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Dr. Mantis Toboggan posted:What is with all these people getting jobs and interviews in the last several pages? This does not compute. I've gotten 4 interviews in the past 2 weeks after not hearing back from anybody in almost a year. Not that it's helped me at all, since now I'm out of practice in interviewing. Thankfully, I'm still a practiced drinker, so the haunting memory of every misstep can be drowned in copious alcohol. Oh wait, bad memories float. 
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May 21, 2010 00:24
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I have an interview with a temp agency tomorrow which I guess is a good thing but it means that I actually have to get up for something in the morning so I can't drink tonight. I'm upset about how much that annoys me
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May 21, 2010 00:31
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Lykourgos posted:You are going to be a staff atty at 26th street? I worked there my first summer and it's a great place. The judges are great to work with, and there are big trials going on every single day. America's largest criminal court or something. I'm interviewing for a spot over at the Cook County Treasurer, actually. I am not sure if my friend works in appeals or not. Do you know a guy named Declan?
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May 21, 2010 00:43
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Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate?
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May 21, 2010 00:44
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evilweasel posted:Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate? If you ever meet opposing counsel, introduce yourself to them. Be a social butterfly and hope that it pays off further down the road if someone remembers you and can hire you.
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May 21, 2010 00:57
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evilweasel posted:Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate? I think the #1 tip is not waiting for work to come to you, you need to seek it out. Approach the attorneys to ask for work to do. Seems like a no-brainer, but a lot of summer associates do the whole 'sit there and wait' thing, and it never looks good.
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May 21, 2010 00:59
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evilweasel posted:Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate? Take full advantage of the free lunches. Order dessert.
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May 21, 2010 01:00
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Abugadu posted:I think the #1 tip is not waiting for work to come to you, you need to seek it out. Approach the attorneys to ask for work to do. Seems like a no-brainer, but a lot of summer associates do the whole 'sit there and wait' thing, and it never looks good. Someone will always have a project that's interesting (or at least less boring than the others). Seek them out, make yourself at least somewhat integral to things on their end. Local counsel on one of my cases is working the plaintiff's side of the oil spill and it's all I can do to keep from jumping around and yelling "ME ME ME I WANT TO HELP ME OH GOD WE'RE ALL GOING TO BE RICH (even though I don't work for you)." G-Mawwwwwww fucked around with this message at 01:10 on May 21, 2010 |
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May 21, 2010 01:06
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Defleshed posted:I'm interviewing for a spot over at the Cook County Treasurer, actually. I am not sure if my friend works in appeals or not. Do you know a guy named Declan? I don't think I know a Declan. Did he start early this year/late last year? I don't know all of the new people too well. There are a few other departments that you can be placed in for your first assignment, though, so he might not be in Appeals. Good luck on your CC Treasurer interview, too; the more good people in Chicago the better. It's the best city I've been to in the States.
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May 21, 2010 01:16
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Abugadu posted:I think the #1 tip is not waiting for work to come to you, you need to seek it out. Approach the attorneys to ask for work to do. This is critical. Also, be proactive in getting assignments relating to the kind of law you want to practice. Once you impress the first few attorneys you work with, they'll let their friends know about you, and you'll end up getting a lot of related work. If there's a particular practice area that interests you in your firm, you can build up your network in that area over the summer, so that placing you there if you get an offer seems like a no-brainer to everyone involved.
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May 21, 2010 01:37
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evilweasel posted:Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate? 2) Don't be a dumbass and kill yourself. You aren't impressing anybody working until midnight as a summer (note: this is Chicago advice - if you're at cravath or something in NY, maybe they would). 3) Do things that make you a good associate. Ask about and understand the desired deadlines and deliverables. If you aren't going to be able to finish something, or something turns more complicated, talk to the guy - you probably have a false deadline anyways. 4) Be social, but don't be a drunken rear end. 5) Don't try to get all your fellow summers to start a mutiny against your firm in protest. 6) This should go without saying, but do awesome loving work. If your research raises an obvious follow up issue, investigate the follow up issue. 7) If you don't put on ten pounds, you aren't taking proper advantage of summer lunches. 8) Play eve online e'ryday. Torpor posted:If you ever meet opposing counsel, introduce yourself to them. Be a social butterfly and hope that it pays off further down the road if someone remembers you and can hire you. gvibes fucked around with this message at 01:58 on May 21, 2010 |
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May 21, 2010 01:54
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Also, making yourself indispensable to one or two attorneys is generally worth more than talking a little bit to each one but not doing anything particularly noteworthy for any of them.
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May 21, 2010 01:59
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JudicialRestraints posted:what are the chances of us getting paid for this 'internet law' 400 lolis/hour
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May 21, 2010 02:41
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gvibes posted:5) Don't try to get all your fellow summers to start a mutiny against your firm in protest.
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May 21, 2010 04:30
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gvibes posted:2) Don't be a dumbass and kill yourself. You aren't impressing anybody working until midnight as a summer (note: this is Chicago advice - if you're at cravath or something in NY, maybe they would). At least in New York, you need to do the work required to get something done. If you're not willing to stay late, you don't want the job enough and there's a bunch of students around who do. The shape of the legal market and the continuing layoffs has pretty much made employers expect even more than the impossible out of the associates. If you're getting worked to death, it's a sign of respect and it's something you're supposed to be grateful for.
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May 21, 2010 05:03
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Lykourgos posted:Received a phone call this morning; Chicago just got one more prosecutor! Enjoy persecuting black people and getting Mexicans deported. My way of saying congrats evilweasel posted:Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate? 2. Leave after the partners 3. Volunteer for more work and jump at the opportunity to do more 4. Do not buy booze on the company account unless specifically authorized. 5. Never ever get drunk at firm events or with firm employees 6. Work your loving rear end off You're there to get noticed (in a good way), not to have fun. nm fucked around with this message at 05:25 on May 21, 2010 |
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May 21, 2010 05:22
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Green Crayons posted:Is there a story behind this? http://abovethelaw.com/2010/03/mutiny-at-mayer-brown/
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May 21, 2010 05:37
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ewr2870 posted:http://abovethelaw.com/2010/03/mutiny-at-mayer-brown/ The sense of entitlement in those emails makes me want to loving throw up. I wish there was a follow up about them joining the bread lines with the rest of us, but I know the world is not a fair or just place.
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May 21, 2010 12:47
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I don't know, I can kind of feel for people just graduating and getting ready for finals/the bar and being scared shitless at having no job. But they're probably just douchebags though.
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May 21, 2010 13:09
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diospadre posted:I don't know, I can kind of feel for people just graduating and getting ready for finals/the bar and being scared shitless at having no job.
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May 21, 2010 15:50
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gvibes posted:No, that's the worst part - these were people who actually had jobs, but just weren't starting as early as they wanted to. Hey, MJ's death hit him hard ok?
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May 21, 2010 15:53
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I still have two weeks of finals prep to go before I'm done with this semester of law school. gently caress all of you.
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May 21, 2010 15:56
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Regarding SA advice, I think it's important to seek out work and volunteer and such, but do so to get the type of work you're interested in (or work with the attorneys you want to work with), and don't overextend yourself. I think it's more important to ensure you have all good reviews then to have an extra 50 state review in your file for your review. One of the most important grown-up lawyer things you can do as an SA is check and respond to emails promptly. If you're given a Blackberry, use it and check it often. It's not because you're that important and it's going to be buzzing all day from partner emails, but there's going to be a couple times during the summer when someone needs to reach you now and it's important to be reachable. (I think a general theme is that during the summer, most of the work you do won't be that important and it won't be hard to do it right, so when you do have the opportunity to prove yourself as reliable/competent, it's important to take advantage of that) Just because it's a recession it doesn't mean that social events aren't important. No one doubts your legal aptitude, but whether you "fit in" may be an open question. Go to events, enjoy yourself, and try to be a somewhat normal person. I know many of the people at my firm that were no-offered tended to be very introverted, or very competitive/obnoxious types. I'm a rather introverted person myself, and I think it helped me that I did go to most of the social events and made a concerted effort to be more personable and such.
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May 21, 2010 16:22
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I would add to the SA advice: Act like a professional. That ends up covering a lot of ground but I don't think I can over-emphasize its importance. That's the single most important thing I can think of. Other than that, try hard, be nice and use the associate mentor your firm assigns you. Don't ask them stupid jackass questions but you should be able to ask them about what it's really like to work at that firm and why every single firm including yours hemorrhages mid-level and senior associates (do not ask your partner mentor these questions even if your partner mentor seems super nice and says something like "ask me anything you want!"). fake edit: don't ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever get drunk. Go to every social event, have a couple of drinks and then go home after an hour or an hour and a half. You'll get a reputation as someone who goes out and is friendly but nothing more and that's exactly what you want. Some firms have more of a going out and getting hammered culture (hi Weill) than others so if you're at one of those you should stay a little longer and have another drink but there's still absolutely no reason to get drunk. Nothing good can come of it.
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May 21, 2010 16:56
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Wait I thought Lykourgos was Grumblefish. WTF is he doing as a prosecutor? Or am I horribly mistaken?
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May 21, 2010 17:03
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SWATJester posted:Wait I thought Lykourgos was Grumblefish. WTF is he doing as a prosecutor? Grumblefish was a prosecutor
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May 21, 2010 17:14
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Is an externship with a state court of appeals research division a "judicial externship" I mean I wrote poo poo for judges.
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May 21, 2010 17:16
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Ainsley McTree posted:Grumblefish was a prosecutor The calls are coming from inside the courthouse!
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May 21, 2010 17:34
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evilweasel posted:Anyone have any tips on being a summer associate? The answer to the question "do you have time to . . . .?" is always yes.
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May 21, 2010 17:37
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Solomon Grundy posted:The answer to the question "do you have time to . . . .?" is always yes. Also if you think the partner has the law wrong, stick to your guns. He or she will appreciate your gumption and determination.
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May 21, 2010 18:02
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nm posted:Fightin' the bad fight, eh? Strange, the first case I worked on (2 years ago) was a white guy who touched countless children and won himself a civil commitment order upon release. On a more amusing note I used that (very graphic) order as my writing sample for firm jobs. SWATJester posted:Wait I thought Lykourgos was Grumblefish. WTF is he doing as a prosecutor? Where else would you have me work? It's a noble office, managing the realm under the learned guidance of honourable judges.
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May 21, 2010 18:14
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Roger_Mudd posted:Also if you think the partner has the law wrong, stick to your guns. He or she will appreciate your gumption and determination. I can't tell if you are serious or not. I think that the subordinate attorney should stick to his guns if he thinks the partner is wrong, but the subordinate must have good data to back his position up, and must be very polite and respectful when arguing back. Don't just "stick to your guns" in typical layperson argument mode.
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May 21, 2010 18:44
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entris posted:I can't tell if you are serious or not. What are the odds that a summer associate knows the "correct" law? 
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May 21, 2010 19:30
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Roger_Mudd posted:What are the odds that a summer associate knows the "correct" law? I assume because they spent 8 hours reading every detail and the partner is going off memory.
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May 21, 2010 19:34
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evilweasel posted:I assume because they spent 8 hours reading every detail and the partner is going off memory. The partner more likely having years of experience on cases of that kind and knowing in depth the history of that practice area, as opposed to the summer researching it fresh?
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May 21, 2010 19:42
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Solomon Grundy posted:The answer to the question "do you have time to . . . .?" is always yes.
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May 21, 2010 19:47
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gvibes posted:I disagree. You'd rather do amazing work on fewer projects while saying no "to" a few people than spreading yourself too thin. We were specifically warned to not take on too much work since doing a bad job on one thing will significantly outweigh having done a lot of things. However, you'd better be able to justify why you're too busy (and they suggested you say "well, I have all these things to do: x,y,z, I don't think I can do an excellent job on all those and this", and let them work out which one you should stop working on.
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May 21, 2010 19:52
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Lykourgos posted:Where else would you have me work? It's a noble office, managing the realm under the learned guidance of honourable judges. Finally, an admission of identity
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May 21, 2010 19:53
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Once as a law clerk I did some research and brought my results to the partner who asked for it and he let me finish and said "You sure?" Being full of gumption myself, I said yes. "Positive?" "Yes." He smiled at me with a weird glint in his eye. "Do you want to bet your job on it?" poo poo. Can't back down now. "Yes." Of course I was wrong but he didn't fire me. That guy ruled.
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May 21, 2010 21:02
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evilweasel posted:We were specifically warned to not take on too much work since doing a bad job on one thing will significantly outweigh having done a lot of things. However, you'd better be able to justify why you're too busy (and they suggested you say "well, I have all these things to do: x,y,z, I don't think I can do an excellent job on all those and this", and let them work out which one you should stop working on.
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May 21, 2010 21:08
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