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GreenTea4Breakfast
Feb 17, 2016

good morning, friends
Succinctly, with updates to follow:

My 23-year-old sister is bipolar and has had problems with compulsive shopping in the past -- a couple hundred dollars of credit card debt that my mother paid off. She has also spent financial aid money on herself (i.e., on electronics rather than on school supplies), including tuition reimbursements to my parents.

Last night, I learned that she has accumulated $11,000 of debt this year. She's still being cagey about what exactly she bought; she says some of the purchases she's gotten receipts for don't sound like her but might be anyway, and the very fact that she doesn't remember makes me inclined to think that few if any are fraudulent. In a conversation with our mother, she threatened to use our grandmother's social security number to take out a loan, which makes me wonder if she's already used other people's information in acquiring credit.

My parents are about seventy and about eighty, respectively, and just last week my mother just lost her job as a teacher in a manner that drove her near suicide, her rationalization being that my father could then sue the school district and win enough for the family to live comfortably on. That being the case, I don't want them to have to shoulder this burden alone, but I've never dealt with a financial problem of quite this magnitude.

Some obvious first steps: Ask her to cut up her credit cards; determine what she spent and where; return the items we can return and sell whatever we can't; get her in to see her psychiatrist, whom she hasn't been able to visit regularly due to the cost. What other information do we need and what other steps should we take?

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Rat Patrol
Feb 15, 2008

kill kill kill kill
kill me now
If you think she's committing fraud, look into it. Check your credit report, your parents', any other relative whose SSN she somehow knows. You can check your complete reports for free once a year online, here.

GreenTea4Breakfast
Feb 17, 2016

good morning, friends

Huntersoninski posted:

If you think she's committing fraud, look into it. Check your credit report, your parents', any other relative whose SSN she somehow knows. You can check your complete reports for free once a year online, here.

Thanks, I'll get right on that.

The crazy thing is that she shouldn't know anyone's, but I can't afford to assume she was bluffing.

devtesla
Jan 2, 2012


Grimey Drawer
You might get better answers in the BFC forum.

GodsGiftToWomen
Jan 26, 2004
Providing women with sexual pleasure since 1983
Gun Saliva
Seconding that you need to check your credit report and maybe even look into establishing some identity protection for yourself and your family members.

GreenTea4Breakfast
Feb 17, 2016

good morning, friends

Cool. Is crossposting all right or do I need to appeal to a mod to move this thread?

Mirthless
Mar 27, 2011

by the sex ghost

GreenTea4Breakfast posted:

Succinctly, with updates to follow:

My 23-year-old sister is bipolar and has had problems with compulsive shopping in the past -- a couple hundred dollars of credit card debt that my mother paid off. She has also spent financial aid money on herself (i.e., on electronics rather than on school supplies), including tuition reimbursements to my parents.

Last night, I learned that she has accumulated $11,000 of debt this year. She's still being cagey about what exactly she bought; she says some of the purchases she's gotten receipts for don't sound like her but might be anyway, and the very fact that she doesn't remember makes me inclined to think that few if any are fraudulent. In a conversation with our mother, she threatened to use our grandmother's social security number to take out a loan, which makes me wonder if she's already used other people's information in acquiring credit.

My parents are about seventy and about eighty, respectively, and just last week my mother just lost her job as a teacher in a manner that drove her near suicide, her rationalization being that my father could then sue the school district and win enough for the family to live comfortably on. That being the case, I don't want them to have to shoulder this burden alone, but I've never dealt with a financial problem of quite this magnitude.

Some obvious first steps: Ask her to cut up her credit cards; determine what she spent and where; return the items we can return and sell whatever we can't; get her in to see her psychiatrist, whom she hasn't been able to visit regularly due to the cost. What other information do we need and what other steps should we take?

How the gently caress did she get an $11,000 dollar line of credit? :psyduck:

(Oh god. Your parents are on all of her credit cards, aren't they?)


GreenTea4Breakfast posted:

Thanks, I'll get right on that.

The crazy thing is that she shouldn't know anyone's, but I can't afford to assume she was bluffing.

Yeah if she mentioned it the idea is in her head already and she is one manic swing away from stealing from family if she hasn't already. It would probably be a good time to start pulling credit reports.

GreenTea4Breakfast
Feb 17, 2016

good morning, friends

Mirthless posted:

How the gently caress did she get an $11,000 dollar line of credit? :psyduck:

This is what none of us could figure out. Apparently it's multiple lines via PayPal, Amazon, etc. -- which would still seem to me to require some degree of falsification.

Mirthless posted:

(Oh god. Your parents are on all of her credit cards, aren't they?)

We didn't even know she had more than one until yesterday!

Canine Blues Arooo
Jan 7, 2008

when you think about it...i'm the first girl you ever spent the night with

Grimey Drawer
Is there any legal way of controlling her spending? If not, then I'd make sure that however she's getting credit, that you distance yourself and your family from that (don't co-sign anything ever), and then let her deal with the consequences.

I mean, IANAL and all, but legally removing your family from her financially seems like an extremely good idea.

SurfaceDetail
Feb 17, 2016

by Cowcaster
Get lifelock or the equivalent for all your family members and check your credit report every few months for the next year or two. It'll be worth the money.

green chicken feet
Nov 5, 2015

spray-paint the vegetables
dog food stalls
with the beefcake pantyhose
Grimey Drawer
Being that she's an adult apparently not about to be committed to a mental hospital or something, there may not be much you can do to control her. Take the steps you can to protect yourself under the law, as others here have recommended. Checking credit reports, freezing your credit.

Check out this guide on how to freeze your credit. This costs maybe $5 or $10 per credit bureau and makes it hard for anyone to open loans in your name.
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0497-credit-freeze-faqs

I'd recommend seeing a financial counselor, as he or she may know exactly what to do next. Part of this may involve being willing to prosecute if anything illegal has occurred.

There are also the radio call-in programs The Dave Ramsey Show and The Clark Howard Show where you might get some good answers for free. I've heard people call in with similar situations.

GreenTea4Breakfast
Feb 17, 2016

good morning, friends
Some good news: We've gotten the total down to about five thousand dollars. Updates to follow when I have time.

Canine Blues Arooo posted:

(don't co-sign anything ever)

Funny thing -- this all came out because my parents refused to co-sign a loan.

Burt Sexual
Jan 26, 2006

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Switchblade Switcharoo
My WIFE makes good money, like 70k/year. She came out about having 25$k in credit debt. I was furious. I can't imagine being unemployed (presumably) and having 11k of debt with no way to pay it off.

defectivemonkey
Jun 5, 2012
I'll move this tonight. Until I get to a real computer, I'll let E/N address the mental illness side of things.

Blistex
Oct 30, 2003

Macho Business
Donkey Wrestler

GreenTea4Breakfast posted:

My parents are about seventy and about eighty, respectively, and just last week my mother just lost her job as a teacher. . .

Totally unrelated, but how the hell is one still a teacher in their 70's?

devtesla
Jan 2, 2012


Grimey Drawer

Blistex posted:

Totally unrelated, but how the hell is one still a teacher in their 70's?

Pensions aren't what they used to be.

Archives
Nov 23, 2008

Blistex posted:

Totally unrelated, but how the hell is one still a teacher in their 70's?

And she had a kid at 50?

Palisader
Mar 14, 2012

DESPAIR MORTALS, FOR I WISH TO PLAY PATTY-CAKE

Archives posted:

And she had a kid at 50?

Possibly adoption?

Blistex
Oct 30, 2003

Macho Business
Donkey Wrestler

Palisader posted:

Possibly adoption?

Do they even adopt to people that old?

defectivemonkey
Jun 5, 2012
Sorry, I'm an rear end in a top hat and forgot to move this until now :(

slap me silly
Nov 1, 2009
Grimey Drawer

SurfaceDetail posted:

Get lifelock
Please don't get this, it is a scam. Freeze your credit in the usual way, already mentioned.

defectivemonkey posted:

Sorry, I'm an rear end in a top hat and forgot to move this until now :(
:argh:

froglet
Nov 12, 2009

You see, the best way to Stop the Boats is a massive swarm of autonomous armed dogs. Strafing a few boats will stop the rest and save many lives in the long term.

You can't make an Omelet without breaking a few eggs. Vote Greens.

Blistex posted:

Do they even adopt to people that old?

They do if GreenTea4Breakfast's sister was taken into state care and their mum was the only family member willing/able to take in the kid.

Also, it's not completely unheard of - my friend's mum was significantly older than the other parents when we were in school. Might not have been 50, but she would have been well into her 40s when she had my friend.

Elephanthead
Sep 11, 2008


Toilet Rascal
Retail credit is easy to get. Some retailers don't even do a credit check. Between the item markups and insane interest rate they do ok. God Bless America. You sister is likely to be a lifetime credit spender. If you pay off her debt she will just run up more. Until she pays it off herself, she will never understand why buying on credit is bad. My mother in law is the same. I offered to pay off her dumb 21% interest credit card in exchange for her canceling the card. She refused because she might need to use the card in an emergency even though it has no credit left on it. It is cheaper to just let her keep the cards at max limit then to give her the opportunity to run up more debt. Eventually they will stop offering her credit. (I hope) Anyway you have to let people live their lives even if they don't do what you want them to do. (Unless you are a Republican then you throw them in jail.)

Centripetal Horse
Nov 22, 2009

Fuck money, get GBS

This could have bought you a half a tank of gas, lmfao -
Love, gromdul

Blistex posted:

Totally unrelated, but how the hell is one still a teacher in their 70's?

My ex-wife's mother taught for 44 years, then retired and taught as a substitute for a couple more. She was 70 +/- a couple of years when she finally retired for real. Some people want to have something to give them purpose, or just want to keep the money coming in.

GreenTea4Breakfast
Feb 17, 2016

good morning, friends
Thank you to the mods for moving this thread! It's been a whirlwind month; we have returned enough that the total is now down from $13K (my sister underestimated) to about $4K. Other updates and answers to questions, including information about medication that I hope could be useful to other people with bipolar:

My sister and I were each adopted from different parents at birth. Adoption is, I think, one of the roots of her lack of a sense of self-worth: Her mother didn't realize she was pregnant for months during which she continued to drink heavily, and, like some children whose sensitivity is heightened by alcohol and psychological factors, my sister has always had a deep awareness of the loss of her real family (her words) despite never having lived with them. That she has now met her biological parents and knows how poorly-equipped they would be to take care of her has only heightened her grief and anger.

My mother is still working in part to provide for my sister.

We do have some good news on the psychiatric front: Her doctor determined that her behavior was a rare side-effect of a drug called pramipexole. Looking at some of her purchases, which included insurance policies on musical instruments she didn't own, it's easy to believe that she made them while in an altered state of mind; she says she experienced physical pain when she tried not to order anything. These potential side-effects aren't even listed in the information to patients, which is alarming, but mostly I'm relieved that her doctor told us rather than attempting to conceal it to protect himself.


The bad news is that my sister had problems with compulsive spending before this major episode and continues to after it: Assuming her grandmother would loan her the four thousand dollars, my sister spent her entire paycheck and didn't make the minimum payments on her credit. She has no savings for rent when she graduates and has lost her front-desk job. The question of whether she could live with family is seriously complicated by her hostility toward my parents.

Perhaps unsurprisingly, my sister has neglected her schoolwork all semester, so my mother spent much of March and April helping her catch up; having spent six years on a BA because of routine breakdowns like this one, she really needs to graduate this may. After graduation, God only knows what's next. We're trying to find out if she qualifies for Social Security benefits and, in the meantime, welcome any advice.

Mr.AARP
Apr 20, 2010

I was born after Kurt Cobain died. Now you feel old.

It might not be severe enough, but look into lithium treatments if she has been diagnosed as bipolar.

Jacobin
Feb 1, 2013

by exmarx

Mr.AARP posted:

It might not be severe enough, but look into lithium treatments if she has been diagnosed as bipolar.

Lithium doesn't work for everyone - and yes its scary since its a very long-term medication - but in general its the most chill possible course of medication than the newer less understood stuff that people end up changing/adjusting more often. Most people can adjust to function close or the same as they would without the whole crazy episodes that destroy everything phenomenon.


--
RE OP:

As a person diagnosed as Bipolar Type I for whats it worth I empathize with your situation greatly. Yes, if you are out of it, clicking or not clicking a bunch of Amazon orders or whatever else thats happened that seems at the time like nothing in that state but ends up a huge problem for yourself or family and the shame and regret is hard to deal with following such actions.

Your sister deserves and needs to be diagnosed, to receive disability support such as social security (they deny almost everyone the first time) and ultimately programmed towards accepting lifelong brain-borne illness to move forward.

I can only say that its possible to be completely empathetic, understanding of a persons real struggle and issues and also have zero tolerance for the kinds of behaviors you describe that affect surrounding families.

My experiences and information really though relate to a different country with a very different legal-social regime about admitting people to hospital and treatment against their 'will' when in a state of mania for example. Good luck

Jacobin fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Apr 24, 2016

Burt Sexual
Jan 26, 2006

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Switchblade Switcharoo
Does your sister have FAS?

Womens Jeans
Sep 13, 2007

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
Cancel all her credit cards and get her to put a lock/freeze on her credit with the credit agencies so that she cannot physically open more credit cards.

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Burt Sexual
Jan 26, 2006

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Switchblade Switcharoo

Womens Jeans posted:

Cancel all her credit cards and get her to put a lock/freeze on her credit with the credit agencies so that she cannot physically open more credit cards.

How many jeans you own?

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

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