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Luna posted:I have never left a job on bad terms. I always give a notice and leave my contact information with whoever is taking over for me in case they have any questions later. I still have friendships with most of my old bosses. You won't accomplish anything doing this.
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Aug 24, 2010 21:32
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three posted:You won't accomplish anything doing this. Doing what? Quitting? I'm not going to poo poo on my bosses desk. I'm going to submit my resignation, turn in my equipment and leave.
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Aug 25, 2010 01:53
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Luna posted:Doing what? Quitting? I'm not going to poo poo on my bosses desk. I'm going to submit my resignation, turn in my equipment and leave. Yeah. You acted like you were going to go around telling people how they can all suck your dick. That's not a good idea.
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Aug 25, 2010 03:59
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Luna posted:Doing what? Quitting? I'm not going to poo poo on my bosses desk. I'm going to submit my resignation, turn in my equipment and leave. Give 2 weeks notice.
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Aug 25, 2010 06:14
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If I would have turned in my notice they would have asked me to continue to work with equipment that malfunctions in an already unsafe environment. (Working with a cherry picker that the controls randomly freak out and extend the bucket arm straight up. This work occurs within 3-6 feet of power lines. Also all protection has been bypassed on the power lines so if any of my cable comes in contact with it, it will energize that cable until it burns up.) I didn't want to risk any kind of injury that might compromise the new job. I would have just sat at my desk for two weeks and twiddled my thumbs until they fired me. It was a terrible situation and I had nothing to gain by staying 2 more weeks. I didn't mean to sound like I was going to make a scene, I was just a little excited to be leaving that job. They aren't too mad as they contacted me to do some contract work for them. Sysadmin stuff not the dangerous poo poo. I really don't want to do it, but I'm considering throwing them a huge number to see if they bite.
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Sep 5, 2010 08:18
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Luna posted:Working with a cherry picker that the controls randomly freak out and extend the bucket arm straight up. This work occurs within 3-6 feet of power lines. Also all protection has been bypassed on the power lines so if any of my cable comes in contact with it, it will energize that cable until it burns up. You were working for a utility company? Isn't there some organization you can contact about this kind of thing? OSHA? At my company, if there are these types of obvious safety screwups we're encouraged to stop work until the problem has been resolved and if there's any push-bash we run the problem up the chain all the way to the CEO. And the CEO will come bust some heads over this kind of crap, he has in the recent past.
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Sep 5, 2010 14:06
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I am so glad I only stayed at help desk for 8 months. I am 25 and have only been in the IT field for 3 years. I am doing security now and couldn't be happier. I have an interview on friday to be a security manager that would pay 6 figures if I had the proper certs.
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Sep 7, 2010 02:13
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After searching some listings, I think the greatest regret of my IT career is veering into non-profit. There's no play, there's nothing to really do except repair dying machines that have no business doing what they're doing, and figuring out strange configurations that exist because someone with no tech experience told the tech to 'make it work no matter what' and the tech gave up, made it work, and sat on the job until something better came along. It's a sweet job if you do things right, but as a job to help you experiment with new things it's a dead end.
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Sep 7, 2010 08:02
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CZwtrpolo2 posted:I am so glad I only stayed at help desk for 8 months. I am 25 and have only been in the IT field for 3 years. I am doing security now and couldn't be happier. I have an interview on friday to be a security manager that would pay 6 figures if I had the proper certs. Do you have the proper certs (and what certs are they looking for)? My company likes to mess with people. We hire Security positions with rank/pay based on certs. If you come in at a lower level because you lack some certs, but then you go get certs, you become "eligible" for re-class and a higher pay, which basically means good luck getting re-classed. I'd take the manager job regardless, just saying companies can be crooked like that.
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Sep 7, 2010 12:44
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shredswithpiks posted:Do you have the proper certs (and what certs are they looking for)? My company likes to mess with people. We hire Security positions with rank/pay based on certs. If you come in at a lower level because you lack some certs, but then you go get certs, you become "eligible" for re-class and a higher pay, which basically means good luck getting re-classed. The position is with a government contractor. The agency wrote specific requirements in the contract that the candidate must have. Since I am just short of those requirements they are going to do exactly what you said and decrease the rank/pay until I reach the necessary requirements. The cert everyone is looking for now is the CISSP. From what I hear, it is going to be a necessity for any security position (analysts, security managers, etc) working with the government at the start of 2011.
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Sep 7, 2010 13:06
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CZwtrpolo2 posted:The cert everyone is looking for now is the CISSP. From what I hear, it is going to be a necessity for any security position (analysts, security managers, etc) working with the government at the start of 2011. Yes it is. I'm going for the test at the beginning of next year (soonest I can get my company to pay for it, otherwise it comes out of my pocket). So far I have mixed feelings on it. They say they require 5 years security experience for it (4 years if you have a degree) but they count basic sysadmin or network admin stuff for that. I've also heard it's this grueling 6 hour test, covering everything in super-detail, but from the idiots I've met who hold the cert, I'm not convinced it's anything that tough (I mean guys who don't know what authorized_keys authentication is, guys who don't understand NAT, guys who have a very hard time wrapping their heads around a server with two network interfaces, etc). I picked up some "prepare yourself!" books and it looks like a very basic understanding of "the ten domains" is all you really need to pass the test. Guess I'll find out. Anyway, hope it works out for you! I got kinda jipped in that there's no guarantee my rank/pay will increase when I load up on the cert requirements for the upper ranks at my company. But... they are paying for the classes and certs, and it's great for getting higher pay at a different company I guess. I'm seeing DoD hiring in my town with pay starting in the 90k range for people with no "real" experience. So load up on those certs, buddy!
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Sep 8, 2010 00:54
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shredswithpiks posted:They say they require 5 years security experience for it (4 years if you have a degree) but they count basic sysadmin or network admin stuff for that. I've also heard it's this grueling 6 hour test, covering everything in super-detail, but from the idiots I've met who hold the cert, I'm not convinced it's anything that tough... Yes, you have to have 5 years of experience, but they started some new thing where if you don't have the experience you can still take the test and get an associate cissp. Then when you get the experience it becomes a cissp. The test is 250 questions and you need a 70 I believe to pass. You have up to 6 hours to complete it but most people take around 4. A bunch of people in my office have it now and they range in experience. Some I can't believe passed the first time and surprised others took more than one try. Each test though is different. Some are more technical and some more compliance related. You just have to get lucky that you get the one better suited for you. If you don't think rank/pay will increase when you get cissp then I would tell them go to gently caress themselves and look for a different job. Well maybe look for another job first...
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Sep 8, 2010 01:47
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CZwtrpolo2 posted:If you don't think rank/pay will increase when you get cissp then I would tell them go to gently caress themselves and look for a different job. Well maybe look for another job first... I've been guaranteed my rank won't increase (at least not in 2011), but I'm not exactly making bad money right now. It's just not over 90k. I don't think I can make better money at another company with my current resume, and this company is "filling the gap" in pay by covering the costs of ~$10k worth of cert training each year. And I get to do the training on work's time, so that's neat.
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Sep 8, 2010 13:04
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shredswithpiks posted:I've been guaranteed my rank won't increase (at least not in 2011), but I'm not exactly making bad money right now. It's just not over 90k. I don't think I can make better money at another company with my current resume, and this company is "filling the gap" in pay by covering the costs of ~$10k worth of cert training each year. And I get to do the training on work's time, so that's neat. Do you owe them any time after you finish all of the training and get the cert? I would post your resume online and see what bites. I think you will be surprised. I know people that only had 1-2 years experience, but just because they had a cissp they are sitting pretty nice. Security overall I think it is the quickest way up the IT ladder.
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Sep 8, 2010 13:32
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CZwtrpolo2 posted:Do you owe them any time after you finish all of the training and get the cert? Not outside of being polite, I don't. I kinda like working for this company, but it depends on what they can do for me. Gotta feed my household first.
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Sep 9, 2010 00:43
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CZwtrpolo2 posted:I am so glad I only stayed at help desk for 8 months. I am 25 and have only been in the IT field for 3 years. I am doing security now and couldn't be happier. I have an interview on friday to be a security manager that would pay 6 figures if I had the proper certs. How did you go about getting out of help desk into security?
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Sep 9, 2010 02:19
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Following this CISSP discussion- yeah I can tell you that in the Seattle region at least, a CISSP is an immediate job at six figures. If I had a CISSP my salary would double overnight. That said, that cert is no joke. Some people in this thread have been downplaying it a bit. I am staring at this book sitting on my boss's shelf and having read a chunk of it, the sheer amount of data inside is staggering. And this is is coming from someone who has been through three FDIC audits and four state audits in the finance industry. Edit: Did not specify- the audits we undergo are IT audits. The FDIC audits the financial side separately.
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Sep 10, 2010 20:34
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I am a CISSP, and I can give a little info to anyone considering going for it. The description "an inch deep and a mile wide" is very accurate. It's a mix of technical and compliance/policy type material. There are a lot of books on the subject matter, and they all cover the 10 security domains included by the cert and test. The real killer is that the test can literally be on ANYTHING that falls within those domains, so basically anything could be on the test. The books are just guides that cover the main points, but there's no real way to limit the scope your studying to a specific list of material that you can memorize and feel confident you know everything will be on the test. Experience in the security field will definitely give you a big edge. And yes, as previously mentioned, the tests are different. Even within the same testing session. If I had to pick one book to get to start studying, I'd get the latest version of the Shon Harris book. And there are great free practice quizzes at https://www.cccure.org Mighty_Ferguson fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Sep 12, 2010 |
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Sep 12, 2010 19:04
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Mighty_Ferguson, Do you mind if I ask you some questions? What industry do you work in? How old are you? Do you have a four year degree? What is your ballpark salary? How hard did you find it to obtain the CISSP? How hard it is to maintain your CISSP status? Prior to your current position, what position did you hold? (I am currently a network admin and hope to move into a security auditor position) I ask these questions because I will be pursuing my Security+ and then CISSP certs this year.
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Sep 13, 2010 21:11
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Defghanistan posted:Mighty_Ferguson, I work for a security consulting company and security hardware/software VAR. I'm 36 years old. I have a 4 year degree, but my major was unrelated to computers. My salary is along the lines of what's been discussed in this thread. Sorry, but I'm not going to be more specific. Maintaining the cert is a matter of an annual fee and completing a certain amount of educational actvities (CPEs) per year. It's not an unreasonable amount. The requirements are outlined on the ISC(2) site. My background is network admin/engineer as well. It's a good place from which to branch into security as there's definitely some overlap.
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Sep 14, 2010 03:02
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Mighty_Ferguson posted:I work for a security consulting company and security hardware/software VAR. Can I go for a CISSP directly, or do need lower level certs? Currently debating between grad school and the infosec industry, if I go with the latter I plan to try and pick up certs. (Since a BS doesn't get you jack in this industry, and research experience, even security research, is even kind of sneered at) Is a CISSP even worth trying for without any prior infosec work experience? (Again, unless we count academic research, which was more theory and less practicality)
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Sep 14, 2010 17:02
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Mighty_Ferguson posted:I work for a security consulting company and security hardware/software VAR. That is basically the path I want to take. I am so burned out on doing IT support. I like planning and projects and even audits and auditing but good lord, do I hate support. Nice, how long did you study/prepare for the CISSP before you tested? I have no four year degree but so far it hasn't held me back. Might pursue one after the CISSP. I agree about the overlap. I am hoping it will allow me a smooth transition. I already have a few contacts who are CISSP's that I think could help me prepare. Do you think it would be wise to get my Security+ before my CISSP? I already have a Network+.
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Sep 14, 2010 17:35
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GregNorc posted:Can I go for a CISSP directly, or do need lower level certs? Currently debating between grad school and the infosec industry, if I go with the latter I plan to try and pick up certs. (Since a BS doesn't get you jack in this industry, and research experience, even security research, is even kind of sneered at) You don't need any certs prior to going for the CISSP, but there's an experience requirement, which leads to your second question. In order to get the cert you need to not only pass the test, but be able to demonstrate a certain number of years of experience within the 10 security domains they define. As was mentioned earlier in the thread, without the required experience you can still take the test. If you pass you can become an "Associate of ISC(2)". Then when you've completed the experience requirements, it will convert to a full CISSP. As for research, security research isn't sneered at in the field. In fact, a lot of the high profile people in the field are researchers. These are the guys who are finding the vulnerabilities and proof of concepts that lead to the features in security products.
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Sep 14, 2010 18:04
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Defghanistan posted:That is basically the path I want to take. I am so burned out on doing IT support. I like planning and projects and even audits and auditing but good lord, do I hate support. I studied for a couple of months, and attended a weekly study group for a while. I'm not sure how directly I benefited from the group, but indirectly it really forced me to keep making my way through the book chapters on a schedule. Your having other CISSP contacts reminded me of another requirement - after you pass the test and prove your experience, you still need to be endorsed by another current CISSP. There are some alternatives if you really don't know anyone (an employer or ISC(2) can provide someone to review your credentials), but I've heard validating them can take forever and it becomes a big hassle. If you don't know anyone, I'd start trying to get involved in the local security community a bit more. And yes, they do verify the things on your resume. I was chosen to be audited when I submitted my materials. I don't really know anything about the Security+ cert. I've seen it on people's resumes and things, but I don't know what it covers. In my opinion, the big certs in the security field right now are CISSP, CISA, and CEH is becoming big now as well.
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Sep 14, 2010 18:13
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Mighty_Ferguson posted:I studied for a couple of months, and attended a weekly study group for a while. I'm not sure how directly I benefited from the group, but indirectly it really forced me to keep making my way through the book chapters on a schedule. A couple months? Wow, that is intense, I assumed it would take a year or something. I did know about the endorsement requirement which is why I am going to try to get in good with the guys that do our internal audits. They are CISSP's and I have had face time with them off and on for a few years now. Total time in my current role is about 3.5 years with another two years in a network admin role for a non-regulated consulting firm. Well, I'll get it and then let you know! Couple more questions: Can you describe your typical day? Do you ever get work from home opportunities or do you see that as a possibility in this field? Do you do any independent consulting with your CISSP? Do you enjoy your work? Are you happy in your field? How many hours a week do you work, and do you consider it high stress? That was way more than a couple. Thanks for being such a good sport while we slam you with questions. Would you mind shooting me an email at the following temp email address? albion9 at live.com Thanks again
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Sep 14, 2010 18:37
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Defghanistan posted:
Typically my day is split between pre/post sales support for security products we resell, and general security consulting/auditing. I work from home only occasionally. There's probably more opportunity for that if you're dedicated to doing something like application code review, etc, but I wouldn't expect it from a general all around security role. I don't do any independent consulting, my full time jobs keeps me busy enough. I generally enjoy the work, and like the field. It's definitely more than a 40 hour a week job (but it seems like most corporate jobs in the US nowadays are), and it sometimes is very high stress. That's due to the workload, not the work itself though. Just like any other field, there are unreasonable deadlines, poor planning, etc. Email is on the way.
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Sep 14, 2010 20:54
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All you guys chasing the CISSP, I realize it's the new hot great paying cert, but going into it without several years of real world IT experience as a well rounded system admin is just asking for trouble. You really need to have an exposure to networking, Linux, Windows, DB, etc. You really should have a good foundation in IT and how it works in the real world so you can really understand security. I wouldn't trust someone fresh out of school telling me about IT security as far as I could throw him. I've worked with IT security guys that don't have a background in administrating anything, and frankly the suggestion and processes they put in place suck. The lack of background is really telling.
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Sep 14, 2010 21:26
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Yeah a CISSP basically says there's a good chance you're not grossly incompetent. It's what employers/HR want to see so you're better off just getting it. In the US it seems like it's going to become required to do any sort of government work, which is another reason if you're in the US. If you want to move up from support or in general you have to show you can take on the new responsibilities before they are given to you. It can be really hard to get the opportunity to prove yourself in such a way, and I think smaller companies are better for this because they're more strapped for resources so more likely to take a punt on existing staff, assuming they have the underlying demand. Certs & side projects can all help in showing you're motivated enough to take on the extra work.
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Sep 14, 2010 21:36
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skipdogg posted:All you guys chasing the CISSP, I realize it's the new hot great paying cert, but going into it without several years of real world IT experience as a well rounded system admin is just asking for trouble. You really need to have an exposure to networking, Linux, Windows, DB, etc. Yeah that is good advice. Currently I've been a network admin for over five years with 3.5 of it working in a regulated highly secure environment. I've been through FDIC and state audits and we usually score very well. I am hoping this experience will segue really well into the CISSP. Though I am going to start with the Security+ as a good primer to get out of the way quickly and easily.
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Sep 14, 2010 21:58
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Anyone that is interested in the GS side of the house for IA I highly recommend getting the Security+ and then the CISSP. It is getting to the point where when we go to higher network engineers and they have to have it. For those that want to pursue the CISSP I recommend what Mighty_Ferguson mentioned with CCCURE.org. For back round purposes I'm a Network Technician in the army and I completed the CCNA, Sec+, and CISSP during a six month time frame. I studied for about three to four months using the Shon Harris all in one guide, CCCure quizzes, a boot camp, and some Shon Harris videos. I really enjoy the IA side of the house and overall as a specialization I think it is more dynamic and interesting versus network engineering. Skippdogg is also correct in stating that you need to have an IT background before hand.
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Sep 17, 2010 11:19
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Theonlydk posted:Anyone that is interested in the GS side of the house for IA I highly recommend getting the Security+ and then the CISSP. It is getting to the point where when we go to higher network engineers and they have to have it. For those that want to pursue the CISSP I recommend what Mighty_Ferguson mentioned with CCCURE.org. Wow you got all of those in SIX MONTHS? That is mind blowing. When you say you used the Shon Harris guide, did that one guide prep you adequately for all three certs?
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Sep 17, 2010 18:04
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Defghanistan posted:Wow you got all of those in SIX MONTHS? That is mind blowing. I should have clarified that I was only mentioning the prep I did for the CISSP. I started prep for the CCNA prior to this time frame since I knew I would have to take a Cisco course as part of my military training. I didn't know about the Security+ until I got there and I volunteered to extend and take the CISSP. The Shon Harris guide is good for the CISSP and probably would help you a bit with the Security+ but I treated them as separate. For the CCNA I used the Train Signal line of videos in addition to a Cisco Press book. Additionally, I had four semesters of Cisco academy classes as part of my tech training. The Security+ too me was extremely easy. I was actually studying for the CCNA during my one week long class covering it. I didn't really study for it and just went for it. The CISSP is a monster and I spent a lot of time in study groups, self study, and a ten day "bootcamp" if you want to call it that. I mainly ignored the instructor and either read, reviewed, or took practice quizzes. Also, this sounds impressive until you consider how much experience a person has and how well they take tests. I was also a student during this time frame so my workload wasn't that bad. Theonlydk fucked around with this message at 08:30 on Sep 18, 2010 |
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Sep 18, 2010 08:27
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Theonlydk posted:I should have clarified that I was only mentioning the prep I did for the CISSP. I started prep for the CCNA prior to this time frame since I knew I would have to take a Cisco course as part of my military training. I didn't know about the Security+ until I got there and I volunteered to extend and take the CISSP. Thank you for your response. So I just started digging into the Security+ and so far this is cake. Having worked in finance IT this stuff is kind of common sense to me so I think I should be able to test out of this before 2011. The CISSP I am going to start on in 2011, probably mid January and if I can have completed it before 2012 I will be thrilled. I plan on taking an official "bootcamp" or class to prep. My career goals are to nab a six figure job in security auditing in Seattle (most likely with Coalfire or a similar company) and then eventually do independent security consulting.
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Sep 20, 2010 17:55
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BS Computer Science, nine years experience as a programmer. Burnt the gently caress out. I was consulting. Generally, my first priority was to make my boss happy, my second priority was to make a global corporation happy, and my third priority was to make my client's client happy. Business was much more important than solutions. If I could do it over again, I would have started looking for a different programming gig before I was burnt out -- the time I was in good standing and had professional references. I firmly believe that I would have been happy working directly for an entity that needed solutions, instead of working for a middle man who worked for another middle man. Now I'm starting over, but sticking with computers one way or another. IT, help desk, whatever pays the bills really. I may do something else entirely. One of those jobs that simply requires a college degree. edits to bring my content in line with the thread's theme Console Parade fucked around with this message at 06:13 on Sep 21, 2010 |
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Sep 20, 2010 18:08
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If I had to do it again: I would have done my undergrad at a much cheaper school and majored in Computer Science. I would have gone for my Masters immediately after graduating. I would plan on an MBA at some point. (still do) Good Will Punting fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Nov 10, 2010 |
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Sep 21, 2010 02:43
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Tab8715 posted:If I want to do sys admin work, should I go for the networking program or go into programming? I was not interested in CS, because I knew my limits when it comes to advanced math. Calc wasn't happening. Maybe I didn't want it to happen, who knows. Anyways, I graduated and had a job all lined up and ready to go. What I do now involves managing a network used to run EDA applications (stuff like Cadence, Mentor Graphics, Xilinx, HFSS, Ticra, Sonnet, etc) and designing networks and architectures for various research projects mostly involving free-space optical communication (tossing fiber through the air basically, one project we're throwing it all the way to the moon). I spec out hardware, figure out how it's going to fit into the network, purchase, and implement. I do take the occasional support call from users, but they're mostly from high level users who just need guidance or have hit a wall. For all that, I get compensated in the lower mid 70s. I'm happy with it. My advice for those going the Networking-ish degree route: - Learn everything you can about anything you're interested in. Tinker. - Dont limit yourself to one OS. Know how to use and operate the others. It makes you stick out. - Understand assignments and make them relevant, if only to justify the reason you may be learning something about <x> for the 3rd time. - Don't depend on school to teach you everything. Get out there and work on real stuff... do an internship or three. - Don't be lazy and choose a simple capstone project (if your school does this) because it's easy, pick something that's challenging and interesting and something you can be proud of. Just about everyone I know who graduated from my program who did those things had jobs lined up before they left, ranging in salary from 55-80k. Not bad; there is a market for skilled sysadmins that know how to make poo poo work. The students who like to complain that they learned nothing and that their time was wasted are also the ones who don't have jobs (or have awful ones). Hmm. My background: liked computers too much as a kid, got a bunch of press for making my town's website when I was 9 (nerdiest kid alert), fixed people's computers, got a job offer at an elementary school in the school district I attended high school, got a contract with the town I grew up in to manage their IT services, legitimized my business, went to school for a few years, worked as a co-op student at where I work now, got full time job and dissolved the business. mrbucket fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Sep 21, 2010 |
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Sep 21, 2010 05:58
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Beatladdius posted:but I hate my job! I've never been so miserable. And this is not just hatred of working, I am really not challenged here at all. Also, be glad you're not doing 100+ hour weeks Console Parade posted:The moral of my story, I suppose, is not to be a consultant: especially if you want to help people, fix things, and make stuff happen.
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Sep 21, 2010 06:05
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Yeah I think you're right, I should be lashing out at specific kinds of business relationships instead of consulting itself. It may or may not be a good job. Edits to my post above.
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Sep 21, 2010 06:12
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Beatladdius posted:I got an MIS degree and was hired by (shocker) someone else with an MIS degree! I'm in digital forensics, but also do a lot of business stuff. I got a job right out of school, been there about 5 months, but I hate my job! I've never been so miserable. And this is not just hatred of working, I am really not challenged here at all. I think my opinion is the other side of the coin from yours. From your post I get the feeling that you think your degree is going to dictate what job you get or that your current degree is going to limit you. My position is that I believe your work experience, personality and ability to learn are what dictate what jobs you can get. Coming from a guy that has no degree and got his first IT (helpdesk/admi) job by just being a generally nice and helpful dude let me tell you that with your work experience that you explained and your degree you could go just about anywhere you want. Don't let your degree hold you back, school isn't the end all. Get into that interview, tell them you know what you're doing and whatever you don't know you'll learn in a week, smile and shake their hand and you'll do fine.
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Sep 21, 2010 16:19
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Well I've had my first ever real IT job for the last 8 months, planning on keeping it for at least 4 more if the business stays open (its a little geek squad type place, but the owner is an alcoholic and doesn't come into work much but I'm not sure how much longer this guy is going to keep his shop running) I should have an associates information security degree. The problem is all the classes I took for this degree were so scattered. I feel like I know a little bit about EVERYTHING instead of A LOT about one thing. I'm kind of stuck on where to go next. This job isn't enough for me to support myself on my own (currently living with mom) should I do more schooling and get a bachelor's degree in something?? Or would it be more practical to just find another job and...work my way up? Help me IT goons
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Sep 21, 2010 18:57
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