credit here. That said, you are welcome to. Literary Professors and the like have been making a living exaggerating the abilities of hack, mediocre, competent and gifted authors until they are politely agreed upon to be nearly-omnipotent psychic artist-paragons for decades. I additionally agree that with all else that was painfully bad in the series- and the comparison to LOST is apt- one can certainly say it wasn't King's greasy self-insertion that would have been the straw to break the camel's back. Hell, by the time he did it most people who'd read that far were already committed to seeing it through to the end anyway. More's the pity for them, us, as King- who perhaps reasonably has a huge problem with writing endings- elects to shove his difficulties on the readership as them just being assholes for wanting some manner of conclusion. Actually it dawns on me that The Dork Tower series wasn't even the straw that broke ME regarding King's work. That honor goes to CELL and a scene in which two near-brainless levitating psychic psuedozombies fistfight while levitating- over ownership of a firetruck. ... And I have just learned that book was made into a movie. Don't think I'm going to watch that. Not even for Samuel L. Jackson. The Snark fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Feb 9, 2016 |
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Feb 9, 2016 22:44
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Applewhite posted:Anyway, wasn't them "rescuing" him just a metaphor for how his passion for working on the Dark Tower series motivated him to clean up his life? Yes. This is pretty obvious when Roland and Eddie talk to King in his house. He talks about how he channels characters and stories but also that he's a fat piece of poo poo. Then later, King says to his wife that he's had sudden inspiration to finish the series and also stop drinking and start exercising. To the people who were annoyed by the meta elements in the series, you have missed the point . The world of The Dark Tower is a place for King to let his weird writer brain go completely free. How writers write and how living characters evolve are major story elements, they just don't become so explicit until book 5. Even in the first book though, he was Roland Son of Stephen fighting a servant of the Crimson King.
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Feb 10, 2016 03:14
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Oh. My. Zeus. posted:Yes. This is pretty obvious when Roland and Eddie talk to King in his house. He talks about how he channels characters and stories but also that he's a fat piece of poo poo. Then later, King says to his wife that he's had sudden inspiration to finish the series and also stop drinking and start exercising. I don't think we missed the point I think we just think it's incredibly dumb.
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Feb 10, 2016 04:20
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Applewhite posted:"Hubris" is gilding the lily a little. I doubt King is going to be fatally undone by inserting himself into his story. Hell yes it's gilding the lily; that's my vanity, sweetheart. You're right, it would not bother me as much if King had dressed up his own cameo as well as Roland or any of the others. Maybe it would have bloated an already needless detour but w/e, it would have required some effort (just more evidence that it should have been cut). It's like when you have these really famous and talented artists and musicians that start releasing absolute turds because no one wants to tell them "that sucks". He admits that what we do have is just snippets from this "uber-novel" that represents the memory palace of his fiction. The concept of the fiction writer god is perfectly valid, and fits in the context, but after several long eye-rolling segments this felt like lazy literary masturbation. King wen't through a traumatic thing, and he absolutely should write about it, but save that poo poo for Tumblr Steve. Oh. My. Zeus. posted:The world of The Dark Tower is a place for King to let his weird writer brain go completely free. How writers write and how living characters evolve are major story elements, One of those things is story, and the other one is auto-fellatio. This is why editors exist. 
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Feb 10, 2016 04:20
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I'm just relieved because my ex who has the ka tattoo poo poo tried to get me to read it and if I would have gotten through four books to have king write himself in I may have killed her
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Feb 10, 2016 04:21
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oh god. I've read this whole series through 3 times
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Feb 10, 2016 04:24
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I like to think that in the alternate dimension where king writes a whole series as good as the first book everyone dies of the flu or robot/vampires attack or something, like here in our reality we are safe
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Feb 10, 2016 04:43
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Smash it Smash hit posted:I'm just relieved because my ex who has the ka tattoo poo poo tried to get me to read it and if I would have gotten through four books to have king write himself in I may have killed her Ka tattoo? She has a tattoo of the word ka??
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Feb 10, 2016 04:44
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Oh. My. Zeus. posted:Yes. This is pretty obvious when Roland and Eddie talk to King in his house. He talks about how he channels characters and stories but also that he's a fat piece of poo poo. Then later, King says to his wife that he's had sudden inspiration to finish the series and also stop drinking and start exercising. The conceit that anyone who doesn't like something *I* like must simply fail to *GET* it is a very old one and can be found in intellectuals of all flavors on down to bronies and juggalos. Sure, it's technically possible. There probably are a few people out there who's disdain is entirely the function of misunderstanding the text and whom, if they had understood, would like it for some reason. It's just sheer vanity to imagine it's anything approaching the majority.
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Feb 10, 2016 11:47
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Smash it Smash hit posted:I don't think we missed the point I think we just think it's incredibly dumb. Yeah this
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Feb 10, 2016 12:20
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The Snark posted:The conceit that anyone who doesn't like something *I* like must simply fail to *GET* it is a very old one and can be found in intellectuals of all flavors on down to bronies and juggalos. Pls come over here and say what you just said to fans of Evangelion.
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Feb 10, 2016 12:53
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I'm crazy enough to do it too. I'd say PM me with the place to go, but Abe banned my platinum away in ye olden days and quite frankly I can't be arsed to re-buy it. Tell you what, just quote me wherever. Close enough.
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Feb 10, 2016 13:05
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I'm torn between wanting to read to weird Dr. Doom fan fiction and just burning all the books in a pyre. I bought them all because my mate was praising them as the greatest and best thing ever but I got to book 4 and just didn't give a poo poo about some cowboy falling in love so stopped.
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Feb 10, 2016 13:58
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If anyone read dream catcher, it's practically a retelling of his experience getting hit by that car. Oh and aliens, psychic special needs children, and possible schizophrenia.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:09
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ChogsEnhour posted:I'm torn between wanting to read to weird Dr. Doom fan fiction and just burning all the books in a pyre. I bought them all because my mate was praising them as the greatest and best thing ever but I got to book 4 and just didn't give a poo poo about some cowboy falling in love so stopped. Compromise. Read Wolves of the Calla, then burn it all. Actually don't. That pains me even to suggest as a joke, however crappy I personally feel the books are. Give them to someone who is desperately bored and can get away with reading to alleviate it.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:09
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Wolves wasn't that bad until the Snitch throwing Doom Bots.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:11
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Universe Master posted:Wolves wasn't that bad until the Snitch throwing Doom Bots. I think the snitch throwing Doom bots would have been alright if he'd provided some sort of justification, either in the form of symbolism or something pragmatic like "the bad guy were deliberately invoking familiar imagery in order to blah blah blah." I remember thinking it was cool when reading the actual chapter, but being disappointed afterwards that there wasn't more to it. Like it might have been cool if the whole snitch throwing Doom thing had been related to some sort of twisted, Thursday Next-type interfictional organization.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:17
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notZaar posted:Ka tattoo? She has a tattoo of the word ka?? No it's like some circle with a k it's stupid
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Feb 10, 2016 14:20
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Universe Master posted:Wolves wasn't that bad until the Snitch throwing Doom Bots. The dialogue is really grating though with all the "do ya"s and "thankie" etc. It annoys me more and more each time I read it (I think I've read the whole series around 11 times by now). But yeah it does have its good parts. The sixth is my least favorite but even it has some pretty good sections. The only thing I didn't like at all about the seventh was the crimson king "fight" and everything to do with Patrick Danville, so overall it was pretty good, but those two things are so bad it ruined it for me. I still have no problem reading it though. The first time I read through the fourth one I hated it - I started reading it on an airplane and got about halfway through and didn't give it another chance for about a decade. Now I think it's one of the best though, unless you don't like backstory/character development. The love story part is kind of irrelevant to the main plot i guess and seemed more like a standalone novel, but it has grown on me.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:20
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One thing I think we can all agree on is that Oy is the best character.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:22
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Smash it Smash hit posted:No it's like some circle with a k it's stupid Kosher?
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Feb 10, 2016 14:27
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Smash it Smash hit posted:No it's like some circle with a k it's stupid That's the symbol for kosher foods on groceries lmao
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Feb 10, 2016 14:28
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Applewhite posted:One thing I think we can all agree on is that Oy is the best character. A lot of the book barn thread people seem to think Oy is what ruined the entire series and I just don't understand how anyone could htink that
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Feb 10, 2016 14:29
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Murphy Brownback posted:A lot of the book barn thread people seem to think Oy is what ruined the entire series and I just don't understand how anyone could htink that There's something unnatural going on in the "serious" media discussion threads I tell you what.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:33
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I've got no beef with Oy. Guessing when you have imagineered all of the actual crap away you have to find some sort of scapegoat for why it still stinks. The parrotdog was fairly harmless, let's blame that.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:42
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notZaar posted:That's the symbol for kosher foods on groceries lmao I'm on my phone but just type in ka symbol dark tower and its that thing it's a k with an a being made at the bottom of the k
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Feb 10, 2016 14:54
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For real though I legit call any adventuring group in any story a "Ka-Tet" since it's a great single word descriptor for the core protagonists of a story.
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Feb 10, 2016 14:57
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Because of the importance of ka to the world of King's Dark Tower, many phrases in the High Speech use the word ka, such as: ka-babbies: young ka-tet members. ka-tel: a class of apprentice gunslingers. ka-mai: ka's fool. ka-me: ka's wiseman; the opposite of ka-mai. kas-ka: a prophet ka-shume: a unique feeling that a ka-tet is destined to break soon. te-ka: ka's friend. Can'-Ka No Rey: the red fields of none, where the Dark Tower lies. tet-ka can Gan: the navel (specifically, the navel of Gan). kas-ka Gan: singer of Gan's song/ prophet of Gan. ves-ka Gan: Song of the Turtle http://darktower.wikia.com/wiki/Ka Symbol front and center here. It's KA. In a circle. Like a mystical cattle brand. Latest Dark Tower Movie News : A Bunch of Crying Ka-Babbies.
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Feb 10, 2016 15:01
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Applewhite posted:There's something unnatural going on in the "serious" media discussion threads I tell you what. This is why I hate it when threads about star wars and whatever get gassed in GBS. I want to talk about nerd poo poo with people who aren't utter fanboy lunatics.
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Feb 10, 2016 15:02
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If you bought all the signed limited books when they came out the whole set is worth like 15k. Regular 1st editions only like $1200. Only the first four worth anything.
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Feb 10, 2016 15:02
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That's commala crazy!
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Feb 10, 2016 15:02
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The Snark posted:Because of the importance of ka to the world of King's Dark Tower, many phrases in the High Speech use the word ka, such as: Kaka means poop
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Feb 10, 2016 15:05
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My GOD, this was so OBVIOUS. Surely this could not have been a mistake by King?! What... what could ka-ka be then- Why, it's the series itself! Clearly King hints here that he is in fact trolling the reader. Well played Mr. King. Well played. All is forgiven. The Snark fucked around with this message at 15:14 on Feb 10, 2016 |
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Feb 10, 2016 15:11
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The Snark posted:Because of the importance of ka to the world of King's Dark Tower, many phrases in the High Speech use the word ka, such as: The last half of that list is from book 5 on when King decided to go full Tolkein with the nonsense made up words. He even cops to it in the epilogue of one of them.
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Feb 10, 2016 15:15
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Also agreed that Oy is the best thing about the books and anyone who disagrees is a huge kaka.
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Feb 10, 2016 15:18
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