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Paul Revere 3000 posted:There's these two schmoes called John Cena and Randy Orton that use their own names, but they probably don't have any big plans for those guys anyway. I'm surprised they let anybody keep their real name, after how Lesnar and Angle have jumped ship. It seems like the only way they keep it is if they were brought in as a somebody from another discipline (like Henry and Angle being Olympians, and Lesnar's collegiate success)
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Jan 11, 2010 01:23
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Also Ted DiBiase, Mark Henry, the Hardys, Gail Kim, Eve Torres, Charlie Haas, Michelle McCool (yes that is her honest to God name), and Gregory Helms. The list gets a lot longer if you count people like Melina or Finlay who just use their first/last names.
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Jan 11, 2010 01:23
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tendrilsfor20 posted:I was wikitrawling the other day and found out Shad Gaspard is the wrestler's real, full name. That really surprised me, since I assumed it was WWE SOP to give a name that can be trademarked (and more importantly, that the wrestler can't take with them when they leave - qv "Chris Chen" on TNA) WWE's decision on names depends on which way the wind is blowing. Sometimes they want names they can own, sometimes they feel that they need to use real names so they seem real. Also, when the women are on the Diva Search they have a little bit of a name to market. I am also not counting commentators/ring announcers. The list I can think of, for guys post-WCW with the company right now: Kofi Kingston - According to Wikipedia, his ring name before WWE. Paul Burchill - Real name is Birchall Gail Kim Jillian Maryse Melina Batista - Dave Bautista, nobody before WWE signed him Charlie Haas CM Punk - However, I wouldn't count him 100% since he did have some name value from the indy scene Shad - Shad Gaspard Beth Phoenix Mickie Names - Real name, but used Alexis Laree on the indy scene and in TNA John Cone - Referee
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Jan 11, 2010 01:28
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tendrilsfor20 posted:Orton doesn't count because his last name means something to wrestling fans. I don't think most fans actually knew who Bob Orton was until WWE made a thing out of it, though. It might be different for the Rhodes family, but even then we're talking about viewers who weren't even born the last time Dusty was on the scene.
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Jan 11, 2010 04:48
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Have there been many (any?) matches where the person who was supposed to win never kicked out?
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Jan 11, 2010 05:35
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Shitty_Wok posted:Have there been many (any?) matches where the person who was supposed to win never kicked out? Along these lines: Has a result ever been changed in the ring? Like, say HHH blows his quad again and realizes it, would he change the result on the fly so he doesn't win the title and then have the vacate it the next night?
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Jan 11, 2010 05:41
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Shitty_Wok posted:Have there been many (any?) matches where the person who was supposed to win never kicked out? Mark Henry and Matt Hardy v Miz/Morrison from 08, Morrison got a stinger from a top rope side effect and forgot to kick out in time, resulting in the ref getting fired. DannoMack posted:Along these lines: Mankind was originally supposed to win the belt at IYH: Mind Games against Shawn Michaels in 96, but for whatever reason, the finish was changed to become a DQ mid match. This is pretty notable since you see Vince talk to Shawn at ringside and you get to see him throw a little prima donna fit.
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Jan 11, 2010 05:43
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DannoMack posted:Along these lines: Or, another example - was Austin meant to beat Owen the night his neck got broke?
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Jan 11, 2010 05:43
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dusty udder smoker posted:Mark Henry and Matt Hardy v Miz/Morrison from 08, Morrison got a stinger from a top rope side effect and forgot to kick out in time, resulting in the ref getting fired. That... doesn't seem right.
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Jan 11, 2010 05:44
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Shitty_Wok posted:Or, another example - was Austin meant to beat Owen the night his neck got broke? Since the stipulation was that Austin would have to kiss Owen's rear end if he lost, yes. That's why Owen had to buy time for Austin to pin him instead of just pinning Austin
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Jan 11, 2010 05:44
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Supposedly Austin was going to win the Fatal Fourway at the February In Your House after Shawn lost his smile. The story goes that Austin got injured midmatch and they improvised a Bret victory.
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Jan 11, 2010 05:52
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Shitty_Wok posted:That... doesn't seem right. If I remember correctly it was at the same time they were doing their bit where they didn't tell refs the endings to matches so they wouldn't be able to unconsciously telegraph kick-outs/endings coming and the wrestlers had to be careful about actually being DQed. I thought it was actually a really neat idea, but whenever anything went wrong the referee seemed to be the one unfairly getting blamed.
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Jan 11, 2010 05:55
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dusty udder smoker posted:Mankind was originally supposed to win the belt at IYH: Mind Games against Shawn Michaels in 96, but for whatever reason, the finish was changed to become a DQ mid match. This is pretty notable since you see Vince talk to Shawn at ringside and you get to see him throw a little prima donna fit. Well now I HAVE to find this match
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Jan 11, 2010 05:57
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DannoMack posted:Well now I HAVE to find this match I've never seen it, but I think Foley considers (or considered) it his favorite match of all time even though there really wasn't anything "special" about it, because he just thought that everything clicked perfectly. Now finding out that HBK pitched a fit during it cracks me up.
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Jan 11, 2010 05:59
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DannoMack posted:Well now I HAVE to find this match It was a good match. I dont remember Shawn throwing a fit, but was during that time that ITH was new and the WWF didn't know how to build matches monthly, so it was largely forgotten.
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Jan 11, 2010 06:02
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DannoMack posted:Well now I HAVE to find this match It's on Michaels's From the Vault DVD & Foley's Greatest Hits & Misses DVD, for what that's worth. This is also the first time I've heard that Foley was supposed to win the title that night. Also, regarding the ref getting fired match, wasn't Miz supposed to run in to make the save and forget his cue?
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Jan 11, 2010 06:06
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Another one is from Souled Out 2000 where Billy Kidman had to face 3 wrestlers in 3 different match types. His first challenge was against Dean Malenko in a "Catch as Catch Can" match, which is an extremely old school match type that is all about different types of moves and holds that Dean would have excelled at. There were two problems. The first was that Dean is a very methodical wrestler and, as a heel, stalling and cowardice are part of his repertoire. The second was that either no one told Dean the specific rules or he forgot. Either way, 2 minutes in, Dean slides out of the ring to stall. However, under catch rules, leaving the ring is like giving up, so the match was over.
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Jan 11, 2010 06:07
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Foley has said that his match with Orton at Backlash '04 has replaced the Michaels match as his favorite. I dont understand the huge deal about it. Its a very good match for sure, but I never counted it among Mick's best. The match itself is on the Shawn Michaels From the Vault DVD and I think it is on Mick's Hard KNocks Cheap Pops DVD also.
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Jan 11, 2010 06:08
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Shitty_Wok posted:Have there been many (any?) matches where the person who was supposed to win never kicked out? I remember on the Bret Hart DVD, he got hurt in a match and was supposed to win it, but instead he put his leg on the bottom rope for a kick out, then lost by count out instead because of his injury. "He didn't want to lose to such a bad wrestler" was his reasoning for not letting him get the pinfall victory.
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Jan 11, 2010 06:17
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oldpainless posted:Foley has said that his match with Orton at Backlash '04 has replaced the Michaels match as his favorite. I dont understand the huge deal about it. Its a very good match for sure, but I never counted it among Mick's best. Mick only has a handful of good matches.
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Jan 11, 2010 06:37
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Alright, I'm watching the ECW Blood Sport DVD, and there's really no way for me to ask this without sounding insulting, but...did Sandman ever have formal training on how to be a wrestler? He was more in shape for the ECW revival in 2006 than he was back in 1996-97, and I don't remember any of his matches not being a clusterfuck of weapon spots (this worked in ECW back then; I'm just curious).
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Jan 11, 2010 06:40
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Ktik posted:I remember on the Bret Hart DVD, he got hurt in a match and was supposed to win it, but instead he put his leg on the bottom rope for a kick out, then lost by count out instead because of his injury. "He didn't want to lose to such a bad wrestler" was his reasoning for not letting him get the pinfall victory. Bret did a spot where he gets knocked off the apron onto the guard rail, and crushed his sternum or something. Dino Bravo tried to drag him back in to pin him, but Bret kept rolling out of the ring until he got counted out
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Jan 11, 2010 06:44
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Jerusalem posted:If I remember correctly it was at the same time they were doing their bit where they didn't tell refs the endings to matches so they wouldn't be able to unconsciously telegraph kick-outs/endings coming and the wrestlers had to be careful about actually being DQed. I thought it was actually a really neat idea, but whenever anything went wrong the referee seemed to be the one unfairly getting blamed.
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Jan 11, 2010 07:28
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Speaking of the HBK-Foley match (my favorite match of all times, for the record), there's a bit in there where it looks like Mick legit slaps Michaels in the face, leading to a very real looking roll-around-and-hit-each-other sequence. Was this planned? It's such an odd spot.
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Jan 11, 2010 07:38
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Minidust posted:whoa, did this really happen? even in the indy shows I've worked, the referees need to know the finishes and match times so the show can be paced properly. I assume this would be even more strict on televised WWE shows. WWE tried it for about 3 months last year or so, it didn't work well.
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Jan 11, 2010 07:40
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rotinaj posted:WWE tried it for about 3 months last year or so, it didn't work well.
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Jan 11, 2010 07:49
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Jerusalem posted:I've never seen it, but I think Foley considers (or considered) it his favorite match of all time even though there really wasn't anything "special" about it, because he just thought that everything clicked perfectly. Now finding out that HBK pitched a fit during it cracks me up. If I recall correctly, Shawn also got into a visible argument in the ring with Earl Hebner a couple months before during his match with Vader at Summerslam. I've heard conflicting stories on the Mind Games match, either that Vince switched the ending up on them, or that he just told them to go home because the match was running long. The match itself is excellent--Shawn and Foley's styles worked really well together (no surprise I guess since Shawn is arguably the best of all time at complementing the routine of whoever he faces). It's really only hampered by the DQ ending. TL posted:Speaking of the HBK-Foley match (my favorite match of all times, for the record), there's a bit in there where it looks like Mick legit slaps Michaels in the face, leading to a very real looking roll-around-and-hit-each-other sequence. Was this planned? It's such an odd spot. I'm going by second hand information I read a few years ago (and may be misremembering) but I think that stuff was all a worked shoot Shawn and Foley decided to put on for some reason. It's very obvious at one point where Shawn is whipped into the corner and appears to be expecting a certain spot, and Foley doesn't cooperate, so Shawn looks visibly pissed off and delivers some stiff punches and kicks. Not sure why they wanted to work people like that.
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Jan 11, 2010 08:59
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CVagts posted:There's really no way for me to ask this without sounding insulting, but...did Sandman ever have formal training on how to be a wrestler? He was more in shape for the ECW revival in 2006 than he was back in 1996-97, and I don't remember any of his matches not being a clusterfuck of weapon spots (this worked in ECW back then; I'm just curious).
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Jan 11, 2010 09:56
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tendrilsfor20 posted:Also want to know the answer to this Trained by Larry Winters[1] Tri-State Wrestling Academy[1] Mark Tendler[1] J.T. Smith[1]
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Jan 11, 2010 10:02
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I believe there was an IWGP title change that wasn't supposed to happen because the current champ was knocked out cold in like 4 minutes.
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Jan 11, 2010 10:46
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:Mick only has a handful of good matches. Untrue. Mick is one of the few garbage wrestlers whose matches actually made sense, and he managed to drag something watchable out of Van Hammer of all people.
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Jan 11, 2010 18:22
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Is it true that Vince told Carlito to "spic it up" a little bit more?
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Jan 11, 2010 20:06
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AlbertFlasher posted:Is it true that Vince told Carlito to "spic it up" a little bit more? Yes, Vince is a horrible racist.
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Jan 11, 2010 21:05
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BizarroAzrael posted:Yes, Vince is a horrible racist. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXBnEabG43s
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Jan 11, 2010 21:07
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Speaking of racism I was watching Wrestlemania 4 last night due to boredom and during the Demolition/Strike Force tag team championship match Ventura was really letting Tito Santana have it. "I'll bet that Chico Santana wishes he was back in Tijuana selling tacos again, Gorilla!" This was in 1987, amazing the poo poo they got away with and there's probably worse than this example. Heeling it up is one thing but come on.
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Jan 11, 2010 21:12
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AlbertFlasher posted:Is it true that Vince told Carlito to "spic it up" a little bit more? How should I know?
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Jan 11, 2010 21:23
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Shawn stiffed Vader at some point during his match with him because he was supposed to roll out of the way of an elbow drop but didn't. So Shawn landed on his feet and just kicked him in the head. I know Foley liked that spot or the look of that spot a lot so he worked it into his match with Shawn. Most of what you're talking about in that match was probably "worked shoot" style.
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Jan 11, 2010 21:24
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Bearnt! posted:Speaking of racism I was watching Wrestlemania 4 last night due to boredom and during the Demolition/Strike Force tag team championship match Ventura was really letting Tito Santana have it. "I'll bet that Chico Santana wishes he was back in Tijuana selling tacos again, Gorilla!" This was in 1987, amazing the poo poo they got away with and there's probably worse than this example. Heeling it up is one thing but come on. I vaguely recall an interview with Santana where he noted that Ventura always gave it to him with both barrels but Santana considered it just part of the show and that it made the people watching at home like him more to show that lousy Ventura what for 
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Jan 11, 2010 21:46
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oldpainless posted:Foley has said that his match with Orton at Backlash '04 has replaced the Michaels match as his favorite. I dont understand the huge deal about it. Its a very good match for sure, but I never counted it among Mick's best. Favorite and good are not necessarily the same thing.
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Jan 11, 2010 22:22
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What was the original plan for Lesnar/Goldberg before everything went to poo poo? I could probably leave my question at that but I won't. They had their quick stare down tease at Survivor Series, followed by Lesnar F5'ing Goldberg during the Rumble causing him to be eliminated. Lesnar then drops the title to Eddie at No Way Out when Goldberg takes Stone Cold's advice and interferes. Was Lesnar confirmed as leaving at this point hence the title drop? After this it gets hazy for me. Did they realize a deal wasn't going to be worked out with Goldberg to renew his contact and then to make things worse Brock decided to leave on top of that? So they kind of just said gently caress it and got Stone Cold involved to send them off in front of a hot crowd who knew they were both leaving the company?
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Jan 11, 2010 22:28
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