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Seconding Robin Hobb-- she's also got the Liveship Trilogy, which is set in the same world as the Tawny Man and Farseer books. Her Second Son trilogy is good, but frustrating as hell at times. Back on topic: Where have we seen the followers of R'hllor warg into stuff?
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Sep 5, 2011 16:01
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Pucklynn posted:Seconding Robin Hobb-- she's also got the Liveship Trilogy, which is set in the same world as the Tawny Man and Farseer books. Her Second Son trilogy is good, but frustrating as hell at times. I think he means when Melisandre tamed Ghost. Also I'm getting a real kick out of the Red God v Great Other story war to end all wars that the archenemy, more than the Lannister's or Littlefinger or Gregor, is going to end up being Bran Stark as the great other. And he's too young to realise he's already evil.
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Sep 5, 2011 16:10
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Azure_Horizon posted:Misogyny is probably the silliest insult levied at the books. It has absolutely no footing anywhere. I know this was a joke post but people seriously argue this and I just laugh in their face, straight up. pretty sure this was already linked, but: http://tigerbeatdown.com/2011/08/26/enter-ye-myne-mystic-world-of-gayng-raype-what-the-r-stands-for-in-george-r-r-martin/  I feel like I walked into the bad thread when I read it.
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Sep 5, 2011 16:51
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whowhatwhere posted:pretty sure this was already linked, but: http://tigerbeatdown.com/2011/08/26/enter-ye-myne-mystic-world-of-gayng-raype-what-the-r-stands-for-in-george-r-r-martin/
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Sep 5, 2011 17:18
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It's funny to poke fun at people who take things too seriously.
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Sep 5, 2011 17:28
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Lid posted:Also I'm getting a real kick out of the Red God v Great Other story war to end all wars that the archenemy, more than the Lannister's or Littlefinger or Gregor, is going to end up being Bran Stark as the great other. And he's too young to realise he's already evil. Noooo but I like Bran  How is Bran the Otherrrrrrr anyway?
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Sep 5, 2011 17:40
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Raserys posted:Noooo but I like Bran Well he is on some level working together with an undead dude north of the wall.
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Sep 5, 2011 17:42
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Quantify! posted:I just like throwing jokes out there to stimulate discussion because people get really passionate about this issue. It makes for interesting debate! But I don't really think he's a misogynist. I don't either, I was just really not feeling the whole equating Cersei's deeds with Ramsay's.
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Sep 5, 2011 17:45
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Quantify! posted:How does it feel to be a misogynist? HAHAHA the white-knighting continues! Seriously  Someone made the point that she had already been "shamed", etc. by being imprisoned. This isn't true because even at the height of her ill treatment in the tower, she was still plotting to murder everyone involved and hadn't changed or been humbled at all. Up until her public humiliation, she still believed that she was better than everyone else and that she deserved to be the ruler of all Westeros, with the common people existing only as items to be used. gently caress Cersei - she is one of the most reprehensible characters I've ever read and I didn't feel sorry for her at all.
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Sep 5, 2011 19:05
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She's power hungry, bungling, callous and reaped what she sowed, but the she's not a one dimensional villain like Ramsey. Ramsey is a monster. edit: I didnt mean to say I think Ramsey is a bad or boring character, hes a high quality bad guy in my opinion.
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Sep 5, 2011 19:20
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Azure_Horizon posted:Misogyny is probably the silliest insult levied at the books. It has absolutely no footing anywhere. I know this was a joke post but people seriously argue this and I just laugh in their face, straight up. Wait a minute, there is a ton of misogyny in the books. Unless you are saying that people are calling Martin a misogynist for writing them- that's ridiculous. Is a person who writes serial killer crime novels a murderer? But these books are rife with misogyny because the time period they are set in was not exactly a golden period for women's rights.
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Sep 5, 2011 19:21
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Martin Van Buren posted:I don't either, I was just really not feeling the whole equating Cersei's deeds with Ramsay's. Actually, if Ramsay were forced to walk naked through a huge city under looming threat of gang rape, it would be way more poetic, though highly unlikely given the setting. *edit* As for Cersei, she's already acutely aware of her "proper place" in Westerosi society, that's a big part of why she's so bitter and claws for any bit of power she can. The whole shame walk seemed better at showing the power of the church over the crown than making me feel any emotion at all w/r/t Cersei. YES bread fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Sep 5, 2011 |
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Sep 5, 2011 19:25
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The only scene that REALLY disturbed me as opposed to just making me uncomfortable was the Asha Rape-or-Not Rape chapter. Goddamn, what the gently caress was that?
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Sep 5, 2011 19:40
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Unzip and Attack posted:Someone made the point that she had already been "shamed", etc. by being imprisoned. This isn't true because even at the height of her ill treatment in the tower, she was still plotting to murder everyone involved and hadn't changed or been humbled at all. Up until her public humiliation, she still believed that she was better than everyone else and that she deserved to be the ruler of all Westeros, with the common people existing only as items to be used. gently caress Cersei - she is one of the most reprehensible characters I've ever read and I didn't feel sorry for her at all. Came here to post something very similar to this (though I don't think I hate her as much as you). Cersei hadn't learned anything until after the walk; I'm curious to see how it changed her. I'm guessing that though she'll be changed, she won't become a lot more likable a la Jaime. I'm guessing it'll be more like a mix of Jaime's arc and Theon's arc. Drunkboxer posted:She's power hungry, bungling, callous and reaped what she sowed, but the she's not a one dimensional villain like Ramsey. Ramsey is a monster. Yeah, that's the thing -- Ramsay's a flat-out psychopath. He's not on his rocker. He's inhuman. Cersei's motivations, by contrast, are very human... but they represent some of the very worst of what it is to be human. I would be afraid of Ramsay the same way I'd be afraid of a hurricane or some other force of nature. Cersei has more of an emotional impact on me because I can identify some of my own traits in her, except of course they're my worst traits taken to an extreme. Namirsolo posted:Unless you are saying that people are calling Martin a misogynist for writing them- that's ridiculous. People do this all the time; and yes, every time they do it is exactly as ridiculous as you would imagine it would be.
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Sep 5, 2011 19:48
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YES bread posted:Actually, if Ramsay were forced to walk naked through a huge city under looming threat of gang rape, it would be way more poetic, though highly unlikely given the setting. Poetic because he's a sociopathic rape-baby? That's kinda hosed up, dude. I guess I'd like to see Theon kill Ramsay, though I don't see how that could happen unless it's really pathetic on Theon's part. All grrm's gifts are poisoned.
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Sep 5, 2011 19:55
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Martin Van Buren posted:Poetic because he's a sociopathic rape-baby? That's kinda hosed up, dude. No, more because he feels the need to dominate and terrorize everyone around him, (maybe as a way of "legitimizing" his power?), he in turn becoming powerless under a higher authority and himself terrorized. I had actually forgotten that he was a rape-baby though, eugh.
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Sep 5, 2011 20:03
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If I call enough people in this thread misogynists will it get me laid?
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Sep 5, 2011 20:08
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Ross posted:If I call enough people in this thread misogynists will it get me laid? That's such a misogynistic thing to ask. Content: Martin Van Buren posted:Poetic because he's a sociopathic rape-baby? That's kinda hosed up, dude. I guess I'd like to see Theon kill Ramsay, though I don't see how that could happen unless it's really pathetic on Theon's part. All grrm's gifts are poisoned.
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Sep 5, 2011 20:11
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Raserys posted:The only scene that REALLY disturbed me as opposed to just making me uncomfortable was the Asha Rape-or-Not Rape chapter. Goddamn, what the gently caress was that? Hot (to her). She obviously likes that kind of thing. She had been described before as really good with her daggers, so it seemed like she purposefully fumbled while going for them. I wasn't sure until the nature of their relationship was revealed, though.
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Sep 5, 2011 20:31
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Namirsolo posted:Wait a minute, there is a ton of misogyny in the books. Unless you are saying that people are calling Martin a misogynist for writing them- that's ridiculous. Is a person who writes serial killer crime novels a murderer? But these books are rife with misogyny because the time period they are set in was not exactly a golden period for women's rights. Well, yes. There IS misogyny in the books but it fits like a glove for the world that Martin is presenting. However, you have people like that person on Tigerbeatdown who claim Martin is a misogynist because of it. And then I just lose it. Especially when you have the bandwagon of commenters on that site who are rallying around it (some going I'LL NEVER BUY THE BOOKS NOW). Not my fault they're intentionally retarded.
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Sep 5, 2011 20:49
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Namirsolo posted:Hot (to her). She obviously likes that kind of thing. She had been described before as really good with her daggers, so it seemed like she purposefully fumbled while going for them. I wasn't sure until the nature of their relationship was revealed, though. Wasn't it implied that that wasn't the first time they slept together as well?
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Sep 5, 2011 21:26
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Drunkboxer posted:Wasn't it implied that that wasn't the first time they slept together as well? Not so much implied as explicitly explained at length
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Sep 5, 2011 21:29
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Drunkboxer posted:Wasn't it implied that that wasn't the first time they slept together as well? Yes, and apparently it was a lot. But that wasn't mentioned until after the sex scene was over.
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Sep 5, 2011 21:29
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GRRM likes you to think one thing, then reveal that it's actually another thing. I don't see any difference in how he normally does that and how he did it with "oh he's raping her" then "oh she likes rough pseudo-rape sex". But hey your mileage may vary.
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Sep 5, 2011 22:18
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I feel like it must be an Iron Islands/wildling thing for women to see rape as like a friendly competition sort of thing. If only real women would see things that way 
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Sep 5, 2011 22:39
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Namirsolo posted:Yes, and apparently it was a lot. But that wasn't mentioned until after the sex scene was over. The morning after scene gave my girlfriend ideas so hey I don't mind it.
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Sep 6, 2011 01:25
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I like how some people think Cersei is going to really change. She'll play the game but she'll always be a conniving bitch. I forget how it's worded but isn't it pretty strongly implied that her humble act is simply an act?
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Sep 6, 2011 03:40
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The thing about Cersei is I think she really is quite damaged, mentally. The greatest part of the writing in AFFC is that I hated reading Cersei's chapters because she made me feel like I was going crazy being in her head.
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Sep 6, 2011 03:42
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Maytag posted:I forget how it's worded but isn't it pretty strongly implied that her humble act is simply an act? See I thought exactly the opposite. It seemed like he went well, well out of his way to imply that it's for real, and that she was well and thoroughly broken by it. It's just that all the other characters (Kevan, mostly) assume it's just an act, since, well, it's fuckin' Cersei. Read her last chapter and the epilogue again. I think it's for real.
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Sep 6, 2011 03:53
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Namirsolo posted:But these books are rife with misogyny because fixed that for yaz. I'm pretty positive that GRRM has a dark sexual fantasy side - and while misogynist is a strong word.. hah ahahahah ah haa see what I did there defending him before I remembered that he's a total furry loving pedo, and I don't care. So what if his books have child rape and disembowelings and flayings and animal fuckings and lactating boobs being sucked on by fat rear end hobbits with magic glass swords? poo poo is cool, yo! Whats wrong with a bit of woman hate in your fantasy anyway? I mean, you can get off on something like the red wedding which has people slicing each other up, dude getting his head chopped off and sowing a wolfs head in his place, Cat slicing up the throat of some loving retard, and her brother upstairs banging away at some chick the whole time... but a little looking down on women gets people up in arms? I loved Dany getting mounted in front of the whole tribe. loving pro. Little kid getting his head bashed in by Gregorz and presented to Robert in a cloak? Hell yeah. Poor Pia put in stocks so anyone who wanted to could gently caress her? Hardcore yo. Cannibal Pie, eating Septa's tits, chopping off captives finger and cocks, oh yeah and some classy style incest. Just own it. Love it. Be one with the GRRM.  edit: Don't normally like fan art, but thought this was pretty cool:  edit: quote:Also, "a scale of the dragon that flamed you" is the dumbest goddamn thing I have ever read, and I have read that Wildcards book about the super-hero reality show. I could be wrong about this, but I think both Jon and someone on the other side of the world both use it in this book.. like its some common expression. something about that bothered me more than anything. Like he just thought of it, and now had to use it everywhere. kcroy fucked around with this message at 04:38 on Sep 6, 2011 |
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Sep 6, 2011 04:26
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kcroy posted:This is just fantastic. Find that at DeviantArt or something?
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Sep 6, 2011 05:17
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I can't remember where exactly, but I heard the shame walk for Cersei was modeled after a real woman, Margaret of Anjou, consort Queen of the twice deposed Henry VI, so at least there's a precedent for it. Also, for a good series, Dave Duncan's The King's Blade is pretty good.
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Sep 6, 2011 05:57
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There is a percent for it, it was reserved for prideful women in particular to shame and humiliate them, but from what I can tell the walk was done in the woman's under-clothes, and there was no pussy shavin'. leave it to GRRM to kick up the creep factor a notch.
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Sep 6, 2011 06:18
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Dead Man Posting posted:This is just fantastic. Find that at DeviantArt or something? actually I was looking for that pic of Dany's figuring with the nipple showing, was going to be all "SEE 13 YEAR OLD NIPPLES".. but yeah. Anyway, this showed up in the image search. I really like the graphic blueprint/egg feel to it, and obviously the way the dragon merges with her breasts. And the double circles also give it a locket feel? Yeah, its cooler than the average fan art! That guy Phil Noto has some cool stuff.. definitely has a similar style through all his work. http://www.notoart.com/NewPicsfr.html  
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Sep 6, 2011 06:37
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The men of the Night's Watch jeered and threw refuse at him as he stumbled through their midst. Atop the Wall it was dreadfully cold; the winter snows were beginning to fall, whirling around his naked form. Snowflakes bit at his flaccid cock, the tiny ice shards lancing though the numbness that had enveloped him. His fruits hung tight to his loins, shriveled like tiny walnuts hidden amidst the hoary girdle of coarse black hair. The men shouted obscenities, calling his manhood into question, declaring him to be a woman, a boylover, and worse things. But most of all they called him a traitor. The spearmaids had gone south when they had heard about their beloved minstrel-king, leaving Dolorous Edd to explain things to the rest of the men. They had not been receptive, calling him a lackey and consort of the late Lord Commander. Edd believed not a word of the lies they heaped at the feet of the boy; Jon Snow was no traitor. He was his father's son through and through. He shook his head glumly as he took the abuse. One had to take things as they came. You had to be realistic about these things. Ahead stood Lord Commander Bowen Marsh, red face sneering. Edd felt his cock stiffen, not from arousal but from the bitter cold.
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Sep 6, 2011 09:05
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well I just don't know what to say
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Sep 6, 2011 15:32
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bigmcgaffney posted:The men of the Night's Watch jeered and threw refuse at him as he stumbled through their midst. Atop the Wall it was dreadfully cold; the winter snows were beginning to fall, whirling around his naked form. Snowflakes bit at his flaccid cock, the tiny ice shards lancing though the numbness that had enveloped him. His fruits hung tight to his loins, shriveled like tiny walnuts hidden amidst the hoary girdle of coarse black hair. Well now I understand why people like the Cersei shame walk so much. Boioing!!
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Sep 6, 2011 15:45
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Isn't this just the deleted Dumbledore flashback chapter from 'Deathly Hallows' with the names changed?
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Sep 6, 2011 17:52
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Raserys posted:Noooo but I like Bran I think its Moqorro who has a vision of the other/enemy as a creature with one eye and many tentacles reaching everywhere. While given it being a Victarion chapter it would think Euron it is as applicable to Bloodraven with the tentacles being the weirwoods. Not to mention Bran has commited crimes against nature including cannibalism and controlling Hodor which the Sixskins peologue makes clear is an abomination.
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Sep 6, 2011 19:28
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The only thing I don't really get about that all the lore that we get says that the children of the forest helped beat back the others before, and here they are tending to the three eyed crow.
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Sep 6, 2011 19:46
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