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Realistically, yes, we should have given the moon a more thorough scientific survey before getting overexcited and turning it into a million+ population refugee camp. While it is in theory self-sufficient in a base subsistence way, it's difficult to imagine a future without a capacity for basically any heavy industry up the the modern TN-based standard, which seems the only way it can realistically expand its habitable infrastructure without just being a rump state totally beholden to Earth polities. Also, as delegate of the Democratic Republic of Minnesota, I must inform you President Mondale took great offense to all those weather jokes
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Oct 30, 2020 02:55
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The Democratic Republic of Minnesota puts forward that the Socialist Aid Program, while enormously successful, has not yet reached its full potential or accomplished its stated goals of offering support to those hardest hit by humanitarian crises. The Trans-Newtonian Revolution has opened up new avenues for infrastructure relief and we've yet to test its full potential. The dwindling of Neutronium is worrying, however. We put forward that the Moon be surveyed for TNEs, especially Neutronium, as quickly as possible, as to aid and subsidize the establishing of heavy TNE-based native industry in Lunagrad. It has been our concern for months what long-term economic future Lunagrad has beyond hand-to-mouth self sufficiency, and heavy industry seems viable. For our more ecologically-minded parties, Luna has no native environment to damage with large-scale manufacturing, and would allow the citizens of the Lunar Republic to expand their habitable living space and improve their quality of life, while also providing resources to the Socialist Aid Program for their earthbound comrades. As far as developing of weapons technology, I advocate for missile-based weapons platforms and fighters as well. While the military application of this technology would be a last resort, the development of it would be an extension of our extant propulsion and sensor technology, and the researching of it in missile fighters may yield civilian applications in ship design.
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Oct 31, 2020 23:37
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Servetus posted:
I second the motion, requestiong that some free labs be allocated to the study of biology/genetics with an emphasis on treatments and mitigation for radiation-based diseases both to improve terrestrial health and improve colonization of naturally highly irradiated space, in what I shall call the Radiological Attenuation and Defense, or RAD Initiative quote:The capacities of our new sensor systems astound, and offer the opportunity for us to quicken the end of the continuing conflicts. While some of the Fascist groups causing this terror hide amongst the populace others hide in the wilderness. Sensors that can resolve an oar powered that sunk two thousand years ago could easily resolve a fascist base or convoys. We could then pass information to friendly governments and autonomous zones. Or, if the situation truly demanded it, we could do a weapons test. I therefore call for the Friendly Eyes in Space To Extinguish Reactionaries: We should find a way to provide sensor coverage of known fascist redoubts outside of urban areas, and maintain surveilance on them. This could involve satellites, the Small Fry design, or any other method of maintaining surveillance using our new tech. This however, seems like a poor use of resources, as all intelligence gathered on these insurgents so far indicates a guerilla movement using civilian vehicles and facilities and stolen military hardware, making it unlikely to be easily tracked solely by sensor signature.
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Nov 1, 2020 00:42
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Rhjamiz posted:
Agreed, right now this is all incredibly hypothetical. While we know there are other civilizations out there, and that they have SOME sort of weapons technology, the disposition of their forces is entirely unknown, and any attempt to devise a military doctrine against them could easily be pointless in the field. Actually... upon further review of our only piece of information on alien war capabilities, the Roswell Object, an excess focus on missiles might not be a good idea. IT was theorized to be a small carrier-based short range figher armed with missile launchers, presumably more advanced than any we currently posess, and it was shot down. Hostile forces may be familar wih this strategy and have countermeasures.
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Nov 1, 2020 01:14
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Sanev.Khan posted:
Actually, it tells us a great deal more than that. It tells us that there is a conflict between forces with a greater mastery of TNEs than we posess, and ONE of those sides is at least partially composed of carriers fielding missile-armed fighters. from this there are two possibilities: 1) The side who made the Roswell Object is the dominant force, in which case if we were to engage them with a carrier and missile fighter based strategy, they would be doing the same, only with more sophisticated tech. It is a technology gap we would need to close, and would require anti-fighter doctrines and a focus on point defense, OR 2) The side that shot down the Roswell Object is dominant, in which case they have experience winning against better fighters than we can currently make. We shouldn't even attempt using any fighter-based strategy againt them until we have something AT LEAST equal in specs to the Roswell object, or some other novel technology they wouldn't have countermeasures prepared for. All that being said quote:Now that TNs are well understood, did anyone manage to get the ship's computer to run after refuelling it with fresh sorium, or scrub its data or something? There might be clues in there. This would answer a lot of these hypotheticals. We've been making headway in computer science lately, this might be worth looking into.
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Nov 1, 2020 02:21
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The Democratic Republic of Minnesota votes as follows: Ship Prefixes: EDGFCAB Research: CDBA Socialist Aid Program: ABC I-24: Nay A-25: Yea K-26: Nay F-27: Yea F-28: Yea F-29: Yea L-30: Nay I-31: Nay H-32: Yea N-33: Yea N-34: Yea S-35: Nay A-36: Yea A-37: Yea
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Nov 4, 2020 18:21
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(if I may editorialize, let me say how cathartic it's been participating in essentially a LARP of what a functional optimistic Leftist democracy is like?)
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Nov 5, 2020 05:11
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Rhjamiz posted:I’m glad we didn’t go with Victorian. 70s Soviet retrofuture is much easier to grasp, and I can already imagine goons competing to create the most absurd 19th century style portmanteaus for spacetech along the line of Velocipedes and atomic auto-gyro. ...damnit that actually sounds amazing. Ah well, next time~ 
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Nov 6, 2020 16:47
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I would be all about a Spelljammer themed Aurora LP
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Nov 6, 2020 19:27
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Hot drat, look at all that corbomite! We gotta start looking into researching its applications, if this poo poo is a room temp superconductor. Definitely wanna spin up infrastructure and immigration to Luna to really start mining and manufacturing with the stuff, it's gonna be a gold rush once we find something to DO with it. And that was literally our first and easiest survey, God knows what's waiting in Mars or Venus. Depending on what we find we may have to look into that NOMAD Venera proposal again...
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Nov 7, 2020 14:53
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Sanev.Khan posted:There's still a lot of it on Earth at higher accessibility, and even if we mine everything we'll likely have a stockpile that can last a while. A mine on Earth produces all minerals at once, a mine on Luna would only produce corbomite and duranium. True, Earth's deposits are more accessible and currently more than meet our demand. However, Luna provides a test-bed for research into off-world mining techniques, with a fairly short supply chain of necessary supplies and quick radio access and travel time for experts in the field. Plus I'm sure the Lunar Socialist Republic would appreciate the bootstrapping of the local economy.
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Nov 7, 2020 16:42
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Low orbit survey to get a better idea as to the disposition of the site, and if it appears safe/dead, send down the lander to investigate. Be careful though, this might be the most significant find since the Roswell Object, and I'm not sure we sent any trained archaeologists on this mission. We CANNOT risk contaminating or damaging the site just so we can take touristy photo ops. e: quote:The course of action seems obvious; deploy the lander. This is best investigated in person. Perhaps a delayed live feed transmission across public access. THIS however is a potentially terrible idea. Leaving aside the PR nightmare if the world sees the first cosmonaut to set foot on another planet get their face ripped off by a Martian, there's STILL stuff about our last alien artifact that hasn't been broadly de-classified as far as I know. I'd rather not expose the entire populace to God knows what, let alone our fascist rivals who still linger on the fringe. Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Nov 8, 2020 |
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Nov 7, 2020 23:52
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I'm with Cryo on this, honestly. Realistically, the odds of the away team being slaughtered like redshirts is minimal (though NOT ZERO), the bigger concern is someone untrained in archaeological excavation stepping on something important. Remember, the modern state of the world, which is in many ways unrecognizable compared to even ten years ago, is because of discoveries based on ONE partially intact alien artifact, and here we have an entire site visible from orbit. Let's not be like 19th century tomb robbers and accidentally break the REAL treasures just because we got overexcited. If we send a lander, it is with the understanding that nobody touches ANYTHING, they're just scouting out the terrain in preparation for a proper scientific mission.
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Nov 8, 2020 00:38
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Well the NOMAD Collective will be happy about the Venus news, Venera Initiative looks vaguely viable now that we know there's actual resources to extract there to justify the balloon habitats. What's the industrial applications of Gallicite anyway? I'm guessing it's like Corbomite where currently our Earth supply more than meets our demand? As for Mars... these orbital passes tell us a lot, and it's a bit worrying. All these underground structures could just be economical radiation shielding, like Lunagrad building into lunar lava tubes. The apparent debris field radiating out from The Pyramid however tells me "fortified military position," and one that saw active combat with who knows what. Whether they won or lost is up for speculation, we don't know if the debris came from something on the Pyramid itself blowing up or whether something blew up above it, it MIGHT be an anti-aircraft defense of some sort? It's a real shame we can't scan the EM spectrum for any signs of life. This place could be derelict for hundreds, thousands, hell maybe millions of years. These ruins could justify a Mars colony by themselves, they'd keep archaeologists busy for decades, let alone anyone trying to reverse-engineer whatever goodies are in there. However, we have no idea how old these are, and we know there was active combat going on in the Solar system at least in the late 40s. These could be fairly recent. Hell, they could still be occupied for all we know. If we send a team, they better be sure to knock carefully before going in the front door of this thing.
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Nov 8, 2020 14:35
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So if I'm reading this right, assuming we go big into resource extraction on Luna and Venus, we'll have an excess of the materials needed for ships with a hypothetical "stealth" capability, as well as powerful yet "quiet" engines? Interesting. Gentlemen, this may inform our spaceborne military doctrine going forward. And depending on what we find on Mars, we might need it.
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Nov 8, 2020 15:09
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New New Hampshire, surely.
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Nov 8, 2020 20:15
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...Okay I'm genuinely surprised FESTER worked that well. I wasn't expecting them to all be using entirely unique transmission protocols you could pinpoint from orbit. GodDAMN fascists are stupid. Also let me extend my congratulations to Comrade Cobb as first human to set foot on Mars, and best wishes to Administrator Thatbastardken. Keep 'em out of trouble!
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Nov 9, 2020 03:13
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Hmm... okay after thinking about it, Gladio seems both more and less sophisticated than I thought. They're seemingly widespread throughout Western Europe, and instead of the guerilla setup of unconnected cells being directed by dead-drops like I hypothesized, they have their own encrypted radio network to rapidly coordinate across the continent. This WOULD be threatening, except they obviously haven't infiltrated MOSA or anything high up in the Comintern. They seemingly had no clue as to FESTERs capabilities, or possibly even the project's existence. The SigInt tech gap is only going to widen with the next generation of Electrons, and poor infosec is a death sentence for a large clandestine organization.
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Nov 9, 2020 03:50
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Servetus posted:That's a chilling possibility. The signal in the North Sea could be a problem. If it turns out to be the Revenge or some other NATO remnant nuclear submarine, then it might be something of a "Dead Man's Switch," with orders to fire a nuclear payload if it goes without regular check-ins, an insurance policy if the rest of the organization is hopelessly dismantled. We have a surveillance advantage at the moment, but if we tip our hand too early, even with a simultaneous coordinated raid on every identified likely Gladio site, it could be disastrous. However, if we wait too long, Gladio might find out about FESTER and decide to burn all their compromised assets, and us, in nuclear fire. We need to find and neutralize that mobile signal.
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Nov 9, 2020 18:12
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Pacho posted:Is there a way for us to research an anti-missile, planet-wide defense system that could help us destroy potential NATO/Israeli/Japanese nukes before they reach their intended targets? If we do this, it will have to be Manhattan Project-level secret. While the tech to neutralize conventional ICBMs might be possible, it would take time to implement across the whole globe. And in that time, various world powers, and potentially Gladio, will be seeing their nuclear deterrents slowly becoming obsolete and MAD no longer being in effect, and a lot of global conflict is being suppressed by the possibility of a strategic nuclear World War Four. They may decide to take a "it's now or never" approach with their nuclear arsenals, and I can't guarantee everyone would pick "never" e: Perhaps we work towards a global nuclear disarmament treaty? The Comintern's pre-TNE nukes are likely to be obsolete anyways, it would be a show of international solidarity (and therefore a PR coup), and would eliminate the threat of spooking any "legitimate" nuclear powers with anti-missile defenses upsetting MAD. As for the missile defense itself... dress it up as anti-alien defense? Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Nov 9, 2020 |
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Nov 9, 2020 19:08
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Kitfox88 posted:I agree with the theory that if Gladio initiates a nuclear attack it's likely to not be ICBM in nature. Additional FESTER elements to actually decode and interpret Gladio communications would likely be wise to get operational before tipping them to the fact they're not hiding anymore. ICBMs are unlikely, but if they do have a nuclear ballistic missile submarine (with some continuing source of supply and maintenance coming from somewhere), they could easily have access to Polaris missiles. While not an ICBM, from the North Sea they could throw a 600 kiloton warhead pretty much anywhere west of Novgorod and north of Lisbon.
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Nov 10, 2020 02:07
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Sanev.Khan posted:
Seconded, we still have a lack of trained scientists in a variety of fields. quote:
Also Seconded, in these turbulent times we really cannot predict what will be useful in five years, best not to tether ourselves to an artificial timetable. If something is a good idea to do for five years, it'll be done in five years whether it's reviewed yearly or not. As for other current issues, 2) Proposal for EM and Thermal scan of Mars in anticipation of a formal Xenoarcheology expedition to Cydonia. The Cydonia Ruins are potentially incalculably valuabe, but we can't rule out that they're not as dead as we'd like. A further orbial scan can be done per Foxfire_'s earlier workshopping: quote:A 50RP project for a dinky 100 ton engine would let us make an Electron-like platform self-mobile at almost-Karzalek speeds with a few billion km range. That would get us orbital EM scans on a weeks timescale, and we could do something similar once the FESTER thermal sensor is ready. The crew accommodations are also maybe generous enough to transport a small (fluff) initial science team since it'd be a few-months mission instead of its design multi-year deployment. Also, President Mondale thanks the Comintern intelligence agencies for aiding us in securing Rochester from the "Minnesota Patriot Corps," as well as the Socialist Aid Program for helping us weather the recent blizzard. It's a shame our Wisconsin neighbors have not enjoyed this prosperity, and we hope to extend continuing diplomatic overtures to normalize relations (muttering under breath) dumb Cheeseheads... Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 23:27 on Nov 10, 2020 |
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Nov 10, 2020 22:40
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Mister Bates posted:For reference, four of the following design are currently over half-completed in the Comintern's orbital shipyards, with a projected completion date of April 4: ...Thank you, that will do nicely 
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Nov 10, 2020 22:57
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Serf posted:The Lower Georgia United Workers' Front proposes the following: Proposals 1 and 2 seem well in hand from multiple parties making similar proposals, so I will formally Second Proposals 3 and 4. Proposal 4 I would personally like to suggest the addition of a small pilot project investigating Mass Driver-based mineral transport between Luna and Earth, as a test for future interplanetary trade logistics. We pledge the full resources of Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing Cooperative to assist. e: Pacho posted:
Seconded, while we feel full colonization efforts are still some ways off, research into the technology at least should be considered. Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Nov 11, 2020 |
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Nov 11, 2020 00:10
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Man, the moon is in such a weird place right now, in that we don't have a large enough workforce to spin up heavy resource extraction or industry, but we're already at population capacity unless we start throwing infrastructure at it that we just don't have until Earth's native industry gets converted.
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Nov 11, 2020 01:13
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Foxfire_ posted:Fidelity of simulation thing. Training a few hundred infantry shouldn't require that much stuff, but the game doesn't have anything smaller than a 1m worker complex that could also produce trucks/tanks/mechs/planes/giant armored bunkers. Oh I'm not complaining about verisimilitude, just the catch-22 of this transitional state. There's just so much to do Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 01:47 on Nov 11, 2020 |
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Nov 11, 2020 01:45
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The Indigenous Nations Reparations Act, as it is currently worded, is so enormously sweeping in its powers and vague in its criteria that it could easily lead to nationalistic ethnostates springing up around the globe. Do we really want a dozen new Israel-Palestine conflicts springing up around the world as people quibble over who is more or less indigenous and entitled to sovereignty over any given parsel of land? Minnesota is sympathetic to the injustices perpetrated upon native peoples, we were the site of the largest mass execution in US History, and Lincoln wasn't hanging white people. We will work toward reparations for crimes that may realistically never be forgivable. But we feel this will just incentivize a "blood and soil" nationalistic tribalism. Besides, there are already official channels by which native peoples can be recognized for sovereignty, with several such nations already members in good standing in the Comintern. The Southwestern Tribal Confederation and the Five Tribes Confederation come to mind in North America alone.
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Nov 12, 2020 00:18
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Again I'm mostly concerned that given the global nature of the bill, and a given definition of "indigenous," this could lead to some 1938 Sudetenland mishaps.
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Nov 12, 2020 02:14
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HiHo ChiRho posted:
Have we actually seen any evidence of GLADIO activities in North America? I thought the 50-some likely cells were almost all concentrated in Western Europe. Mind you there's at least one cell on THE MOON, so they really could smuggle themselves anywhere... As for the official business of the day, the Democratic Republic of Minnesota votes as such: SK-38, Expand Interkosmos Academy NO, it's an enormous cost and will only mildly improve our science output in the forseeable future SK-39, Repeal Five-Year Plans YES HC-40, Integrate North America YES, but please God be careful about giving more guns to anyone on this continent, we have enough guns, thank you. S-41, Research and Deploy Spying Technology YES, GLADIO is dangerous but possibly moreso if provoked without sufficient intel, it can hopefully wait for ELINT to be researched. A-42, Surveil the Mars Ruins YES JR-43, The Extraplanetary Focus Discovery Act YES, We need to get our rear end to Mars, and Troop Transport can't be THAT hard I-44, Administrative Overhaul YES I-45, Diplomatic Overtures YES P-46, Venera Initiative 2.0 YES, While full colonization efforts are a loooong ways off, it's worth throwing a think tank together to map it out for when we're ready NM-47, the Trans-Newtonian Global Network Project YES F-48, Organizational Capacity YES F-49, Long-Term Research Efficiency YES P-50, X-COM YES Z-51, IRPA YES, the rewritten bill with an oversight committe eases most of my worries of this becoming some top-down well meaning piece of legistlation ripe for abuse and resentment I-52, Armed Spacecraft Development YES W-53, Lunplan Expansion YES, more Life Support Infrastructure means more people, means more manpower to start actually getting some productive resource extraction and industry up and running. W-54, Medals YES W-55, Rename the Comintern YES, As long as the acronym doesn't become something dumb like ComInterp H-56, More Medals YES
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Nov 14, 2020 21:20
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Rhjamiz posted:I'm not opposed to dedicated Boarding Cruisers as a mop-up squad, but as a primary tactic it seems... designed to kill as many of our comrades as possible. Hey, it's a strategy endorsed by our greatest minds in space warfare 
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Nov 16, 2020 02:49
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Personally I'm hoping for stealth-oriented naval doctrine. Once we get Luna and Venus producing TNEs we'll have a surplus of Corbomite and Gallicite for cloaking and reduced thermal signature on our engines. Plus the Klingons were always the Soviet analogues, might as well lean into that and get ourselves a Bird of Prey or two.
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Nov 16, 2020 03:23
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Kitfox88 posted:Just a weather balloon Naw, totally swamp gas ...we need that EM probe Mars-side yesterday 
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Nov 24, 2020 08:35
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Zurai posted:Venus is actually hotter than Mercury, and has 90 times Earth's atmospheric pressure (these two facts are related). The atmosphere is also incredibly corrosive, with clouds of sulphuric acid. A colony on Venus, even in the clouds, would require us to develop flying cities that are immune to both corrosion and enormous heat, as well as EVA suits with the same qualities. It's significantly harder to cool something down than to heat it up, and it's significantly harder to maintain a structure in an ocean of high-density sulfuric acid than it is in a vacuum.  While the corrosive clouds might be a problem, the Venusian troposphere at ~50km up is actually a pleasant 20oC, and the atmospheric density is such that regular earth nitrogen-oxygen mix is an effective lifting gas. You could just have big balloon habitats and could step outside on the patio with a non-pressurized suit.
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Nov 24, 2020 20:03
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Rhjamiz posted:Imagine tripping over your balcony railing and taking a tumble. This would be the rare case where it's not the landing that kills you
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Nov 24, 2020 20:11
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Specifically, the stuff that goes into engines. Engines need it, good engines need a lot of it, good engines with a low thermal signature need a WHOLE lot of it e: As for the whys, yes it's rad as gently caress, and also the USSR were the ones who actually landed the Venera probe on its surface back in '70 and now it's a matter of Soviet Pride  Also note the NOMAD Collective seem to be the ones lobbying it hardest, and hypothetical balloon habitats would fit their stated principles of freedom of movement and providing homes for displaced peoples (which was partially what kicked off the sudden massive influx of lunar immigration we're still trying to figure out) Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Nov 24, 2020 |
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Nov 24, 2020 21:30
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...welp, it turns out there IS something that would surprise me more than merely aliens being down there, holy poo poo For reference, the USS Cyclops was a Proteus-class ore collier that, in March 1918, mysteriously disappeared with all 293 passengers and crew somewhere in the vicinity of, yes, the Bermuda Triangle, assumed either sunk by a freak storm or German sub (though to this day Germany hasn't disclosed any record of doing so). It is the largest single loss of life in US Naval history not directly involving combat. Or so we thought. The fact that apparently someone decided to pluck a 19,000 ton ship out of the ocean like a bath toy and deposit it on Mars, along with what seems like a human-livable habitat, is weird enough. What's stranger and perhaps more worrying, is that either the passengers (or more accurately at this point their children and grandchildren) have been living up there and broadcasting an SOS for over 60 years, OR they're a recent arrival, and whoever put it there can transcend space and TIME.
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Dec 15, 2020 16:19
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If we're going with the "captured humans" theory, it does beg the question...why allow them to even have access to a radio transmitter? By definition it exists to give away its own existence as loudly as possible, it's not like it can be some super secret low-power tight-beam directional like Gladio's setup, it's a simple point-source audio transmission. If they're zoo animals under security or close scrutiny, why allow them the tech to possibly call for help in such an obvious way?
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Dec 15, 2020 20:48
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We're working on a lot of guesswork here, maybe we should...respond on the same frequency like they requested and just ask them about the situation groundside before we send in the battalions? If they respond we can at least rule out a recording.
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Dec 15, 2020 22:24
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It occurs to me that, in terms of archaeology, we don't have to worry about contaminating the site if a bunch of random Navy guys have been squatting in an alien shanty town since the fuckin' Wilson administration. On the other hand, it might be a boon that locals have been there for possibly several generations getting intimately acquainted with all that alien stuff in advance of us even sending a science team.
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Dec 16, 2020 00:48
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Okay, so looks like they took the initiative and answered our question before we asked it; they're probably NOT a recording. They also probably haven't just been sending this message constantly for 60 years, they've been scanning the sky looking for contacts, possibly by naked eye or telescope. They might have been transmitting this message since we sent those first geosurvey flybys and we missed it by not looking for it. I'm not sure what sort of radio equipment they have down there, maybe salvaged stuff from the Cyclops or crappy spark-gap transmitter made on-site or alien stuff or whatever, but it might be weak enough that we wouldn't pick it up unless doing a TNE-tech broad EM scan of the area. Wild hypothesis time: They were brought here by whoever built all this stuff in 1918,as test subjects or slaves or zoo specimens or whatever, and whoever built it got hosed up by someone ELSE between then and now, possibly in connection to whatever conflict left us the Roswell Object. The base was shelled, left derelict, and these poor bastards have had the run of the place ever since, stranded and watching for anyone to show up. 'Course, if the place was attacked from space, it's slightly weird for them to broadcast openly to any space object they can't identify as friendly... e: Or it's aliens crank calling us, but if so they're showing better grasp of human communication than just parroting back contextless old Morse code distress signals. That's interesting all by itself. Asterite34 fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Dec 17, 2020 |
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Dec 17, 2020 00:10
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