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OXBALLS DOT COM
Sep 11, 2005

by FactsAreUseless
Young Orc

Fat Shat Sings posted:

This thread brings up the most heated argument in SA's history, next to Gun vs Katana, .999 = 1, and Plane on Treadmill.

Could a human with any amount of training and conditioning beat a gorilla in hand to hand combat?

Depends, how do you define beat?

In the wild or a stand-up ring fight?
Get them to surrender or is it a fight to the death?

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The Bananana
May 21, 2008

This is a metaphor, a Christian allegory. The fact that I have to explain to you that Jesus is the Warthog, and the Banana is drepanocytosis is just embarrassing for you.



Of course to the death. Animals don't recognize "Uncle!", idiot

OXBALLS DOT COM
Sep 11, 2005

by FactsAreUseless
Young Orc
Confrontations in nature are rarely to the death. Unless babies are involved, then it's game on

The Bananana
May 21, 2008

This is a metaphor, a Christian allegory. The fact that I have to explain to you that Jesus is the Warthog, and the Banana is drepanocytosis is just embarrassing for you.



Mange Mite posted:

Confrontations in nature are rarely to the death. Unless babies are involved, then it's game on

When do babies fight to the death?

Iron Crowned
May 6, 2003

by Hand Knit

The Bananana posted:

When do babies fight to the death?

Someone has never had to fight a baby

LGD
Sep 25, 2004

then no, super-duper no

as far as large primates go, even the most physically impressive humans are comparably weak

we have large advantages in other areas (and not just the obvious difference in mental acuity/social organization, we have physical advantages too, some of which play into why we're not as strong), which is why we're in a position to put all the other large apes in cages at fairly minimal risk, but a bare-handed deathmatch is entirely playing to their strengths while removing almost all of our own

Fat Shat Sings
Jan 24, 2016

Roylicious posted:

An average human or can we do like Andre the Giant v a gorilla?

Any human with any circumstances. Through natural training is it possible to best a gorilla in a fight.

Ruggan
Feb 20, 2007
WHAT THAT SMELL LIKE?!


apparently the kid fell into another exhibit that day too... heres some recently uncovered security footage:

Ruggan
Feb 20, 2007
WHAT THAT SMELL LIKE?!


if this little tyke fell into MY pen, id bash him against the wall too



only thing allowed in my pen (moms basement) is my keeper (mom)

Roylicious
Feb 21, 2012

Braver than the cops
ain't afraid of no chaps
If they steppin up on me
I just start bustin some caps
I feel like a gorilla could rip an average human's limbs clean off no matter how hard the human trained.

The Bananana posted:

When do babies fight to the death?

When there aren't enough teats to suckle on

Ichabod Tane
Oct 30, 2005

A most notable
coward, an infinite and endless liar, an hourly promise breaker, the owner of no one good quality.


https://youtu.be/_Ojd0BdtMBY?t=4
Put me in a ring with a gorilla and a wounded child in the middle and we'll see who loving wins.

Ruggan
Feb 20, 2007
WHAT THAT SMELL LIKE?!


Roylicious posted:

I feel like a gorilla could rip an average human's limbs clean off no matter how hard the human trained.

People say this poo poo a lot, but is it actually true? I know gorillas are super strong and could break all your bones and rip off your face, but dismember strong? How many pounds of force does it take to rip off a human arm?

Roylicious
Feb 21, 2012

Braver than the cops
ain't afraid of no chaps
If they steppin up on me
I just start bustin some caps

Ruggan posted:

People say this poo poo a lot, but is it actually true? I know gorillas are super strong and could break all your bones and rip off your face, but dismember strong? How many pounds of force does it take to rip off a human arm?

I dunno but this video shows a gorilla breaking the trunk off a banana tree I assume to get the grubs and stuff inside:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4amRA0jl0qI

Those trees are pretty rubbery and strong as far as I know?

Apes/monkeys just have way more muscle mass and strength in their ligaments/tendons. Google tells me in the 20s they did a 'pull strength' test, the men could only pull 150-200 lbs but a chimpanzee which was relatively small pulled almost 850 lbs. And that was a captive chimp that had no idea what a pulley was so he didn't have the same leverage the men had.

Roylicious fucked around with this message at 19:02 on May 31, 2016

The Bananana
May 21, 2008

This is a metaphor, a Christian allegory. The fact that I have to explain to you that Jesus is the Warthog, and the Banana is drepanocytosis is just embarrassing for you.



Blacktoll posted:

Put me in a ring with a gorilla and a wounded child in the middle and we'll see who loving wins.

:raise:

Iron Crowned
May 6, 2003

by Hand Knit

Blacktoll posted:

Put me in a ring with a gorilla and a wounded child in the middle and we'll see who loving wins.

No handicaps on the child fighters dude, that's just cheating

Cthulu Carl
Apr 16, 2006

Roylicious posted:

When there aren't enough teats to suckle on

Also when a new male moves in.

Though that's less of a fight than a murderfest to get rid of the old male's genetic heritage and to bring the females into estrus for new rounds of mating.

Lemon
May 22, 2003

So do police/child support agencies decided to investigate cases based on petitions or am I missing something here?

Ichabod Tane
Oct 30, 2005

A most notable
coward, an infinite and endless liar, an hourly promise breaker, the owner of no one good quality.


https://youtu.be/_Ojd0BdtMBY?t=4
If someone gets a gorilla who will obey the Marquess of Queensberry rules consider me toxxed to fight it. I'll take the Pepsi challenge.

Tumble
Jun 24, 2003
I'm not thinking of anything!

Ruggan posted:

People say this poo poo a lot, but is it actually true? I know gorillas are super strong and could break all your bones and rip off your face, but dismember strong? How many pounds of force does it take to rip off a human arm?

A chimp can pull over 1200 pounds on a dynamometer (though one chimp did 847 pounds one-handed so it may be higher than 1200lbs). A human can do... Maybe 400. 450-500 if they've trained for it. That chimp has enough power to badly mangle your arm or leg if it were to try to specifically attack and pull on it. Given a few extra tugs it very well could pull an arm off it tried to, especially if it has leverage.

A gorilla could probably tug you apart without trying all that hard.

bawk
Mar 31, 2013

Lemon posted:

So do police/child support agencies decided to investigate cases based on petitions or am I missing something here?

change.org is just a great way for idiots to gather together and sign their names on a big list to feel vindicated about being outraged over something without having to face any kind of counterargument or question their viewpoint, now stop asking questions and grab my dick so we can keep this circle unbroken

Roylicious
Feb 21, 2012

Braver than the cops
ain't afraid of no chaps
If they steppin up on me
I just start bustin some caps
Gorilla v Human like that seems unfair though, it handicaps the human by removing our greatest advantage. Give us our tools, that fight would definitely go in the human's favor.

Might as well say who would win a Chess match, human or gorilla?

Tumble
Jun 24, 2003
I'm not thinking of anything!

Roylicious posted:

Apes/monkeys just have way more muscle mass and strength in their ligaments/tendons. Google tells me in the 20s they did a 'pull strength' test, the men could only pull 150-200 lbs but a chimpanzee which was relatively small pulled almost 850 lbs. And that was a captive chimp that had no idea what a pulley was so he didn't have the same leverage the men had.

That test result you're referring to was ONE HANDED! Another chimp did 1200lbs without trying.

(Also quote ≠ edit, sorry for the double post.)

Ichabod Tane
Oct 30, 2005

A most notable
coward, an infinite and endless liar, an hourly promise breaker, the owner of no one good quality.


https://youtu.be/_Ojd0BdtMBY?t=4

Roylicious posted:

Gorilla v Human like that seems unfair though, it handicaps the human by removing our greatest advantage. Give us our tools, that fight would definitely go in the human's favor.

Might as well say who would win a Chess match, human or gorilla?

God dammit Roy, I know that you're an enormous pussy liberal but where is your American Pride? I'll fist fight a gorilla for the red white and blue anyday if the week. And if he wins, god dammit, I'd buy him beer. Because while he might be backwards and mentally stunted, everyone loves a cold one.

Nonsense
Jan 26, 2007

The gorilla looked uninterested in the kid. Good job killing an animal over some future juvie

LGD
Sep 25, 2004

Fat Shat Sings posted:

Any human with any circumstances. Through natural training is it possible to best a gorilla in a fight.

then sure, the human wins easily because through training they know how to use tools and manipulate their environment, so even if they're restricted to what they can manufacture themselves from a natural environment, the gorilla is likely going to lose because it will die of puncture wounds at the bottom of a pit/bleed out from getting repeatedly hit with poisoned atlatl darts/etc.

humans are specialist tool users- part of the reason we'd lose automatically in bare handed combat is the same reason we win in the real world, the flexible tendons/ligaments that make us relatively weaker give us much more precise/refined motor control than the other great apes

The Bananana
May 21, 2008

This is a metaphor, a Christian allegory. The fact that I have to explain to you that Jesus is the Warthog, and the Banana is drepanocytosis is just embarrassing for you.



Blacktoll posted:

God dammit Roy, I know that you're an enormous pussy liberal but where is your American Pride? I'll fist fight a gorilla for the red white and blue anyday if the week. And if he wins, god dammit, I'd buy him beer. Because while he might be backwards and mentally stunted, everyone loves a cold one.

I don't want to encourage you to post more, but I will say I enjoyed this post. Honestly, I'm torn.

Roylicious
Feb 21, 2012

Braver than the cops
ain't afraid of no chaps
If they steppin up on me
I just start bustin some caps

Blacktoll posted:

God dammit Roy, I know that you're an enormous pussy liberal but where is your American Pride? I'll fist fight a gorilla for the red white and blue anyday if the week. And if he wins, god dammit, I'd buy him beer. Because while he might be backwards and mentally stunted, everyone loves a cold one.

Yeah I guess winning in the face of insurmountable odds is pretty American.

I mean I'd love to watch a gorilla fight a human don't get me wrong. I might look away once it starts getting bloody like in the first 5 seconds but you know.

Nonsense
Jan 26, 2007

Crash_N_Burn posted:

Oh the prehumanity

Blazing Ownager
Jun 2, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Mustard Snobbery posted:

this wouldn't have happened if the gorilla had a gun

The Gorillas learned the same lesson

Ichabod Tane
Oct 30, 2005

A most notable
coward, an infinite and endless liar, an hourly promise breaker, the owner of no one good quality.


https://youtu.be/_Ojd0BdtMBY?t=4
I like you Roy, you're silly and ignorant but you're honest.

But you're also wrong. I'm not fighting the gorilla. The gorilla is fighting me.

Blazing Ownager
Jun 2, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Roylicious posted:

Might as well say who would win a Chess match, human or gorilla?

Remember that scene in Star Wars where they suggest Chewbacca will tear your arms off if you beat him at chess?

My point is gorillas always win at Chess

Nonsense
Jan 26, 2007

Anybody gone apeshit in Ohio yet? Some PTSD vet opened fire on his high-value property neighbors in Houston before being downed by an officers bullet.

8-Bit Scholar
Jan 23, 2016

by FactsAreUseless
There's an issue of Preacher where an evil redneck kills a gorilla with his bare hands.

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.
What if the child has a suit of futuristic power armor?

Cthulu Carl
Apr 16, 2006

8-Bit Scholar posted:

There's an issue of Preacher where an evil redneck kills a gorilla with his bare hands.

I hope that makes it into the series

Booblord Zagats
Oct 30, 2011


Pork Pro
Imagine bein a feller who suplexes a gat-dang gorilla in plain view of the adoring public.

You'd never have to buy your own beer, thats for sure

The Bananana
May 21, 2008

This is a metaphor, a Christian allegory. The fact that I have to explain to you that Jesus is the Warthog, and the Banana is drepanocytosis is just embarrassing for you.



cheerfullydrab posted:

What if the child has a suit of futuristic power armor?

I'll try to work this into the screenplay

Fat Shat Sings
Jan 24, 2016

LGD posted:

then sure, the human wins easily because through training they know how to use tools and manipulate their environment, so even if they're restricted to what they can manufacture themselves from a natural environment, the gorilla is likely going to lose because it will die of puncture wounds at the bottom of a pit/bleed out from getting repeatedly hit with poisoned atlatl darts/etc.

humans are specialist tool users- part of the reason we'd lose automatically in bare handed combat is the same reason we win in the real world, the flexible tendons/ligaments that make us relatively weaker give us much more precise/refined motor control than the other great apes

I'm sure we could use our higher intellectual capacity to befriend the gorilla, establish a routine where it allows us near it, then we can just poison it slowly or something.

But we are talking about a fist fight here.

Basically I want to start my own reality series where you get crossfit people that think they can take a gorilla to sign waivers then get into fights with them. The qualifying round would be to survive against a chimpanzee without losing your face.

Do it ironically
Jul 13, 2010

by Pragmatica

Lemon posted:

So do police/child support agencies decided to investigate cases based on petitions or am I missing something here?

yeah bro the police are going to go to the hood to check on the welfare of a black child <---- lmao

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OMG JC a Bomb!
Jul 13, 2004

We are the Invisible Spatula. We are the Grilluminati. We eat before and after dinner. We eat forever. And eventually... eventually we will lead them into the dining room.
Breaking: Mother Plans to Celebrate Son's Miraculous Escape from Gorilla Pit with Grand Canyon Trip

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