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 Marco Polo was Netflix's attempt at creating their own Game of Thrones' feudal palace intrigue with a huge budget and bold press ads and it didn't work out so great. Many people were put off by the wire-fu (which isn't actually used very much) and some pretty poor opening episodes. I'll be honest, if I hadn't been sick at home and had had something else to watch I would've quit in the first two episodes but I'm very glad I didn't because the last half of the season redeemed the show to me. It went from an easy C- to a strong B+ and actually has me looking forward to season 2. If you stuck around though you were rewarded with a story that has many layers to it with a lot of subtleties that after seeing 3x I was still noticing new things for. Another pro for the show is that (despite some it didn't) it avoided a lot of tropes. Marco isn't sold or delivered as a white savior, his journey in season 1 was him really affecting very little and it was almost entirely the Asian cast who carried the bulk. It also has very strong female characters who don't need them no mans. It also wasn't afraid of making a Muslim the most honorable and selfless person on a show with Christians/Buddhists. No update on how the Anti-Muslim Defense Force plans to counter this nefarious Islamization of media. This ain't TVtropes motherfucker get to the characters already. Okay! Characters-  Marco Polo - Son of a traveling merchant who never met his father until he was an adult. After meeting his father, who is the head of their traveling merchant group along with Marco's uncle, Marco sneaks onto his father's trip through Kublai Khan's kingdom. His father alternates between a huge piece of poo poo and a loving father which leads to Marco being left as a slave to Kublai's court. Most of season 1 is Marco coming to terms with his servitude, learning Mongol society and charting a course through serving an emperor whose moods fluctuate even worse than his father's and avoiding the court's constantly shifting sands.  Kublai Khan (Benedict Wong) - Emperor of one of the largest empires in human history (over 25% of the world's population at the time) Kublai's empire is very diverse. He invites and allows all religions in his kingdom despite his royal court wishing him to stop. All of his liberalism has equal and opposite negatives however; his mood is ever changing, he's prone to throwing temper tantrums, commits monstrous war crimes and he is seen as weak by many of his subjects and royal court which has led to repeated civil wars. Kublai ended the first civil war by killing his brother in combat, after uniting all of China into his kingdom by defeating the last Song holdout he inadvertently triggered another civil war that carries on to season 2.  Hundred Eyes (Tom Wu) - Hundred Eyes is a blind Taoist, Confucius, or whatever philosophy he needs to be to deliver the sickest burns at any particular time warrior monk. When his people went to war with Kublai, he killed roughly 9 billion of Kublai's soldiers before being captured and was afterwards blinded by Kublai. Hundred Eyes doesn't really seem to hold any grudges over it because even blinded nobody fucks with him. He now serves as Kublai's chief martial arts instructor who has trained Kublai's children and top members of the court, including Marco. He's easily the most lethal fighter in the show and despite giving Marco the best training around has to save Marco from the antagonist of season 1 because Marco lasted roughly 2.1 nanoseconds himself.  Empress Chabi (Joan Chen) - Kublai's first and favorite wife, mother to his heir designate, and played by an actress who apparently doesn't loving age. Chabi is the closest to a humanitarian the show has, she believes in feeding the poor but is ruthless to anyone she believes puts her family in danger. Like all Mongol women she is a master of the bow. While she isn't the only wife of Kublai she is his favorite and he heeds her advice above all others (except his ever changing own). She is the mother of Jingim, Kublai's favorite son, and defends his position as heir equally as ruthless.  Prince Jingim (Remy Hii) - Jingim begins as a massive whiny bitch forever pouting about perceived slights whether real or imagined. He is a major antagonist to Marco due to jealousy stemming from Marco being Kublai's new favorite pet. It isn't until the later half of the season where you start to realize Jingim has a lot to be bitter about, his father is a bipolar baby who abuses him both mentally and physically, along with Kublai surrounding him with Chinese teachers and advisors which has led to the Mongol side of the royal court rejecting him as heir. Last seen running face first into history's first guns then being carried away by history's slowest ambulance while finally realizing Marco isn't his enemy.  Ahmad (Mahesh Jadu) - Also technically a slave since childhood, he now serves as the minister of finances in Kublai's court and runs it with ruthless efficiency. Forget to deposit tax revenue? Your rear end is getting wrapped in a rug and run over by horses. He has no moral compass and his advice is to always go to war, where he will then swoop in and make sure Kublai gets his due. At the end of season 1 we find out Ahmad has been manipulating events to overthrow Kublai and become emperor himself.  Yusuf (Amir Waked) - Technically a Muslim slave, he serves as Kublai's minister of war. He spends the entirety of season 1 trying to avoid war at all turns (his work being sabotaged by Ahmad). He serves as the moral compass of most of the season battling both Ahmad's and Kublai's disastrous policies. Ultimately he realizes he is incapable of protecting Kublai from himself and sacrifices his life to not only save Marco but the Mongol empire by claiming to have sabotaged the failed war effort against the Song dynasty that served as a critical blow to Kublai's popularity and would have led to another civil war.  Byamba (Uli Latukefu) - Bastard son of Kublai, Byamba is still allowed in the royal court due to his fierce fighting and unwaivering support of his father. He has no place in the succession, which is something his half brother Jingim brings up constantly, though they are still friends. Many see Byamba as the son that deserves to lead the Mongol empire after Kublai which also infuriates Jingim. Season 1 establishes that Byamba begins a relationship with Khutulun, daughter of Kaidu, the leader of the second Mongol civil war.  Kaidu (Rick Yune) - Leader of the House of Ogedei, the second largest army under Kublai's kingdom, he sees weakness in Kublai and Kublai's court and succession. He is the father of Khutulun, a daughter he raised as a son who becomes Byamba's girlfriend. Kaidu wishes for Kublai to close the kingdom to all other religions and outsiders. He secretly wishes to replace Kublai or at the very least have Byamba replace Jingim as heir. He has supported Kublai in many wars but due to Kublai's arrogance, losing two of his sons in battle and Kublai's erratic behavior he ultimately declares the second civil war of the Mongol empire.  Khutulun (Claudia Kim) - Daughter of Kaidu, she is a fierce warrior and wrestler. Chabi and Kublai adore her. She leads part of Kaidu's army. Prior to Kaidu declaring civil war she is in a relationship with Byamba. Kaidu refuses to let her marry or date until someone beats her wrestling first, which no one ever did until Byamba. Despite that she openly hosed Marco (and I mean openly, like out in full public view) in one of the early episodes so I think a writer lost a few pages of the script or something because nobody knows what the gently caress that was about.  Kokachin (Zhu Zhu) - A former slave servant to the real Kokachin, known as the Blue Princess, when Kublai's army conquered them the real Kokachin committed suicide while her servant posed as her to avoid being butchered. She is now a slave to Kublai and as the last of her (supposed) royal family she serves as diplomatic marriage material. She is perpetually kept guarded by eunuch body guards but despite this begins a romance with Marco before ultimately being promised to be wed as Jingim's fourth wife.  Jia Sidao (Chin Han) - Off and on leader of the only Chinese empire left resisting Kublai for season 1, the Song dynasty. He was perpetually in power struggles with the dying Chinese emperor, the emperor's wife later on, and his own sister Mei Lin, who was a concubine of the emperor's and with whom she had a daughter with. Sidao is the most ruthless character on the show and due to having grown up poor he relied on his sister's prostitution to survive before she began prostituting herself to the royal court for Sidao. He rose through the court due to her and it led to him deeply despising his sister and prostitutes so much that he binds the feet of his niece just to stop her from dancing (which reminds him of his sister). Sidao is no ceremonial general, he is the best fighter of his army but ultimately dies to Hundred Eyes after effortlessly owning Marco.  Mei Lin (Olivia Cheng) - Sister of Jia Sidao, prostitute, royal concubine, assassin, mother. After the Chinese emperor dies Sidao begins forcing Mei Lin to carry out his will or he will kill his own niece, Mei Lin's daughter. Mei Lin attempts to assassinate Chabi only for Chabi to put an arrow through her. Mei Lin is kept alive by Chabi due to understanding Mei Lin only acted out of necessity for her daughter, however Mei Lin despises the Mongol nation and begins plotting with Ahmad to overthrow Kublai. Love Crime fucked around with this message at 06:11 on Jul 6, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 04:20
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Season 2 begins tomorrow (July 1st). Spoiler tags for first 24 hours Looking forward to season 2. I know a lot of people wrote the show off after giving it a few episodes at most but it was really Spartacus-esque to me and got a whole lot better.
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Jul 1, 2016 04:22
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Great timing on this. I had just finished rewatching season 1 only yesterday. Been on a real big Mongol kick over the past weeks.
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Jul 1, 2016 13:29
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Outstanding, I loved this show. Well, most of the show. I'll be the first to admit it had some rough patches and weird decisions but the cast are stellar and carry the show through those parts.
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Jul 1, 2016 13:55
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Watched the first ep of S2 and the 100 eyes special just before which was okay. The first episode was good and it laid out what to expect from the storyline for this season. I feel like this show seems more real than GOT, I know both use a lot of cgi and are both tv shows but the historical setting and the outdoor scenes are pretty great because they're not over the top.
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Jul 1, 2016 14:04
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drunkill posted:
100 eyes is more unrealistic than dragsons imo Though GOT post season 4+ is poo poo at this point and Marco Polo is good
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Jul 1, 2016 17:53
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Great OP, but one nitpick: Mei Lin was trying to assassinate Empress Chabi, to drive Kublai into a rage, not Kublai himself. I always thought Sidao bound Mei's daughter because of Mei's perceived failure and to motivate her further, rather than his own hosed up poo poo, but I don't remember anymore. Looking forward to this, I thought S1 was really quite good and made better by the unusual setting, at least for Hollywood. Based on the previews, they're taking 100 Eye's wire-fu to new extremes. Normally I really hate that kind of stuff, but it feels more grounded on this show than say, Crouching Tiger or Hero. 100 Eyes might be a badass that can reset his bones mid fight, but at least he's not flitting around on leaves and literally flying through the air like Peter Pan.
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Jul 1, 2016 19:17
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counterfeitsaint posted:Great OP, but one nitpick: Mei Lin was trying to assassinate Empress Chabi, to drive Kublai into a rage, not Kublai himself. Yep you're right about the first one, second one though is what I first thought too but upon rewatch it was definitely about her dancing, he sees his niece dancing in the background and calls her over to him and she's wearing her mother's oversized shoes and she says she wants to be a great dancer like her mother and then the next scene is him deciding to do it. His reason for punishing her is because of Mei Lin, but the reason for that specific punishment is because his weird obsessive hatred with prostitutes. About to begin my S2 binge yay
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Jul 1, 2016 19:57
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Not really a spoiler but just in case I love how Marco constantly gets his rear end kicked. Poor guy runs in and tries his best at martial arts, but nope. If this was a lazy show he'd be just as competent as folks who have been training their whole life after a training montage Edit: Ep1 real spoilers who's heads were those at the end? counterfeitsaint fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 21:17
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That's what I was just going to post about, I know Byamba rode in alone so no idea who the guys were, I imagine we'll get told in Ep2. That room that he's butchering the men in is the same dungeon room that he also kept Hundred Eyes locked up in when he first became a slave. LOL'd at Mei Lin dropping a white savior comment in on the boat. Marco is such a fuckup
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Jul 1, 2016 21:37
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Space Pussy posted:100 eyes is more unrealistic than dragsons imo It always makes me happy when people say GOT is poo poo, because they must be having fun in that trippy rear end bizarro universe that has even better shows on TV. Marco Polo is a pretty solid oriental methadone to it though, I'm looking forward to season 2.
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Jul 1, 2016 22:00
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Anyone have a good season 1 recap. It's been so long I don't really remember what's going on.
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Jul 1, 2016 22:49
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I think this show is fine, I enjoy watching it, I think people are a little too hard on it. That being said, that goddamn painting is hilarious. So is its reveal at the end of season 1. I don't see how anyone could defend that choice. I definitely laughed out loud. More villains need secret paintings detailing their evil plans all over a room. This would increase my enjoyment of television greatly.
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Jul 1, 2016 22:55
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Lame Devil posted:Anyone have a good season 1 recap. It's been so long I don't really remember what's going on.
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Jul 1, 2016 23:00
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Lame Devil posted:Anyone have a good season 1 recap. It's been so long I don't really remember what's going on. S1 recap: -Kublai finally destroys the wall that Genghis never could due to Marco telling him about Alexander's trebuchet, Kublai conquers the Song dynasty . Hundred Eyes kills the Song leader Jia Sidao but the child emperor of the Song manages to evade capture and Kublai sends people searching for him. -In his obsession with destroying the wall Kublai alienated the House of Ogodei led by Kaidu who is now trying to take over -Jingim got shot but survives and is set to marry Kokachin, the Blue Princess that Marco and she are in love with, finally loses his bitterness with Marco -Mei Lin, sister of Jia Sidao, is kept prisoner along with her child (the old Song Emperor's daughter) with Ahmad and they are conspiring to overthrow Kublai too -Byamba is left twisting in the wind unsure of what to do now that his girlfriend is the daughter of the guy challenging Kublai cheerfullydrab posted:I think this show is fine, I enjoy watching it, I think people are a little too hard on it. That being said, that goddamn painting is hilarious. So is its reveal at the end of season 1. I don't see how anyone could defend that choice. I definitely laughed out loud. Yeah, this is Khutulun loving Marco out in the wide open, just really weird. I hope Ahmad's story line ends with a janitor coming in and figuring everything out. Love Crime fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 23:04
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Maybe Ahmad gets Hundred Eyes to clean the place for him. With dual wielded brooms.
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Jul 1, 2016 23:58
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Episode 2: Jesus loving christ, Kublai. I guess we're really supposed to be siding with Kaidu at this point because I can't see how anyone can still support Kublai after that. Also something really unnerving about a 5 year old actor begging for his life. Beginning of Ep 3: ...really? Hanging the child on your battlement was really what you thought you should do in this situation? 
Love Crime fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jul 2, 2016 |
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Jul 2, 2016 00:06
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The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > The TV IV > Marco Polo - Season 2 - Worse than Season 1
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Jul 2, 2016 05:41
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Currently ~40 minutes in to episode 5: Oh no. Oh very very very much, no.
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Jul 2, 2016 06:21
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cheerfullydrab posted:Currently ~40 minutes in to episode 5: This and what he does at the end and this is seriously like they're doing a barrel dive to see which character can become the least likable. Chabi murdering the stable hand, Kublai turning into a wife beating child murderer, Ahmad killing his own mother, christ on a cracker. And Jingim being totally chill all season so far and it's a topsy turvy world. Complete 180 from season 1.
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Jul 2, 2016 10:07
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The dialog between Kaidu's mom and Kublai has been the highlight of the season so far.
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Jul 2, 2016 10:33
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Just finished, that's a hell of a cliff hangar if we're going to have to wait 18 months again for the next seasonBlackIronHeart posted:The dialog between Kaidu's mom and Chabi has been the highlight of the season so far. ftfy
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Jul 2, 2016 10:37
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Oh man, I can't wait for that. Also, I really enjoyed how this scene was framed (EP 4) 
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Jul 2, 2016 10:47
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Welp, just marathoned season 2 and holy hell did this show take a huge leap in quality Also what the gently caress Prester John is real
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Jul 2, 2016 17:02
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cheerfullydrab posted:Currently ~40 minutes in to episode 5: 
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Jul 2, 2016 17:36
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drunkill posted:Watched the first ep of S2 and the 100 eyes special just before which was okay. I think a big part of it is that every set in Marco Polo is physical (there's actually zero CG sets, IIRC I think there's actually zero CG in season 1 outside of the intro animation :O) and that in season 1 at least there are no stuntpeople. So what action there is is very immediately shot. The costumes are also a big part, they're not 100% (like Marco as an example is usually wearing stuff that's tailored a bit too modernly) but in general they're the real deal, like almost textbook. Not that GoT has lovely costumes but a lot of them are "dark fantasy," the real stuff was way more detailed and awesome looking honestly, and Marco Polo really nails that. It's almost cheating since it being in such a diverse place and time allows for massive variety. Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Jul 2, 2016 |
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Jul 2, 2016 17:37
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Bro Dad posted:Welp, just marathoned season 2 and holy hell did this show take a huge leap in quality I thought ep1 was solid, but after that it took a nosedive.
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Jul 2, 2016 18:34
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Iseeyouseemeseeyou posted:I thought ep1 was solid, but after that it took a nosedive. Depends on what you're watching it for. This is not a complicated and thoughtful drama with deep themes, but rather Asian Spartacus. Anything to up the crazy bullshit factor is a good change in my book.
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Jul 2, 2016 19:53
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Neo Rasa posted:I think a big part of it is that every set in Marco Polo is physical (there's actually zero CG sets, IIRC I think there's actually zero CG in season 1 outside of the intro animation :O) and that in season 1 at least there are no stuntpeople. So what action there is is very immediately shot. The costumes are also a big part, they're not 100% (like Marco as an example is usually wearing stuff that's tailored a bit too modernly) but in general they're the real deal, like almost textbook. Not that GoT has lovely costumes but a lot of them are "dark fantasy," the real stuff was way more detailed and awesome looking honestly, and Marco Polo really nails that. It's almost cheating since it being in such a diverse place and time allows for massive variety. Yeah, I'd agree with this. Game of Thrones occasionally looks great but the amount of detail in every costume on this show is fairly amazing, and the cinematography stands out (especially the tracking shot in the first season with the hundreds/thousands of extras) in ways that GoT doesn't.
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Jul 2, 2016 21:20
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People are finishing so not using spoilers anymore unless you really feel the need to Overall not as enjoyable as season one to me. Not horrible by any stretch though. Episodes 3-7 felt like complete filler material with a very slow pace on top of it. Last season was the same but it had learning Mongol culture at the same time which is something pretty rare in media, so it wasn't bad. This season instead had a big focus on the papacy and I just don't give a poo poo about that. We've all seen it in a billion shows and movies by now. New supporting characters felt very weak and underdeveloped too. Last season we had characters like Yusuf, who I thought was a very complex and interesting character and this season we get things like an old harpy mother crone, a Hundred Eyes love interest, etc. None of them were anything beyond the flimsiest possible motives. Also I can't be the only one who thought they went a little (a lot) overboard on the animal torture. I knew it was off to a bad start with the first scene of the season lighting cages of birds on fire but god drat, then they just keep going with gouging horse's eyes out, setting them on fire, surprise lamb chops, etc. Pretty good cliff hanger though. I'm not loving the thought of crusaders vs mongols for season 3 very much due but now with almost all of season 1 and 2's hanging plot threads cut they can get season 3 off to a good start hopefully. Assuming it does even get a 3rd season. I mean Netflix gave Hemlock loving Grove 3 seasons and wow, but that didn't cost but a fraction of MP. Love Crime fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Jul 3, 2016 |
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Jul 3, 2016 01:07
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ep 7: That Gypsy woman 
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Jul 3, 2016 04:17
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 The horse cgi in episode 9 So bad but so effective.
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Jul 3, 2016 06:40
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Wasn't Marco Polo moderately popular? I had to search for it on netflix to find season 2. Usually Netflix isn't shy about their content.
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Jul 3, 2016 14:47
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Harry posted:Wasn't Marco Polo moderately popular? I had to search for it on netflix to find season 2. Usually Netflix isn't shy about their content. It was moderately popular because Netflix went crazy for the promotion of it before S1, they really wanted to recreate Game of Thrones' appeal but when people watched it a lot of them hated it because the first few episodes were pretty bad. S1 had a Rotten Tomatoes of 24%. The show Spartacus had the exact same problem, first few episodes were objectively terrible then came back to being fantastic, but MP hasn't quite reached that level yet and costs a boat load more money so it might not ever.
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Jul 3, 2016 21:29
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So Prester John is the Night King from GoT?
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Jul 4, 2016 08:05
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I think it's Brian Boitano.
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Jul 5, 2016 00:22
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I like this series a lot. That is all
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Jul 5, 2016 01:47
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Watched this whole season in one sitting the day it came out. Love this show. Lots of Altan Urag this season. Benedict Wong is amazing.
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Jul 5, 2016 08:21
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Rewatching the scene from the first episode when Marco first meets his father, and it's already hinted that the whole plot with the Pope was already in motion. Niccolo talks about being in Jerusalem and being preoccupied with a certain "arrangement". And they were only in Venice so they could meet the bishop.
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Jul 5, 2016 08:23
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I wonder if the show would've done better had it been called "Kublai Khan" or "Mongol" or anything else. edit: An Italian Yankee in Kublai Khan's Court Josh Lyman fucked around with this message at 08:39 on Jul 5, 2016 |
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Jul 5, 2016 08:33
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