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Niggurath posted:You seriously have never heard the tired trope of "Oh she may look like a sexualized 12 year old but she's really a 5,000 year old demon...so it's cool!". I mean that's pretty much a main stay in Disgaea's character roster. Ok, so they used a convention that has been used before. Why is this particular case a parody, as opposed to the numerous examples of this "tired trope" that presumably aren't?
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 11:17 |
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# ? Mar 29, 2024 07:58 |
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Zenithe posted:Ok, so they used a convention that has been used before. Why is this particular case a parody, as opposed to the numerous examples of this "tired trope" that presumably aren't?
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 11:24 |
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Niggurath posted:Because it's clearly a joke? I just can't take the game that uses the word waifu as something to be taken seriously or as biting social commentary. If people were actually looking for a failed attempt at that, then I'm sure they'd play Read Only Memories rather than playing the game with just a guest appearance from a character from that. What about the character or dialog screams "joke" to you? Just because there is rampant evidence that this game was made by total weebs doesn't mean they're parodying any of the cliches they're using. They could just as easily be just using them normally.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 11:43 |
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EclecticTastes posted:What about the character or dialog screams "joke" to you? Just because there is rampant evidence that this game was made by total weebs doesn't mean they're parodying any of the cliches they're using. They could just as easily be just using them normally.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 12:04 |
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Is it some kind of ironic meta-parody where it's played straighter than the source material, and that's the joke somehow?
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 12:18 |
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Please don't put this game on the same level as Snatcher. And while we're at it, mods please rename this thread to Cyberpunk Honeypot Action cause holy poo poo I'm learning things about people I did not want to know. Anoia fucked around with this message at 12:59 on Jul 24, 2016 |
# ? Jul 24, 2016 12:52 |
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What will goons compare this game to next? A) The Shawshank Redemption B) The Holy Bible C) Humans' first use of fire
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 14:02 |
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Really Pants posted:What will goons compare this game to next? You're getting too salty about this Anime VN for nerds.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 14:07 |
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Rigged Death Trap posted:You're getting too salty about this Anime VN for nerds. The high crime of anime
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 14:13 |
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Rigged Death Trap posted:You're getting too salty about this Anime VN for nerds. I'm actually enjoying how awful it all is. I can't wait for the next new customer to come in and say "Man it's so GRIMDARK out there in our post-cyberpocalypse world, I can't believe [something that might have actually been interesting to see] happened today, now can I interest you in some fresh human organs?" or whatever their deal's gonna be Hwurmp fucked around with this message at 14:23 on Jul 24, 2016 |
# ? Jul 24, 2016 14:19 |
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Niggurath posted:Because it's clearly a joke? I just can't take the game that uses the word waifu as something to be taken seriously or as biting social commentary. If people were actually looking for a failed attempt at that, then I'm sure they'd play Read Only Memories rather than playing the game with just a guest appearance from a character from that. You are right, it is a joke. But a joke does not make parody. To be parody you have to mimic something without actually being that very thing. If you make a parody of a racist 4chan meme, and 4chan latches onto it and starts reposting it unironically, you haven't made a parody, you just made a racist 4chan meme. A few days ago I checked the steam reviews for this game and found this: And the devs don't seem to discourage this. In fact can you guess what their twitter avatar is? I bet you can. Similarly to be satire, it would have to be contemptuous of, or at least unapologetically critical of something. Just being silly and making references doesn't cut it. A few posts back I outlined some examples of things you could do with Dorothy that might qualify, but we just did another recording session and surprise, they haven't gone that route. Actually she's gotten worse. Also god drat I was incoherent this last episode. If I start mumbling about vampires again feel free to throw me in the drunk tank.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 15:20 |
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Everyone in the drat thread seems to have unacceptable salt levels. People riffing on the game because they don't like it aren't personally attacking everyone who did enjoy it. People defending the game aren't inherently the scum of the earth attempting to justify moral depravity in all its forms. For gently caress's sake the only reason I'm in this at all is because I wanted to have some booze with internet strangers. We're all adults here, can we ease up with the poo poo-stirring? It's a goddamn LP of an anime visual novel, in a year none of us will even remember this thread. ...I just want us all to be friends.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 15:35 |
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Pavlov posted:And the devs don't seem to discourage this. In fact can you guess what their twitter avatar is? I bet you can.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 15:35 |
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why did you make a video LP of a VN
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:05 |
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Shibbo I think we recorded at least one drunken tirade where you tell everyone who likes this game to go gently caress themselves.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:07 |
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Also I am IRL a woman with a glandular disorder that makes her look much younger than she really is Think Gary Coleman We do exist outside of skeevy anime stuff y'know
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:09 |
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Small Frozen Thing posted:Also I am IRL a woman with a glandular disorder that makes her look much younger than she really is I have good news and bad news lots of people are anxious to marry you
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:18 |
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shibbotech posted:People defending the game aren't inherently the scum of the earth attempting to justify moral depravity in all its forms. This is actually pretty much exactly what you've been suggesting the whole time.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:19 |
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Please quote your sources.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:39 |
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Really Pants posted:I have good news and bad news Oh cool, thanks for the condescending joke Never heard that one before
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:41 |
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Rodyle posted:This is actually pretty much exactly what you've been suggesting the whole time. As caustic as I can come off, I'm going to take a more nuanced position. I think that this game, like a lot of stuff, is easy to glide through without thinking about it too hard. You don't have any dialogue choices, so it doesn't ask you to actually take a position on anything the game brings up. It doesn't really challenge you, and if you give it the benefit of the doubt, it's probably good for a cheap laugh. But this is a game acclaimed for its excellent writing, and that asks you to treat the game as writing, and think about what that writing says. We're saying that what it says just happens to also be awful. Small Frozen Thing posted:Also I am IRL a woman with a glandular disorder that makes her look much younger than she really is I'm confused. Do you identify with the fetish-obsessed sexbot hooker built to look like a 12 year old?
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:53 |
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Small Frozen Thing posted:Oh cool, thanks for the condescending joke Alright, I apologize for being thoughtless. It can't be pleasant, to say the very least, to have a debilitating disorder and see idiots make a fetish out of it, and I shouldn't stoop to that level.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:54 |
Look what this game has done to us. we've turned on each other like rabid dogs. This game is guilty of any crime it may be that.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 16:54 |
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Pavlov posted:I'm confused. Do you identify with the fetish-obsessed sexbot hooker built to look like a 12 year old? More than I do with you, almost certainly. Edit: But really, that's only because she probably wouldn't have made a VLP of a VN.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 17:05 |
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Small Frozen Thing posted:why did you make a video LP of a VN *takes a drink* Small Frozen Thing posted:More than I do with you, almost certainly. And another! Holy poo poo, I was wrong before, it actually does work. Anoia fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Jul 24, 2016 |
# ? Jul 24, 2016 17:08 |
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Why did you make a video LP of a VN
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 17:16 |
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Having now played this game a bit, I can actually agree with the thread premise, re: it is indeed bad. My apologies. I stand by my previous question though.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 17:19 |
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I like the videos because they provide a more authentic experience it feels like I'm right there, clicking on the drink ingredients and the dialogue advance button
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 17:22 |
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To be fair with the whole built to look like a twelve year old I can sort of see a reason for it. They're not emotionally/mentally mature unless they pass 3 tests, as we've been told, at which point they're given an adult body, so the young look is "meant" to be a deterrent from attacking them and they have special nano-bots so that if someone does attack the immature robot they get jailed. However from what I've seen it seems Dorothy completed those tests and then decided that she wanted to specifically target an audience as a prostitute, because she can make them pay more for what is presumably a completely legal way to work out their own disturbed sexual desires, she also just happens to enjoy sex too which explains why she's making a job out of it. Now I'm not saying this is good, and the writing so far has been terrible to mediocre at best, but I can imagine a character like Dorothy being interesting in a much better written game/story. Also didn't notice the DFC model thing which is just in poor taste. The other characters similarly could be interesting in a better written game/story. In my opinion Donovan comes off as the best written because he is the least strange character and thus easiest to write well, which suggests to me the people making this game just aren't particularly clever writers. So what I'm saying is there's some interesting ideas here, it just fails to explore or do anything with them, at least as far as I've seen. Even Ingram could be an interesting character, someone who gives absolutely no shits whatsoever and is sort of the ultimate bad hedonist, who will try anything once because in the cyberpunk future there's no limits beyond your money and he's stinking rich. He could be an interesting mirror of your own situation as given, where you have to pick and choose specific things you enjoy because you're nearly broke and really need money for rent and food, everything else is a luxury. In fact make that a game-play mechanic, at the end of the day you have to spend money wisely or you get various bad endings. Could even work it into a potential ask people to move on mechanic, where if you find a person particularly uncomfortable you can have them removed or pass them on to Gill but in return you don't get as much money, so you really get this idea that your job is lovely but without it you'd just be screwed.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 17:29 |
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IMO if you're going to tackle uncomfortable subjects head on, dont let the uncomfortableness level dip until you've finished addressing it. If you do relent you'd risk muddling your message about it. Which this game quite utterly fails at. It tries to be parody yet wants you to take it seriously enough to connect, then nosedives right back down into parodic scenes and shallow characters, it doesn't fully commit. Parody can be a tool for the exploration of certain subjects, but that's it, a tool. Not the key. And The message doesn't even have to be anything deep or profound, just consistently delivered. [e] Though christ dorothy is most definitely not the way to address that sorta thing. Rigged Death Trap fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jul 24, 2016 |
# ? Jul 24, 2016 18:43 |
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Rigged Death Trap posted:IMO if you're going to tackle uncomfortable subjects head on, dont let the uncomfortableness level dip until you've finished addressing it. If you do relent you'd risk muddling your message about it. Which this game quite utterly fails at. It tries to be parody yet wants you to take it seriously enough to connect, then nosedives right back down into parodic scenes and shallow characters, it doesn't fully commit. Parody can be a tool for the exploration of certain subjects, but that's it, a tool. Not the key. And The message doesn't even have to be anything deep or profound, just consistently delivered. Yes, this exactly. You've got today's internet subculture parodies all jumbled up in the cyberpunk dystopia and they do not mix well at all. The game careens from sex robots, to street warfare, to chan references references... and while it's possible to somehow juggle the heavy poo poo and the comedy like chainsaws and bowling pins, they failed. If you still enjoy it, well, hey, there's still the spectacle of seeing someone fumbling with all that, I guess.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 19:29 |
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By the way, concerning the discussion early on in the last episode, it was Otakon who said it. It's always Otakon. And yes, MGS did start that meme.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 20:19 |
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Small Frozen Thing posted:I stand by my previous question though. SSLPs are tedious to make. If you're going to spend that effort, you need to either (1) be fond of the material, or (2) be an incredible masochist. I do not think Zen is either of those. I don't think he's even finished the game yet. He needs a gaggle of heckling drunks to push him the rest of the way. Small Frozen Thing posted:My apologies. Only if you promise that next time you leap to defend an anime, you will at least watch/play it first.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 20:39 |
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HMS Boromir posted:Also you can call trap sprung on this but I used to hang out in some of the more unpleasant parts of the internet in my teenage years and I'd like to point out that the "DFC" in Dorothy's model number absolutely stands for "Delicious Flat Chest". (Hazy memory corollary: Kira Miki has a similar model designation.) Lord_Magmar posted:To be fair with the whole built to look like a twelve year old I can sort of see a reason for it. They're not emotionally/mentally mature unless they pass 3 tests, as we've been told, at which point they're given an adult body, so the young look is "meant" to be a deterrent from attacking them and they have special nano-bots so that if someone does attack the immature robot they get jailed. However from what I've seen it seems Dorothy completed those tests and then decided that she wanted to specifically target an audience as a prostitute, because she can make them pay more for what is presumably a completely legal way to work out their own disturbed sexual desires, she also just happens to enjoy sex too which explains why she's making a job out of it. If you remove the whole 'appears younger than they are' trope and her explicit intent on capitalizing that trope from Dorothy she fits in with a lot of my experiences with people who are open and accepting about their sexuality. The reactions to people around her support this in that while friendly, she can easily make them uncomfortable. But then you've got the trope layer on top of that which just makes things worse. (It's ok Dorothy, I still like you for who you are. Lets just be friends. No not those kind of friends.)
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 21:14 |
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EponymousMrYar posted:If you remove the whole 'appears younger than they are' trope and her explicit intent on capitalizing that trope from Dorothy she fits in with a lot of my experiences with people who are open and accepting about their sexuality. The reactions to people around her support this in that while friendly, she can easily make them uncomfortable. To give this game credit where absolutely none is due, Dorothy also reminds me of people I've met who loudly proclaim how open and accepting about their sexuality they are, as though people with the social graces not to talk about their peccadilloes incessantly somehow aren't. That is to say, she comes off as someone whose actual personality is so empty and bland that they pretty much have to shock everyone around them with their not-nearly-as-unusual-as-they-believe kinks or stories of their sexual escapades in order to appear at all interesting. If this game actually went anywhere with that, it would make Dorothy at least a character with some modicum of depth.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 21:22 |
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Zenithe posted:There have been several comments regarding why this is a VLP rather than a SSLP, and I feel showing this to people who have mixed amounts of experience with this game to be the most interesting, and that can't really be captured as well through screenshots I feel. As we continue through, this may change.
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 22:05 |
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Pavlov posted:SSLPs are tedious to make. If you're going to spend that effort, you need to either (1) be fond of the material, or (2) be an incredible masochist. gently caress off you sanctimonious turd. I didn't leap in to defend anything. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 23:14 |
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this still doesn't really make sense though
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 23:19 |
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Small Frozen Thing posted:Having now played this game a bit, I can actually agree with the thread premise, re: it is indeed bad. Wait... You never actually even played the game but you came in here saying you identified with Dorothy?
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 23:20 |
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# ? Mar 29, 2024 07:58 |
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Anoia posted:Wait... You never actually even played the game but you came in here saying you identified with Dorothy? whoosh
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# ? Jul 24, 2016 23:25 |