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Sometimes erroneously, too. Bad corners tell their fighters that they're winning, and by "playing it safe" they let close fights slip away. At worst I think letting everyone have more information would turn out a wash, though maybe I'm wrong.
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Feb 15, 2011 09:12
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Jack of Hearts posted:By "open scoring" I just mean scores being shown at the end of rounds instead of the end of the fight. It seems like such a minor improvement, but for some reason I find it very satisfying not to have to guess where the fight stands at the end of round two or whatever. This would have made the Phan/Garcia fight much better. Fans and Rogan especially would have an addition 10 minutes to boo and openly mock the judges. Then again, perhaps crowd feedback on the scoring system would affect the judges? Pandering to the vulgar mob?
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Feb 15, 2011 09:22
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The AC's would never go for it because it would paint a target on any official who scored against the public sentiment.
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Feb 15, 2011 09:30
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Goddamn polite, non-loutish Japanese fans! How come they get to have nice things and we don't?
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Feb 15, 2011 09:34
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Who is Thonglor? What's all the Thonglor fandom about?
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Feb 15, 2011 14:33
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TomWaitsForNoMan posted:Who is Thonglor? What's all the Thonglor fandom about? He's the pimp/leader of a california based male prostitution ring.
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Feb 15, 2011 15:50
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He's the eccentric Muay Thai coach of Team Alpha Male (Uriah Faber's shortman punchman team). He does crazy poo poo like catching possums and then posts videos of it on youtube.
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Feb 15, 2011 15:55
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TomWaitsForNoMan posted:Who is Thonglor? What's all the Thonglor fandom about? Master Thonglor is the flamboyant Muay Thai coach for Team Alpha Male, a fight team composed entirely of tiny So-Cal bros. In his spare time he enjoys gambling and messing with possums. His most prominent public appearance was when he casually carried the head tiny bro, Urijah Faber, to his stool in between rounds of the Aldo fight because Faber had been crippled by leg kicks. Leg kicks and defending them are a very fundamental part of Muay Thai, so this incident does not reflect particularly well on his coaching ability. This is Master Thonglor: 
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Feb 15, 2011 15:56
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Jack of Hearts posted:Goddamn polite, non-loutish Japanese fans! How come they get to have nice things and we don't? Correct, Japanese judges never bowed to pressure from the crowd when scoring for the guy that the promotion/fans obviously wanted to win.
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Feb 15, 2011 16:26
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I think a good thing would be to encourage 10-10 scoring, but to help allay the possibility of more draws (which is doubtlessly why the commission discourages 10-10 scores) they could add one or two extension rounds in the case of a draw.
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Feb 15, 2011 16:37
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red19fire posted:Then again, perhaps crowd feedback on the scoring system would affect the judges? Pandering to the vulgar mob? Thumbs up he lives thumbs
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Feb 15, 2011 16:52
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mobn posted:I think a good thing would be to encourage 10-10 scoring, but to help allay the possibility of more draws (which is doubtlessly why the commission discourages 10-10 scores) they could add one or two extension rounds in the case of a draw. why not just have a draw when there's a draw.
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Feb 15, 2011 17:12
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mobn posted:I think a good thing would be to encourage 10-10 scoring, but to help allay the possibility of more draws (which is doubtlessly why the commission discourages 10-10 scores) they could add one or two extension rounds in the case of a draw. Extension rounds must use the P-something Panda aggression-only judging criteria: first man to cease winging haymakers loses. In the event of another draw, judges will refer to "just look at his face" criteria.
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Feb 15, 2011 17:35
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iirc the Panda Method also placed a lot of weight on which fighter seemed the angriest 
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Feb 15, 2011 18:32
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Thermos H Christ posted:iirc the Panda Method also placed a lot of weight on which fighter seemed the angriest Utilizing the Panda Method of judging, James Thompson would have soundly beaten Aleks
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Feb 15, 2011 18:41
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Gomi Pile posted:why not just have a draw when there's a draw. Because that's the most unsatisfying ending to a fight imaginable short of a No Contest (and even those can be more satisfying if they involve ball smashing of one manner or another). Didn't even the NHL do away with ties some while back? I like the idea of extension rounds though. Maybe up to 2 3 minute extensions if necessary. Of course it will never happen and judging will continue to be atrocious, but a man can dream.
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Feb 15, 2011 19:26
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Gomi Pile posted:why not just have a draw when there's a draw. because the commissions hate draws and it is largely the reason we cant have 10-10 rounds in close fights that deserve them
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Feb 15, 2011 19:32
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10-8 rounds are just as likely to produce a draw as 10-10 rounds.
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Feb 15, 2011 19:33
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fatherdog posted:10-8 rounds are just as likely to produce a draw as 10-10 rounds. And we see less of those than we probably should as well.
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Feb 15, 2011 20:40
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fatherdog posted:Correct, Japanese judges never bowed to pressure from the crowd when scoring for the guy that the promotion/fans obviously wanted to win. Yeah, maybe my meaning was unclear, but why can't we have nice things? What's your take on why open scoring hasn't caught on? I really like it, do most people just not care?
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Feb 15, 2011 20:54
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Jack of Hearts posted:most people just not care
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Feb 15, 2011 20:57
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if it takes any effort on the part of a sanctioning body it will never happen, this goes for any change
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Feb 15, 2011 20:58
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Giovanni Qobras posted:if it takes any effort on the part of a sanctioning body it will never happen, this goes for any change They'll resist change even if they don't have to do poo poo. There was a UFC where either the UFC or one of their sponsors installed a shitload of monitors ringside for the judges to use. Keith Kizer personally disconnected them all.
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Feb 15, 2011 21:58
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keith kizer is like the sporting equivalent of a radical conservative
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Feb 15, 2011 23:20
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fatherdog posted:10-8 rounds are just as likely to produce a draw as 10-10 rounds.
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Feb 15, 2011 23:41
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niethan posted:If you got two fighters and one dominates the other in a round and gets a 10-8 then it's improbable that the other gets(or previewsly got) the two others 9-10. I know that watching fights is passe, but this is exactly what happened in Edgar/Maynard 2, with an extra 10-9/9-10 each.
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Feb 16, 2011 00:46
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Sanchez/Guida could have also gone that way, but judges are bad.
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Feb 16, 2011 00:51
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1st AD posted:Sanchez/Guida could have also gone that way, but judges are bad. Diego did way more damage from the bottom. He won at least two rounds in that fight.
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Feb 16, 2011 01:08
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Lone Goat posted:I know that watching fights is passe, but this is exactly what happened in Edgar/Maynard 2, with an extra 10-9/9-10 each. He didn't say impossible, just improbable. Most people after having their asses handed to them in a round never really recover and continue to get their asses beaten.
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Feb 16, 2011 01:26
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fawker posted:He didn't say impossible, just improbable. Most people after having their asses handed to them in a round never really recover and continue to get their asses beaten. It was a dumb argument and 10-8s can also happen in the last round.
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Feb 16, 2011 03:02
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1st AD posted:They'll resist change even if they don't have to do poo poo. There was a UFC where either the UFC or one of their sponsors installed a shitload of monitors ringside for the judges to use. Keith Kizer personally disconnected them all. What the hell, did that really happen? That's amazing.
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Feb 16, 2011 03:58
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JiveHonky posted:What the hell, did that really happen? That's amazing. http://mmajunkie.com/news/19620/keith-kizer-nevada-hasnt-adopted-judges-tv-monitors-screens-unplugged-for-show.mma "I unplugged them all," said Kizer, who spoke to MMAjunkie.com after Saturday's show at The Pearl at the Palms Casino Resort in Las Vegas. "The UFC had no idea why they were there either. I talked to the producer for the [Spike TV broadcast]. He said the [production] company put them there as a favor I guess."
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Feb 16, 2011 04:05
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Bundt Cake posted:http://mmajunkie.com/news/19620/keith-kizer-nevada-hasnt-adopted-judges-tv-monitors-screens-unplugged-for-show.mma Am I reading this wrong, or does he expect the judges to look up at the screens above the crowd if they can't see what's going on?
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Feb 16, 2011 04:18
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1st AD posted:Sanchez/Guida could have also gone that way, but judges are bad. The worst case would be Stun Gun v Karo. The third round was so terrible by both that online reports were jumping between rating it 10-10, 9-9 or 0-0. Karo got the nod, though his round 2 was very meh compared to Stun Gun's spectacular round 1. Of course this fight lead to the discovery of Karo's painkiller addiction so silver lining, but it was the clearest case of a draw due to a round of complete inactivity by both from exhaustion.
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Feb 16, 2011 04:29
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Thermos H Christ posted:Master Thonglor is the flamboyant Muay Thai coach for Team Alpha Male, a fight team composed entirely of tiny So-Cal bros. NOR CAL BROS, DAMMIT
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Feb 16, 2011 04:33
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Pneub posted:Am I reading this wrong, or does he expect the judges to look up at the screens above the crowd if they can't see what's going on? He thinks looking through the cage at the fight from ringside is more impartial than screens with multiple angles. Yes, he's not very smart.
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Feb 16, 2011 05:18
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Lid posted:The worst case would be Stun Gun v Karo. The third round was so terrible by both that online reports were jumping between rating it 10-10, 9-9 or 0-0. Karo got the nod, though his round 2 was very meh compared to Stun Gun's spectacular round 1. Of course this fight lead to the discovery of Karo's painkiller addiction so silver lining, but it was the clearest case of a draw due to a round of complete inactivity by both from exhaustion. Stun gun's an interesting name for him since it's like he's been hit with one, 2 mins into any of the last two rounds.
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Feb 16, 2011 05:23
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Lone Goat posted:It was a dumb argument and 10-8s can also happen in the last round. It is less probable for me to dominate a dude 10-8 after just having been outworked with two 9-10.
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Feb 16, 2011 08:52
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niethan posted:It is less probable for me to dominate a dude 10-8 after just having been outworked with two 9-10. You made it sound like it's really unlikely, but there's no need to color it so. R1: 1 barely outjabs 2 R2: 1 barely outjabs 2 R3: 2 finally lands haymaker and knocks down 2, finishes with very strong GNP 10-9 rounds can be very close and very uneventful (aka no damage) for both fighters.
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Feb 16, 2011 08:57
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niethan posted:It is less probable for me to dominate a dude 10-8 after just having been outworked with two 9-10. Condit vs. MacDonald was exactly this. Two rounds of MacDonald controlling the striking and grappling before Condit took him down in the third and pounded the poo poo out of him on the ground. Granted the ref stopped the fight with like ten seconds to go but if he hadn't it would've been a clear cut 28-28, although I think at least two of the judges didn't score the last round 10-8 meaning it would've been a split for MacDonald.
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Feb 16, 2011 09:10
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