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This thread reminded me that I had started reading Foreigner a while back but had gotten distracted and set it down. So I started over from the beginning a week or two ago and just finished book six tonight. I can definitely see how this series would not appeal to everyone, but I am loving the hell out of it. The first book, in particular, is a bit rough in that it effectively has two largeish intro pieces to set up the backstory, both with different sets of characters, and then you get to the actual start of the story which sticks with Bren Cameron's POV at least through the next five books. I read a review somewhere that believed the intro pieces were at the suggestion of an editor, which I could believe. On one hand they do set up some fairly complex backstory which ends up being useful, but on the other hand just starting with a cold open on the night of the assassination attempt on Bren would have been pretty awesome. The front matter could have been introduced throughout the first book or two as necessary. For my money Tabini's grandmother, Ilisidi is the absolute best character in the series thus far, though I find much of the main cast fun, and seriously love the world building, the portrayal of enjoyably aliens, and the world building. I hope the quality keeps up -- certainly the first six books have had somewhat variable pacing, but they've all been great reads. I've also read Pride of Chanur recently, and intend to read more in that series, but it didn't grab me quite the same way Foreigner did. Quinton fucked around with this message at 11:40 on Nov 4, 2013 |
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Nov 4, 2013 11:34
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So, just a single mention of the Fortress books? Granted they're probably not her best effort, but Cherryh at her worst (which she isn't in this case) is still pretty drat good and I confess to having a soft spot for them. Slowish, yes, but in the same way the atevi books are, leaving more time for characters and setting. Liked the uncertainty and nebulous(?) feel of the magic in those books, as opposed to strict systems like e.g. Sanderson's. I remember reading on WWaS that she'd like to write more in that universe, but I guess it's the usual case of certain modest income (= atevi) vs taking a risk... like most full-time authors I suspect she isn't that well off anyway. Sure wish somebody gave her a few years' income upfront just to write other stuff for a change... It seems her fantasy is not quite as popular as the science fiction. Maybe that's because the tight third person narrative she almost invariably uses could be more suited to one genre over another? Regardless, still going to buy everything she writes in hardcover.
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Nov 4, 2013 12:28
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^^ I really don't like her fantasy, actually. I barely made it through the Morgaine books and I found Fortress completely unreadable on three separate occasions. I would unhesitatingly call her my favourite SF author, but her fantasy leaves me cold.Quinton posted:This thread reminded me that I had started reading Foreigner a while back but had gotten distracted and set it down. So I started over from the beginning a week or two ago and just finished book six tonight. I can definitely see how this series would not appeal to everyone, but I am loving the hell out of it. Cherryh outright says on her website that those sections were added at the insistence of her editor: quote:starts with Foreigner and goes through the career of Bren Cameron, translator between atevi and humans. Each arc is 3 books, and you are safe reading the first of any arc first, but you may enjoy tracking down Foreigner and starting at the beginning. I didn't want to put the first few chapters into Foreigner: be patient with them---everybody in those chapters has been long gone by the time their descendant, Bren Cameron, comes on the scene with a midnight intruder, a shadow on the curtains, and a gunshot.
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Nov 4, 2013 14:09
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Was that the case with the beginning of Downbelow Station as well?
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Nov 4, 2013 14:54
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mystes posted:Was that the case with the beginning of Downbelow Station as well? No idea. If so there's no obvious mention of it on her site.
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Nov 5, 2013 02:22
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mystes posted:Was that the case with the beginning of Downbelow Station as well? The books written prior to DBS (Faded Sun, Morgaine, a few one-offs) are set rather far along the A-U timeline, and are not really entirely consistent with each other. It feels to me that the DBS prologue is partly an attempt to avoid this problem at least for the Company Wars period, it being the first such book published; if so, a successful one as those novels fit together a lot more tightly. Don't remember seeing anybody ask her whose idea it was to include that section (I assume it was originally a part of her private notes, a bible, so to speak), but I suspect the publisher/editor here.
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Nov 5, 2013 08:44
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Hammerfall is on Kindle for $3.99 today (don't know if it's a one-day sale or will last longer) Direct Link Edit: Still on sale today, so if you've been wanting a copy, here's your chance. Zola fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Feb 4, 2014 |
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Feb 3, 2014 22:50
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Peacemaker officially came out yesterday. Sadly, I'm still waiting for my pre-ordered copy to arrive, but it should be here soon and I can't wait--Protector ended much too soon!
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Apr 3, 2014 02:02
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Zola posted:Peacemaker officially came out yesterday. Sadly, I'm still waiting for my pre-ordered copy to arrive, but it should be here soon and I can't wait--Protector ended much too soon! And I finally picked up a copy of Peacemaker, myself! This really felt like the other half of Protector - it would have been a Wheel of Time-sized hardback if they were published together, and it would have prevented Cherryh from having a book each and every year (and I cannot begrudge her wanting to get paid regularly, especially not when the results are so good), but it really does feel like the two should have been one book. I absolutely loved Irene's little speech, and Jase-aiji's promise to keep the kids from going to Maudit. Maybe we'll get to see Bjorn visit the planet, if the promise extends to him? I was really, really looking forward to seeing the atevi reaction to a human "nearly as dark as an ateva" and was disappointed when Cherryh switched which friend that was from Irene to Bjorn. I am somewhat dubious about Bren's desire to have Toby succeed either him or Jase as paidhi. Jase, sure (though I don't know how well he'd be able to interface with Mospheira), but Toby? Especially since Barb would come with Toby?
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May 6, 2014 01:04
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I just finished Finity's End, having never read anything by her before, and now I'm grabbing up everything I can find because holy poo poo, I thought it was amazing. I don't remember the last time I found a fictional world so absolutely convincing. And she doesn't neglect character, which is all I can really ask for from scifi these days. Hooray.
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Jul 2, 2014 11:50
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HopperUK posted:I just finished Finity's End, having never read anything by her before, and now I'm grabbing up everything I can find because holy poo poo, I thought it was amazing. I don't remember the last time I found a fictional world so absolutely convincing. And she doesn't neglect character, which is all I can really ask for from scifi these days. Hooray.  Particular recommendations from me: Cyteen, all the Chanur and Faded Sun books, all the "merchanter" (postwar Alliance-Union) books, Serpent's Reach. I'd hold off on Downbelow Station until you've read most of the other A-U stuff, that fucker is dense and it makes more sense in historical context. But really, just read all of her SF.
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Jul 2, 2014 12:50
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ToxicFrog posted:
I find Cyteen far denser than Downbelow, but it is really _big_ and covers a lot. I particulary liked a lot "Rimrunners", narrated from the POV of a very colateral character (kinda lot of "fog of war").
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Jul 2, 2014 17:27
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Amberskin posted:I find Cyteen far denser than Downbelow, but it is really _big_ and covers a lot. I particulary liked a lot "Rimrunners", narrated from the POV of a very colateral character (kinda lot of "fog of war"). Huh, I had exactly the opposite experience. Cyteen is longer than Downbelow Station, but it went down very smoothly, while Downbelow Station took actual serious effort to get through. Rimrunners was fun, but I liked Cyteen more.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:33
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Zola posted:Peacemaker officially came out yesterday. Sadly, I'm still waiting for my pre-ordered copy to arrive, but it should be here soon and I can't wait--Protector ended much too soon! I don't know why but somehow I had no idea Cherryh was still writing. I thought she was in Asimov's generation for some reason.
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Jul 2, 2014 20:22
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I don't know why but somehow I had no idea Cherryh was still writing. I thought she was in Asimov's generation for some reason. Well, there's a bit of overlap; she started writing in the late 70s, about the time Asimov was writing the final Foundation books, IIRC. Since the mid-90s, though, she's been working exclusively on the Foreigner series, apart from the two Gene Wars books and Regenesis. As much as I like Foreigner, I wish she'd mix things up a bit; I like the A-U and Compact Space settings even more, and Cyteen/Regenesis in particular are begging for a third book to bring some closure to the Reseune story.
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Jul 2, 2014 20:31
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I don't know why but somehow I had no idea Cherryh was still writing. I thought she was in Asimov's generation for some reason. She was a CIS (compuserve) user in the nineties. and I had the privilege to chat with her a couple of times. Definitely younger than Asimov (she was born in 1942), but she has that classy smell. Actually, one of my absolute fav writers and world-builders. And I'd really like to know what happened with the Mazianni after the vague hint given in "Tripoint" about them colonizing a new planet.
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Jul 2, 2014 22:17
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Get up here to the Pacific Northwest and meet her in person, at conventions. I've carded her at room parties, and she laughs.  (John Dalmas still had the best response, though - he pulled out his WWII base pass.  )She'll be running aroud SpoCon in August here in Spokane WA, and I usaully see here at RadCon in Pasco (February) as well. Next year is also Worldcon here  and I'd expect her there.
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Jul 3, 2014 16:29
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Zamboni Apocalypse posted:Get up here to the Pacific Northwest and meet her in person, at conventions. I've carded her at room parties, and she laughs. On her blog, at the bottom of the left-hand column of the page, there is a list of convention appearances.
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Jul 3, 2014 17:39
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I haven't forgotten this thread, it's just taking me a while to work my way forward through the alliance/union chronology. Started with Downbelow, read the next two, went back and read the first two, now moving forward through her timeline and up to Cyteen. SO far the only jarring note has been the way the Downers are just a little too noble-babytalk-savage to quite swallow (same problem with H. Beam Piper's Little Fuzzy series and Scalzi's re-write of it, so this is something SF is still wrestling with). So far Cyteen is amazing. You can really tell this is an experienced master writer -- no amateur or novice could write children's-viewpoint like this and make it as believable as she does. To write this kind of book you have to be really good and really confident in exactly how good you are; a lesser writer couldn't hack it and a less confident writer wouldn't have tried in the first place.
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Jul 30, 2014 19:37
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So far Cyteen is amazing. You can really tell this is an experienced master writer -- no amateur or novice could write children's-viewpoint like this and make it as believable as she does. To write this kind of book you have to be really good and really confident in exactly how good you are; a lesser writer couldn't hack it and a less confident writer wouldn't have tried in the first place. I'll have to get CJs books in their original english and reread all of them. I read most of the A-U stuff in a horrible spanish translation. Apart of losing the quality of CJs writing, some of those (specially Heavy Time) were simply not understandable in translated form.
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Jul 30, 2014 19:53
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I grew up with CJ Cherryh, though over the years I have drifted away (the last book was either Precursor or Defender). However, fans of her work might like Embassytown by China Mieville. It is also a story about aliens that don't think like us. I found the book so good I think it blew her off my bookshelf.
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Jul 30, 2014 20:20
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iron_weasel posted:I grew up with CJ Cherryh, though over the years I have drifted away (the last book was either Precursor or Defender). However, fans of her work might like Embassytown by China Mieville. It is also a story about aliens that don't think like us. I found the book so good I think it blew her off my bookshelf. I haven't read Embassytown, but after being deeply unimpressed by the Bas-Lag books I'm not terribly inclined to try more Mieville. I've been feeling a craving for the Foreigner books lately, but I've been holding off on them because I want her to finish the series first. Maybe rereading the Faded Sun and Devil to the Belt books will take the edge off?
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Jul 31, 2014 00:02
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ToxicFrog posted:I've been feeling a craving for the Foreigner books lately, but I've been holding off on them because I want her to finish the series first. Maybe rereading the Faded Sun and Devil to the Belt books will take the edge off? I'm not sure she's planning on really finishing the series, honestly; unless she runs out of ideas or her publisher stops wanting one a year from her, I don't see her bringing it to any sort of end any time soon. At a minimum, she plans on at least another three (they're grouped in threes, Peacemaker (the latest one) was the third of a set, and she's working on another book in that universe...), and I strongly suspect that unless [character who wasn't born in Foreigner and turned nine in Peacemaker] becomes an adult during the book in progress there will be at least another three after this next set of three. Do reread the Devil to the Belt books, they're fantastic, though 
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Jul 31, 2014 00:14
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zonohedron posted:I'm not sure she's planning on really finishing the series, honestly; unless she runs out of ideas or her publisher stops wanting one a year from her, I don't see her bringing it to any sort of end any time soon. At a minimum, she plans on at least another three (they're grouped in threes, Peacemaker (the latest one) was the third of a set, and she's working on another book in that universe...), and I strongly suspect that unless [character who wasn't born in Foreigner and turned nine in Peacemaker] becomes an adult during the book in progress there will be at least another three after this next set of three. Yeah, I like Foreigner but I wish she'd return to the A-U and Compact Space settings for a while! I think DttB is going to be next in my queue, though.
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Jul 31, 2014 02:29
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The newest Foreigner book is on its way to Cherryh's editors. She expects it to be out in April, even though she's late getting it in. (No word on what she's going to write next - she probably wants to not think about that for a minute or two!)
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Aug 13, 2014 01:00
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A couple of months ago, I decided it was time to get around to reading CJ Cherryh's books. I started with the Downbelow trilogy and then read Foreigner. Wow. I've mainlined the rest of the foreigner series in my free time since then. It's very enjoyable to read about the main character's development although it's not handled perfectly: it's amazing in the first 4-5 books, then he spends a lot of time being hyper-competent but implausibly unwilling to act on or recognise the fact, then he suddenly realises that he's an amazing politician; at no point in the process does he ever get anything wrong. This makes him likeable but, after the initial period, not totally convincing. On the other hand, there's so much that's right about it - she nails the feelings of uncertainty and distrust that come with encountering strangers and wondering how they're going to react to you. And the tea party in the first book is a thing of beauty.
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Aug 25, 2014 17:01
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Beefeater1980 posted:And I mean, not that I have a favorite character or anything. I like Bren, though I think Cherryh is outright looking for occasions to get him injured at this point, but you're right that his character development is..... unconvincing.
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Aug 25, 2014 17:22
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So far Cyteen is amazing. You can really tell this is an experienced master writer -- no amateur or novice could write children's-viewpoint like this and make it as believable as she does. To write this kind of book you have to be really good and really confident in exactly how good you are; a lesser writer couldn't hack it and a less confident writer wouldn't have tried in the first place. I really, really enjoy Cyteen and Regenesis for this. Throughout, her mastery of writing to her characters' viewpoints is absurdly subtle but striking. When she's writing from Emory's viewpoint, you get an amazing impression of reading the words of someone who is smarter than you and has the confidence to not care about hiding it, and it utterly makes the character. Especially when you watch how Ari's viewpoint writing shifts through the two books. Also, I did not realize that Cherryh and Jane Francher finally officially got married this spring. Huzzah for them!
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Sep 29, 2014 00:17
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Liquid Communism posted:I really, really enjoy Cyteen and Regenesis for this. Throughout, her mastery of writing to her characters' viewpoints is absurdly subtle but striking. When she's writing from Emory's viewpoint, you get an amazing impression of reading the words of someone who is smarter than you and has the confidence to not care about hiding it, and it utterly makes the character. Especially when you watch how Ari's viewpoint writing shifts through the two books. Oh, seriously? Awesome! 
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Sep 29, 2014 01:52
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ToxicFrog posted:Oh, seriously? Awesome! I'm going to promote another author, who also recently married her long-term partner; Susan R Matthews was married last fall, the first day Washington allowed same-sex marriage. She write good, if somewhat disturbing (in the thought provoking way as well as emotionally), psychological and ethical science fiction. Ebooks are on Baen.com.
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Sep 29, 2014 02:00
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Oh cool, I didn't even know Cherryh was lesbionic!
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Sep 29, 2014 05:24
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It's not something she makes a big deal about, coming from the age she grew up in. Hell, when she started writing, they didn't use her real first name because the idea of a female sci-fi writer was one that wouldn't sell.
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Dec 13, 2014 07:15
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Liquid Communism posted:It's not something she makes a big deal about, coming from the age she grew up in. Hell, when she started writing, they didn't use her real first name because the idea of a female sci-fi writer was one that wouldn't sell. And, IIRC, didn't use her last name (Cherry) because "people will think it's a romance novel written under a pen name".
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Dec 13, 2014 21:49
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I'd like to thank the thread for compelling me into reading lots of her work, but think I'm done with my Cherryh binge for now, having gone through Chanur x4 / Cuckoo's Egg / Downbelow, Cyteen, Regenisis / Foreigner x9 in very short order. I held off on the latter series initially because of issues with the first book, but to me it was a warm, comfortable blanket throughout most of the first three trilogies. However, it did feel like there was a rut starting to set in towards the end, and nothing I've read about books 10-15 suggest that it gets any better. Fantastic author though.
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