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Rangpur posted:I imported two-thirds of the original DS trilogy from Japan for God's sake, how the hell did this sneak up on me? Also... how is it the 10th game? There's the first three, Justice for All, Edgeworth spin-off, Dual Destinies, Layton crossover, and that one set in the past. Add in this latest, and you're still at nine. There were 2 edgeworth spin-offs
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Sep 9, 2016 03:14
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Only played the first 2 cases but man. The Court Gallery in this game is just made up of the absolute worst people.
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Sep 9, 2016 12:31
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Well, finished my 1st day with this game and it kinda got off on the wrong foot but all in all I felt it was pretty good. Case 1 had a really rough 1st half.Not only did I think the intro was too long, but until Ahnderstand'in shows up the trial is honestly kinda depressing. Like everyone hates Phoenix and wants him dead, and there's not that many jokes or anything. It's just not a great atmosphere. You'd expect Payne to provide some by being pathetic and everything, but Gaspen is just a goddamn scumbag who is not funny at all. The most you've got for some fun is Rayfa because of how easily she reverts to being an embarrassing 13 year old brat, but even then half her lines are "kill the lawyer" or "the lawyer will burn in hell for his insolence". And the case suffers from Phoenix not having a co-council to bounce off of, I didn't realise how essential it ended up seeming to the formula. Rocker Jesus was great though. Case 2 on the other hand I really enjoyed. Some weird solutions in the trial aside I thought it was pretty great. I kinda wished they extended it to 2 days, I think there was enough there if they split the investigation and trial up a bit. Good characters all round, nice to have happy Ema back but it's still good to see some bitterness and curmudgeonyness in some of her trial scenes. Most importantly though Retinz was a fantastic villain for what was a 1 day case with no plot importance (I think). His animations were great, the confrontation with him was great, his motives were good and he made the case really personal not just for Trucy but for the whole Wright Agency. Nahyuta kinda got overshadowed though, and while I like his animations he doesn't seem too interesting. And his thing of not getting all that angry with the defence, but instead just acting super disappointed with them goes a long way into making him hateable. Really though the whole case kinda felt to me like it'd be a much better final case to AJ than what we got for that game. The whole Gramayre thing and how during Retinz breakdown he rants about how he only lost because of Apollo and he still totally beat the Gramayres, is just a really nice moment since the game doesn't point it out but considering Apollo's mom he still lost to a Gramayre anyway. It was a fun case. Anyway, it's been a good game so far. I hope it keeps it up.
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Sep 9, 2016 14:29
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gannyGrabber posted:Uuugh I can't believe I'm going to have to put up with Trucy again. I suppose there's no way to just skip the Apollo sections..? Case 2 rules and Trucy is cool and good.
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Sep 10, 2016 01:19
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Waffleman_ posted:Revisualization was such a small thing for DD to add, but it really really does add SO MUCH to that final turnabout. Thought Route is probably the best single mechanic AA has ever added. It's so good.
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Sep 10, 2016 04:53
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Man, day 1 of Case 3 ends so weirdly.Nahyuta proves the Defence's original assertion that Inmee is a rebel but nobody mentions that this just strengthens Phoenix's case. Like, sure it eventually turns out to make Maya's guilt even more damning but that's only after a guilty verdict's already been handed out. It's like the writers somehow forgot they hadn't shown Inmee being a rebel was bad for Phoenix's argument yet.
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Sep 10, 2016 07:58
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Just finished case 3. And man, the pun game in Khura'in is loving fantastic. I love it. It almost makes up for the depressing tone of the trial segments. Like, everything is usually against Phoenix but it's different when every testimony the crowd shouts about how awful he is and how he should die, and even the Judge who's the least anti-lawyer person in the room is still actively hostile half the time. I'm not sure I enjoy it. Rayfa's pretty good though. She's pretty funny and it's easier to forgive her for talking about executions every few sentences since she's just a kid and doesn't quite get how mean she's being. Also, the implication that the only reason she's so adamant about her country's lovely system and on Phoenix being guilty is because if all that isn't right, she's basically committed a bunch of innocent people to death, is a pretty powerful point of characterisation. And it's a pretty rough thing for a kid to think about. Even if it's kinda undermined by her still insulting Maya and being a tool about channelling even after all that was revealed. She's still cool though and I hope she becomes pals with everyone. Maybe investigates with Apollo and Athena or something. Took a while for the case to get going though. Wasn't fond of day 1 since Datz' testimony was all relatively pointless (even if the dude himself is pretty funny), and i'm just not fond of the seance's. Once Tahrust takes the stand though it becomes really good. The moment I had right before the thought route where I realised why he framed Maya and everything, was just really really sad. The whole ending was great, Beh'leeb confessing to save Maya and indicting the minister of justice and revealing their legal system to be a sham at the same time was great, and basically everyone in the trial agreeing. Even Rayfa to a point. Hell Nahyuta being really receptive to what she and Tahrust said stopped my desire to see him get punched, which I really wanted to happen for most of that case. And i'm really glad Beh'leeb ended up free and ok after all that. Also, Apollo is the adopted brother of Nahyuta and the adopted son of Mr. Badass Defence Attorney Rebel Leader who is planning for a violent revolution against a corrupt government. That was pretty surprising.
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Sep 10, 2016 14:03
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Just started playing case 4. I'm really mad Nahyuta's turned the gallery against Athena. Can we get one case where the world isn't out to get the Defence!! (Though i'm happy the judge is rooting for Athena to be recognised by the prosecution. He's way better than the other judge) Edit: It feels like this is supposed to be a re-do of 5-1 in a way. Where Athena's on her own out there with little experience and a prosecutor who is seeking to win by getting her to quit. Except this time she stays lead attorney throughout and proves them wrong, even if Simon is helping out. SyntheticPolygon fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Sep 11, 2016 |
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Sep 11, 2016 01:58
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I almost feel like case 4 could have been pretty good if it had more time. Outside of Uendo none of the characters really get a chance to shine or assert themselves. Though i'm glad Athena got a case, even if it wasn't super important they didn't have to use her and I think it shows the writers still think of her as an important character. It still has some pretty good moments though, mostly from Simon. Him going on about how Western food is far inferior to Japanese noodles, and being really insistent about it being called "sake" not "rice wine" you uncultured fools. Him being forced to go on a lunch run for the courtroom was pretty great as well, and he even managed to use the old prosecution standby of manipulating the witness into giving benifical testimony for himself for the side of good this time. It was fun having him around. Blackquill, still the best prosecutor.
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Sep 11, 2016 07:58
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VolticSurge posted:So,I've been contemplating getting this game,but the thread seems divided on it. Like apparently the 4th case sucks? I've just gotten started on Dual Destinies, but I've really been enjoying it so far. Would I enjoy this? Yes. It's very good. Case 4 isn't even that bad it's just kind of in a weird place. It probably would've worked better earlier on in the game.
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Sep 11, 2016 10:17
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Just started case 5. Dhurke is an incredibly cool dad and i like him a lot. I'm glad he and Trucy get along. Also man, Apollo's real father. Revealed just like that. Case 5 don't mess around.
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Sep 11, 2016 12:46
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Just finished the first half of case 5. A civil trial was something new, I mean we still got a man convicted for murder but y'know it was different. I feel like more could have been done with Phoenix as the opponent though, he's kinda of a pretty standard prosecution figure for most of it. Even if the moment near the end where Apollo pretty conclusively proves his case and Nick reverts to sputtering out half-formed objections before managing to make one hell of a stupid bluff and buy enough time for a recess, was pretty incredible and almost felt exactly like a regular case. Also, Armie might be one of the best one-off witnesses in the series. She was great, and had some really cool parallels to both Apollo and Athena that allowed them both to help her. I thought it was really cool how it was Athena that got through to her since she also has the experience of having incredible trauma following her mother's tragic death and was able to help her out with that. It's also neat that most of the time in this game the Mood Matrix was helping with actual psychological issues, sure they were dramatised to hell and back but I still liked it. Case 5 has had a pretty good start and have cemented in my mind that Apollo and Athena are hella cool and much better protagonists than Phoenix Wright at this stage. And I am glad they defeated their lawyer-dad (I guess Apollo's 2nd lawyer-dad since he has another) in courtroom combat. They deserved it.
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Sep 12, 2016 00:04
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Justin_Brett posted:Does anyone ever tell Nahyuta to just gently caress off? Even his breakdown animation isn't that satisfying for all the work you have to do to get it. I don't like Nahyuta but his 'getting pelted by rosary beads' animation is very good and you should appreciate it.
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Sep 12, 2016 10:00
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I'm mid way through the day 2 investigation of case 5. And man, Rayfa.....  She has it rough. And her Mum's probably evil too. I hope she makes it out of this ok. I'm surprised at how much i'm liking her. Maybe the best new character in this game? On an unrelated note though Phoenix accidentally becoming pals with noted crazy person Datz Are'bal is one of my favourite small things about this game.  Edit: Oh wow. Just the tiny revelation that Thalassa was travelling with Apollo's dad when the building he and Apollo were in burned to the ground with everything they owned as well kinda changes a few things about how I viewed her in AJ. I mean as far as she knew her husband and son just burned to death and the culprit was an apparent friend. I can't even blame her for returning to the craziest magician family in the world. And then she ends up in a accident, gets amnesia, and disappears a few years later. Apollo's family is surprisingly tragic. SyntheticPolygon fucked around with this message at 11:28 on Sep 12, 2016 |
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Sep 12, 2016 11:07
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Momomo posted:Case 2 was the best case in AA4, which I think says a lot about the quality of that game. It is. The forged evidence colours Apollo's interactions with Phoenix for pretty much the whole game until case 4. Especially early in case 2, where Apollo clearly just doesn't want to work for Nick and is still bitter about the whole thing. Anyway, 4-3 is a real awkward case that relies too hard on the player accepting the premise of the case even if it is really hard to swallow. Moreso than most cases in the series. At least it ain't 4-4 though where every character in the game is sidelined in order to focus on the previous protagonist, who even in better plotted games wasn't the type to be able to carry the story by himself. And then the final trial is just a single testimony, which is just absurdly bad.
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Sep 12, 2016 22:43
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Momomo posted:In a plot where Phoenix using forged evidence a single time lost him his badge, Apollo doing so under the same circumstances without there being an issue seems like pretty shoddy writing. Nobody knows it's forged until after the fact. Where immediately upon realising Apollo decks Phoenix in the face and storms out.
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Sep 12, 2016 22:57
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Waffleman_ posted:Case 4: SAKE IS NOT RICE WINE, YOU BAKA GAIJIN Case 4 pretty conclusively proved to me that Blackquill is the goddamn best and the coolest dude.
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Sep 13, 2016 02:38
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Kay Kessler posted:You hadn't figured that out by 5-3? I didn't know if he'd be able to keep it up outside of his debut game! But he proved me wrong. I never should have doubted him.
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Sep 13, 2016 02:51
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I'm leaving."
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Jeabus Mahogany posted:Take a trip to see a friend, accidentally cause a revolution. Thaaaaaaaaaaaat's Phoenix! *sitcom jingle* Eh. There was already a revolution happening. Phoenix just sorta helped it along, and even then he wasn't the main force for it. Also, case 5 spoilers. I was not expecting the Queen to be the prosecutor. Or have an immediate and incredibly evil image change within 10 seconds of getting on the bench. Seriously, wouldn't be surprised to see her turn someone into a toad or something, or at least decapitate a few heads with that fan of hers.
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Sep 13, 2016 05:04
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Still case 5. Ga'ran is literally changing the law on the fly, what the Hell!!!?? This is nuts. Also, heck yeah Rayfa! Tell your Mother what for. Edit: I can't believe Inga having trouble remembering or recognising Phoenix was foreshadowing for this case. This is getting really good. SyntheticPolygon fucked around with this message at 05:53 on Sep 13, 2016 |
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Sep 13, 2016 05:35
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Case 5 is a loving rollercoaster, holy poo poo. Dhurke is loving dead. He's been loving dead since before the whole case even started. This is a very good videogame.
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Sep 13, 2016 06:28
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Did Amara just loving die as well??!?!?. What in the world is this goddamn case?
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Sep 13, 2016 06:52
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Case 5 day 2 sure was one hell of a ride. Since it was a 1 day trial it was easily the most condensed and dramatic case in the series. Every testimony had a truth bomb or insane twist or two. It was crazy. The Queen is actually an undefeated super prosecutor who can change the law to suit her whims and aid her prosecution!!! Rayfa's random attendant is actually the former Queen, Dhurke's wife, who supposedly died 23 years ago!!! Dhurke is actually loving dead and Maya's been channeling him for the entire case!!! Seriously, the player never even interacts with him while he's alive!! Rayfa's real Mom and Dad are actually Amara and Dhurke and Amara's been working with Ga'ran partially for Rayfa's safety! Nahyuta is only such a huge rear end in a top hat because the Queen is using Rayfa as a hostage! Ga'ran literally just loving shoots her sister while she's on the goddamn stand!!!! Apollo's real Dad who has no loving relevance due to being dead for 23 years is the secret key piece of evidence which solves the entire case!!! Ga'ran just brands the gang terrorists surrounds them with guns and almost publicly executes them!!! Apollo manages to dethrone the Queen before even convicting her with murder through one well-placed argument that also causes her to lose her mind and go insane!!!! And probably some more stuff as well. Honestly, it might be my new favourite case in the series. I might have to sit on the ending some more before I give my thoughts on it but man, this game was really freaking good. Deserves a place among the best AA has to offer.
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Sep 13, 2016 07:54
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Amppelix posted:Luckily, somehow Von Karma has managed to actually be the most competent bad guy in the series ever, as the only one to actually manage to do something to hinder our heroes outside of the courtroom. Ga'ran was literally a few seconds away from murdering everyone while court was still in session so you've got to give her credit for that!
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Sep 13, 2016 22:40
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TheKingofSprings posted:hi I just got to case 5's 2nd day of the trial and what the gently caress You ain't seen nothing yet.
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Sep 14, 2016 04:45
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TheKingofSprings posted:Apollo Justice does have some good qualities to it that the games before had, that the games before didn't have, and that the games after will likely never have. It's also very unique in the series for it's atmosphere, and that's in no small part thanks to the brilliant music and the great look of the game. What do you mean by more fanfiction-y?
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Sep 14, 2016 06:02
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AlphaKretin posted:Not to speak for the guy who said it, but something I've noticed is that the more recent games are fond of suddenly making up history for existing characters, like Apollo's situation both in this game and with Clay, and Edgeworth with Dogen in AAI2. To be fair for Apollo at least, dude legitimately had no history until DD. And even then the stuff revealed about him this game I thought fit surprisingly well with what we knew of his past in AJ. Although him being the adopted son of a revolutionary leader/husband-to-the-queen of a foreign country was kind of out there. Though, in general DD and SoJ are way more over-dramatic and like ridiculous than the original games (not really a bad thing in my books). Which now that I think about it might have been what he meant by fanfictiony-y but I could still be wrong.
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Sep 14, 2016 06:18
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Honestly, SoJ might have the strongest overall cast of any AA game. I think I really liked every witness outside of just Geiru. Everyone else was really entertaining or interesting or funny, and I would legitimately not be upset if any of them showed up again in future games. And I don't think I can say that about any other game in the series. Seriously though, SoJ was basically exactly what I wanted it to be. I think I mentioned in the old thread a couple of times that I hoped the game would be used to push Phoenix out of the spotlight and give Athena and Apollo a more central protagonist role. Though I was pretty sure it was never going to happen, but then that's basically what occurred. This is Apollo's game and it was wonderful. It somehow focuses on a character who's arc was completely mishandled in his debut, and then a side-plot (albeit a surprisingly compelling and well-done side-plot) in the next game, and pulls it all together and gives it a really satisfactory conclusion. Dude's backstory is weird and over-complicated but I really enjoyed everything they did with it and was invested the entire time. He might be my favourite AA character now. The game also basically proved to me that Phoenix and other characters from the original series can probably just head out of the spotlight now, like I enjoyed what Phoenix and Maya did this game but they're done. Their arcs are completed and they've basically become the best characters they can be. They are exactly where they should be when the series ends. I don't want them to disappear or anything, but they don't need to get much more focus, and I think the series kinda understands that now. It's still got some problems though. Like, the new prosecutor is an important part of every AA game but Nahyuta is really underwhelming. Especially around all the other fantastic characters introduced this game. He doesn't change or show more character until case 5, from 2-4 he's basically the exact same dude. And that dude is just kinda a huge rear end in a top hat. Speaking of sorta antagonistic figures though, Rayfa on the other hand is really cool. Gets a well done arc throughout the game and clearly changes over each case. Also she's funny and entertaining. She's the best and I hope she shows up again in the future. Her being queen might make that difficult, but Nahyuta's the regent so maybe she can take some time off to go to the states and meet with the WAA crew. Investigate with Athena or hang with Trucy or something. I'd like it to happen. Anyway, it's a great game. I can't wait for AA7: Athena Cykes - Ace Attorney. Because she's basically the protagonist with the most area for development and stuff now. And it means Blackquill will show up more and he's the best prosecutor so it's a win-win. Though, the last two games have really sold me on the whole multiple playable characters thing so I hope they keep that up as well.
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Sep 14, 2016 07:04
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Terper posted:Rayfa is the sweetest thing in the world and they should kick Trucy out and adopt her instead imho This but don't kick out Trucy because she is also sweet and cool and good. I bet they would be good sisters, who would get along and hang out.
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Sep 14, 2016 07:05
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And More posted:Phoenix fights like a mad man during his second case. Mia has to point out to him that he needs to look at the receipt, but he has to use it as evidence. She also ends up forcing White to admit his guilt, but that's after his guilt is basically proven. Athena, on the other hand, gets flustered because the prosecutor and the audience are mean to her. Phoenix literally has his head in his hands because he can't prove White's guilt and then Mia is like "read this you idiot" and then he does and White admits his guilt while Phoenix still has no idea what's going on. At least Athena is the one who actually solves the loving case. Simon helps out especially with keeping people on the stand, and providing moral support when she almost gives up (which happens too often). But Athena figures out Uendo's deal, how he obfuscated the time of murder, and how Geiru killed him and hid the evidence by herself. She's way more essential to the whole thing than Phoenix is in 1-2.
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Sep 14, 2016 23:55
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And More posted:That's not true, though. Phoenix tears White to shreds. He's got his head in his hands because he fears that Edgeworth will fake some evidence to prove White's innocence. Yeah, he's basically lost and has no idea how to get the win and then Mia shows up and does it for him, while he has no idea what's going on or why the evidence is relevant. Edit: I think the difference is in presentation. Athena's inexperience is a much bigger part of her character, and while Phoenix gets bailed out in the end the game doesn't make a big deal of him being a rookie. Same with Apollo being saved by Klav in 4-2, it's less because Apollo's a newbie at the whole lawyer thing and more to show that Klavier is a good dude who just wants to find the truth. I'm fine with how it works for Athena though because by focusing more on that inexperience and her proving itself she manages to have a better showing and really solve the case herself, moreso than the other two in similar situations. At least that's how I feel about it. SyntheticPolygon fucked around with this message at 00:07 on Sep 15, 2016 |
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Sep 15, 2016 00:02
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And More posted:It's not evidence, she blackmails White into giving up. And it's not because Phoenix has lost, it's because Edgeworth is trying to weasel his way out of losing by digging up some more shady evidence or by accusing White himself. I mean that he has something in the court record that can get him out of this mess but he can't put it all together so Mia does it for him. She's the one that wins the case. Which is fine cause she's avenging her own death and that's cool, but it still shows that Nick isn't at her level yet and still basically a rookie. It's not too dissimilar a situation I feel.
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Sep 15, 2016 00:32
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alcharagia posted:why is this game titled phoenix wright even It's an elaborate ruse and you need to find the contradiction within it.
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Sep 15, 2016 02:56
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Quest For Glory II posted:even still, phoenix is heavily involved in 3 of 5 cases So is Athena!
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Sep 15, 2016 03:05
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Waffleman_ posted:Okay, case 5 trial 2 is getting crazy go nuts. Pretty much exceeding 3-5. Case 5 day 2 is extremely good.
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Sep 16, 2016 01:30
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Waffleman_ posted:UM EXCUSE ME I honestly don't know if any case will be able to surpass 2-4 as a complete package, but I do think that Turnabout Revolution day 2 is the single best trial day in the series. It condenses like a whole 3 day case worth of twists and emotional moments into just 1 trial, and it rules hard.
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Sep 16, 2016 04:58
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Pearl will never grow out of being a child because all her appearances in the series now are cameos and fanservice, without really being all that important. And for that sake the writers are keeping her close to her previous characterisation.
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Sep 16, 2016 05:12
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It's kind of funny that only AA1 has any 3 day cases. Though I suppose DD kinda cheats on that because cases 4 and 5 are so closely connected they can kinda function as one long case. Edit: 2-4 to me is basically just the case that encapsulates Phoenix Wright as a character. It reinforces Edgeworth as his closest friend and rival, it challenges his ideals and values more than any other case, and it really kinda solidifies what kind of a person he is. In some ways 1-4 is more about Edgey than Phoenix himself, but 2-4 is really front and center the Phoenix Wright show. 6-5 is kinda the same for Apollo now that I think about it. Except most of the set up for it comes within the case itself because Apollo has had a sort of messy arc, so I give the edge to 2-4. But only barely. SyntheticPolygon fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Sep 16, 2016 |
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Sep 16, 2016 06:10
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Waffleman_ posted:OH MY GOD ARE YOU loving KIDDING ME WITH THIS FINAL SCENE You thought they forgot. And heck, so did everyone else.
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Sep 16, 2016 06:35
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Waffleman_ posted:I'm actually super curious as to what they're going to do with AA7 and going forward. I hope they don't bring Apollo back immediately, it's a good excuse to have an Athena-centric game, plus Apollo can have his own 2-4 Great Revival moment in like AA8 or 9. He's gonna show back up in 7-4 when he's the key suspect in the murder of Thalassa Gramayre, otherwise known as Lamiroir. I've got mixed feeling on when Apollo should return. Next game should definitely star Athena, but i've really liked the multiple playable characters thing DD and SoJ have had. So I kinda want him and Athena in AA7, since I think it'd probably be for the best if Phoenix took less of a prominent role (though I still want him around, just in less of a playable capacity).
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Sep 16, 2016 06:53
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