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Eh. Those are both Hollywood cliches and if anything they work better in games then they do there. Realism often makes for lovely mechanics and "crouching = stealth" or "tranq guns = nonlethal" allow for simple to grasp gameplay mechanics that can be worked around and implemented into the game. It's the same as things exploding when you shoot them or Silencers somehow muffling all the sound from a gun or the various ridiculous ways of stealth killing someone or... well, all the unrealistic stuff. They make good gameplay mechanics and that's more important then being realistic. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 16:56
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ImpAtom posted:Eh. Those are both Hollywood cliches and if anything they work better in games then they do there. Realism often makes for lovely mechanics and "crouching = stealth" or "tranq guns = nonlethal" allow for simple to grasp gameplay mechanics that can be worked around and implemented into the game. Yes, but games are not Hollywood. There are at least some movies that subvert this trope, none of the games I can think of do. I mean its usually done to add some complexity, but at times it doesn't even make sense. Its just annoying for me. You are a bad rear end super spy, your job isn't to put the enemy army to sleep. blackguy32 fucked around with this message at 17:07 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 17:02
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blackguy32 posted:Yes, but games are not Hollywood. There are at least some movies that subvert this trope, none of the games I can think of do. I mean its usually done to add some complexity, but at times it doesn't even make sense. Pretty much nothing in a game is realistic and appealing to movie/book/television/whatever cliches makes it easier to teach the rules to people because it functions under a certain kind of logic that people are already trained to expect. Games are... well, games. They're not trying to be realistic. They are functioning under unrealistic rules by their basic design. They are forced to compensate for the fact that they are in an artificial world with very set rules and limitations and using cliches to teach the rules to the player is pretty important. While something might not be realistic, it can feel natural simple through media absorption. It's not ever going to make sense but rarely does anything in media make sense. It is more important for it to function to compensate for the media. Realism is rarely beneficial to a product, especially a video game where realism tends to make for poor mechanics. Yeah, you're a badass super spy but your job isn't to put the bad guys to sleep. It also isn't to single-handedly kill the population of a small country or sneak into conveniently placed vents that go everywhere in the world. It's just the nature of a game that you're not approaching things realistically, since realistic stealth would be pretty dull. Adding tranquilizer or stun darts to a game allows you to approach things differently if you so wish and that's good game design. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:14 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 17:10
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ImpAtom posted:Pretty much nothing in a game is realistic and appealing to movie/book/television/whatever cliches makes it easier to teach the rules to people because it functions under a certain kind of logic that people are already trained to expect. Yes, but MGS got by fine with only lethal means of eliminating people. And really for all intents and purposes, outside of boss battles, its actually easier to tranquilize every body. Once they are asleep, there really is very little difference between a guy who is asleep and a dead guy other than the guy might wake up if you take too long in an area. They don't even alert the guards when they do wake up. Also, I believe Hitman Blood Money does crouching right. Its slow as gently caress and not really how you would really sneak. I mean it seems that after Splinter Cell came out, everyone latched onto the idea that the only way to be perfectly silent was to crouch everywhere. blackguy32 fucked around with this message at 17:18 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 17:16
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Sistergodiva posted:DC online goes free* to play. If it's anything like Everquest 2 Extended, you'll be very limited in the type of character you can make, and the free option will be a bit of a money sink initially because of this.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:18
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I always figured crouching/sneaking being the same button came more from the number of buttons on the controller. Like, you could have crouch and sneak as separate, but smoe other aspect of the game would lose fuctionality. If crouching has to mean sneaking for the rest of the game to work well and be fun, so be it.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:21
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blackguy32 posted:Yes, but MGS got by fine with only lethal means of eliminating people. And really for all intents and purposes, outside of boss battles, its actually easier to tranquilize every body. MGS didn't have only lethal means tho'. You could sneak up and UHUHUHUHUH them to knock them out. Not to mention that one of the big emphasis of the game that you're scored for is getting through without killing anyone, which Tranq Guns play into. I agree that tranquilizing enemies should have more mechanical difficulty to compensate for it being higher scoring, but that's something else entirely from it not needing to exist. H:BM is awesome but it's focused around a specific kind of stealth. (In particular, 'public stealth') It wouldn't work for everything because not every game is designed like H:BM. ... Although I wish more were. H:BM was fantastic. SpacePig posted:I always figured crouching/sneaking being the same button came more from the number of buttons on the controller. Like, you could have crouch and sneak as separate, but smoe other aspect of the game would lose fuctionality. If crouching has to mean sneaking for the rest of the game to work well and be fun, so be it. Crouch = sneaky was around even on the PC. It's convenient but it didn't start on consoles. It really is just because is a convenient shorthand for "your character is being stealthy" more then anything else. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 17:22
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ImpAtom posted:Crouch = sneaky was around even on the PC. It's convenient but it didn't start on consoles. It really is just because isn't a convenient shorthand for "your character is being stealthy" more then anything else. Yeah, in Deus Ex, it was faster and more quiet to crouch to sneak instead of walking.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:29
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ImpAtom posted:Crouch = sneaky was around even on the PC. It's convenient but it didn't start on consoles. It really is just because isn't a convenient shorthand for "your character is being stealthy" more then anything else. Oh. Well, whatever. It may not make a whole lot of sense, but I honestly don't see the big deal about it so long as it's fun. Also, there aren't many games I've played past the N64 era where crouching and moving kept you as low as possible. Most games raise you up a bit, and have it look a bit more like you were keeping low and walking purposefully than just nearly crawling.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:32
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Speaking of being stealthy, I had to crack up at New Vegas. I just wrapped up the quest where you have to find the evidence linking the Crimson Caravan and VanGraff families to the destruction of various caravans, Cass's quest. Part of that involved stealing documents from the VanGraff safe. In front of that safe is a door. In front of the door were two heavily armed guards. One of them had the door in his field of vision. I strapped on my StealthBoy, crouched and moved quietly up to the door, and picked it. The door opened, I slipped inside, and did my thing. Now I don't know about you, but if I was standing there minding my business and a door just randomly popped open, especially one that's supposed to be highly secured, I think I'd start, you know, investigating. Plus, people in the Fallout universe are familiar with the idea of StealthBoys, the first thing I'd think of as that guard would be "Oh gently caress someone with a StealthBoy is trying to break in SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT" [for those who haven't played, a StealthBoy makes you almost totally invisible, you just kind of look like "shimmering air" or something, like Predator-style] Video games. 
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Sep 19, 2011 17:36
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Since pretty much everyone I know said it's the best game on the PS3, I finally just started playing Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots for the first time last night. My first venture back to MGS since Metal Gear Solid on the Playstation 1. I don't think I know what I'm doing  What is the general consensus on the game here?
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Sep 19, 2011 17:37
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I loved the series, but I tried to go back to it a few weeks ago and couldn't get into it. Also, skipping MGS 2 and 3 is a bad idea. Especially 3.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:41
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eightysixed posted:Since pretty much everyone I know said it's the best game on the PS3, I finally just started playing Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots for the first time last night. My first venture back to MGS since Metal Gear Solid on the Playstation 1. I don't think I know what I'm doing
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Sep 19, 2011 17:41
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the truth posted:I loved the series, but I tried to go back to it a few weeks ago and couldn't get into it. Also, skipping MGS 2 and 3 is a bad idea. Especially 3. Like, "mine as well not play it then" bad idea? 
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Sep 19, 2011 17:43
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Yeah, whoever told you it's the best thing on the PS3 was a liar. Maybe it was at the time it was released (hell, it was the reason I got my PS3), but so much has been released that is better that it's almost funny. That, by no means, mean it's a bad game. Just not the best. And like the other 2 said, MGS3(Subsistence, if you can find it or feel like waiting for the DH collection) is the best of the series. e: There are alot of plot elements that won't make sense unless you've played or read up on 2 and 3, and that takes alot out of the cutscenes, I think, of which there are many.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:44
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Gameplay wise, the first two acts are great fun; but after a dramatic shift in Act 3, the game just kind of goes insane. Did the people who recommend it, know that you haven't played 2 or 3? Because, without those two, I really doubt any plot in 4 will make much sense to you. You might want to just put it on hold, until the MGS HD pack comes out. That's got 2-3 in it, and Peace Walker, one of the best games in the series.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:44
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eightysixed posted:Since pretty much everyone I know said it's the best game on the PS3, I finally just started playing Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots for the first time last night. My first venture back to MGS since Metal Gear Solid on the Playstation 1. I don't think I know what I'm doing And it should be noted that going straight from MGS1 to MGS4 is a huge mistake. I'd like to say that you won't have any idea what's going on in the story if you miss out on MGS2 and MGS3 (especially the former) but that doesn't feel right. It's more like you're not confused enough by the series to play MGS4 yet. I recommend you wait and get confused by getting the Metal Gear Solid HD collection which is out in a couple of months before jumping into MGS4. Edit: Beaten, but my point still stands I think. Playing MGS2 is good in terms of story, but MGS3 and Peace Walker (which I haven't played myself but heard great things about) are genuinely fantastic games and shouldn't be missed, period. And get Uncharted 1 and 2 if you haven't yet. It's pretty universally regarded that any PS3 owner should have those games. Stare-Out fucked around with this message at 17:50 on Sep 19, 2011 |
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Sep 19, 2011 17:46
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vkeios posted:Did the people who recommend it, know that you haven't played 2 or 3? Because, without those two, I really doubt any plot in 4 will make much sense to you. No, I don't think so, but that's my own stupid fault. I remember loving the original, and was stoked to play a similar type game. Maybe I will hold off though
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Sep 19, 2011 17:47
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Buy the Uncharted double pack. If you liked MGS back in the day then you should give the HD collection a shot.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:47
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the truth posted:Buy the Uncharted double pack. This, seriosuly. The MGS:HD collection is coming in November, so play the 2 Uncharted games, and maybe some other exclusives until then.
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Sep 19, 2011 17:49
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I had never played MGS 2 or 3 before I purchased a PS3. I played through the first three games in preparation for MGS4. I thought they were good games that got better as they went, but I didn't have any sort of attachment to them, and I thought MGS4 was the best one of the series. It is most certainly not the best games on the PS3. Uncharted 2 is the best game on the system, so you should play Uncharted 1 and 2 (please play the first one).
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Sep 19, 2011 17:53
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I've heard people say that Metal Gear Solid 4 is really cinematic, and whilst I can see where they're coming from, the film it's portraying is poo poo. There are some instances where people are giving monologues that go on for several minutes with very little else happening- I can remember one being 10 minutes, but it was a while ago so I may be exagerating - which you couldn't get away with in film. They'd be rightly slammed for terrible exposition. If any of it was on the big screen for real it would be ripped apart for being awful. For the most part, I'd give it a pass and tolerate a bit of crap story. But there are times when they are 20-30 minutes long (the ending drags on forever, but since it's the ending I wasn't anticipating playing, so I can accept sitting and watching more.) When I'm sat doing nothing for that long, I don't feel I'm playing a game any more, but rather watching a film or TV show. And when a lot of it is really badly done, I'm inclined to either watch a better film or play a different game. The gameplay that's there is pretty great, though.
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Sep 19, 2011 18:25
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I don't know why people think it's a good idea to jump into the concluding chapter of a story-driven series.
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Sep 19, 2011 18:28
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Even having played all the previous ones, a lot of MGS4's story (and all the others, except possibly 3) is horrible gobbledygook.
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Sep 19, 2011 18:36
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Samurai Sanders posted:Even having played all the previous ones, a lot of MGS4's story (and all the others, except possibly 3) is horrible gobbledygook. All of them have some lovely stories. Crows Turn Off posted:I had never played MGS 2 or 3 before I purchased a PS3. I played through the first three games in preparation for MGS4. I thought they were good games that got better as they went, but I didn't have any sort of attachment to them, and I thought MGS4 was the best one of the series. I agree with this. MGS4 really refined the way the game controlled and played. I would like MGS3 the most, but a lot of the stuff in the game thats important is a clunky mess. The controls, using camo, aiming using the rifles, etc.
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Sep 19, 2011 18:42
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So I'm thinking about getting the new Sony Tablet with it's super rad Playstation Certified thingy. BUT, I can't see if I can connect it to my PSN account and download the PS1 games I've already purchased. Anyone know?
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Sep 19, 2011 18:50
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the truth posted:Buy the Uncharted double pack. If you liked MGS back in the day then you should give the HD collection a shot. I sold my PS3 when the 360 elite came out and just recently picked up another one. The Uncharted dual pack is really good value for it's price (even though Uncharted 1 has some drat glaring flaws. ([fixed in Uncharted 2]) I also picked up White Knight Chronicles 2 since it had the first game as well. It was really heart-warming to grab all the PSN games I got way back in 2007 though, though all my friends say "been offline for: 2 years" Are there any other-type of values on games that I've missed since April 2007? Other than the greatest hits line of course.
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Sep 19, 2011 19:35
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Zomodok posted:Are there any other-type of values on games that I've missed since April 2007? Other than the greatest hits line of course. You could grab all five God of War games. God of War III is only 20 dollars now, and there's two HD collections from the PS2 and PSP titles.
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Sep 19, 2011 19:46
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I predicted that DCUO would go free to play in 6 months. So close
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Sep 19, 2011 19:53
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Zomodok posted:I sold my PS3 when the 360 eliteI also picked up White Knight Chronicles 2 since it had the first game as well. Don't do that
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Sep 19, 2011 19:56
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I'm finally playing through Arkham Asylum after a couple friends told me they wouldn't play anything online with me until I finished it. I didn't enjoy it much at the beginning, maybe because I'm not really into superheroes, but then I got to the part where you fight Scarecrow. That segment, coupled with the wireless headphones I got the other day, was awesome. 
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Sep 19, 2011 19:57
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the truth posted:Don't do that Is it a bad game or is it just Anime: The RPG Because if it's the second I'll just let my friend play it but if it's the former I'll take it back.
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Sep 19, 2011 20:00
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Zomodok posted:Is it a bad game or is it just Anime: The RPG
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Sep 19, 2011 20:02
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If you want Anime: The SRPG then get Record of Agarest War. ... good lord. I actually like anime and this poo poo's just too much for me. Handsome young hero rebels against his own army to protect underage elf girl within like the first 10 minutes, and soon after comes the parade of scantily clad anime babes and dramatic ellipses, ie "Leonhardt...". It's a collection of pure distilled terrible anime tropes compiled into a PS3 game. It's reeeeeally cringe-worthy. Plus I've been spoiled with Disgaea's combat system, so I'm having a hard time putting time into Agarest.
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Sep 19, 2011 20:19
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Zomodok posted:Is it a bad game or is it just Anime: The RPG It's love it or hate it really. I enjoy the Knight gimmick and the online play (especially now that I got my Avatar's Knight and will soon be able to use it online), but the SP story is kinda blah. The second part has some frustrating bossfights, but I really like the overhaul to the entire battle system. I also always find it funny that the strongest character in the game is always your Avatar, and he or she is always just kinda hanging out around the main characters, dragged in to all this nonsense because of poo poo Going Down on his/her first day on the job.
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Sep 19, 2011 20:42
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If I've learned anything from previous iterations of this thread, it's that I should never play a WKC game.
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Sep 19, 2011 20:54
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I liked WKC. The gameplay system wasn't atrocious and I actually enjoyed comboing attacks together. I just think it had a great amount of expectation and being Level 5 failed to meet such lofty expectations. It doesn't help that the US got the game 2 years after it's release date, making it feel dated in the market.
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Sep 19, 2011 21:47
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WKC's major problem is that it's obvious it was an MMORPG that was downgraded at some point to a Monster Hunter/Phantasy Star Online style hub system with repeatable quests and they jerry-rigged in a story mode to it. If you like MMOs and that kind of treadmill gameplay, you'll probably enjoy it. I didn't mind WKC's online mode, it just had way too much grinding in it if you were the type to want to get all the Trophies. Regular people would be fine.
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Sep 19, 2011 21:52
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It's really depressing that a lovely game such as WKC can spark so much conversation but a game like Resistance 3 pretty much gets no attention at all
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Sep 19, 2011 22:03
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Code Jockey posted:If you want Anime: The SRPG then get Record of Agarest War. Just part ex'd this for a copy of Demon's Souls, I think I might have liked it and gotten more out of it if the battles hadn't been so loving slow. The actual combat system was pretty boss, but everything just seemed to take forever. Still, never mind, I now have some demon's to not kill because they are handing my arse to me
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Sep 19, 2011 22:04
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