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They really should reboot the UFC gladiator with Melvin starring.
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Sep 1, 2011 13:57
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Boxing question here. Figure it's a better place the the boxing thread. Whats the deal with all the different organisations (IBF WBO etc.)? Are they the equivalent to a Strikeforce, UFC etc? Is the some that are considered better than others? The boxing thread states the that "True World Champions" are awarded by Ring Magazine. What makes Ring Magazine so special to be able to award a true world champion?
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Sep 1, 2011 15:05
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xcore posted:Boxing question here. Figure it's a better place the the boxing thread. You probably figure wrong, but here - quote:Whats the deal with all the different organisations (IBF WBO etc.)? Are they the equivalent to a Strikeforce, UFC etc? No, not at all. Strikeforce and the UFC are promoting organizations, they have their own titles and they put on fights with their fighters under contract. In boxing, promoting and title sanctioning are separate - promoters put on fights, and the sanctioning bodies maintain rankings and sanction title bouts for fighters that are high enough in their rankings, as long as they pay a sanctioning fee.[/quote] quote:Is the some that are considered better than others? They're all hopelessly corrupt, but in general people actually pay attention to the WBA, WBC, IBF, and WBO. The IBF is sort of on the fringe, and anything else is basically rinkydink. quote:The boxing thread states the that "True World Champions" are awarded by Ring Magazine. What makes Ring Magazine so special to be able to award a true world champion? The boxing thread is overstating things a bit, especially now that Golden Boy owns The Ring, but historically the Ring ranks every boxer fighting, and only considers somebody to have the championship if A) they beat the previous champion, or B) if the previous champ retired or went up in weight, the #1 and #2 ranked guys fight each other. This is in contrast to the sanctioning bodies, who frequently only rank guys who aren't ranked by other sanctioning bodies, and only allow guys to fight for titles if they pay sanctioning fees. Generally the Ring rankings have been a lot closer than the rankings of the sanctioning bodies to what people actually consider to be the best guys in a given weight class. fatherdog fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Sep 1, 2011 |
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Sep 1, 2011 15:34
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fatherdog posted:You probably figure wrong, but here -  Boxing is a combat sport.
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Sep 4, 2011 09:26
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Polemides posted:
"better than the boxing thread"
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Sep 4, 2011 10:06
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Ok so here's a dumb question: Sometimes when one fighter is on his back, with the other guy standing over him, the fighter on his back will put his hands behind his head like he's relaxing. What's that for?
Chexoid fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Sep 14, 2011 |
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Sep 14, 2011 02:31
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Chexoid posted:Ok so here's a dumb question: Sometimes when one fighter is on his back, with the other guy standing over him, the fighter on his back will put his hands behind his head like he's relaxing. What's that for? It's two fold one is to show the ref "hey brah, I'm bored as gently caress can you stand us up please" the other is to say to his opponent "I'm bored as gently caress, do something, like jump in my guard or try to punch me so I can grab for a sweep or sub" You usually see it with BJJ guys who have good subs against strikers who score a knockdown or if a BJJ dude fails with a takedown. If you're scrambling you usually are open to eating a shot so if you've got the base you can lie back relatively comfortable your legs can keep your opponent at distance on his feet until he's ready to enter your guard, give you an opening or allow the ref to stand you up. It's equal parts ring craft, showing off and taunting your opponent.
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Sep 14, 2011 02:44
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Also, it's good technique to keep your head mobile and off the ground at all times. This is actually somewhat tiring if you try it, so it's just easier to hold your head up by hand.
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Sep 14, 2011 03:23
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actually its a lot harder to see a dude and react if the back of your head is flat on the ground
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Sep 14, 2011 04:23
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BlindSite posted:It's two fold one is to show the ref "hey brah, I'm bored as gently caress can you stand us up please" the other is to say to his opponent "I'm bored as gently caress, do something, like jump in my guard or try to punch me so I can grab for a sweep or sub" wow, i always assumed it was to give themselves a wider/more stable base to throw upkicks and poo poo. the more you know.
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Sep 14, 2011 04:25
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also you only see it with bjj guys because they are the only people stupid enough to lay on their back when no one is holding them there
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Sep 14, 2011 04:43
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Thermos H Christ posted:wow, i always assumed it was to give themselves a wider/more stable base to throw upkicks and poo poo. the more you know. You'd be more stable posting a hand than in the "just relaxin" position
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Sep 14, 2011 06:11
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BlindSite posted:You'd be more stable posting a hand than in the "just relaxin" position Not for upkicks, you wouldn't.
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Sep 14, 2011 14:03
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Gomi Pile posted:also you only see it with bjj guys because they are the only people stupid enough to lay on their back when no one is holding them there The best bjj for mma guy, Demian Maia does not do poo poo like this. I do not think it is unrelated.
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Sep 14, 2011 15:58
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fatherdog posted:Not for upkicks, you wouldn't. Posting is probably the wrong term for what I mean.
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Sep 14, 2011 23:23
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fwiw, they teach the AMERICAN MILITARY™ to bend one leg and put the foot on the ground so you can spring up, and put the same side hand on the ground behind you so you can scoot. this is probably dumb for anything but immediately regaining your feet, though.
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Sep 16, 2011 04:49
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Save Russian Jews posted:fwiw, they teach the AMERICAN MILITARY™ to bend one leg and put the foot on the ground so you can spring up, and put the same side hand on the ground behind you so you can scoot. It is the BJJ-Approved [tm] way to get back to your feet without your face getting kicked off, though
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Sep 16, 2011 04:54
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Yeah but it's not like Werdum wanted to stand up.
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Sep 17, 2011 10:13
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who is dukez and why should i free him
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Sep 18, 2011 03:07
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Gomi Pile posted:who is dukez and why should i free him he's not free. he needs to be freed. read the electrical tape on white t-shirt, that's all you need to know
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Sep 18, 2011 06:44
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Has there ever been a fighter who cleared up a massive hole in his game? I always hear about grapplers working on their boxing or whatever, but the second they get hit in the face they revert back to the stuff they started out with.
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Sep 18, 2011 15:59
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not really no
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Sep 18, 2011 20:27
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Frank Edgar and Kenny Florian have both massively improved over their careers. Edgar improved his cardio from kinda regular guy with good cardio and slows down in the 3rd to being a machine, and his grappling has substantially improved as well, probably thanks to training with Renzo's crew. He used to be a typical good wrestler who ended up in a lot of scrambles to having really tight top control, and also his boxing went from being to where Gray Maynard easily exploited his defense with left hands, to outboxing BJ Penn. Kenny was a good fighter to begin with too but he's gotten much better over time as well. He went from pretty rudimentary striking, i mean it was terrible, but he became a real good kickboxer with Dellagrotte, although not great or anything, and his wrestling went from being functional jiu jitsu guy takedowns to stuffing Guida easily, and training with Ziras tightened his punching up considerably, to the point where he pasted guida with 1 punch, and managed to wear down Gomi with jabs, which are things he would not have been able to do earlier in his career. yeah guys improve. those two guys are probably the two most improved fighters that I know about. oh yeah another real good example is Anderson Silva, who has really great jiu jitsu now, and significantly shored up wrestling abilities compared to earlier in his career Carlos Condit is another guy who has made big strides too. If you compare his striking now to his striking as WEC, it's a world apart. He used to be a pretty loose but active outside fighter, without much one-blow knock out threat, or really much punching chops at all. now he gets right in the pocket and counterpunches guys Bundt Cake fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Sep 18, 2011 |
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Sep 18, 2011 20:36
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Bundt Cake posted:Frank Edgar and Kenny Florian have both massively improved over their careers. Edgar improved his cardio from kinda regular guy with good cardio and slows down in the 3rd to being a machine, and his grappling has substantially improved as well, probably thanks to training with Renzo's crew. He used to be a typical good wrestler who ended up in a lot of scrambles to having really tight top control, and also his boxing went from being to where Gray Maynard easily exploited his defense with left hands, to outboxing BJ Penn. Clay Guida has been more active looking for submissions from the top too lately his fight against pettis notwithstanding he's gone from the definition of lay and pray to someone who seems to want to finish.
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Sep 19, 2011 00:10
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I know it was against Nog, (and the real test will be against Dos Santos) but the general reaction from the Velasquez - Nog fight was "When the hell did Velasquez learn to box?"
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Sep 19, 2011 00:28
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Demian Maia, while you'd never mistake him for a golden gloves winner, has raised his striking from Gracie-esque to at least average. Cowboy Ceronne used to have zero wrestling, like he would fall down if you leaned on him to at least an active sprawl. GSP is a weird one since he basically learned how to wrestle after he already had a decently successful career, and is now the best wrestler in his division. A lot of guys actually improve a good amount, its just really really hard, and usually not a great idea, to try to use your weakest skill in the ring against the best in the world, so you don't see it much.
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Sep 19, 2011 04:01
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MMA question #1: I often see MMA fighters make heavy roundhouse kicks, even going as far as spinning which seems extremely risky to my admittedly casual eyes because: 1) it puts them in a less balanced position, 2) they're more easily telegraphed than say, a jab or haymaker, 3) there's a large window of opportunity for counters, and in the latter case, 4) their eyes leave the opponent. However, (and maybe it's because I don't watch MMA enough) I rarely see opponents capitalize on a miss, instead settling with dodges or blocks. Why is that? MMA question #2: How big of a piece of poo poo is Chael Sonnen for Anderson Silva to do stuff like this:  I've only just recently started following MMA again (stopped around 2008ish) but I remember Anderson Silva being a class act back in Pride.
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Sep 19, 2011 09:07
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theDOWmustflow posted:
Sonnen insulted Silva for months, insulted Brazil, his camp, jiu jitsu, the Nogs, his manager, everything. On top of that, if my memory is correct he did the pose Anderson is doing there at the press conference a few days earlier. He also insulted his pink shirts, so Anderson showed up to the press conference in his best pink shirt.
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Sep 19, 2011 09:11
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Headkicks depend on the style and execution, but you're describing a generic Muay Thai style kick. It relies on power which is generated through the hip movement and rotation of the body...so when someone whiffs completely they spin a bit or completely. That said, if it's a complete whiff, it's (hopefully) because the opponent has to step away from the attack so that leaves a space that keeps the attacker relatively safe.
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Sep 19, 2011 09:15
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theDOWmustflow posted:MMA question #2: How big of a piece of poo poo is Chael Sonnen for Anderson Silva to do stuff like this: Chael did the same thing to Anderson following a press conference the week of the fight. 1st AD fucked around with this message at 09:29 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 09:23
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theDOWmustflow posted:I remember Anderson Silva being a class act back in Pride. I encourage you to watch Demian Maia vs Anderson Silva at UFC 112. report back with your findings. and welcome back to the wonderful world of mixed martial arts. Current champions to watch are Frankie Edgar, Gilbert Melendez, Dominick Cruz, and Dan "Bones" Hendowns. if you have not followed the career of Fedor in the last few years, you are in for a very tasty treat.
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Sep 19, 2011 09:27
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1st AD posted:Chael did the same thing to Anderson following a press conference the week of the fight. Actually they squared off and then when they turned to face the cameras Anderson wouldn't stop looking at Chael so no please don't try to bring Chael down to Anderson's despicable levels of disrespect
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Sep 19, 2011 13:48
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Question for you guys. In MMA, how is it that some guys can have such good jiu-jitsu while having such terrible wrestling? The Diazes are the obvious example here, but there are others. Discounting submissions and takedowns, BJJ and wrestling have the same basic goal, which is controlling dudes on the ground, yet there are a lot of highly regarded BJJ guys in MMA who are terrible at that aspect. Are they just overrated or is there some distinguishing characteristic between BJJ and wrestling for MMA?
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Sep 21, 2011 05:04
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Meat Recital posted:Question for you guys. In MMA, how is it that some guys can have such good jiu-jitsu while having such terrible wrestling? The Diazes are the obvious example here, but there are others. Discounting submissions and takedowns, BJJ and wrestling have the same basic goal, which is controlling dudes on the ground, yet there are a lot of highly regarded BJJ guys in MMA who are terrible at that aspect. Are they just overrated or is there some distinguishing characteristic between BJJ and wrestling for MMA? Lots of BJJ guys come from countries where wrestling is not a widely competed sport, and as a result do not spend years developing these skills from the time they can walk. BJJ practitioners also have to drill lots of different positions which means they can't devote as much of their time to practicing starting from the feet, as they also need to do sessions where they start from all sorts of different positions to be able to attack and defend from them. There's also the factor that almost anyone's wrestling is going to look bad next to American wrestlers who have been doing just wrestling from the beginning of junior high school, even if in a non-UFC context their wrestling would be considered passable.
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Sep 21, 2011 06:24
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Meat Recital posted:Question for you guys. In MMA, how is it that some guys can have such good jiu-jitsu while having such terrible wrestling? The Diazes are the obvious example here, but there are others. Discounting submissions and takedowns, BJJ and wrestling have the same basic goal, which is controlling dudes on the ground, yet there are a lot of highly regarded BJJ guys in MMA who are terrible at that aspect. Are they just overrated or is there some distinguishing characteristic between BJJ and wrestling for MMA? Most jiu jitsu schools spend very little time working takedowns(like at most schools the ratio of ground work to takedown is at least 5:1). Beyond that takedowns and mat work are very different and being good at one doesn't necessarily mean your going to be good at the other(even if you spend the same amount of time on each)
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Sep 21, 2011 06:27
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I've seen a BJJ instructional video where you're told not to spend too much time on take downs, since time with a training partner should be spent on valuable groundwork, as "real fights will go to the ground." For a classic Wrestler vs. Grappler matchup, check out (Dubai grappling champion) Damian Maia vs. (NCAA wrestling champion) Mark Munoz. Munoz is able to take Maia down and get top position, but Maia is often able to curl up like a shrimp to get his legs between him and his opponent, then methodically shift position.
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Sep 21, 2011 14:28
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dokomoy posted:Beyond that takedowns and mat work are very different and being good at one doesn't necessarily mean your going to be good at the other(even if you spend the same amount of time on each) What I dont understand is how the mat work can be that different. The rules are different, and so are the techniques, but it's not like no one has ever seen a whizzer or an underhook in BJJ. I'm looking for a deeper understanding of why you can have good BJJ and bad wrestling when they share so much in common.
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Sep 22, 2011 01:03
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Meat Recital posted:What I dont understand is how the mat work can be that different. The rules are different, and so are the techniques, but it's not like no one has ever seen a whizzer or an underhook in BJJ. I'm looking for a deeper understanding of why you can have good BJJ and bad wrestling when they share so much in common. Because you don't drill takedowns nearly as much in BJJ. It isn't that complicated.
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Sep 22, 2011 01:11
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Meat Recital posted:I'm looking for a deeper understanding of why you can have good BJJ and bad wrestling when they share so much in common. Because they have different end goals and rules? Its the same reason why even though Wrestling, Judo and BJJ they are "similar" in that you want to establish control on the ground, they all have different means and ways of achieving it. Wrestlers work hard and lift alot of weights so they just suplex each other or something like that. BJJ players are homosexual and try to entice other men in between their legs so that they can sub/sweep Judo practitioners year weird pyjamas so they use them to toss each other.
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Sep 22, 2011 01:14
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Meat Recital posted:What I dont understand is how the mat work can be that different. The rules are different, and so are the techniques, but it's not like no one has ever seen a whizzer or an underhook in BJJ. I'm looking for a deeper understanding of why you can have good BJJ and bad wrestling when they share so much in common. A) If you practice your BJJ groundwork a lot and don't practice your takedowns much, you will be very good at groundwork and not good at takedowns B) Even if you practice everything the same amount, some people have more of an aptitude for things than others. Pete Spratt has been training wrestling for longer than Georges St. Pierre. People improve in different skills at different rates.
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Sep 22, 2011 01:39
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