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Their grasp of the history of WCW was just terrible. It was like the people who put it together had no idea what happened, getting some of the most basic facts incorrect. The history of the purchase of GCW by Vince for example is so off the mark that it is baffling. The DVD is being put out by the company who made the purchase!
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Feb 13, 2011 21:05
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Mr. Carlisle posted:WWE now owns WCW and doesn't want to 'devalue their own brand'. As a wise man once said, "A little too loving late for that realization" Good Listener posted:The Rise and Fall of WCW is really disappointing because the Rise and Fall of ECW was so awesome. I assume it's because they had to reuse a lot of old interviews due to a lot of the people ending up in TNA or something like that. Just a thought. Reuse of interviews has pretty much nothing to do with it. The reused interviews were fine. It was just the staggering amount of information they left out or got wrong.
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Feb 13, 2011 21:35
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Even when it lives on merely as a retrospective DVD created by another promotion, WCW still manages to gently caress up.
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Feb 13, 2011 22:02
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Rise and Fall of WCW wasn't bad because it was too nice or too mean on WCW. It was just poorly made nonsense. I really know nothing about WCW before Monday Night Wars era and after watching that movie, I still don't. They just jumped from topic to topic so fast, never mentioning years, name dropping people and events and never explaining what they are and why I should care. THIS GUY WAS THE BEST REALLY doesn't tell me anything but quick we have to jump 3 more years into the future of WCW. So you think they might just be skipping though the "rise" to really make fun of the dumb stuff WCW did, but even that was nonsense. How can you mention how bad a booker is without ever acknowledging what a booker does? The entire thing was a list of good things and bad things with no context, edited like a movie long commercial for a real WCW documentary that doesn't actually exist.
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Feb 13, 2011 23:32
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Mullah Nasrudin posted:Even when it lives on merely as a retrospective DVD created by another promotion, WCW still manages to gently caress up. The hilarious part is that the Monday Night Wars dvd is a much better retrospective.
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Feb 13, 2011 23:48
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I felt that while you could compact the history of ECW into one DVD set, you couldn't with WCW. There was far too many history. It should have been broken into four DVDs: Rise and Fall of WCW Part I: The JCP Years (82-88) Rise and Fall of WCW Part II: The Turner Years (88-94) Rise and Fall of WCW Part III: The Monday Night War (95-98) Rise and Fall of WCW Part IV: The End of WCW (99-01) Even then I'd consider breaking up Part III into two parts.
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Feb 14, 2011 00:13
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Lone Rogue posted:Even then I'd consider breaking up Part III into two parts. A first DVD showcasing their victories over WWF followed by a second DVD showing how it all fell apart would be really interesting.
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Feb 14, 2011 01:01
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The one thing I learned from the Death of WCW is that Mike Graham is the smartest man in the universe.
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Feb 14, 2011 01:08
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I was reminded that Ray makes a great lawn dart
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Feb 14, 2011 01:09
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bobkatt013 posted:I was reminded that Ray makes a great lawn dart My mom was in the room when Nash threw him back in 96 or 97 and a few years ago when he was on wwe, she asked me if that was the same guy that got thrown like a dart. If she could remember, how could you forget one of the best lines of the 90's.
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Feb 14, 2011 06:04
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The American Dream posted:My mom was in the room when Nash threw him back in 96 or 97 and a few years ago when he was on wwe, she asked me if that was the same guy that got thrown like a dart. If she could remember, how could you forget one of the best lines of the 90's. HE THREW HIM LIKE HE WAS A DART
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Feb 14, 2011 06:13
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Jerusalem posted:Also, mention you heard that Ultimate Warrior came back for another match with Hulk Hogan, and say that sounds cool there's no way anyone could blow a money-making program like that. People will go all kinds of fun colors before they're finished responding!
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Feb 14, 2011 07:15
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tzirean posted:That's a bit different because he'd already earned that money; he was sitting around partly because he'd have to be paid extra for any further matches during that time. Is this true? I always wondered why their top face didn't wrestle for 15 months, I figured he was hurt and they just kept him on the shelf a few months longer so it could main event their big show. And then they of course hosed it up. But of course WCW keeps him out of the ring for 15 months instead of like 6. I guess it worked out up until about halfway vs. the match with Hogan, but it still seems odd.
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Feb 14, 2011 07:32
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MassRayPer posted:Their grasp of the history of WCW was just terrible. It was like the people who put it together had no idea what happened, getting some of the most basic facts incorrect. The history of the purchase of GCW by Vince for example is so off the mark that it is baffling. The DVD is being put out by the company who made the purchase! I'm really fuzzy on Vince's purchase of GCW. As I recall, he bought it from the (I think) the Briscos, had a huge backlash from the fans used to the NWA style of wrestling, and ended up selling it to Crockett, I think. Did Vince buy GCW just for the TV clearance, or did he end up using any of the talent from GCW? I'm really iffy on who came from where prior to like 1985.
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Feb 14, 2011 07:51
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TL posted:I'm really fuzzy on Vince's purchase of GCW. As I recall, he bought it from the (I think) the Briscos, had a huge backlash from the fans used to the NWA style of wrestling, and ended up selling it to Crockett, I think. Did Vince buy GCW just for the TV clearance, or did he end up using any of the talent from GCW? I'm really iffy on who came from where prior to like 1985. The purchase was solely for the television slot and the only people who really benefited from the sale at the time were the Briscoes and Jim Barnett.
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Feb 14, 2011 09:39
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Dragging Iron Feet posted:The one thing I learned from the Death of WCW is that Mike Graham is the smartest man in the universe. What a coincidence, I learned that from the episodes of Legends of Wrestling he was on!
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Feb 14, 2011 09:44
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Another example of WCW idiocy... WCW paid Lanny Poffo $200,000 per year and had him under contract for four years, during which time he sat at home and did nothing. The story goes that he was originally hired as a favorite to his brother, Randy Savage, and has supposed to manage Savage using the Gorgeous George gimmick to get heel heat. Of course, Savage's girlfriend Stephany Bellars was given the role instead, while Lanny sat at home wondering why the phone never rung. Now, that's the sort of job I want; getting around $4000 a week to do nothing.
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Feb 14, 2011 11:29
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I posted:
That's why he's The Genius and we aren't.
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Feb 14, 2011 13:57
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I posted:Another example of WCW idiocy... I wouldn't say he did nothing. I bet he wrote a lot of poems during that time.
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Feb 14, 2011 19:20
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"Ode to My Own Penis" by My Own Mouth
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Feb 14, 2011 19:21
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Sionistic posted:MMA People Can someone explain what happened with Sting? I was in my early teens when he became the Crow ripoff, so this is really interesting to me. Why did he not fight for all of '97? I remember he joined the red NWO, but I stopped watching right then, what came after? Was it some horribly botched angle?
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Feb 14, 2011 20:14
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Lurkee Mcgee posted:Can someone explain what happened with Sting? I was in my early teens when he became the Crow ripoff, so this is really interesting to me. Why did he not fight for all of '97? I remember he joined the red NWO, but I stopped watching right then, what came after? Was it some horribly botched angle? nWo brought out a fake Sting to make the fans believe Sting turned on WCW. Team WCW confronted Sting about it and it pissed Sting off so he declared himself a free agent. He beat the poo poo out of fake Sting and the nWo offered him a spot but he declined. He started hovering in the rafters to gently caress with everyone. He kicked the nWo's rear end at Uncensored in 1997 and they dragged out the angle to Starrcade in probably the most anticipated match ever. So naturally, they decided the best result was a Dusty Finish of some kind with Bret Hart shoehorned in as the special referee. They had a rematch on Nitro the next night after the stupid finish and decided the end would run over Nitro's allotted time and SEEYOUONTHUNDER for the rest. That match ALSO had a lovely swerve ending with two referees making different counts. JJ Dillon made Sting vacate the belt. That's off the top of my head so I apologize if some of it is wrong, but it was a golden ticket that they did everything in their power to just take a long, wet poo poo all over.
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Feb 14, 2011 20:20
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sportsgenius86 posted:nWo brought out a fake Sting to make the fans believe Sting turned on WCW. Team WCW confronted Sting about it and it pissed Sting off so he declared himself a free agent. And then after loving everything up, they just had Sting join the nWo Wolfpack and start smiling and saying "hoody hoo" and poo poo. It was basically the best build ever (if we ignore Luger's week long title reign) leading to a can't miss Sting win and the beginning of the end of the nWo, but WCW set out to prove all the nay-sayers wrong.
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Feb 14, 2011 20:49
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CSammich posted:And then after loving everything up, they just had Sting join the nWo Wolfpack and start smiling and saying "hoody hoo" and poo poo. It does strike me that this was where things started to go off the rails. The relative failure of the two attempts at "nWo-only" shows (the Souled Out PPV and the nWo Nitro show) should have been a sign that there was only so far the brand could go, and maybe that it was time to start bringing the story to a conclusion. You wouldn't have to destroy the nWo altogether, just hand them a decisive loss and stop their momentum, and start building up other threats. Instead, it became the pro wrestling equivalent of the Spider-Man Clone Saga: a really great idea at first that gets everybody's attention, but is too successful to end and instead just spirals out of control, becoming too convoluted and complex for people to care about anymore.
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Feb 14, 2011 21:53
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The Sting-Hogan match is generally accepted as the beginning of the end. It should have been about 10-12 minutes of Sting beating the gently caress out of Hogan and winning clean, but what we got was a ton of bullshit, and Hogan getting screwed twice. Then as mentioned Sting gives up the belt 2 weeks later anyway.
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Feb 14, 2011 22:07
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I wanted to do a really big write up on the Sting/Hogan storyline and horrible after math. I just can't anymore. 13 years later it still makes me a little angry and a bit sad to think about. It was the perfect storyline and they hosed it all up. This company had been desperate to make Sting into the next Hogan for almost 10 years. They had their chance and they hosed it up. Then 6 months later they had him join an nWo despite feuding with them for 16 months. They took the hottest babyface act in Pro Wrestling in 1997 and made him third banana in the Wolfpac.
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Feb 14, 2011 22:29
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Maxwell Lord posted:You wouldn't have to destroy the nWo altogether, just hand them a decisive loss and stop their momentum, and start building up other threats. There was nothing wrong with the nWo getting a second wind, either. It just had to take time. Sting should have decisively beaten several nWo guys like Hogan, Hall and Giant. And then you feud him with Nash or Macho and have them win. Say Macho wins it and tries to kick Hogan out of the nWo. This sparks the nWo implosion and Sting or someone else gets back the title because nWo is too embroiled in a feud against themselves. Culiminate in a big ten man tag match at Starrcade '98 which ends up the true end of the nWo. Everyone goes their separate ways after that. If a new stable builds, so be it. 1998 should have been "The Rise of WCW, the Fall of the nWo". Which would have set up 1999 to be "The Year of Goldberg" where the entire focus is heels trying to stop Goldberg and his dominant Worlds Heavyweight Championship reign (that should have begun at Starrcade 98, not ended). Captain Charisma posted:The Sting-Hogan match is generally accepted as the beginning of the end. It should have been about 10-12 minutes of Sting beating the gently caress out of Hogan and winning clean, but what we got was a ton of bullshit, and Hogan getting screwed twice. I think the Goldberg/Hogan match is how it should have went. Hogan tries his usual heelisms but Sting being too good for it. nWo tries to interfere and WCW finally bands together to stop any interferences. Hogan has to face Sting one on one. Sting should have made Hogan tap out to the Scorpion Death Lock as a sign that the nWo was submitting to the power of the Stinger.
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Feb 14, 2011 22:49
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I know I can look a lot of this stuff up online without asking you guys, so I've been going that route. One thing that I don't know if I'm understanding correctly: The WCW reboot. What exactly happened? Did they just come on TV one night and say "we're dropping everything, and writing new stuff"?? Has there ever been such an absolute breaking of the fourth wall in pro wrestling like that?
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Feb 14, 2011 22:55
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So let's go back, and say that Sting wins clean over Hogan, doesn't vacate the belt, momentum carries him through a face title run for x amount of months. Where is WCW and how is WWF doing against WCW's probable larger fanbase?Lurkee Mcgee posted:I know I can look a lot of this stuff up online without asking you guys, so I've been going that route. One thing that I don't know if I'm understanding correctly: The WCW reboot. What exactly happened? Did they just come on TV one night and say "we're dropping everything, and writing new stuff"?? Vince Russo walked out, asked for everyone's championship belts, walked to the back, and the Big Reset was explained the next week.
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Feb 14, 2011 22:55
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Lurkee Mcgee posted:I know I can look a lot of this stuff up online without asking you guys, so I've been going that route. One thing that I don't know if I'm understanding correctly: The WCW reboot. What exactly happened? Did they just come on TV one night and say "we're dropping everything, and writing new stuff"?? There was a one week break where they showed a best of show then came a Russerific time.
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Feb 14, 2011 22:57
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bobkatt013 posted:There was a one week break where they showed a best of show then came a Russerific time. The highlight of it was this wasn't a best of "WCW" show. It was all about Bischoff and Russo's writing. They even talked about crash tv booking and how it worked, and Bisch's tendancy to book on the fly. Why on earth they did these shows the way they did is a mystery.
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Feb 14, 2011 23:06
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Skinty McEdger posted:The highlight of it was this wasn't a best of "WCW" show. It was all about Bischoff and Russo's writing. They even talked about crash tv booking and how it worked, and Bisch's tendancy to book on the fly. Why on earth they did these shows the way they did is a mystery. I remember everyone reaction was it could not be worse the Sullivan. Then came the episode and then PPV and everyone realized yes yes it could.
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Feb 14, 2011 23:07
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Did Russo plan/write the Sting/Robocop and Steiner/Chucky bits?
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Feb 14, 2011 23:13
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projecthalaxy posted:Did Russo plan/write the Sting/Robocop and Steiner/Chucky bits? No Russo did not think that was the American Dream for Sting/Robocop and Bishoff Steiner/Chucky.
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Feb 14, 2011 23:16
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Russo didn't work for WCW until 1999. I know it's the easy thing to just blame everything on Russo but at least do some basic fact checking.
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Feb 14, 2011 23:19
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Captain Charisma posted:The Sting-Hogan match is generally accepted as the beginning of the end. It should have been about 10-12 minutes of Sting beating the gently caress out of Hogan and winning clean. This is exactly what it should have been, after years of watching WCW screw things up I was thinking to myself that they had done it really right this time, the build up was so intense. Then the match happened; the timing was off by both guys and before Bret Hart showed up the match pretty much ended with Hogan getting a clean pin over Sting. I watched this match the other day and still can't believe how badly it was executed.
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Feb 15, 2011 00:33
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Hogan and Bischoff's version of events is that Sting showed up looking pudgy almost as if he hadn't been working a weekly schedual for a year. Hogan felt that it would be "not fair to the rest of the guys on the card who work week in and week out" to see someone who wasn't in shape win the big belt. So the booking was adjusted to give much more to Hogan in the match. And then of course the ending was "botched." It was bullshit politics from start to finish, and a microcosm for everything wrong with WCW. Even after that match things were salvageable, if they had treated Sting in the right way. Instead his reign and the cathasis the fans yearned for was treated as an utter joke.
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Feb 15, 2011 01:28
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Does anyone else remember Marvel's WCW comic? It was hilarious. Here's Scott Steiner eliminating himself from an over the top rope battle royal to save his brother. Why didn't you go under the rope, dummy?
ZoDiAC_ fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Mar 5, 2011 |
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Mar 5, 2011 18:26
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The best part about that is not only does he eliminate himself, he does it in the way that could probably result in the biggest injury to himself (although I guess it could be seen a totally badass). He could have just leaped over the top rope onto the apron and then walked down if he wanted to eliminate himself.
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Mar 5, 2011 18:59
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He did work so hard... but that WAS a sprain!
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Mar 5, 2011 19:05
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