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el topo
Apr 11, 2008

by Fistgrrl

Crustashio posted:

Autoblog posted a few shots of what they call the FR-S, but the comments point out that those are subaru wheels on it.


The Subaru wheels you mention are just Oz wheels, really...

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Crustashio
Jul 27, 2000

ruh roh
Oh well, either way it looks surprisingly good camoed. Not as over the top as the concept.

FistEnergy
Nov 3, 2000

DAY CREW: WORKING HARD

Fun Shoe

CornHolio posted:

I saw my first new Focus today. Front looks great, interior looks great, but I saw it first from the rear and thought it was a new Hyundai. :(

In general, I have found that car reviews seem to glowingly praise the exterior styling of the new Focus. In addition, they call the Cruze's styling decent but boring.

I personally feel the opposite...I think the Cruze looks grown-up, and that the exterior as a whole seems to fit together and make sense to my eyes. Too many elements of the Focus seem mishmash-y to me, especially the lower front end and the taillights.

Maybe I'm just getting too old for the Focus's target audience, but I much prefer the understated Cruze.

NOTinuyasha
Oct 17, 2006

 
The Great Twist

Cream_Filling posted:

They just announced a 1.6L 208 hp turbo version of the Veloster is coming later. 208 hp in a car that weighs between 2584 and 2657 pounds in NA trim sounds pretty drat good, actually, with power to weight comparable if not superior to the Scirocco. 12.5 lb/hp. They even have a six-speed Dual-Clutch Transmission available in the Hyundai, too, in addition to a six-speed manual.

So they have a turbo Sonata and the Veloster will also have a turbo option, all they need now is a turbo Elantra.

The new accent is also getting a refresh + same 1.6L as the Veloster:





$15,000 gets you a 6-speed manual, AC, XM, power windows. Not really worth it, when you can get the Elantra for $2k more. At least it's less embarrassing to rent...

kimcicle
Feb 23, 2003

Morphix posted:

/\/\ And they promptly went out of business haha


loving kidding me? They finally franchised outside of California? And it's Texas? Fuucck. Texas is too lovely for such delicious burgers.

Nope, not franchised. Still run by the same family, they had to locate suppliers for everything in the area that met their standards and relocated a few store managers to take over these stores.

Crustashio posted:

Autoblog posted a few shots of what they call the FR-S, but the comments point out that those are subaru wheels on it.

Jesus Christ this is shaping up to look at least somewhat decent. Too early to get my hopes up, but that might be the next car I buy.

Powershift
Nov 23, 2009


Was just bored and reading up on some cars.

Despite weighing over 4000lbs and having more horsepower than any of the previous generation taurus SHOs, the 2013 2.0T taurus will be the most fuel efficient taurus they have ever built.

Technology!

Powershift fucked around with this message at 00:19 on May 18, 2011

Christobevii3
Jul 3, 2006
Too bad it wont have the sweet blue interior like the early Taurus.

eames
May 9, 2009

Looks like the S1 is getting closer to production:

http://www.autoblog.com/2011/05/17/audi-s1-caught-testing-likes-wearing-a1-clothing/
(with regular A1 bodywork in the pictures)

270 hp and AWD sounds crazy and would probably make it faster than the 1M. I would have expected ~225 hp for the S1 (and then maybe a 270 hp RS1).

allonblack
Dec 9, 2004

Yes, you.

eames posted:

Looks like the S1 is getting closer to production:

http://www.autoblog.com/2011/05/17/audi-s1-caught-testing-likes-wearing-a1-clothing/
(with regular A1 bodywork in the pictures)

270 hp and AWD sounds crazy and would probably make it faster than the 1M. I would have expected ~225 hp for the S1 (and then maybe a 270 hp RS1).

It's a shame we'll never see it on US shores. I'd buy one of those in a heartbeat if in fact it had the 270hp that Autoblog claims, no one else however is quoting that number for the regular S1.

el topo posted:

The Subaru wheels you mention are just Oz wheels, really...

Actually if I'm not mistaken they're the older STI Spec C wheels which are made by Enkei.

allonblack fucked around with this message at 14:59 on May 18, 2011

CornHolio
May 20, 2001

Toilet Rascal

Christobevii3 posted:

Too bad it wont have the sweet blue interior like the early Taurus.


Or maroon, my god those maroon interiors. I think they all had the same strange smell, too.

BeastOfExmoor
Aug 19, 2003

I will be gone, but not forever.

Morphix posted:

/\/\ And they promptly went out of business haha


loving kidding me? They finally franchised outside of California? And it's Texas? Fuucck. Texas is too lovely for such delicious burgers.

Hah. You'll be thrilled to know they actually opened locations in Arizona, Nevada, and Utah before hitting Texas. I had quite the :wtf: moment when I drove by one while I was in Orem on business.

BrokenKnucklez
Apr 22, 2008

by zen death robot
Umm I don't know if this was brought up at all... partial laziness that I didn't want to wade around the previous posts....

But this dealer...

http://www.shuanghuanofdesmoines.com/site/

Resides not to far from me.

I need to go down and drive one of these cars. Looks like a smart car but at a price (I have been told) for around 8,000 bucks.

travisray2004
Dec 2, 2004
SuprMan

BrokenKnucklez posted:

Umm I don't know if this was brought up at all... partial laziness that I didn't want to wade around the previous posts....

But this dealer...

http://www.shuanghuanofdesmoines.com/site/

Resides not to far from me.

I need to go down and drive one of these cars. Looks like a smart car but at a price (I have been told) for around 8,000 bucks.

Wtf? I'm so confused. How are they selling these legally? Not only from a copyright perspective but unless I've been out of the loop lately; those aren't even regulated for US use.

el topo
Apr 11, 2008

by Fistgrrl
So their lineup is basically a Smart Car ripoff and an X5 ripoff? That'll dispel all those nasty rumors about the Chinese car industry!

BrokenKnucklez
Apr 22, 2008

by zen death robot
Actually... this is a good read, I was searching out other things but take a look

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2011/05/the-chinese-are-coming-part-one-a-tale-of-two-nobles/

The SUV looks like an X5. What is even better is the prospect of a small turbo diesel.

This is me thinking out loud, but with Ford, BMW and other manufactures moving towards turbo's. Have we reached the pinnacle of cramming as much power and efficiency of normally aspirated engines? It makes me giddy to see more power with out sacrificing gas millage.

edit: DOH! I can't do math. Yeah not excited about the prospect of a small diesel.

BrokenKnucklez fucked around with this message at 03:41 on May 19, 2011

travisray2004
Dec 2, 2004
SuprMan

el topo posted:

So their lineup is basically a Smart Car ripoff and an X5 ripoff? That'll dispel all those nasty rumors about the Chinese car industry!

Not to mention that's is a Chinese vehicle the same size as a Smart. I wonder if I'd die from a gas fire or becoming a living projectile after driving that thing.

dissss
Nov 10, 2007

I'm a terrible forums poster with terrible opinions.

Here's a cat fucking a squid.

BrokenKnucklez posted:

What is even better is the prospect of a small turbo diesel.

Why?

Yes there are some amazing turbo diesels available now (like the one in an actual X5) but the one in the knock-off is terrible. All you have to do is look at the curb weight (1900kgs is 4188lbs) and the engine specs (68kw is 91hp, 202nm is 149ft/lbs)

Revolvyerom
Nov 12, 2005

Hell yes, tell him we're plenty front right now.

Powershift posted:

Was just bored and reading up on some cars.

Despite weighing over 4000lbs and having more horsepower than any of the previous generation taurus SHOs, the 2013 2.0T taurus will be the most fuel efficient taurus they have ever built.

Technology!


Autoblog disagrees, it's the same engine as the previous gen.

INCHI DICKARI
Aug 23, 2006

by FactsAreUseless

dissss posted:

Why?

Yes there are some amazing turbo diesels available now (like the one in an actual X5) but the one in the knock-off is terrible. All you have to do is look at the curb weight (1900kgs is 4188lbs) and the engine specs (68kw is 91hp, 202nm is 149ft/lbs)

Wanna see some 'Ring times on this bitch.

Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

We're fucking built for this shit!

Revolvyerom posted:

Autoblog disagrees, it's the same engine as the previous gen.

Re-read what he said. The Taurus with the 2.0 EcoBoost 4 banger (not the SHO) will make more horsepower and get better mileage than any previous gen SHO. (i.e. Any SHO before the 2010)

Q_res fucked around with this message at 04:37 on May 19, 2011

angryhampster
Oct 21, 2005

BrokenKnucklez posted:

Actually... this is a good read, I was searching out other things but take a look

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2011/05/the-chinese-are-coming-part-one-a-tale-of-two-nobles/

The SUV looks like an X5. What is even better is the prospect of a small turbo diesel.

This is me thinking out loud, but with Ford, BMW and other manufactures moving towards turbo's. Have we reached the pinnacle of cramming as much power and efficiency of normally aspirated engines? It makes me giddy to see more power with out sacrificing gas millage.

edit: DOH! I can't do math. Yeah not excited about the prospect of a small diesel.

This is bizarre. The Gabus dealers are huge and reputable. I don't have a clue why they would want to make a move like this.

travisray2004
Dec 2, 2004
SuprMan

angryhampster posted:

This is bizarre. The Gabus dealers are huge and reputable. I don't have a clue why they would want to make a move like this.

because if it succeeds and he'll be able to sell these fuckers for 4-5Gs a piece he won't be able to keep them on the lot. Scary times; I could totally see this screwing over the American motor industry.

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

actually, yeah, I am a little mad

travisray2004 posted:

because if it succeeds and he'll be able to sell these fuckers for 4-5Gs a piece he won't be able to keep them on the lot. Scary times; I could totally see this screwing over the American motor industry.

I don't think so. I think the proportion of buyers who would want a 4-5k small car is still limited. It might hurt sales somewhat, but probably wouldn't revolutionize the industry.

Autism Monday
Mar 18, 2005

anime comes to life and kisses me on the lips
Oh yeah, The Truth About Cars. These Chinese Smart clones won't sell, by the way - most people aren't retarded enough to pay even $5K for a tiny, impractical car of questionable quality and with no dealer support.

PT6A
Jan 5, 2006

Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane
The only people who would even consider buying a Chinese car, I'm convinced, have never actually been in one. Even as a passenger, it's a truly frightening experience. I can't see how you'd go for a test drive and then say, "yep, this piece of poo poo is the car for me!"

In Cuba, where Chinese cars are getting more and more common, people driving Lada 2102s that won't start without a push laugh at how lovely and unreliable Geelys are.

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

actually, yeah, I am a little mad
After all their efforts in trying to get rotaries to be efficient, I guess Mazda did a number on plain old ICEs:
http://jalopnik.com/5803609/mazdas-70-mpg-13+liter-gasoline-engine
That poster pining for the days of the HF CRX has a new ride to look forward to.

Russian Bear
Dec 26, 2007


I was wondering when they were going to come out with the figures for the new SKYD and SKYG engines, but holy drat! Even if that's a liberal number and in real world is closer to 60, it is quite an achievement. So which engine will be stuffed in the ND miata?

Jackdonkey
May 31, 2007
It pissed me off to no end that my Mazdaspeed Miata got <25 mpg when my 800 pounds heavier, slightly more power, and AWD Eclipse got similar mileage. Nice to see they're finally trying some technology from this century.

Powershift
Nov 23, 2009


The scary part is that the skyG engine runs 14:1 compression and requires premium gas. Eventually, somebody is going to put regular in, or just plain bad gas, and at 14:1 compression some bad things could happen.

Russian Bear
Dec 26, 2007


I'm sure they'll put lots of WARNING and DANGER stickers everywhere about CATASTROPHIC events happening, but it'll happen then a bunch of idiots will want to make a "recall" out of it, while the Mazda fans will call it a 'quirk' and common sense.

"Oh I put 87 in there to save on gas moneys :v:"

Autism Monday
Mar 18, 2005

anime comes to life and kisses me on the lips
Call me a pessimist but I really doubt that engine will more than double the fuel economy of a Mazda 2.

oRenj9
Aug 3, 2004

Who loves oRenj soda?!?
College Slice

Russian Bear posted:

"Oh I put 87 in there to save on gas moneys :v:"

Just put a dummy meter that senses low octane gas and reports how "efficient" the engine is running. Something like:

code:
87: Regular Efficiency ++-------------- Premium-Efficiency
89: Regular Efficiency ++++++++-------- Premium-Efficiency
91: Regular Efficiency ++++++++++++++++ Premium-Efficiency
^^ It only needs to improve gas mileage by about 20% to hit the 40MPG mark. Plus, all of the other cool cars in its class are managing it.

oRenj9 fucked around with this message at 07:03 on May 20, 2011

grover
Jan 23, 2002

PEW PEW PEW
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:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
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:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:

Powershift posted:

The scary part is that the skyG engine runs 14:1 compression and requires premium gas. Eventually, somebody is going to put regular in, or just plain bad gas, and at 14:1 compression some bad things could happen.
Don't all modern fuel-injected engines have safeguards to detect predetonation and prevent damage from occurring?

That is one hell of a compression, though! Do they expect piston cavities and multi-hole injection to be that effective?

Here's Mazda's press release on it:

Mazda posted:

HIROSHIMA, Japan—Mazda Motor Corporation has announced that the "SKYACTIV-G 1.3" direct-injection 1.3-liter gasoline engine will be the first of its next-generation SKYACTIV technologies to be introduced to the market. Mazda will unveil the engine at the Automotive Engineering Exposition that will be held from May 18 through 20, 2011, at the Pacifico Yokohama convention center near Tokyo, Japan.

The breakthrough SKYACTIV-G 1.3 achieves a record high compression ratio (for a regular gasoline mass production automobile engine) of 14.0:1 and exhibits high efficiency, especially under high load at low rpm. In order to avoid knocking – an unavoidable issue with conventional high-compression engines – the SKYACTIV-G 1.3 features a number of new technologies, such as piston cavities that are specially designed to support ideal combustion, and multi-hole injectors that enable precise fuel injection control.

Mazda plans to introduce the SKYACTIV-G 1.3 to the Japanese market in the facelifted Mazda Demio (known overseas as the Mazda2) during the first half of 2011. It will be the first ever 1.3-liter direct-injection gasoline engine to be equipped in a compact car manufactured in Japan. Combined with Mazda's unique idling stop system, i-stop, and a continuously variable transmission (CVT), SKYACTIV-G 1.3 will achieve fuel economy of 30km/L under Japan's 10-15 mode test cycle.

Mazda has applied for over 130 patents in relation to the engine (as of the end of February, 2011).



SKYACTIV TECHNOLOGY is the umbrella term for Mazda's range of next-generation technologies – including gasoline and diesel engines, transmissions, and a new body and chassis – that significantly improve vehicle driving dynamics as well as environmental and safety performance. The SKYACTIV-G 1.3 that is equipped in the facelifted Mazda Demio adopts all of Mazda's SKYACTIV engine technologies except for the exhaust manifold. It also features other new components that are exclusive to the Demio, such as a cooled EGR* system.

Under its Sustainable Zoom-Zoom vision, Mazda aims to deliver outstanding driving pleasure as well as environmental and safety performance, and is committed to increasing its global fleet fuel economy by 30 percent by 2015, compared with the 2008 level.

Main features of the SKYACTIV-G 1.3 engine
  • Highly efficient automobile gasoline engine and the world's first to achieve a compression ratio of 14.0:1
  • Multi-hole injectors enable precise fuel injection control for ideal combustion
  • Mazda's first dual sequential valve timing system (dual S-VT with electronically-operated intake) in combination with the high compression ratio achieves an unconventional Miller cycle (extremely delayed closure of intake valves) that improves efficiency
  • Compact combustion chambers have a longer stroke for better efficiency
  • Piston cavities are specially designed to support ideal combustion
  • 30 percent less mechanical friction, due to a narrower crankshaft, new roller followers and low-tension piston rings that also reduce oil consumption
  • Various countermeasures to prevent knocking, including a cooled EGR system
  • An updated version of Mazda's innovative idling stop system, i-stop, improves fuel economy by eight percent. It operates with a higher frequency, requires less fuel to restart, and achieves a smoother restart
  • A lightweight and highly rigid aluminum alloy engine block


Major specifications of the SKYACTIV-G 1.3
Inline four-cylinder 1.3-liter direct-injection engine (with i-stop)
Engine displacement: 1.298L
Bore and stroke: 71.0mm x 82.0mm
Compression ratio: 14.0:1
Maximum output (net): 62kW@5,400rpm (84ps@5,400rpm)
Maximum torque (net): 112Nm@4,000rpm

grover fucked around with this message at 12:41 on May 20, 2011

KozmoNaut
Apr 23, 2008

Happiness is a warm
Turbo Plasma Rifle


Mazda press release posted:

Bore and stroke: 71.0mm x 82.0mm

Isn't that awfully oversquareundersquare for a gas engine? It's awfully close to the 69.60mm × 82.00mm of my car's diesel engine.

EDIT: vvvv I stand corrected.

KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 15:53 on May 20, 2011

lazer_chicken
May 14, 2009

PEW PEW ZAP ZAP

KozmoNaut posted:

Isn't that awfully oversquare for a gas engine? It's awfully close to the 69.60mm × 82.00mm of my car's diesel engine.

If that's 71mm bore and 82mm stroke then it's undersquare, and it's common for small 4-bangers to be undersquare. Most FWD 4 pots are. It makes the engine a more convenient shape for a FWD package and helps their low speed torque. A honda k24, for example is 87mm x 99mm and a toyota 1zz-fe is 79mm x 91.5mm. Those are both about the same ratio as the skyactiv.

2ndclasscitizen
Jan 2, 2009

by Y Kant Ozma Post
Won't the Miller cycle-ing reduce the stress of the 14.0:1 compression?

Powershift
Nov 23, 2009


grover posted:

Don't all modern fuel-injected engines have safeguards to detect predetonation and prevent damage from occurring?

That is one hell of a compression, though! Do they expect piston cavities and multi-hole injection to be that effective?

Here's Mazda's press release on it:

Yes, most modern engines have knock sensors, and can adjust timing for bad fuel. With 14:1 compression and bad fuel or 87 octane fuel, the engine might have to shut itself down.

2ndclasscitizen posted:

Won't the Miller cycle-ing reduce the stress of the 14.0:1 compression?

It would if it is actually a 14:1 expansion ratio which in a miller would mean ~12:1 compression ratio

Powershift fucked around with this message at 21:13 on May 20, 2011

sanchez
Feb 26, 2003

Powershift posted:

Yes, most modern engines have knock sensors, and can adjust timing for bad fuel. With 14:1 compression and bad fuel or 87 octane fuel, the engine might have to shut itself down.

Even if it can run in some kind of limp mode any reduction from 62kw will make it hilariously slow.

62kw is bad enough already, they better put it in something light.

Powershift
Nov 23, 2009


Without a supercharger it's not a miller cycle, it's an atkinson cycle like the prius or fusion hybrid. They run 13:1 and 12.4:1 "compression" on reg gas, so i guess it might not be that much of an issue.

If the knock sensor detects detonation, it'll probably keep the intake valve open longer effectively lowering the compression ratio, and lowering power output.

At 83hp and 82ft/lbs, what mazda has esentially made here is an engine that sacrifices power and the ability to run regular gas to produce a really high fuel economy rating. The world's first gasoline powered diesel!(minus the torque)

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Throatwarbler
Nov 17, 2008

by vyelkin
The number being quotes seems to be from the Japanese test cycle that usually gives much higher figures than other testy cycles - the Prius is rated for 90mpg, for example.

They should call it "Gross MPG".

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