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Who Killed WCW?
Eric Bischoff
Hulk Hogan
Vince Russo
Jerusalem
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coconono
Aug 11, 2004

KISS ME KRIS

The A-Team Van posted:

"...oh, my new name is Seven BTW"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7RLzLXDsAI

holy crap that's amazing. They spend all this time and effort putting together that entrance only to be used as a plot device.

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LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

coconono posted:

holy crap that's amazing. They spend all this time and effort putting together that entrance only to be used as a plot device.
It wasn't their fault. AOL made them scrap the character. Rather than just drop it completely and have Dustin Rhodes just randomly show up one day, they actually gave it some closure.

coconono
Aug 11, 2004

KISS ME KRIS

LividLiquid posted:

It wasn't their fault. AOL made them scrap the character. Rather than just drop it completely and have Dustin Rhodes just randomly show up one day, they actually gave it some closure.

They could have had him hit by a hummer or something rather than go through all that. oh wait, WCW.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Gavok posted:

People talk about the Fingerpoke of Doom and the reformation of the nWo to screw Goldberg over, but there's one segment from a week or so later that's also retarded and nobody ever remembers it.

The idea is that with Goldberg on a rampage, he's going to start picking off the nWo like he's Jason Voorhees. This involved, I poo poo you not, spearing Kevin Nash in the shower.

To expand on that idea, Nash hangs out with his nWo buddies backstage and they gloat. Then he decides he's going to go take a shower. He gets naked and walks into the shower and THE CAMERA FOLLOWS HIM! There's a mosaic over his waist and even the announcers are shocked to be seeing this. All so Goldberg can stalk him and lay him out.
Was that the same night that Goldberg decided he could break a window with his bare hand?

some bust on that guy
Jan 21, 2006

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

Strawberry Panda posted:

A decade later Dustin Rhodes is still playing Goldust after a failed run as some retard named Black Reign.

Goldust is the best thing Russo has ever come up with, isn't it? Well, you know.. aside from the Attitude Era.. Oh and having Tank Abbott join 3 Count.

JavyOO7 posted:

g) Always calling out the competition. Why? Maybe there'd be a point if TNA was highly regarded as a legit competitor to WWE but it isn't. Even if it WAS I see that there's no point but upsetting me because why the gently caress would I want to hear about your competition when I am tuned into your channel? It makes no sense. There's this awesome collection of videos at youtube with Scott Steiner ranting and raving on TNA... and there's a video where it seems like where its his debut where he screams three WWE main eventers and says WWE like a million times. ITS ANNOYING.

This happens to even the greatest of promotions. WWF did this too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-d6JgyXycXI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP6UP081pys

joshtothemaxx
Nov 17, 2008

I will have a whole army of zombies! A zombie Marine Corps, a zombie Navy Corps, zombie Space Cadets...

Rusty Shackelford posted:

How many people had funerals that week besides Dale Earnhardt? How many wrestlers fell to their death in that same arena? There's a pretty big difference there.

/shrug. I'm not really arguing it. Just pointing out that there was likely a significant chunk of people that watched both WCW and NASCAR like a religion. It really is a stupid parallel to draw though.

LightsGameraAction
Sep 4, 2006

Super Ninja Fish posted:



This happens to even the greatest of promotions. WWF did this too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-d6JgyXycXI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP6UP081pys

In the Monday Night Wars documentary Triple H talks about the DX invading WCW thing and says the arena closing the gate on their jeep was the worst thing WCW could have done, because if they just let DX into the arena and on their show everyone would have tuned into Nitro instead to see what was going on.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

I'm so bummed that didn't happen.

CVagts
Oct 19, 2009
That is a genius point that I have never thought of until I read it just now.

And assuming the cameramen from RAW couldn't follow them, I'd DEFINITELY turn to Nitro to see what was going on. At the worst I'd have been flipping back and forth like a madman.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

CVagts posted:

That is a genius point that I have never thought of until I read it just now.

And assuming the cameramen from RAW couldn't follow them, I'd DEFINITELY turn to Nitro to see what was going on. At the worst I'd have been flipping back and forth like a madman.
It'd leave WCW in a lot of legal trouble, most likely. I don't think there's any legal precedent set for this kind of bizarre situation, but I doubt Vince would take it lying down and it would have made for a lengthy court case.

Paper Jam Dipper
Jul 14, 2007

by XyloJW

LividLiquid posted:

It'd leave WCW in a lot of legal trouble, most likely. I don't think there's any legal precedent set for this kind of bizarre situation, but I doubt Vince would take it lying down and it would have made for a lengthy court case.

A lengthy court case for allowing WWF talent into a WCW building?

The truth is, what Triple H neglects, is the true legal trouble is what DX, who are WWF contracted talent, would say/do while on TNT television. There is nothing stopping them from sucker punching WCW talents, injuring staff or more importantly, saying vulgarities to the moon. What, was WCW going to put a camera on them but mute them?

And then, what about getting them out of the building? Not easy. It would have been absolute mess.

Great TV, but an absolute mess.

Zack_Gochuck
Jan 4, 2007

Stupid Wrestling People
Wouldn't DX be taken to court by the WWF as opposed to WCW? They were the ones under a contract with the WWF, not WCW.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

BAEST MODE!!!

Lone Rogue posted:

A lengthy court case for allowing WWF talent into a WCW building?

The truth is, what Triple H neglects, is the true legal trouble is what DX, who are WWF contracted talent, would say/do while on TNT television. There is nothing stopping them from sucker punching WCW talents, injuring staff or more importantly, saying vulgarities to the moon. What, was WCW going to put a camera on them but mute them?

And then, what about getting them out of the building? Not easy. It would have been absolute mess.

Great TV, but an absolute mess.

You know what would stop them? The law and going to jail for assault.

And if they just bought a ticket and sat in the crowd they'd be fair game to be shown on TV given all the disclaimers on your tickets and in the building.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

MassRayPer posted:

You know what would stop them? The law and going to jail for assault.

And if they just bought a ticket and sat in the crowd they'd be fair game to be shown on TV given all the disclaimers on your tickets and in the building.

Also he seems to forget the lawsuit that WWE had going against WCW - Scott Hall and Kevin Nash copy right infringement. I am sure a lawyer could have easily gotten the law suit thrown out by showing WWE characters on WCW television.

iCloud Strife
Jul 24, 2007

by angerbeet
I'm pretty sure HHH was joking there, guys.

The American Dream
Mar 1, 2007
Don't Forget My Balls
So, I was thinking about the DDP love going on in this thread and I think another one today. I was just flipping around the channels and DDP was in the Devils Rejects on IFC (but with not positive black hair.) DDP still rules 10 years later.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

BAEST MODE!!!

The American Dream posted:

So, I was thinking about the DDP love going on in this thread and I think another one today. I was just flipping around the channels and DDP was in the Devils Rejects on IFC (but with not positive black hair.) DDP still rules 10 years later.

He's also in Carny Wilson's reality show on GSN.

I don't understand how he remains so positive while doing that :(

I have no idea why, but WCW loving up Berlyn was one of the things that pissed me off the most about the company. Alex Wright was never a great worker or promo, but that gimmick and the videos leading up to it were really cool and it seemed like something that would take off.

And they hosed it all up by not having any control over their talent.

TL
Jan 16, 2006

Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world

Fallen Rib
I love how vicious Cornette attacks Sean Waltman in that video, yet he was back in the WWF less than a year later.

Nut Bunnies
May 24, 2005

Fun Shoe

TL posted:

I love how vicious Cornette attacks Sean Waltman in that video, yet he was back in the WWF less than a year later.

HHH did a radio interview back then saying Ric Flair was a washed up dinosaur that should retire.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

BAEST MODE!!!

Captain Charisma posted:

HHH did a radio interview back then saying Ric Flair was a washed up dinosaur that should retire.

Well it's not like HHH had tremendous power and was one of the bookers like Cornette was then...

Oh. Yeah.

Strawberry Panda
Nov 4, 2007

Breakfast Defecting, Slow Dick Touching, Root Beer Barreling SwagVP

MassRayPer posted:

You know what would stop them? The law and going to jail for assault.

And if they just bought a ticket and sat in the crowd they'd be fair game to be shown on TV given all the disclaimers on your tickets and in the building.

But they couldn't but a ticket because the tickets were free!

What always worries me about that segment is that DX was allowed to drive around in a fake tank with fake guns and no one was scared.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

BAEST MODE!!!
Thinking about Berlyn and DDP made me wonder this:

If you followed WCW at all, what about WCW brought you the most joy, and the most rage?

Joy: Diamond Dallas Page. I don't know how they pulled off such a perfect push with DDP. They hosed it up a bit by turning him heel, but he was pretty good at that too. He was this perfect mix of "Wow, he's just a normal dude..." then he'd do a crazy lucha move and you'd go "But I could never do that." and of course Diamond Cutter, BANG.

Chris Jericho's heel turn: Him beating up Penzer and apologizing several shows in a row was grand. Collecting trophies was grand. Going to the library of Congress was grand. And the whole Malenko mascarading as Ciclope/Halloween was the icing on the cake.

Mike Enos: For some reason I was a big mark for Mike Enos. Enos vs Child Murderer from Souled Out 99 is one of my favorite, run of the mill not that special, WCW mid card matches.

The transition from Raven vs Benoit to Raven vs Benoit vs DDP. Raven vs Benoit was a really hot feud, and when Benoit won the blow off, there wasn't much more for them to do... until Raven got involved with DDP while he was feuding with Benoit a month later. This is my favorite three way feud of all time, and DDP vs Raven vs Benoit from Uncensored 98 would rank as my favorite 3 way for years to come.

and of course, the Sting vs Hogan storyline. It was all so perfect. It would take
several pages to write down all of the reasons why it ruled.

Rage: As mentioned a few posts up, Berlyn. Idiots.

Sting joining the nWo: Way to slap the fans in the face. Sting is the lone savior of WCW who the fans desperately want to see kill the nWo for 15 months and then he just joins the Wolfpac 5 months after Sting vs Hogan. This made me really angry at the time, because as a fan I got emotionally invested and seeing Sting turn into Just Another Guy in the Wolfpac on top of that was baffling.

Bret Hart: Is he a heel? Is he a face? Is he in the nWo? Do I give a poo poo? Not anymore!

Savage's two one night title reigns: I wasn't a big Macho Man fan, but he was way more captivating than any of the former WWF Old Guys. He won the title from Sting in 98, which was annoying. But, hey, I still like Macho Man. Then he loses it to Hogan the next night.

Then Macho wins the belt in 99... and loses it the next night to Hogan. Again.

Eric Bischoff's talk show. During the Leno feud, Bischoff had his own talk show that is mentioned elsewhere in this thread. It was nWo Nightcap and it was ATROCIOUS. And it lasted 10-15 minutes in several Nitros and Thunders. I rarely switched to Raw, but the second time it aired I turned on Raw.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Lone Rogue posted:

A lengthy court case for allowing WWF talent into a WCW building?
No.

quote:

The truth is, what Triple H neglects, is the true legal trouble is what DX, who are WWF contracted talent, would say/do while on TNT television. There is nothing stopping them from sucker punching WCW talents, injuring staff or more importantly, saying vulgarities to the moon. What, was WCW going to put a camera on them but mute them?
Yes. This.

LividLiquid fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Jan 27, 2010

EricCrapton
Dec 17, 2009
I THINK ALL WOMEN ARE DUMB BROADS

MassRayPer posted:

Thinking about Berlyn and DDP made me wonder this:

If you followed WCW at all, what about WCW brought you the most joy, and the most rage?




Joy: Anything involving DDP from about 1996 to 1998 or 1999. His matches with Chris Benoit, Randy Savage and Raven where the best thing going in WCW at that time. gently caress the nwo.

Rage: A lot of the really stupid and childish stuff that WCW did before they got really huge. Pretty much anything involving Hulk Hogan pre-nwo days was god awful. His feud with the Dungeon of Doom was basically the Plan 9 From Outer Space of the rasslin' world. Great for comedic value, but probably not in the way that they originally intended. The Yeti, The Giant getting thrown off a building, Kevin Sullivan's journey through the woods to find a fat crusty guy, Brutus Beefcake playing about 700 different characters, "IT'S NOT HOT!", and so on...

Of course, the Russo era WCW was atrocious, but everyone already knows that.

some bust on that guy
Jan 21, 2006

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

TL posted:

I love how vicious Cornette attacks Sean Waltman in that video, yet he was back in the WWF less than a year later.

If this video is any indication, Cornette may have just cut the same promo if Sean Waltman was in the WWF.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pieX_Pd1b9A

Could you ever imagine the WWE today allowing someone to go on a 3 minute tirade about how WWE stinks and "Sports Entertainment" is garbage?

Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005

Strawberry Panda posted:

But they couldn't but a ticket because the tickets were free!

What always worries me about that segment is that DX was allowed to drive around in a fake tank with fake guns and no one was scared.

It wasn't a tank, it was a jeep and they were in Norfolk, which is a military town.

Strawberry Panda
Nov 4, 2007

Breakfast Defecting, Slow Dick Touching, Root Beer Barreling SwagVP

Rusty Shackelford posted:

It wasn't a tank, it was a jeep and they were in Norfolk, which is a military town.

I should have put tank in quotations.

Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005

Strawberry Panda posted:

I should have put tank in quotations.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DbQ8tFuSbg go to 30 seconds. It's just a jeep.

Strawberry Panda
Nov 4, 2007

Breakfast Defecting, Slow Dick Touching, Root Beer Barreling SwagVP

Rusty Shackelford posted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DbQ8tFuSbg go to 30 seconds. It's just a jeep.

I know it's a jeep but the bazooka thing makes it look like it's supposed to resemble a tank.

Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005

Strawberry Panda posted:

I know it's a jeep but the bazooka thing makes it look like it's supposed to resemble a tank.

Not really. It looks like a jeep with a gun attached, even though it the gun has probably been de-commissioned.

Push El Burrito
May 9, 2006

Soiled Meat

Rusty Shackelford posted:

Not really. It looks like a jeep with a gun attached, even though it the gun has probably been de-commissioned.

It was a Bad rear end Billy Gun.

Gavok
Oct 10, 2005

Brock! Oh, man, I'm sorry about your...

...tooth?


bobkatt013 posted:

Was that the same night that Goldberg decided he could break a window with his bare hand?

I really can't remember. WCW is just one big blur to me.

One thing that annoyed the hell out of me in WCW that wasn't really their fault was the Lodi/Lenny Lane angle. Lodi, at the time, was little more than a recurring jobber. Lenny Lane was just the guy known for looking like Chris Jericho. They put the two together as heels and gave them an Ambiguously Gay Duo gimmick. It got really over and fans seemed to really dig it. Lodi actually started winning matches! One could argue that they were one of the most over acts in WCW for a couple weeks.

Then GLAAD stepped in. They didn't like the "FAGGOTS!" chant that the team rarely got. They made a big stink about the gimmick and had WCW drop it. In a statement, one of the representatives discussed how a gay wrestler angle could work and be deemed acceptable by them. I can't remember their exact guidelines, but it was very apparent that they didn't know what they were talking about because Lodi/Lenny was exactly what they were asking for. But whatever, they got their way.

Lodi and Lenny were repackaged as Standards and Practices, which was embarrassing... but at least introduced us to Stacy Kiebler.

There ended up being a semblance of justice in all of this. Years later, we had the Billy Gunn/Chuck Palumbo tag team in WWE that was also based on the same "are they gay?" template. They started as heels and got over as faces. GLAAD publicly endorsed the same exact angle that years earlier they damned, especially when it was announced that Chuck and Billy were going to have a wedding of sorts. It ended up being a huge swerve (Billy and Chuck admit that they aren't gay, then get beat up by the 3 Minute Warning) that made GLAAD looked bad. Normally, I'd feel for them on this, but it's such a fitting turn of events.

Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005

Gavok posted:

I really can't remember. WCW is just one big blur to me.

One thing that annoyed the hell out of me in WCW that wasn't really their fault was the Lodi/Lenny Lane angle. Lodi, at the time, was little more than a recurring jobber. Lenny Lane was just the guy known for looking like Chris Jericho. They put the two together as heels and gave them an Ambiguously Gay Duo gimmick. It got really over and fans seemed to really dig it. Lodi actually started winning matches! One could argue that they were one of the most over acts in WCW for a couple weeks.

Then GLAAD stepped in. They didn't like the "FAGGOTS!" chant that the team rarely got. They made a big stink about the gimmick and had WCW drop it. In a statement, one of the representatives discussed how a gay wrestler angle could work and be deemed acceptable by them. I can't remember their exact guidelines, but it was very apparent that they didn't know what they were talking about because Lodi/Lenny was exactly what they were asking for. But whatever, they got their way.

They weren't ambiguously gay, they were overtly gay.

Flight Bisque
Feb 23, 2008

There is, surprisingly, always hope.

Gavok posted:

I really can't remember. WCW is just one big blur to me.

One thing that annoyed the hell out of me in WCW that wasn't really their fault was the Lodi/Lenny Lane angle. Lodi, at the time, was little more than a recurring jobber. Lenny Lane was just the guy known for looking like Chris Jericho. They put the two together as heels and gave them an Ambiguously Gay Duo gimmick. It got really over and fans seemed to really dig it. Lodi actually started winning matches! One could argue that they were one of the most over acts in WCW for a couple weeks.

Then GLAAD stepped in. They didn't like the "FAGGOTS!" chant that the team rarely got. They made a big stink about the gimmick and had WCW drop it. In a statement, one of the representatives discussed how a gay wrestler angle could work and be deemed acceptable by them. I can't remember their exact guidelines, but it was very apparent that they didn't know what they were talking about because Lodi/Lenny was exactly what they were asking for. But whatever, they got their way.

Lodi and Lenny were repackaged as Standards and Practices, which was embarrassing... but at least introduced us to Stacy Kiebler.

There ended up being a semblance of justice in all of this. Years later, we had the Billy Gunn/Chuck Palumbo tag team in WWE that was also based on the same "are they gay?" template. They started as heels and got over as faces. GLAAD publicly endorsed the same exact angle that years earlier they damned, especially when it was announced that Chuck and Billy were going to have a wedding of sorts. It ended up being a huge swerve (Billy and Chuck admit that they aren't gay, then get beat up by the 3 Minute Warning) that made GLAAD looked bad. Normally, I'd feel for them on this, but it's such a fitting turn of events.

The real loser in the whole deal was Chris Jericho.

He never did get his Loverboy tape back from Larry. :(

Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005

whatsabattle posted:

The real loser in the whole deal was Chris Jericho.

He never did get his Loverboy tape back from Larry. :(

According to a sign that Lodi carried on the Nitro after Jericho debuted on Raw, Jericho stole Lodi's pants.

EricCrapton
Dec 17, 2009
I THINK ALL WOMEN ARE DUMB BROADS
If it makes GLAAD feel any better, Orlando Jordan is now gainfully employed by TNA as Black Ric Flair.

Gus Sawchuk
Jul 13, 2001
One of the things that pissed me off the most about WCW around '98 was the crowds. Two guys could be having an amazing match, but if one of the top draws wasn't involved, the crowd would crap all over it. Here is an example of that, which is one of my favorite matches in WCW history. The crowd barely reacts to this match until near the end:

La Parka/Silver King vs. Damien/Ciclope in a "Mexican Hardcore Match"
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x81u7q_wcw-mexican-hardcore-match_sport

Zack_Gochuck
Jan 4, 2007

Stupid Wrestling People
Holy poo poo! Thank you for digging that up. I totally remember loving this when I was 14.

Shavonie and Brain are hilarious in this one.

The American Dream
Mar 1, 2007
Don't Forget My Balls
Why are they laughing the entire time? Did something dumb happen before or after the match? Or was it just because calling it Mexican was stupid.

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Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
The West Hollywood blondes were over, but they were gay-pride-parade level gay. They wore pink shorts with triangles and were frequently sucking on lollipops. Billy and Chuck...
you know, I was watching the today show before school, and a GLAAD representative actually gave them a gravy boat. For a wedding present. It was really, really bizarre and it really, really happened.

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