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punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.
I'm planning on continuing my travel efforts as soon as this coronavirus stuff dies down. My goal is visiting every continent/regional area, which leaves South America and Australia/Oceania. I typically choose two countries in each visit on each trip.

I obviously had to go to Australia since it is a continent, but I was wondering what should be the other country that I should visit. New Zealand seems like a given, but I prefer to visit more "developing"/hidden gem nations. So I saw Papua New Guinea and it peaked my interest. Doing research, nearly everyone treats the country like Mad Max. People state that it is one of, if not the, most dangerous countries in the world. Homicide wise it doesn't seem THAT high. However it all makes me curious just how dangerous the country is.

Does anyone have any experience visiting/living there?

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freeasinbeer
Mar 26, 2015

by Fluffdaddy
Its uhhhhhh not developed and is a legit shithole. Think less undiscovered beauty and more trash filled beaches and expensive lovely accommodation/transport.

Just visit Thailand/Cambodia/Laos/Vietnam like other westerners and call it a day.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

freeasinbeer posted:

Its uhhhhhh not developed and is a legit shithole. Think less undiscovered beauty and more trash filled beaches and expensive lovely accommodation/transport.

Just visit Thailand/Cambodia/Laos/Vietnam like other westerners and call it a day.

I already visited SE Asia. Where in Oceania would you recommend?

Also I was wondering if it was that dangerous. People on Tourist Reddit made it seem like Caracas.

HookShot
Dec 26, 2005

punk rebel ecks posted:

I already visited SE Asia. Where in Oceania would you recommend?

Also I was wondering if it was that dangerous. People on Tourist Reddit made it seem like Caracas.

There are lots of pacific islands you can visit if you want somewhere that's less developed. Tonga, Samoa, Vanuatu, etc.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

freeasinbeer posted:

Its uhhhhhh not developed and is a legit shithole. Think less undiscovered beauty and more trash filled beaches and expensive lovely accommodation/transport.

The murder rate in PNG is sky high, but I thought that outside of Port Morseby it's mostly tribal warfare, i.e. unlikely to affect a tourist? Kind of like how Corsica has the highest murder rate in Europe, but all the murders are mafia and family vendetta, and thus irrelevant to tourists. I've never been, but thought the Kokoda Track was supposed to be nice. It apparently only gets like 4000 trekkers a year, so I doubt it's filled with plastic trash yet?

When I look up "tourist murder papua new guinea" right now I don't find any about actual tourists being attacked, with the closest I can find being this, with two porters butchered in an attack on a tour group: ( https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/trekking-guides-hacked-to-death-in-front-of-horrified-australian-tourists-8809877.html ).

In almost every country, your risk of being badly injured or killed in a vehicle is 10x to 100x higher than being the victim of a violent attack. I always look road safety stats up when deciding whether or not to rent a car when I go anywhere and I incidentally compare this against other crime stats. I find it ??? when backpackers talk about being worried about being robbed when they go to Guatemala City or wherever, but then they describe how they took a long distance overnight chicken bus through the mountains to get there. I guess those people wouldn't make it as professional actuaries.


E: Out of curiosity OP, where have you been that you consider a hidden gem?

Saladman fucked around with this message at 11:52 on Apr 7, 2020

Nam Taf
Jun 25, 2005

I am Fat Man, hear me roar!

HookShot posted:

There are lots of pacific islands you can visit if you want somewhere that's less developed. Tonga, Samoa, Vanuatu, etc.

This is good adivce. Listen to this. Flights from Australia to the Pacific Islands are cheap and you can go live like an emperor slamming back kava and drinking out of coconuts on really nice beaches.

But also NZ's south island is one of the most picturesque places in the world so don't write it off. It's also even cheaper again to get to from Australia than the islands are.

HookShot
Dec 26, 2005
Yeah, the South Island is one of my favourite places in the entire world. I spend months there at a time normally and never get sick of it.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Saladman posted:

E: Out of curiosity OP, where have you been that you consider a hidden gem?

I guess "hidden gem" is the wrong word to use, but rather places people rarely go but have a unique and interesting culture and/or geography.

The countries I've so far visited have been: Cambodia, Japan, Kenya, and Uganda.

Japan is a popular tourist spot so I won't expand on it.

Cambodia was great. I went during Songkran on accident and it was a lot of fun. I enjoyed the cheap everything and Angkor Wat. I also unironically enjoyed traveling in the tuk-tuk and seeing how there were zero rules of the road and having my driver driving on the wrong side of the road against traffic while I didn't even have a seatbelt on.

Kenya was so-so. I went there primary for the safari but was in the city most days. While I enjoyed Nairobi it began wearing really thin at the end as I got tired getting harassed in the city all the time with people trying to scam me.

Uganda was better than I expected. Lots of interesting stories from me just walking around and meeting people. Interesting scenery. Didn't do too many "touristy" things but it was well worth it.

Nam Taf posted:

This is good adivce. Listen to this. Flights from Australia to the Pacific Islands are cheap and you can go live like an emperor slamming back kava and drinking out of coconuts on really nice beaches.

But also NZ's south island is one of the most picturesque places in the world so don't write it off. It's also even cheaper again to get to from Australia than the islands are.

So what would be some places you would list besides NZ south island?

teacup
Dec 20, 2006

= M I L K E R S =

punk rebel ecks posted:

I guess "hidden gem" is the wrong word to use, but rather places people rarely go but have a unique and interesting culture and/or geography.

The countries I've so far visited have been: Cambodia, Japan, Kenya, and Uganda.

Japan is a popular tourist spot so I won't expand on it.

Cambodia was great. I went during Songkran on accident and it was a lot of fun. I enjoyed the cheap everything and Angkor Wat. I also unironically enjoyed traveling in the tuk-tuk and seeing how there were zero rules of the road and having my driver driving on the wrong side of the road against traffic while I didn't even have a seatbelt on.

Kenya was so-so. I went there primary for the safari but was in the city most days. While I enjoyed Nairobi it began wearing really thin at the end as I got tired getting harassed in the city all the time with people trying to scam me.

Uganda was better than I expected. Lots of interesting stories from me just walking around and meeting people. Interesting scenery. Didn't do too many "touristy" things but it was well worth it.


So what would be some places you would list besides NZ south island?


Places people rarely go- Japan, Kenya, Cambodia.



PNG I've only ever heard horrible things from and I live in Australia, and even when you peel back the typical australian racism angle even the people who didn't hate it just said it was boring.

Interesting geography- New Zealand

But yeah Tonga, Samoa, Fiji, Vanuatu, New Caledonia. They range in price (they are ironically more expensive than you think in many places due to the isolation).

Maybe the highlands of new caledonia?

If you count PNG as Oceania does Indonesia count? Because Indonesia.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

teacup posted:

Places people rarely go- Japan, Kenya, Cambodia.

Yeah, I don't think anyone would ever consider Angor Wat or Nairobi "hidden gems". Anything that's on the "top 10 what to do in X" Dorling Kindersley guidebook or Rick Steves itinerary or whatever is pretty much the definition of what is not a hidden gem.

But to be fair to OP, this is a travel forum, so I'm guessing that the regular posters here are all in the top like <1% worldwide in terms of international travel experience and in terms of being personally responsible for murdering glaciers. Outside of travel forums, Kenya Cambodia, and Uganda are not super commonly gone to, in the way that many of your friends from HS have probably been to France (or I guess for you as an Aussie, maybe Thailand would be the closer equivalent), while probably only a handful of people you personally know have been to Kenya.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Saladman posted:

Yeah, I don't think anyone would ever consider Angor Wat or Nairobi "hidden gems". Anything that's on the "top 10 what to do in X" Dorling Kindersley guidebook or Rick Steves itinerary or whatever is pretty much the definition of what is not a hidden gem.

But to be fair to OP, this is a travel forum, so I'm guessing that the regular posters here are all in the top like <1% worldwide in terms of international travel experience and in terms of being personally responsible for murdering glaciers. Outside of travel forums, Kenya Cambodia, and Uganda are not super commonly gone to, in the way that many of your friends from HS have probably been to France (or I guess for you as an Aussie, maybe Thailand would be the closer equivalent), while probably only a handful of people you personally know have been to Kenya.

Pretty much.

Most people I know either go take a Eurotrip, go to Mexico, or Thailand. That's about it. Maybe add in in Dubai.

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.
I know a few people who've been to PNG. My brother-in-law did the Kokoda Track a couple years back and although he loved the trail, Port Moresby was really sketchy. And he's a well-travelled 70+ countries veteran. An ex-girlfriend of mine worked for an NGO and split her work between office time in Sydney and field time in Port Moresby. She hated being there, particularly as a solo white woman.

So yeah, I'd personally steer clear of PNG. As others have suggested there's a lot of underdeveloped countries in the Pacific that are much safer and easier to travel in. Fiji, Tonga, Samoa, Vanuatu etc. Just avoid the resorts.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.
Are there any Oceania countries that are relatively cheap and are still paradise?

Davincie
Jul 7, 2008

you don’t seem to have that many specific needs and knowledge of the area so why not just do bali ? yeah every other aussie goes there, but japan has millions of tourists every year too. and if you want something more obscure pick one of the many other indonesian islands

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Davincie posted:

you don’t seem to have that many specific needs and knowledge of the area so why not just do bali ? yeah every other aussie goes there, but japan has millions of tourists every year too. and if you want something more obscure pick one of the many other indonesian islands

Because it is technically not part of Oceania.

coronavirus
Jan 27, 2020

by Cyrano4747
Don't deprive yourself of an extended visit to New Zealand just because you like some arbitrary rules of visiting x y z country in each continent. NZ is loving incredible.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

coronavirus posted:

Don't deprive yourself of an extended visit to New Zealand just because you like some arbitrary rules of visiting x y z country in each continent. NZ is loving incredible.

New Zealand is on his list of arbitrarily-accepted places anyway.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Saladman posted:

New Zealand is on his list of arbitrarily-accepted places anyway.

Yeah I think I'll go with New Zealand. So, South Island is far better than North Island correct? Is there a reason to visit the North Island?

HookShot
Dec 26, 2005
There are a lot of things to visit on the North Island too, but the South is prettier.

Really this is the point where you need to start doing a Google search.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

HookShot posted:

There are a lot of things to visit on the North Island too, but the South is prettier.

Really this is the point where you need to start doing a Google search.

But I trust goon opinions above all else.

Nam Taf
Jun 25, 2005

I am Fat Man, hear me roar!

We’ve given you our opinions. We’re not planning your holiday for you. We have no idea what you like to do on it. It’s up to you to decide what sort of holiday you like and plan it

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Nam Taf posted:

We’ve given you our opinions. We’re not planning your holiday for you. We have no idea what you like to do on it. It’s up to you to decide what sort of holiday you like and plan it
I'm not having you all plan my holiday, in just asking what your experiences were like.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

punk rebel ecks posted:

But I trust goon opinions above all else.

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3842929

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3805041

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3730298

And apparently archives only go back 6 years? I don't see any threads older than May 2014. Not that any of those threads have more than a handful of posts on them, T&T seems to really only be geared towards Disney, East Asia, and Europe, every other thread topic on here in the past 10 years I've been following is nearly a ghost town.

Shammypants
May 25, 2004

Let me tell you about true luxury.

There are war torn countries where it's safer for women to travel and that's not a joke or exaggeration.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Saladman posted:

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3842929

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3805041

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3730298

And apparently archives only go back 6 years? I don't see any threads older than May 2014. Not that any of those threads have more than a handful of posts on them, T&T seems to really only be geared towards Disney, East Asia, and Europe, every other thread topic on here in the past 10 years I've been following is nearly a ghost town.

I see. Thank you.

theHUNGERian
Feb 23, 2006

Has the OP considered the Solomon Islands? It's basically PNG in terms of scenery (above and under water), but I do not know about crime rate. I would like to know about it though as I am considering a trip there next year.

AHH F/UGH
May 25, 2002

punk rebel ecks posted:

Are there any Oceania countries that are relatively cheap and are still paradise?

Fiji is dope as hell. Imagine Jamaica without the crime, more authentic(?) and cheaper, but still really good tourist luxury. I have a lifelong friend who is half Fijian and I met him and his family there one time when they went back and I was on vacation. It doesn't have any insane sightseeing spots, but if you hike the main volcano you get a crazy good view, and it has those famous resort houses that sit on the water and you can swim in the clear 80 degree water any time you want.





Saipan is also cool if no one mentioned it yet, like a cheaper version of Hawaii.

AHH F/UGH fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Jun 17, 2020

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.
Yeah I'll definitely consider the Soloman Islands and Fiji.

theHUNGERian
Feb 23, 2006

While I haven't been to Siapan, I thoroughly enjoyed Guam on two separate trips.

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.
If you're considering Fiji, be sure to avoid the major western hotel chains on the south-western corner of the main island. They're nice enough, and I've been a couple of times for weddings and the like but honestly - it's not really Fiji. They're also largely built on reclaimed mangrove swamps, so there's not really beaches (unless the sand's been trucked in), and the snorkelling isn't much good either.

The last time I went to Fiji we stayed at Octopus Resort on Yawa Island which was fantastic. It's a fair way from the main island though, so you'll need a seaplane or speedboat ride (we lucked out and had our seaplace transfer upgraded to a helicopter since it was too choppy for the seaplane to land).

Oakland Martini
Feb 14, 2008
Refugee from the great account hijacking of 2008
I will also second Fiji, or at least the more remote, rustic parts of it. I've stayed on Taveuni and Kandavu and both were fantastic. My sense is that you want to get as far away from Nadi as possible. If you are a diver I highly recommend Dolphin Bay Divers on Taveuni (it's actually across the strait on Vanua Levu but you fly to Taveuni to get there).

Thesaurus
Oct 3, 2004


many thanks to this thread for prompting me to start learning about papua new guinea.

A lot of the info you find is just :stare:

The place sounds truly off the rails

theHUNGERian
Feb 23, 2006

Thesaurus posted:

many thanks to this thread for prompting me to start learning about papua new guinea.

A lot of the info you find is just :stare:

The place sounds truly off the rails

PNG has a special place in my memory even though I have never been there. When I was a kid (growing up in Europe), I had a world map taped to my desk. It was so big that it covered the whole desk. Because of the layout of the desk and map, I was seated in such a way that the pacific islands were right in front of me and PNG had the most pleasant shade of green. I'm sure this (and of course pictures I have seen once I grew up) contributed to my interest in the pacific. Fortunately, I have since then moved to SoCal, so I have a much easier time reaching places. But PNG sounds :stare: indeed, so I will just cherish my memory of a map.

punk rebel ecks
Dec 11, 2010

A shitty post? This calls for a dance of deduction.

Thesaurus posted:

many thanks to this thread for prompting me to start learning about papua new guinea.

A lot of the info you find is just :stare:

The place sounds truly off the rails

I read on Reddit about stories how the country has people robbing tourists cellphones with machetes. Like they'll demand their cell phones or they'll just chop their heads off.

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Tamarillo
Aug 6, 2009
If you want a relatively untouched Pacific Island paradise, consider the Cook Islands (when they open their borders). Rarotonga is warm, sunny and small enough to drive around in an hour, so it basically just feels like an island go-kart track. Muri Beach has a fantastic night meal market where all the locals just make huge pots of amazing food and some of it goes to support the local school. Snorkeling is not as good as it used to be but the beaches are nice, people are lovely and food is great. If you want to get even further away you can go to Aitutaki which is about a 45min flight away. We stayed there for 4 days but only explored our local beaches/area, but it was lovely anyway. Unfortunately a hurricane had smacked the island a few months prior so everything was a bit wrecked.

I'm from NZ and when I want to find somewhere warm with beaches where I can chill out and relax, Raro is my go-to.

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