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waitwhatno posted:Boohooooo Except they might have beaten the poo poo out of him because homophobia, especially since he's old enough to have an MD.
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Sep 27, 2016 00:38
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More specifically (because it makes it even worse), not having pubes was an indicator that you had syphilis and were treating it with poisonous remedies like mercury that made your pubes fall out. Body image and beauty standards are almost completely arbitrary. Ever seen a Peter Paul Rubens painting? In his day, it was considered fashionable and beautiful for women to be what would nowadays be considered quite overweight, with droopy butts and cellulite everywhere, and he painted their fatness in exquisite detail. Woolie Wool fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Sep 30, 2016 |
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Sep 30, 2016 04:11
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OwlFancier posted:I think that was a rather after-the-fact term used to describe fat women in a more polite way. The point is that at certain cultures and certain points in history the beauty standard for women (and in certain parts of the world, still is) was considerably larger than today, often to the point what many modern Westerners would think of women they consider(ed) beautiful as overweight. Beauty standards are arbitrary and constantly change, the closest thing to a constant being "whatever is unattainable to the poors" (being big when food is scarce and expensive, being thin when the poor subsist on cheap high-calorie junk food, being pale when commoners work in the fields all day, being tanned when commoners work inside at sedentary jobs, being white in a society with systemic racism, etc.).
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Oct 1, 2016 19:26
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Periodiko posted:male nipples and balls are fine, and the entire "male bodies are not as aesthetically pleasing as female bodies" thing is pure bullshit. we aestheticize the female form in ways we don't with the male form, or compare an idealized female form to a "normal" male form. if you look at any media that does treat the male form as beautiful, including modern gay art or classic stuff, this is really apparent. Two other things to note: 1. Women are under great societal pressure to beautify their own bodies according to the prevailing standard, while men are under (less severe but it still exists) pressure not to. Women actually have much more hair naturally than most men think, they just have to get rid of it to be tolerated by society. Meanwhile if a man removes all that unwanted butt (or worse, leg) hair, then he's an object of ridicule. (note, this should not be interpreted as downplaying misogyny or saying that what men face is comparable. It isn't.) 2. Most idealized images of male bodies in media are still presented through a straight male gaze--instead of being designed to communicate physical beauty or sexual desirability, they're meant to communicate power. A body like '80s Arnold Schwarzenegger is something that straight men want to be, not something that gay men or women want to gently caress. Ahnold acts but is not acted upon. He fucks but is not hosed. When men appear in the popular media who do present their bodies in a way to make themselves seem sexually available/desirable on someone else's terms, like Rudolph Valentino or Orlando Bloom, they are often loathed and considered threatening or sexually deviant by men. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudolph_Valentino The original pretty boy actor. Many women thought he was beautiful, straight men despised him and saw him as taking away the women that rightly belonged to the "All-American Boy" (an image of the male body marketed to straight men as an ideal of masculine power and dominance). Some Latinophobia was almost certainly also involved. Woolie Wool fucked around with this message at 06:43 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 06:39
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This is an incredibly dumb derail to come out of my real original assertion that most idealized images of male bodies are marketed towards men as aspirational, and alternative ideals of male beauty make many straight men feel uncomfortable or even angry and are thus marginalized in mainstream culture compared to the dominant "Bowflex body" ideal, it's not actually about the Secret to What Women Want, Jesus Christ. 
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Oct 8, 2016 02:25
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Zachack posted:I dunno, this look a lot like you telling women what their standard for sexual desirability is. Maybe if you don't want people to focus on dumb poo poo you supposedly didn't want to discuss you shouldn't write it in the first place. I admit to becoming increasingly alienated from mainstream pop culture as time goes on, but in light of the all-pervading and seemingly never-ending fad for superheroes and superhero movies being one of the most obvious and immediate reasons for said disengagement, I'll present superheroes as an entire class of characters and storytelling as exhibit A. They almost universally present models of hegemonic masculinity designed specifically to appeal to a straight male target audience, completely devoid of any human vulnerability whatsoever. Their bodies are idealized, but along very specific lines so as to present what little sexuality they have as entirely active and outward-directed (there's probably more specific language for the concepts I'm thinking of, but I am not a philosopher or a sociologist--in fact I have like 10 or 15 concepts in my head right now about this very subject that I can't properly articulate because I don't have specific words for them).
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Oct 8, 2016 19:33
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Not just men, straight men. Straight men fill mainstream culture with the male bodies that they want to imagine themselves as having, not loving, while alternative forms of beauty are marginalized, because men may be sexy but to a straight men no man must be allowed to be seen as fuckable, because it is the man's role to gently caress, not be hosed. Images of male bodies targeted at women and gay men tend to be far more diverse (even though most of them are equally idealized, they are idealized in many different ways) but they are excluded from the mainstream because straight men think everything belongs to them and that if their supremacy is challenged they'll all catch the gay or something.
Woolie Wool fucked around with this message at 20:06 on Oct 8, 2016 |
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Oct 8, 2016 20:03
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Thank you for this, hbomberguy videos are awesome and this gets pretty close to what I was going to say (I was actively trying to avoid bringing up video games even though it would have been easy). Also I'm going to have to work the word "killicide" into conversation somewhere, it sounds so fun to say. And now I'm reminded of that "Free!" anime about male swimmers who were definitely objectified in such a way as to appeal to people who want to have sex with men, and even though it looks like an awful obnoxious pile of anime and creepiness that I have no intention of watching, I'm glad it exists because of the hilarious meltdowns I've read from straight male otaku about it. Woolie Wool fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Oct 8, 2016 |
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Oct 8, 2016 20:11
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Zachack posted:For someone who claims to not pay attention to mainstream culture (and for a very weird reason) you sure seem to think you have your finger on the pulse of mainstream culture and what imagery is prevalent. This is not even an argument.
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Oct 8, 2016 20:37
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steinrokkan posted:It's an argument, because you are basically clueless. Ad hominem is not a valid argument, sorry. I posted an example, OwlFancier posted an hbomberguy video that covers the same phenomenon in video games, now put up a rebuttal or gently caress off.
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Oct 8, 2016 21:19
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steinrokkan posted:My entire lived experience as a person living in the world, though I agree it's not as compelling as a video by a minor LP youtube account. I've had the lived experience of being a gay man in a society made by and for straight men, watching entire rooms full of grown-rear end men freak out and throw tantrums at the merest suggestion of a man being the one under a gaze rather than the one gazing. I've watched an entire racing forum lose its poo poo (LOSE. ITS. poo poo.) at an offhand throwaway joke I made about replacing half of the grid girls with scantily clad men. I've had the experience of having to install mods to create male characters who don't look like they're 37 and haven't showered in two weeks in video games with character customization. I've watched shitlord otaku blow the gently caress up because in this particular anime it's not pretty girls being paraded in front of the screen, screaming about how their animes are being taken away from them. I've lived with the knowledge that the way I look at a man's body is considered horrifying by most men, that their fragile little minds cannot bear to see a man that way, and then seeing those fragile men turn around and dismiss women when women express annoyance at constantly having to see themselves and their fellow women through the hetero male gaze, and fail to grasp the irony. This poo poo is real. I will not let you casually sit here and splain it away to me. Woolie Wool fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Oct 8, 2016 |
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Oct 8, 2016 21:39
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504 posted:Sounds like you just hang out with fucken weirdoes to be honest. It's not my job as the gay person to listen to you straightsplain to me and then have to go scouring the internet to dig up things I read two years ago on ephemeral internet forums and social media platforms. This is purestrain splaining and privileged denialism, right down to the jokes about Tumblr. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Oct 12, 2016 05:25
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