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The existing Cyberpunk thread has already fallen into archives so I decided to make a new one. Ask about this dead great genre or talk about how great Gibson's last novel was, whatever. We saw the trailer for "Ready Player One" in front of The Spiderman Cometh Home and the design of "the stacks" is exactly how I pictured The Bridge in Gibson's Bridge Trilogy. Shame to waste that great design work!
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Jul 25, 2017 17:54
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I read Neuromancer a while ago and it blew my mind. Not the cyberspace stuff, which was cool and all, but the writing. It was like punk rock meets beat poetry meets neon chrome sci-fi. Highly recommended. Tried Steffenson's thing after that which people recommend about a pizza software guy? And it was absolute trash just awful, awful, awful trash. What should I read next?
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Jul 29, 2017 19:38
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As Gibson went on, his novels very quickly become much more about the people than the technology; by his third (and arguably best, or one of his best) Mona Lisa Overdrive it's legitimately more fascinating reading about Mona growing up in poverty and being a prostitute in Tennessee than any of the technology. His second trilogy - Virtual Light, Idoru, All Tomorrow's Parties - starts out as light on the characters and heavy on the tech, but inverts itself by the third book. ATP is written like a series of stark prose poems with almost literally no technobabble. His third trilogy keeps with that style. The Peripheral, his latest one, goes back to having some more hard sci-fi edges but keeps the core character study aspect, and is another contender for "his best". Outside of Gibson, only maybe Bruce Sterling is good at keeping that balance. Cyberpunk is a genre with very little quantity but what quality is there is very good (Gibson and Sterling also kinda created "steampunk" when they collaborated on The Difference Engine which is fantastic)
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Jul 29, 2017 22:52
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If you really dig 80's Gibson (the Sprawl Trilogy, plus his short story collection is good and includes some Sprawl stuff) your next stop should be Bruce Sterling. With him start with the Shaper/Mechanist series (a collection of books and short stories) which, if you like Neuromancer, should be right up your alley even though in many ways they are quite different. Neal Stephenson can be an acquired taste and from a tone perspective is different from "cyberpunk" but I like his books, including Snow Crash. Cool if you hate that one (assuming you were referencing it because of the Pizza Guy reference) but it is a pretty popular book. If you finish Gibson's Sprawl books and jump right to it I can see how it might seem to be a little jarring but whatever. Some of his later stuff is also good, like the first 2/3rd of Seveneves (you really have to read it for that to make sense without me spoiling it). If I were you I'd go Shaper/Mechanist stories next.
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Jul 30, 2017 20:43
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Also pick up some Philip K. Dick. Most of his stuff isn't explicitly cyberpunk, but is the source of a lot of the best known cyberpunk/near future dystopian sci-fi films ever created. Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep aka Blade Runner We Can Remember It For You Wholesale aka Total Recall (the second adaption is much better and has a more grime/neon asthetic) Second Variety aka Screamers Paycheck A Scanner Darkly An adaption of Fly My Tears, The Policeman Said is in development hell as well, from the production company that runs the Terminator franchise. Most of his work deals with near-future dystopias, conflicts between men and advanced machines, and the possibilities of simulated reality. It's pretty impressive how the ideas he was working with in the late 60's/early 70's ended up being super influential on 80's cyberpunk. Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 02:27 on Jul 31, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 01:56
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It's real weird, but I love Cyberpunk but I've never read anything even remotely like it until the beginning of this year when I finally read Neuromancer. (Unless you count Transmetropolitan, but I mean actual books) I was told to read the Wonderland Cycle by Michael Shean with the caveat that it jumps genre and turns into a horror towards the end. Anyone read it? I'm literally a few pages into the first book. Also bought a few of the Punktown books by Jeff Thomas too.
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Jul 31, 2017 10:33
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Took my own advice and re-read Bruce Sterling's Schismatrix this week. Technically, Schismatrix Plus, which includes his short stories as well, and comprise "all there is" in Sterling's words as far as Shaper/Mechanist stories go. Easily been 20 years since I read them last, but that is only because I am getting old. Fun read, little dense, and if you've never read them some bits may seem familiar but that's mostly due to how many others since the 80's ripped him off  Though having also recently re-read a bunch of Vernor Vinge's stuff I do detect a whiff of the latter in Sterling's work now that I missed before.Worth reading all the same. Solid work from one of the true living masters of postmodern Sci-Fi.
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Aug 7, 2017 05:20
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i'm reading The Islands by this guy carlos gamerro and its not cyberpunk(for one thing this guy can actually write) but people who like cyberpunk might like it since its got computer hackers and ceos who live in giant gleaming skyscrapers and other staples of the genre.
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Aug 7, 2017 07:57
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Liquid Communism posted:Also pick up some Philip K. Dick. Most of his stuff isn't explicitly cyberpunk, but is the source of a lot of the best known cyberpunk/near future dystopian sci-fi films ever created. I'm honestly not sure how well Flow My Tears, the Policeman Said would adapt to film. It would have to be a slow burn and at the end when Tavener's hellish experience in anonymity is explained by way of a dominatrix taking experimental drugs you'd be sure to piss people off. Hell, I'd rather it went unexplained myself. I'd love to see that world realized, especially the backdrop stuff like the second civil war but otherwise I don't see it working well.
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Aug 8, 2017 02:03
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I like how already on the first page we are mostly in recommendations of "it's not really cyberpunk but..." I hadn't thought of the poetic cadence to Gibsons writing though. It's a neat way to describe it.
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Aug 10, 2017 01:37
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ninguno posted:I like how already on the first page we are mostly in recommendations of "it's not really cyberpunk but..." I recommended that specifically because most 'cyberpunk' is extremely bad, but there's things that are not bad that also have some of the stuff that occurs in cyberpunk.
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Aug 10, 2017 09:24
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I remember reading and rather enjoying some of Pat Cadigan's stuff back in the day. Also, Rudy Rucker. Software was totally cool and rad and at least the first sequel was awesome too. Maybe I'll reread them one of these days.
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Aug 14, 2017 13:28
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Cross-post from the Stephenson tread:Dr. Benway posted:I just picked up Void Star. While I'm not far enough into it to recommend yet, it definitely has some Gibson/Stephenson touches to it. Also, I was a late comer to Gibson, but I enjoyed the Blue Ant Trilogy so much that I wish I had never read it so I could experience it fresh again.
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Aug 14, 2017 15:39
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What books would you guys recommend for someone wanting to get into the genre?
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Aug 14, 2017 21:02
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Dr. Benway posted:Cross-post from the Stephenson tread: It looks like Pattern Recognition is finally out of development hell, as of a few months ago the director of The Imitation Game and Passengers was attached and in pre-production. Also yet another fool has been swindled into directing Neuromancer, as if it will ever come out.
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Aug 15, 2017 00:53
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Wizgot posted:What books would you guys recommend for someone wanting to get into the genre?
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Aug 15, 2017 03:42
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Dr. Benway posted:Cross-post from the Stephenson tread: Void Star is interesting to me because there are so many points of comparison with Gibson that the points of difference say interesting things about where the world is now compared to the 80s and also where the different authors are. Similarities between Void Star and Gibson: 1. Extremely rich and vaguely ominous old guy hires woman to find something mysterious (Pattern Recognition, Count Zero) 2. Poor kid uses his poverty to live in zenlike focus (Spook Country, All Tomorrow's Parties) 3. Designers' labels mentioned in passing as a signifier of culture and attention to fashion (Literally everything Gibson ever wrote, I think) 4. Multiple characters POV from different social strata converging on a core narrative (Count Zero, Mona Lisa Overdrive) 5. Artificial intelligence using human persona to understand people (Neuromancer) 6. Artificial intelligence showing art or creativity as a demonstration that it's something new and unique (Neuromancer, Count Zero) Two major differences stood out to me, though. The first is the internet of things aspect - in Void Star hackers hack drat near everything because drat near everything is connected to the internet. Gibson hasn't dug into that. The second is the fact that there are no Black characters, or characters specifically identified as Black, in Void Star. Even the POV character who is Latino isn't meaningfully Latino - like, it doesn't affect his characterization at all compared to the way that e.g. Tito in Spook Country is defined in part by being Cuban. You can criticize Gibson for maybe being a little heavy handed with "Black people do things like this, White people do things like that," especially in the Sprawl trilogy, but he's always paid a lot of attention to the way that race and class co-exist and intersect in America. Having an author that is so much like Gibson completely gloss over that aspect made me realize how much it's a part of what makes Gibson feel so real to me. I liked Void Star a lot, and I think it's an interesting projection of a lot of Gibsonian tropes into a future that starts with modern technology, but the lack of attention to race kind of stood out to me. It makes me wonder if it was a conscious decision, or if the author isn't as tuned into race in America as Gibson is. Gibson's background growing up in Appalachia really comes through when he writes about race and class, to me.
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Aug 15, 2017 20:10
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Halloween Jack posted:The classic that doesn't get recommended often enough is When Gravity Fails. I just got Neuromancer but when i get around to that book I'll definitely give Gravity a read.
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Aug 16, 2017 15:49
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When Gravity Fails is good and deserves a place in the best of "Cyberpunk" though I am not sure that has done it any favors over the years. Going to repeat what I said earlier - if you want hard-core, genre-defining "Cyberpunk" - outside of Gibson's Sprawl pantheon Bruce Sterling is where it's at. If anyone deserves to stand with Gibson on the very top of the shitheap that Cyberpunk and a whole fuckload of weird Japanese Anime noir-future became, it's him. Schismatrix Plus (a collection of works and a novel) are like a combo of Gibson's particular dystopic world view and larger space opera stuff like Vernor Vinge - and I mean that as a compliment. If you like The Expanse TV show or or the books/short stories behind it you'll probably really dig the Schismatrix stories. The Expanse, for all the ways it is different from his work in the end, owes a lot to Sterling.
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Aug 17, 2017 04:26
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Ixian posted:When Gravity Fails is good and deserves a place in the best of "Cyberpunk" though I am not sure that has done it any favors over the years. I just finished Neuromancer and I found it to totally live up to its name. I just picked up Count Zero (I hope it's a s good as Neuro) and plan on starting it sometime next week. I will definitely look up Sterling's works when I'm done with CZ.
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Aug 22, 2017 01:58
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It's not for everyone, but I've always liked Hardwired by Walter Jon Williams. It's sort of the trashy, goon-y muscle-car cyberpunk to Gibson's seemingly effortless cool. It's also basically the serial-number filed off inspiration for the world of Cyberpunk 2077, the next game from the Witcher people.
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Aug 22, 2017 02:13
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Wizgot posted:I just finished Neuromancer and I found it to totally live up to its name. I just picked up Count Zero (I hope it's a s good as Neuro) and plan on starting it sometime next week. I will definitely look up Sterling's works when I'm done with CZ. CZ isn't quite at the level of Neuromancer - lots of people get put off by all the voodoo/hoodoo poo poo, at least at first - but the follow up and last book Mono Lisa Overdrive pulls it all together. As a trilogy it works.
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Aug 22, 2017 04:19
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I've heard that KW Jeter, when he isn't writing potboiler franchise fiction, has written some downright seminal cyberpunk (Dr. Adder, Glass Hammer, Infernal Devices). Anyone got opinions on his work?Wizgot posted:I just got Neuromancer but when i get around to that book I'll definitely give Gravity a read. If you want a cyberpunk-ish novel with a far out style, check out Jeff Noon's Vurt.
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Aug 22, 2017 14:31
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Anyone have any good recs on Audible? I've got most of Gibson's stuff, but there's a big lack of Sterling on there. Anything else I should check out?
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Aug 29, 2017 17:22
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EdsTeioh posted:Anyone have any good recs on Audible? I've got most of Gibson's stuff, but there's a big lack of Sterling on there. Anything else I should check out? The audiobooks of the Baroque Cycle are insanely good, the narrator absolutely nails it.
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Aug 30, 2017 04:00
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precision posted:The audiobooks of the Baroque Cycle are insanely good, the narrator absolutely nails it. Right on. How dense are those? I listened to Snow Crash a while back and REALLY liked it.
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Aug 31, 2017 17:33
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They're super dense, but I found that the audiobook makes it a lot easier to keep track of who is who and what is what. Then again that might also be a function of the audiobooks being my third time through the series.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:10
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precision posted:They're super dense, but I found that the audiobook makes it a lot easier to keep track of who is who and what is what. Then again that might also be a function of the audiobooks being my third time through the series. Cool, thanks for the info. I'll go ahead and pick up that first one for something to alternate Dark Tower books with.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:55
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EdsTeioh posted:Cool, thanks for the info. I'll go ahead and pick up that first one for something to alternate Dark Tower books with. I'd recommend mainlining the Baroque Cycle all at once, if possible, because of the way the narrative jumps around timelines between books 1, 2, and 3 it can be hard to remember which characters are where at which time if you put anything in between the three books. Fan-loving-tastic books, though.
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Aug 31, 2017 23:06
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How about Rucker's *Ware books?
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Sep 1, 2017 01:48
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Halloween Jack posted:I've heard that KW Jeter, when he isn't writing potboiler franchise fiction, has written some downright seminal cyberpunk (Dr. Adder, Glass Hammer, Infernal Devices). Anyone got opinions on his work? I read Dr. Adder and it's pulpy and ridiculous and very, very fun. It's proto-cyberpunk, in that there's not much in the way of "cyberspace" but plenty about the fusion of organic and synthetic bodies, extreme social stratification under capitalism, and the power of mass media. it was originally written in the early 70s, so the legend goes, and PKD fought for its publication, but it didn't end up coming out until after the first wave of cyberpunk literature crested. It's a great time-capsule book, even if it does get skeevy in parts. quote:If you want a cyberpunk-ish novel with a far out style, check out Jeff Noon's Vurt. I didn't like Vurt as much as I'd hoped to, but there's a lot of good stuff there. If I'd read it as a teenager I can imagine it becoming a favourite book pretty fast. As for other recommendations beyond Gibson, I really enjoyed Necroville (aka Terminal Café), by Ian McDonald. Dense cyberpunk fun, with the core hook being that advances in technology have allowed the dead to walk the streets and remain part of society. The book oozes 90s-SF-cool from every page. Also worth checking out Bone Dance, by Emma Bull. Mainly a fantasy novel but grounded in a heavily cyberpunky setting and with similar spiritual exploration as Gibson's Sprawl books.
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Sep 1, 2017 19:28
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I absolutely hated Vurt, between the creepy incest fetish and the... edgelord-y stuff (like the Rasta gang) it just soured me. That said, I did finish reading it, so it's not THAT bad I guess?Gertrude Perkins posted:As for other recommendations beyond Gibson, I really enjoyed Necroville (aka Terminal Café), by Ian McDonald. Dense cyberpunk fun, with the core hook being that advances in technology have allowed the dead to walk the streets and remain part of society. The book oozes 90s-SF-cool from every page. Also worth checking out Bone Dance, by Emma Bull. Mainly a fantasy novel but grounded in a heavily cyberpunky setting and with similar spiritual exploration as Gibson's Sprawl books. These sound great, thanks!
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Sep 2, 2017 00:35
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Mr. Robot is the closest thing we'll probably ever get to a halfway decent cyberpunk drama tv show. For fans of the genre I'd highly recommend it.
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Sep 2, 2017 03:29
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