Valor - This System Isn't Even My Final Form

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Valor - This System Isn't Even My Final Form

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

As someone who just bought it recently and skimmed through it, it kinda reminds me a bit of Mutants & Masterminds / 4e (powers and combat, respectively) crossed with the Final-Fantasy-ish games Super Console and Zodiac (stat/level relation and more powers). This looks pretty promising so far.

Something I'm kinda sorta missing at the moment from my skimming is some kind of henshin flaw (aka "Go through your stock footage transformation sequence to gain access to your powers"). Then again shows with such a dedicated combat form don't really make it a problem to just transform right before the fight starts, so why should I?

Doresh fucked around with this message at 19:01 on Feb 15, 2016

# ¿ Feb 15, 2016 18:56

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# ¿ Apr 27, 2024 23:43

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

ProfessorProf posted:

For the kind of transformation where you chage up and unleash your true latent power to turn the tables, that's a Transformation, a kind of Ultimate Technique. You get one every 5 levels, and they can be a transformation or a super attack.

Yeah, I've seen that stuff. Very DBZ, I must say.

# ¿ Feb 15, 2016 19:03

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

While we're at clarifications, does using Muscle Guard still count as getting actually hit by the attack, including whatever additional effects the attack has? For example, unless the attack has Piercing Strike, the numbers don't really seem to make it likely for the attacker to have a high enough Damage Increment that can actually get through the target's Defense or Resistance.

# ¿ Feb 20, 2016 00:45

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

ProfessorProf posted:

Muscle Guard does not count as getting hit by the attack, so no other effects proc, but the chip damage taken is also unaffected by def/res. So, if an attack does 100 damage and immobilizes, the attacker has a DI of 10, and the defender has 30 defense:

On a hit: 100-30=70 damage, immobilized.
On a regular miss: 0 damage, not immobilized.
On a Muscle Guard miss: 10 damage, not immobilized.

This does result in some weird interactions with absurdly high defense vs. very weak attacks where a miss does more damage than a hit - these circumstances are super rare, and my houserule that I ought to talk about doing for errata is either that Muscle Guard doesn't take chip damage if the damage dealt would be less than the DI, or that any attack that hits automatically does at least DI damage.

Aaah, now it makes sense. A miss is still a miss, but there's a tradeoff.

I'd probably go with the houserule as it doesn't change too much in the grand scheme of things. Then again, the imagine of someone like roided-out Muten-Roshi getting hurt by a puny attack because he flexed his muscles too hard is hilarious.

ProfessorProf posted:

It's a bit time-consuming before you get used to it - I can put one together in 5 minutes, but it takes some system mastery before that happens. We're working on a monster manual right now to make that easier.

I think what can work for more generic bad guys (or those from a similar school of fighting) is to make some level-up packages beforehand, based on what role you want him to play.

# ¿ Feb 20, 2016 07:47

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

Eopia posted:

So I'm unsure about how Combination Attack actually works. Does it let you take the rest of your turn after making said combination attack after your allies turn resolves? Can you delay your turn after having used your Support and Move actions but not your attack, or is using it basically making a Slow action attack that resolves on your allies turn?

It mentions how your Initiative is set to right before your ally, so you probably take your turn before the attack. And I think it just requires whatever Action you need for the attack you're trying to pull off.

# ¿ Feb 20, 2016 23:28

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

Mmh, since Initiative Limit seems to be a permanent reduction, is there a way to get your Initiative up again?

# ¿ Feb 21, 2016 17:34

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

ProfessorProf posted:

There isn't - however,to run into that limit, you'd have to be extremely slow or use the technique something like ten times in a single scene. I've never seen it happen.

So it's basically a funky version of Ammunition?

# ¿ Feb 21, 2016 18:20

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

Ferrinus posted:

* The system would seem to inherently discourage splitting between different kinds of attacks because you can only max out so many attributes and not making one of those Guts has its own problems. Why include the Energy Attacker and Physical Attacker skills when they just push you further in that direction, and otherwise represent a "well, no duh" automatically-spent-SP to anyone who likes doing damage?

Due to the level cap on attributes, you probably have ample points to keep one energy and physical attribute quite high.

And I think those Attacker skills can work the other way around, as a mens to keep the damage on one of your weaker attack types high if your main one isn't cutting it.

And a Guts-focused build sounds pretty boss. Once your Valor is high enough, you can use Resolve to defend against anything without penalty. And there's even a skill that lets you attack with Resolve.

Doresh fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Feb 24, 2016

# ¿ Feb 24, 2016 21:16

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

AweStriker posted:

Well, it lets you roll Resolve to hit. The actual damage still needs to be based on something else.

Well, you could add some Debilitating Strike for debuff utility, or use Piercing Strike for a bit of Death of a Thousand Cuts.

EDIT: Plus you probably have enough spare points for a main damage attribute.

Doresh fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Feb 24, 2016

# ¿ Feb 24, 2016 22:04

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

lesyay posted:

But really the game is fantastically balanced, and I don't think I've seen any builds that are completely ineffective.

Now we just need a guide about building ineffective characters. What's a good name for the opposite of "min-max"?

# ¿ Feb 25, 2016 19:40

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

Kaja Rainbow posted:

Spread out your stats evenly. Don't favor any one. Get a bunch of one TP techniques. Pick action skills and don't use them at all.

Put all your points into energy attacks. And then get only physical techniques.

# ¿ Feb 25, 2016 20:21

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

ProfessorProf posted:

The chief sources of inspiration/research for the mechanics during development were things like Dragon Ball Z, Bleach, One Piece and Naruto. Valor was built by and for the latter kind of manchild.

It also looks to me like it would work great for stuff based on Monster Hunter, Devil May Cry, Dynasty Warriors and a couple tactical RPGs. Gotta write some stuff up I guess. Wanna see how the almighty hip check of Plesioth translates to the tabletop.

Oh, and I think I found a little omission: The XP reward for Swarms isn't listed. I suppose it's the same as an Elite, as they are roughly equivalent in difficulty?

And what happens if you're a Balanced Fighter whose base Active Skills are all equal? Do I freeze the game XD ?!

Doresh fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Mar 19, 2016

# ¿ Mar 19, 2016 07:51

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

ProfessorProf posted:

If all your Active Attributes are the same, then none of them are lower than your highest one, so it would have no effect.

(You probably shouldn't do this.)

Gotcha. Just trying to look for anti-optimization options.

# ¿ Mar 19, 2016 13:33

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

What does adding Limits to a Mimic Core do, seeing how it's basically just a slot to put other Techniques into?

# ¿ Apr 15, 2016 19:37

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

AweStriker posted:

I'd probably say they apply to the original Mimic Core but not the mimicked technique.

I had a strange thought myself about how the Push or Pull limits could work on a Rush Attack with Reposition - since you're moving through the target as you attack them, they can't be moved closer to you since you're in the same space for that instant, so Pull would just hold them in place; any direction is farther away for the same reason, so Push doesn't actually limit it at all.

I'm just a bit confused with Mimic because Mimic doesn't actually have any Stamina cost or Action associated with it. You just immediately go for the Technique you've mimiced.

Maybe a Pull Rush could have you drag the target behind you XD ?

# ¿ Apr 15, 2016 21:31

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# ¿ Apr 27, 2024 23:43

Doresh: Jan 7, 2015

HidaO-Win posted:

Just got the Valour core book after paying the punitive shipping to Ireland.

Any ideas for how to emulate a character that's primarily a human only shapeshifter, specialises in misdirection and appearing where he shouldn't be?

There are definite combat applications for that power, I'm just wondering if people have any ways to translate it into the crunch.

Cheers for any help.

I'd say Mimic might also be a good idea in order to copy Techniques for more authenticity.

# ¿ Apr 23, 2016 12:59

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