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Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

This latest discussion on horrible factory jacks reminds me that ALL ENTHUSIAST CARS SHOULD COME WITH FACTORY SILL STANDS. Seriously manufacturers....you know what cars you make that will end up being endlessly wrenched on in driveways and on the sides of race tracks. Throw us a bone here.

Edit: Oops, new page and needing content. How about a handful of Viper tranny?



Older article, but I just recently came across it.

Motronic fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Nov 2, 2011

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Poing
Jul 25, 2001

Gaze into my eyes...

Mo Hawk posted:

But how did this happen? I am not a fan of VW's engineering quality at all, but it doesn't seem to be damage which could have been inflicted by this jack.
That doesn't look like damage, look at the line between the (assumedly plastic) side sill and the door and it's perfectly straight. I think the red circle was to highlight the fact that Audi jacks go around the pinch weld under the unibody. I've beaten the poo poo out of the caliper retaining pin on one of my single-casting 4-pot brake calipers while it was on the one-legger (yeah I'm not dumb enough to have anything under the car while doing so) and it was just fine.

Das Volk
Nov 19, 2002

by Cyrano4747

Motronic posted:

This latest discussion on horrible factory jacks reminds me that ALL ENTHUSIAST CARS SHOULD COME WITH FACTORY SILL STANDS. Seriously manufacturers....you know what cars you make that will end up being endlessly wrenched on in driveways and on the sides of race tracks. Throw us a bone here.

Edit: Oops, new page and needing content. How about a handful of Viper tranny?



Older article, but I just recently came across it.

BMW is kind enough to put big fat plastic jack pads at all four corners nowadays at least, although they don't include a jack, just a $40 can of nazi fix-a-flat and an electric pump which is actually pretty handy.

cakesmith handyman
Jul 22, 2007

Pip-Pip old chap! Last one in is a rotten egg what what.

Poing posted:

That doesn't look like damage, look at the line between the (assumedly plastic) side sill and the door and it's perfectly straight. I think the red circle was to highlight the fact that Audi jacks go around the pinch weld under the unibody. I've beaten the poo poo out of the caliper retaining pin on one of my single-casting 4-pot brake calipers while it was on the one-legger (yeah I'm not dumb enough to have anything under the car while doing so) and it was just fine.

Most cars I've had support the sill in this fashion, its a pretty strong area if designed for a jacking point.

Rujo King
Jun 28, 2007

I say old chap have you any of the good sort of catnip if you know what I mean... harrumphaarmaammhhhmm

Coasterphreak posted:

Please tell me you spend sunny Saturdays chilling in a lawn chair on your driveway wearing a Speedo and sipping Smirnoff Ice.

Nah dog, Hanes and Private Stock.

Jork Juggler posted:

This looks similar to the jack in my old 1970 Toronado, which was taller and lifted the car by its bumper. I had to use it once. Very scary, but it got the tire changed.

Automotive Insanity > Post Stories of Jacks and Jacking Points

If they included one with my parents' 1981 model, it was the best part of the car by a fairly wide margin. A few months before it died, the engine decided to have apocalyptic diarrhea all over the engine compartment, and coated every single square inch of the inside of the hood with tar that I assume used to be 10W40. We didn't even bother cleaning it up, because I'm pretty sure our drive would have become a Superfund site.

A few weeks later it dropped its entire store of gear oil on our driveway. After that the muffler fell off. Then my father had to do something that involved flames coming out of what was probably the carburetor. Finally, in a fitting end to the piece of poo poo, it seized up as we drove it into the junkyard. It ended up rolling into a sinkhole, which is honestly a better grave than it deserved.

The only good part (aside from the bizarre amount of rear legroom considering it was a 2-door) was that we got $100 for it, which we used to help pay for a new Camry.

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM
I miss the old GM jacks that were a long bar with notches in the side that slotted into a base and then had a little rider piece that would hook into the bumper. Then you used your lug wrench to stick into a little pivot-y bit in the riding piece and CLICK CLICK CLICK CLICK CLICK jack it up.

JD Brickmeister
Sep 4, 2008

by Y Kant Ozma Post

AlternateAccount posted:

I miss the old GM jacks that were a long bar with notches in the side that slotted into a base and then had a little rider piece that would hook into the bumper. Then you used your lug wrench to stick into a little pivot-y bit in the riding piece and CLICK CLICK CLICK CLICK CLICK jack it up.

Oh, memories.

From here if you're interested.

Hillridge
Aug 3, 2004

WWheeeeeee!
I have a lift at my hackerspace, and it never fails to induce a :stare: when someone finds out that the recommend lift point for their car is the pinch weld. It just looks wrong.

Coasterphreak
May 29, 2007
I like cookies.

Rujo King posted:

Nah dog, Hanes and Private Stock.

I like the cut of your jib.

Root Bear
Nov 15, 2004

DARKEST SKETCH
This 96 Plymouth Voyager makes a delightful sound when it gets jacked up, funny story really:






I lost count of how many of these I've either fixed or recommend that the owner junk their van because the damage was too severe.

It seems to me that the alleged "fix" is more of a temporary stay of execution:

Queen_Combat
Jan 15, 2011
Before they junk the vans you pull the 3.0 V6, right? A Mitsubishi engine shouldn't have to suffer for a Chrysler shortfall (yes, I know, Chrysler redesigned the intake, made it non-interference, etc etc; point stands).



Though that "repair" plate scares the bejeesus out of me. There are vans running around with their front suspension attached soley to aftermarket plates? With that kind of corrosion?

meatpimp
May 15, 2004

Psst -- Wanna buy

:) EVERYWHERE :)
some high-quality thread's DESTROYED!

:kheldragar:

Root Bear posted:



*Comes complete with mounting hardware.

Pop Rivets. :cry:

Joe Mama
May 10, 2008

meatpimp posted:

*Comes complete with mounting hardware.

Pop Rivets. :cry:

Second that. As a professional, this makes me sick.

Bondematt
Jan 26, 2007

Not too stupid

Joe Mama posted:

Second that. As a professional, this makes me sick.

As a non-professional, this makes me sick.

That looks like it would only hold a few hundred pounds at best, and then they used pop rivets(?!) to attach it?

Hell I doubt it would even hold a hundred pounds the way it's set up too.

peepsalot
Apr 24, 2007

        PEEP THIS...
           BITCH!

What's wrong with blind rivets? Commonly used to hold aircraft together.

Nerobro
Nov 4, 2005

Rider now with 100% more titanium!
The number of them. There's nothing wrong with them in particular.

Rot
Apr 18, 2005

peepsalot posted:

What's wrong with blind rivets? Commonly used to hold aircraft together.

Hi, just wanted to poke my head in to say that fasteners such as Cherrymax rivets are very different from pop rivets.

cakesmith handyman
Jul 22, 2007

Pip-Pip old chap! Last one in is a rotten egg what what.

I love that the "All better!":byodood: picture still shows the rust underneath, wouldn't you cut it out to stop it spreading? :psyduck:

Nerobro
Nov 4, 2005

Rider now with 100% more titanium!
I'm going to suggest something more shocking.

Ponder the fact that there's enough of a demand to have someone MARKET this product. Thank you chrysler.

Vanagoon
Jan 20, 2008


Best Dead Gay Forums
on the whole Internet!

meatpimp posted:

1) You're an idiot if you get under a car that is missing any parts without a jackstand. I admit, I'll crawl under from the side with just a floor jack (not the factory bullshit, see below), but as soon as there's a wheel off or other component that will allow the car to go ALL the way down? There's a jackstand under that bitch.

2) Some OEM jacks are exercises in the absurd. We dropped a brand new, $40k Mercedes in ~1987, when $40k cars were expensive. Using the factory jack on a flat, concrete garage floor.

The right rear wheel had a flat and we were changing it. Used the factory jack in the factory location. For those cars, there were holes in the side that you put a rod from the jack into, then cranked the jack up. The problem was that the jack had a 4-loving-inch wide base, which was about as stable as a Kardashian marriage. We got the wheel off, only to watch the jack slowly pivot and dump the car onto the ground. Luckily no damange, but goddamn.

What does a "jack" like that look like? Gaze upon its majesty:


The Vanagon comes with this piece of poo poo too.

Mine didn't manage to squish me with the van as I am still here, thankfully.

Thumposaurus
Jul 24, 2007

Vanagoon posted:

The Vanagon comes with this piece of poo poo too.

Mine didn't manage to squish me with the van as I am still here, thankfully.

My 73 came with one like that too. I used it once and then bought a floor jack and stuck it in the one cabinet in the back.

JD Brickmeister
Sep 4, 2008

by Y Kant Ozma Post

Nerobro posted:

I'm going to suggest something more shocking.

Ponder the fact that there's enough of a demand to have someone MARKET this product. Thank you chrysler.

I think I will market something even better - a stencil you can place over that area and a can of black spray paint. That way you get the identical benefit of having appeared to do something about it without the hassle of drilling the holes, doing the rivets, etc. My solution will be as effective but much cheaper.

My biggest fear is that someone will come along with an even cheaper product that makes it so you can't open the hood.

SimulatedWoodgrain
Oct 6, 2006
What I don't get about that "repair" plate is that it is cut out for the factory strut mount bolts... why not make it go over them so then you are at least bolting the strut mount to something more structurally sound then rust? If that was the case and it was welded in place I could see it being a viable solution... or at least long term band-aid.

Queen_Combat
Jan 15, 2011

SimulatedWoodgrain posted:

What I don't get about that "repair" plate is that it is cut out for the factory strut mount bolts... why not make it go over them so then you are at least bolting the strut mount to something more structurally sound then rust? If that was the case and it was welded in place I could see it being a viable solution... or at least long term band-aid.

You see, if you make it so the struts mount to the plate itself, you could open yourself up for more liability than just a simple reinforcing plate. When the strut fails attached to the old, rusted car body, it's the car's fault, not your (the retarded reinforcing plate manufacturer's) fault.

At least, that's how I see it.

SimulatedWoodgrain
Oct 6, 2006
Perhaps, but what good is the fix when the rusted metal that the strut bolts to finishes rotting away and the strut is just flopping around in there. I did some reading and apparently Chrysler has their own repair plate that is hi-strength epoxied in and the rivets are just for clamping power while it sets up. What Chrysler's looks like I don't know but Doorman's looks rather flawed in that regard. I guess if they are concerned about liability why make it in the first place?

Revolvyerom
Nov 12, 2005

Hell yes, tell him we're plenty front right now.

Rujo King posted:

A few months before it died, the engine decided to have apocalyptic diarrhea all over the engine compartment, and coated every single square inch of the inside of the hood with tar that I assume used to be 10W40. We didn't even bother cleaning it up, because I'm pretty sure our drive would have become a Superfund site.
And you kept driving it with an engine coated in oil? How was that not a fire haz-

quote:

Then my father had to do something that involved flames coming out of what was probably the carburetor.
Oh.

Queen_Combat
Jan 15, 2011

SimulatedWoodgrain posted:

I guess if they are concerned about liability why make it in the first place?

To make money off of dumb people, which is also coincides quite nicely with the people who buy every other thing out of a JC Whitney catalog for their Plymouth Voyager.

The question you should be asking is "Why bother concerning yourself with liability when you can make money all the same?" It's the American Way :patriot:

kastein
Aug 31, 2011

Moderator at http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/and soon to be mod of AI. MAKE AI GREAT AGAIN. Motronic for VP.

Revolvyerom posted:

And you kept driving it with an engine coated in oil? How was that not a fire haz-
Oh.

motor oil, especially 10 weight and higher, is pretty drat hard to light on fire. It has to basically drop right on the exhaust while you're flooring it with all the tires spinning. I drove a jeep for a long, long time that would leak a quart of oil down the back of the block and out the rear main seal directly onto the exhaust without ever seeing a single flame. It did smoke like a son of a gun though.

Rujo King
Jun 28, 2007

I say old chap have you any of the good sort of catnip if you know what I mean... harrumphaarmaammhhhmm
If we can add in retarded design and previous owner failures to the thread, this is what greeted me when I pulled my CD player out to try to fix some grounding issues.


Bad design: The cup holder on the 2nd-gen Legacy is a pop-out design sitting right between the climate controls and radio, so if anything spills ever, it will fill the whole goddamn thing with a sticky residue that is about as tenacious as genital warts.

Previous owner: Yeah man, gently caress wiring harnesses and adaptors! Oh, and all those electrical tape-covered connections were lightly twisted together, and several of them had completely detached. I'd seriously consider a loving stereo delete, just to be rid of it, but my engine doesn't sound good enough for that yet.

As for the "grounding issue," the same jackass that did those poor-rear end connections and clipped all the harness wires simply took the radio ground wire, stripped off about two inches, then wrapped it around a bit of metal. Did it work? Yes, theoretically.

Revolvyerom posted:

And you kept driving it with an engine coated in oil? How was that not a fire haz-
Oh.

Well he did dab some of it off with paper towels, but yeah, several of our cars had problems with "mysterious" smoke. My dad's the kind of guy who makes a plumbing repair which requires two plumbing repairs to fix.

AzureSkys
Apr 27, 2003

I've had 2 2nd Gen Legacies and both required a thorough cleaning of the climate controls due to layers and layers of coffee/soda/who knows what. Also, the little LED bulbs that light the controls always seem burnt out requiring the thing to be pulled apart and cleaned.

Puddin
Apr 9, 2004
Leave it to Brak

Rujo King posted:


Previous owner: Yeah man, gently caress wiring harnesses and adaptors! Oh, and all those electrical tape-covered connections were lightly twisted together, and several of them had completely detached. I'd seriously consider a loving stereo delete, just to be rid of it, but my engine doesn't sound good enough for that yet.

As for the "grounding issue," the same jackass that did those poor-rear end connections and clipped all the harness wires simply took the radio ground wire, stripped off about two inches, then wrapped it around a bit of metal. Did it work? Yes, theoretically.

Having done some shoddy work in my younger years, I'm so grateful now for patch cords that can be bought from pretty much any electrical store to match your OEM stereo plugs to whatever brand headunit you're putting in.

gently caress stripping/soldering/connecting and covering with heat shrink.

Plug and play just loving owns, and makes it all that much easier to reverse if you ever sell the vehicle. I think I swapped out my head unit in my S15 in about 5 minutes flat.

Maker Of Shoes
Sep 4, 2006

AWWWW YISSSSSSSSSS
DIS IS MAH JAM!!!!!!

Puddin posted:

Having done some shoddy work in my younger years, I'm so grateful now for patch cords that can be bought from pretty much any electrical store to match your OEM stereo plugs to whatever brand headunit you're putting in.

gently caress stripping/soldering/connecting and covering with heat shrink.

Plug and play just loving owns, and makes it all that much easier to reverse if you ever sell the vehicle. I think I swapped out my head unit in my S15 in about 5 minutes flat.

This. I don't think I ever got as bad as the picture though. At worst I used fully clamped butt connectors and heat shrink tubing.

JD Brickmeister
Sep 4, 2008

by Y Kant Ozma Post

ack! posted:

I've had 2 2nd Gen Legacies and both required a thorough cleaning of the climate controls due to layers and layers of coffee/soda/who knows what. Also, the little LED bulbs that light the controls always seem burnt out requiring the thing to be pulled apart and cleaned.

My daughter left her lotion in my Sunfire, it got hot and about 1/2 cup of lotion gooshed out into the cup holder. Initially I was pissed, but when I used napkins to wipe up all the goo, it took several years worth of dust, coffee residue, soda, etc. with it. Left it all moisturized I guess, because now it's very clean and looks better than the rest of the vinyl in the car...

BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm

kastein posted:

motor oil, especially 10 weight and higher, is pretty drat hard to light on fire. It has to basically drop right on the exhaust while you're flooring it with all the tires spinning. I drove a jeep for a long, long time that would leak a quart of oil down the back of the block and out the rear main seal directly onto the exhaust without ever seeing a single flame. It did smoke like a son of a gun though.

Now ATF... that poo poo will light right up.

kastein
Aug 31, 2011

Moderator at http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/and soon to be mod of AI. MAKE AI GREAT AGAIN. Motronic for VP.

BlackMK4 posted:

Now ATF... that poo poo will light right up.

Yup. :supaburn:

... speaking of which, the location of the transmission cooler lines on the Jeep XJ and MJ is pretty much a horrible mechanical (design) failure. They're perfectly located to be pinched by the passenger upper control arm mount if you flex it out sufficiently, I've done it on one with 100% stock suspension geometry (minus spring height, but that doesn't affect where the axle is located as it cycles.) Never jumped out of a jeep with a fire extinguisher so fast in my life... my friends noted that I was shooting fire every time I hit the gas, since it was spraying a fine stream directly onto the exhaust. Then I got to lie in trickling water on a muddy rocky hill and patch the trans lines.

Root Bear
Nov 15, 2004

DARKEST SKETCH

Nerobro posted:

I'm going to suggest something more shocking.

Ponder the fact that there's enough of a demand to have someone MARKET this product. Thank you chrysler.

It was originally only available through OEM distributors; and if I remember correctly, it was on back-order for a short time after it's release.

It's not shown in the picture, but in addition to the pop-rivets, it also comes with a tube of JB-Weld type epoxy that you use to coat the existing tower prior to dropping on the cap and pop-riveting it into place. It's messy and it smells bad.

Thank you Chrysler, indeed. :rolleyes:

Phanatic
Mar 13, 2007

Please don't forget that I am an extremely racist idiot who also has terrible opinions about the Culture series.

JD Brickmeister posted:

I think I will market something even better - a stencil you can place over that area and a can of black spray paint.

Set the Wayback Machine for 1990. My friend's Datsun 210 wouldn't pass inspection, because the wheel wells were rusting through.

Enter some sheet aluminum from the hardware store, some rivets, and a can of spray tar. Passed the inspection, car kept going until at least 1992.

INCHI DICKARI
Aug 23, 2006

by FactsAreUseless
Couple randoms.







Rujo King
Jun 28, 2007

I say old chap have you any of the good sort of catnip if you know what I mean... harrumphaarmaammhhhmm

14 INCH DICK TURBO posted:



There's something elegantly sublime about a connecting-rod-through-oil-pan picture. It's horrific failure in its purest form. None of this "what the gently caress is that and is that a crank that is now in seven parts and why is there mayonnaise?" It's just rod, pan, boom.

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Nerobro
Nov 4, 2005

Rider now with 100% more titanium!

Rujo King posted:

There's something elegantly sublime about a connecting-rod-through-oil-pan picture.
Spare the rod...

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