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Stoic Commie
Aug 29, 2005

by XyloJW
I can't decide between the Motorola Photon and HTC Evo 3D (Sprint obviously), although the photon is $50 on Amazon right now while the Evo is $100. I've read tons of reviews and even they can't make up their mind between the two. Are there any major problems with either phone right now that may affect my decision? If I do decide on the photon, I am interested in rooting it and putting senseUI on it, is this possible? HELP.

Stoic Commie fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Nov 24, 2011

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Duckman2008
Jan 6, 2010

TFW you see Flyers goaltending.
Grimey Drawer

Stoic Commie posted:

I can't decide between the Motorola Photon and HTC Evo 3D (Sprint obviously), although the photon is $50 on Amazon right now while the Evo is $100. I've read tons of reviews and even they can't make up their mind between the two. Are there any major problems with either phone right now that may affect my decision? If I do decide on the photon, I am interested in rooting it and putting senseUI on it, is this possible? HELP.

Get the evo 3D, the photon has been havibg problems.

notwithoutmyanus
Mar 17, 2009

SpecialAgentCooper posted:

This is kind of useless for me - I really don't want or need an iPhone. Fair enough if it's a bad idea to go with Windows or Blackberry, but I just don't want or like Apple. Here, how about this: If I chose an Android phone with a physical keyboard and T4 compatibility, which one is best?

I don't know what to tell ya here. I'm hard of hearing somewhat too (aids both ears, yadda), and all I find is that switching to the telecoil on a phone/via the aids does jack poo poo except make everything harder to hear than a normal setting. I've found that to be universal across phones for the last 10 years or so. Example, samsung: http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/learningresources/mobile/accessibility/pop_accessibility.html . Vibrant is claimed T3M3, not even close in reality.

If you want to deal with hearing aids and phones, honestly get the bluetooth thing that is ridiculously overpriced for hearing aids, and do it that way. That opens you up to any phone, as well. Otherwise you're just asking for a bad call experience regardless of carrier. At least that's been my experience across 8 phones the last 10 years, with top of the line hearing aids (I'm a musician as well)

notwithoutmyanus fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Nov 24, 2011

Quebec Bagnet
Apr 28, 2009

mess with the honk
you get the bonk
Lipstick Apathy

SpecialAgentCooper posted:

This is kind of useless for me - I really don't want or need an iPhone. Fair enough if it's a bad idea to go with Windows or Blackberry, but I just don't want or like Apple. Here, how about this: If I chose an Android phone with a physical keyboard and T4 compatibility, which one is best?

Samsung will be releasing the Captivate Glide on AT&T in the near future (it was announced a couple of months ago), which will run Android and have a slide-out keyboard. I don't know about T4 compatibility, though, the website doesn't say anything yet.

Threefor
Nov 3, 2010
Country/Provider: United States, CA/ AT&T
Current contract status: I'm on a family plan with an upgrade for my line
Budget (phone/plan): Flexible
Features I know I want: Android, reliable and with reasonable battery life, slate
Features that would be nice: Root-able would be a definite plus as would expandable memory, minimal/removable carrier bloatware

My old iPhone 3G has been dying a slow and painful death for a while now and after it decided to wipe itself after I plugged it in to charge (what the gently caress?) it's finally time to dump that thing.

I know I want to go with an Android and I don't want to start off way behind the curve. ICS would be neat and I was hoping to hold out until the Galaxy Nexus is available for AT&T, but that looks pretty far off. Really, as long as whatever I end up with can keep up for a while, I'm not too worried about getting the newest bestest thing.

Mostly going to be using it for texting, browsing the internet and some gaming/media. I probably wouldn't bother right away, but I'd like the option to root it later on, so root-ability and community support (Cyanogenmod etc.) would be fantastic. Right now, I've been looking at the HTC Vivid and the SGSII. I only got a chance to play with them each for a minute and I liked the feel of HTC's UI better, but reviews seem a little mixed.

Are either of these a clear choice over the other? Or is there another phone out there that I may have overlooked?
tia

Threefor fucked around with this message at 07:18 on Nov 24, 2011

gardenald
Jul 23, 2007

In the end, it comes down to throwing one pitch after another, and seeing what happens. With each new consequence, the game begins to take shape.
Country/Provider: United States(Western Mass)/Sprint
Current contract status: The 2 years are up
Budget (phone/plan): Up to ~$150/$200 for the phone, $80ish/mo for the plan
Features I know I want: Man, I don't know. I want a smartphone with decent battery life, I guess? I've had a dumbphone forever, I don't know a thing about smartphones.

I live in a kind of rural area right now, but I'll be moving next spring. I've been perusing the major providers' websites, and I just have no idea what I should get.

Brigadier Sockface
Apr 1, 2007
I wasn't able to get a recommendation for my earlier request so I thought I'd simplify it:

Which windows phone/android GSM device do you believe to have the longest battery lifespan? (running conditions: No data, no syncing, no bluetooth and no apps running. Just telephone + mp3)

I have been tracking the release of the Huawei Honor with great interest because apparently its supposed to be an android phone with a battery than can last 3 days!

Duckman2008
Jan 6, 2010

TFW you see Flyers goaltending.
Grimey Drawer

gardenald posted:

Country/Provider: United States(Western Mass)/Sprint
Current contract status: The 2 years are up
Budget (phone/plan): Up to ~$150/$200 for the phone, $80ish/mo for the plan
Features I know I want: Man, I don't know. I want a smartphone with decent battery life, I guess? I've had a dumbphone forever, I don't know a thing about smartphones.

I live in a kind of rural area right now, but I'll be moving next spring. I've been perusing the major providers' websites, and I just have no idea what I should get.

If you like Sprint $79.99 is the base data plan, and you can probably get a discount based on wherever you work (i can verify it if you need to). Smartphone wise go with the Evo 3D, Epic Touch or iPhone 4S. Best 3 options on sprint phone wise.

Brigadier Sockface posted:

I wasn't able to get a recommendation for my earlier request so I thought I'd simplify it:

Which windows phone/android GSM device do you believe to have the longest battery lifespan? (running conditions: No data, no syncing, no bluetooth and no apps running. Just telephone + mp3)

I have been tracking the release of the Huawei Honor with great interest because apparently its supposed to be an android phone with a battery than can last 3 days!

Huwai is a kind of meh manufacturer, I wouldn't touch their stuff. Check out the HTC Radar/Titan on the winphone 7 side, android side I would think one of the dualcore phones, i just don't kow ATT's android lineup. If you are turning 3G and WiFi off any smartphone will last a hell of a lot of time. But if that's the case, I would buy a regular phone, pay less monthly and buy an iPod Touch with whatever storage you want. Or a smartphone and throw it in airplane mode if you hate apple.

Duckman2008 fucked around with this message at 03:10 on Nov 25, 2011

kbar
Aug 9, 2002

SpecialAgentCooper posted:

This is kind of useless for me - I really don't want or need an iPhone. Fair enough if it's a bad idea to go with Windows or Blackberry, but I just don't want or like Apple.
This is sort of a frustrating logic path because it's one that actually eschews logic. iPhones are the best phones for people who aren't smartphone enthusiasts. Period. They have the best software ecosystem, the best hardware build quality, and the poo poo doesn't just randomly break on you. If you can be honest with us and present a clear reason why an iPhone wouldn't be a good fit for you other than "I don't want or like the manufacturer of the best product," maybe we could work with you.

Godzilla already touched on it, but it bears repeating -- Windows Mobile devices were a living hell. Saying that you had to hack them to make them usable is generous, because you could spend hours screwing with the drat things and still have a miserable piece of poo poo that crashed when you got phone calls, was generally unresponsive, and completely sucked to use. Android and iOS rescued all of us from that terrible world and literally brought smartphones from "fringe toys for geeks with a lot of patience" to "absurdly useful for anyone."

As an enthusiast, I love Android. I think Google puts up with way too much bullshit from their hardware partners, because >90% of the Android phones in the marketplace are disgusting and shouldn't be used by anyone. What you saw on the Galaxy S was a miserable mask that Samsung haphazardly slops all over Android -- Samsung phones are really reprehensible out of the box. Ideally, nobody is ever forced to use a phone without CyanogenMod as it provides a speedy, flexible, comfortable baseline Android exprience. Most people just don't get to see it.

There are basically three good options here. Get an iPhone and stop trying to micromanage this area of your life toward optimization any further, do a bunch of reading up on CyanogenMod and get a low-cost device that supports it for a proper introduction to Android, or spend a bucket of money importing a Galaxy Nexus (the only current Android phone that's good out of the box) from the United Kingdom.

This advice is universally applicable to the overwhelming majority of posters in this thread, but somehow demands constant repitition.

Godzilla07
Oct 4, 2008

Threefor posted:

Country/Provider: United States, CA/ AT&T
Current contract status: I'm on a family plan with an upgrade for my line
Budget (phone/plan): Flexible
Features I know I want: Android, reliable and with reasonable battery life, slate
Features that would be nice: Root-able would be a definite plus as would expandable memory, minimal/removable carrier bloatware

My old iPhone 3G has been dying a slow and painful death for a while now and after it decided to wipe itself after I plugged it in to charge (what the gently caress?) it's finally time to dump that thing.

I know I want to go with an Android and I don't want to start off way behind the curve. ICS would be neat and I was hoping to hold out until the Galaxy Nexus is available for AT&T, but that looks pretty far off. Really, as long as whatever I end up with can keep up for a while, I'm not too worried about getting the newest bestest thing.

Mostly going to be using it for texting, browsing the internet and some gaming/media. I probably wouldn't bother right away, but I'd like the option to root it later on, so root-ability and community support (Cyanogenmod etc.) would be fantastic. Right now, I've been looking at the HTC Vivid and the SGSII. I only got a chance to play with them each for a minute and I liked the feel of HTC's UI better, but reviews seem a little mixed.

Are either of these a clear choice over the other? Or is there another phone out there that I may have overlooked?
tia

If you really want Android on AT&T, there's the regular Galaxy S II and the LTE phones. The regular Galaxy S II, not the Skyrocket should have good community support. Between the LTE phones, it's a toss-up. I wouldn't really expect the Skyrocket and Vivid to have good community support because of the oddball nature of the devices. Make sure you're happy with the device right when you get it as is on the LTE ones, if you choose to go that path.

Although to be honest, I'd get an iPhone 4S. Android is disappointing in the games department (they're all old iOS ports) and media (sound chipsets in Android phones aren't up to par). Yeah, the 3G sucked, but it's a three-year old device. The only other three-year old Android device is faring just as well right now.

gardenald posted:

Country/Provider: United States(Western Mass)/Sprint
Current contract status: The 2 years are up
Budget (phone/plan): Up to ~$150/$200 for the phone, $80ish/mo for the plan
Features I know I want: Man, I don't know. I want a smartphone with decent battery life, I guess? I've had a dumbphone forever, I don't know a thing about smartphones.

I live in a kind of rural area right now, but I'll be moving next spring. I've been perusing the major providers' websites, and I just have no idea what I should get.

If you've got decent Sprint coverage in your area, best idea is to stay with Sprint for your budget. Verizon however is $10/month more for with 450 minutes, unlimited texting and 2 GB of data (4 GB for LTE phones). Sprint's cheaper, while Verizon offers better data service on both 3G and 4G and better voice coverage.

As for phones, you've got the iPhone, Android and Windows Phone. Windows Phone is neat, and is good if you want the experience of iOS but you think that Steve Jobs really was the devil himself, or something similar.

Android has three upsides: complete customization, Gmail and Google Maps. The customization of Android means that you can do whatever you want with your phone. A million clocks on your homescreen, or cooler location-aware stuff (i.e. set my phone automatically to vibrate at work). The Gmail experience is exactly like that on the desktop, and works great if you're a heavy Gmail user. Google Maps and free turn-by-turn on Android is neat too.

The iPhone and iOS trade the customization for a guarantee that your phone just works. You don't have to hunt around for what app is causing your battery to drain in 6 hours in iOS, or screw around on a cesspool website to find the solution buried 20 pages deep. The other really big upside of iOS is the apps. The third-party apps are much, much better on iOS because they're simply developed for the platform. Most Android apps don't look very good in comparison to their iOS counterparts. The iPhone also gets better battery life and has a better camera, things like this because of Apple's complete control over the hardware.

The iPhone only has 3G on both carriers, but 4G battery life isn't very good at the moment. On Sprint, there's the Galaxy S II, the Evo 3D and the iPhone 4S. On Verizon, there's the iPhone 4S and Galaxy Nexus.

Brigadier Sockface posted:

I wasn't able to get a recommendation for my earlier request so I thought I'd simplify it:

Which windows phone/android GSM device do you believe to have the longest battery lifespan? (running conditions: No data, no syncing, no bluetooth and no apps running. Just telephone + mp3)

I have been tracking the release of the Huawei Honor with great interest because apparently its supposed to be an android phone with a battery than can last 3 days!

If you're basically going to use your phone as an iPod touch that can make phone calls, just get an iPod touch and a prepaid phone. The iPod will get a lot longer battery life on media playback and it will also get better battery life by simply not having to deal with a cellular radio.

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


kalibar posted:

What you saw on the Galaxy S was a miserable mask that Samsung haphazardly slops all over Android -- Samsung phones are really reprehensible out of the box.
Is this the general consensus regarding Android phones? By out of the box are you saying before any customization with respect to software? I ask because currently I am going to be picking up the Samsung Galaxy S II X from Canada's provider Telus and you seem incredibly critical of Samsung products.

Godzilla07
Oct 4, 2008

Corte posted:

Is this the general consensus regarding Android phones? By out of the box are you saying before any customization with respect to software? I ask because currently I am going to be picking up the Samsung Galaxy S II X from Canada's provider Telus and you seem incredibly critical of Samsung products.

Basically Samsung made the best argument for Android being the new Windows Mobile when they put out the U.S. variants of the Galaxy S. A filesystem that slowed the phone down hard over time, a GPS that was physically broken, and a bunch of weird Samsung poo poo that made it impossible for devs to get something like CyanogenMod onto the device for a very long time.

With the Telus Galaxy S II, make sure you're happy with the device as-is because you're not getting updates. The only thing it shares with the international Galaxy S II is the name. You'd be a lot better off with an iPhone 4S, or if you want to stick with Android, the Amaze 4G.

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


Godzilla07 posted:

Basically Samsung made the best argument for Android being the new Windows Mobile when they put out the U.S. variants of the Galaxy S. A filesystem that slowed the phone down hard over time, a GPS that was physically broken, and a bunch of weird Samsung poo poo that made it impossible for devs to get something like CyanogenMod onto the device for a very long time.

With the Telus Galaxy S II, make sure you're happy with the device as-is because you're not getting updates. The only thing it shares with the international Galaxy S II is the name. You'd be a lot better off with an iPhone 4S, or if you want to stick with Android, the Amaze 4G.
Well this is all news to me after posting here, reading and watching reviews on both products none of that was mentioned. Just to be clear Canada's Telus Galaxy S II variant is no different than any other North American version? I recall seeing that Android's upcoming OS update ICS had already been ported to a Galaxy S II phone but believe it was a UK version.

Hardware-wise I preferred the Galaxy S II X to the HTC Amaze 4 for several reasons:
-longer battery life
-larger screen with brighter colours
-more user activity on the xda-developers forums which I assumed would translate into more attention being given in terms of updates and apps

I can get either of those phones for free as well as the Blackberry Bold 9900 (though so far I've only heard critical things of the OS and how dated it is). The iPhone 4S on the other hand would cost $159.00 before tax so I'd need some convincing to even consider it.

edit: I mention those two Android phones because they are considered the top of the line for Telus but I can receive any of the phones found here for free: http://www.telusmobility.com/en/ON/smartphones/index.shtml

Levin fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Nov 25, 2011

Godzilla07
Oct 4, 2008

Corte posted:

Well this is all news to me after posting here, reading and watching reviews on both products none of that was mentioned. Just to be clear Canada's Telus Galaxy S II variant is no different than any other North American version? I recall seeing that Android's upcoming OS update ICS had already been ported to a Galaxy S II phone but believe it was a UK version.

Hardware-wise I preferred the Galaxy S II X to the HTC Amaze 4 for several reasons:
-longer battery life
-larger screen with brighter colours
-more user activity on the xda-developers forums which I assumed would translate into more attention being given in terms of updates and apps

I can get either of those phones for free as well as the Blackberry Bold 9900 (though so far I've only heard critical things of the OS and how dated it is). The iPhone 4S on the other hand would cost $159.00 before tax so I'd need some convincing to even consider it.

edit: I mention those two Android phones because they are considered the top of the line for Telus but I can receive any of the phones found here for free: http://www.telusmobility.com/en/ON/smartphones/index.shtml

The Galaxy S II on Telus (and the one on T-Mobile US too) are both radically different than every other Galaxy S II in existence. They both use Qualcomm SoCs, completely different than the Samsung SoC that's normally used. This pretty much throws aftermarket support out the window, and aftermarket support is a coin flip anyways these days. (Also, barely working ICS ports don't really count.)

Don't get the BlackBerry. There's no third-party development whatsoever for the platform these days, and RIM can't make anything with a touchscreen.

Reasons for the iPhone is that you'll get a phone that just works. The one downside to Android and the Wild West approach is poking around to find solutions. You don't have to do things such as find which errant app caused your battery to drain in 6 hours on the table, or search through a 20-page XDA thread for a solution to a problem. Third-party apps are also definitely better on the iPhone and iOS. There's a reason why you see third-party apps being paraded around on Apple ads. Plus Apple is able to get better hardware performance out of the iPhone due to the control they have, which results in things like better battery life and better camera performance.

If you go with the Android phones, make drat sure that you're happy with the phone out of the box for however long you plan on keeping the phone.

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


Godzilla07 posted:

If you go with the Android phones, make drat sure that you're happy with the phone out of the box for however long you plan on keeping the phone.
Thanks for the quick response and good advice but it feels like nothing outside of an iPhone is good enough in your opinion, which is not to say that you do not make legitimate points. Unfortunately I don't think I can afford to spend an extra $159. There is an iPhone 3S 8GB for free or iPhone 4 8GB for $49 but they are even more dated than the 4S.

Could you point me towards where you get your information regarding Android phones so I can see which are more likely to receive support and updates over the next couple years?

cycleback
Dec 3, 2004
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources
Any recommendations for an inexpensive non-smart phone with the following features?

AT&T Network (I am off contract and want to stay off contract)

Top priorities:
-Good call reception
-Good voice quality listening and speaking
-Bluetooth (Will work with a Plantronics Voyager Pro+)
-Cheap (I would like to keep this less than $100)

Secondary priorities:
-Port for wired headset
-Preferably small flip phone (I used to a Tracfone Motorola w376g which I liked the form factor)
-Preferably Quad band

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003



Corte posted:

Thanks for the quick response and good advice but it feels like nothing outside of an iPhone is good enough in your opinion, which is not to say that you do not make legitimate points. Unfortunately I don't think I can afford to spend an extra $159. There is an iPhone 3S 8GB for free or iPhone 4 8GB for $49 but they are even more dated than the 4S.
He's not saying there's nothing outside of the iPhone that is good enough (although for your desires, that may very well be the case). He's saying that the specific phone you are looking at is not as good a choice as the iPhone. He even specifically mentioned an alternative Android phone and also suggested Windows Phone 7.

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


Endless Mike posted:

He's not saying there's nothing outside of the iPhone that is good enough (although for your desires, that may very well be the case). He's saying that the specific phone you are looking at is not as good a choice as the iPhone. He even specifically mentioned an alternative Android phone and also suggested Windows Phone 7.
That last post did not offer an alternative to the iPhone 4S, the prior post suggests the HTC Amaze 4G at the end with no explanation as to why, I assume because it will receive better support than the Galaxy S II but can't say for sure. As for my desires I hadn't stated any that I recall but rather inquired about his criticism of Samsung's Android phones.

With respect to my desires I'd like to pick the best phone available to me within my budget which I've stated likely does not cover the iPhone 4S. He was critical of after market support for all Android phones which was good information to have and why I asked for direction as to where I could learn more myself.

I don't see where he suggested a Windows Phone 7. The only time Windows Mobile gets mentioned is when he suggests the North American Samsung Galaxy S II is causing the Android platform to be as terrible as the Windows Mobile has been.

I feel your post suggests that I am being critical or ungrateful for Godzilla07's replies, if so you're mistaken as I thanked him and asked for additional information.

Godzilla07
Oct 4, 2008

Corte posted:

Could you point me towards where you get your information regarding Android phones so I can see which are more likely to receive support and updates over the next couple years?

First off, there's a difference between the Galaxy S and Galaxy S II. The Galaxy S II has generally been well-received, whereas the Galaxy S was universally reviled by its owners in the U.S.

The Amaze is probably the best out of your options. It might not have a dev community, but HTC said the device would get updated to 4.0. However, who knows how long that will be. The Galaxy S II on Telus specifically doesn't have very much hope because the code is completely different, and Samsung doesn't have a good track record on updates to begin with.

If there's one thing to not count on, it's Android updates. Aftermarket support too is in a particularly shaky position at the moment for devices not named "Galaxy Nexus" because that's where pretty much everyone is headed.

Meldonox
Jan 13, 2006

Hey, are you listening to a word I'm saying?
I'm shopping around for phones and service, and it seems like it's best to wait for the Galaxy Nexus, but I have a general, no doubt naïve question:

Coverage being equal in an area, how in the hell do some of these companies manage to get away with being so much more expensive than the alternatives?

I can get a $30/mo plan with T-mobile for 100 minutes, 5GB data, unlimited text. That's perfect. I literally could not ask for better. That's more than enough minutes, plenty of text, adequate data. Unfortunately every other service out there forces me to pay that much for the data alone while forcing me to pay that again just for 450 minutes, then more for text. I've called Verizon and can't leverage my position as a long-time customer for poo poo all. Why are people anything but pissed that they're getting screwed so hard for pricing? It all reminds me of a time when I called Comcast to price internet and they told me how I'd be saving money if I blew an additional $30/mo for TV service then got defensive when I asked how it'd be saving money to spend more for additional features I wouldn't use.

Tying things in more closely with the topic, are there any plans out there that are competitive with T-mobile's $30/mo plan?

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


Godzilla07 posted:

First off, there's a difference between the Galaxy S and Galaxy S II. The Galaxy S II has generally been well-received, whereas the Galaxy S was universally reviled by its owners in the U.S.

The Amaze is probably the best out of your options. It might not have a dev community, but HTC said the device would get updated to 4.0. However, who knows how long that will be. The Galaxy S II on Telus specifically doesn't have very much hope because the code is completely different, and Samsung doesn't have a good track record on updates to begin with.

If there's one thing to not count on, it's Android updates. Aftermarket support too is in a particularly shaky position at the moment for devices not named "Galaxy Nexus" because that's where pretty much everyone is headed.
Sorry if I was unclear on the device, my question was about android after market support in general but I should have specified. This link suggests that the Samsung Galaxy S II X will receive the Android 4.0 ICS update in 2012: http://mobilesyrup.com/2011/11/24/telus-confirms-galaxy-s-ii-x-hercules-android-os-4-0-upgrade-will-be-available-in-2012/.

Unfortunately I'm not in a position to wait until the Galaxy Nexus is released in January.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006

Meldonox posted:

I'm shopping around for phones and service, and it seems like it's best to wait for the Galaxy Nexus, but I have a general, no doubt naïve question:

Coverage being equal in an area, how in the hell do some of these companies manage to get away with being so much more expensive than the alternatives?

I can get a $30/mo plan with T-mobile for 100 minutes, 5GB data, unlimited text. That's perfect. I literally could not ask for better. That's more than enough minutes, plenty of text, adequate data. Unfortunately every other service out there forces me to pay that much for the data alone while forcing me to pay that again just for 450 minutes, then more for text. I've called Verizon and can't leverage my position as a long-time customer for poo poo all. Why are people anything but pissed that they're getting screwed so hard for pricing? It all reminds me of a time when I called Comcast to price internet and they told me how I'd be saving money if I blew an additional $30/mo for TV service then got defensive when I asked how it'd be saving money to spend more for additional features I wouldn't use.

Tying things in more closely with the topic, are there any plans out there that are competitive with T-mobile's $30/mo plan?

I'm definitely not the expert most people in this thread seem to be, but if you don't mind not having a contract, Virgin Mobile offers $35 per month for 300 minutes, unlimited text, and unlimited data. I just dropped my expensive $48 per month, minutes-only AT&T plan, bought an LG Optimus V smartphone at Target at midnight this Black Friday (for $50), and signed on with Virgin Mobile. It seemed liked a great deal, and I've heard good things about them. Virgin uses the Sprint network, by the way.

ExcessBLarg!
Sep 1, 2001

Corte posted:

Sorry if I was unclear on the device, my question was abou android after market support in general but I should have specified.
Historically Samsung has been very, very behind on updates for their North American devices. Case in point: they released 20+ Eclair/Froyo, mostly SGS variants, on the US market alone and by the end of October only one had an official GB update--an incremental OS update that had originally shipped on Samsung hardware (the Nexus S) last december. As of today there's two or three devices with official GB updates, but the vast majority are still stuck on Froyo.

Put simply, that's unacceptable.

Worse, the GB updates Samsung is releasing aren't even good. After eight months of ROM leaks and testing, the Epic's official GB update was released with embarassingly bad (but simple to fix) GPS and other issues.

What it comes down to is that we can't count on Samsung for timely official updates. They will be behind HTC on rolling out ICS and that's a huge, unprecedented, important update. The "good news" is that Samsung's international devices do get updates somewhat timely and a lot of that can, unofficially, carry over to their NA counterparts. Unfortunately I don't think the msm-platform SGSII devices (Skyrocket, X, etc.) have an international counterpart, so you're kind of hosed.

Sorry I don't have a specific link to summarize this situation, but it's well known. To be specific, Samsung promised a Froyo update for the Epic by "end 2010" and it didn't happen until last March/April. They also promised a GB update by June or early July and didn't deliver until November. They've made similar broken promises on practically every other NA device they've released except the Nexus S, since that's really Google's baby.

kbar
Aug 9, 2002

kalibar, on phones:

ExcessBLarg! posted:

Historically Samsung has been very, very behind on updates for their North American devices.
I think you're too tolerant of this bullshit. Having to worry about whether or not x/y/z manufacturer bothered to release a lovely ROM with a new version of Android at some wildly inappropriate time is asking the wrong question. I got my buddy on an HTC Incredible in July because it's a mature CM7 device. Evidently HTC and Verizon just came out of the woodwork a couple weeks ago and released some gross Sense UI-based Gingerbread update for the Incredible -- a lot of tech blogs even praised them for it. I sent him a link to it when the story came out and we laughed because "hey look, HTC says you can use Gingerbread now." We laughed because this is not a reasonable way to own a smartphone.

The whole purchasing situation can be distilled into these options, and it's much simpler.

1. Buy a phone that is well-supported by the CyanogenMod project and learn how to get going with it on your own.
2. Buy a Nexus phone and get your updates from Google.
3. Buy an iPhone, because you want/need a smartphone but don't want/need a smartphone hobby.

Really, that's it. These are the three correct choices, and everything else is the objectively the wrong choice.

I roll my eyes when people come in here asking if whatever remarkably horrible Motorola shitbox-of-the-week with a locked bootloader is going to get Ice Cream Sandwich or whether Sense UI is a better choice than TouchWiz or which dual-core Android phone that runs like pigshit because of its preloaded malware they should replace their perfectly-fine 2010 phone (that is most-likely CM-capable by now) with.

The Galaxy S 1 situation is sort of delicate, but it's not difficult to understand. For about a year, the devices were an unreasonable abomination that should not be purchased by anyone. Do not give Samsung your money during this timeframe. Easy. Incidentally, some very talented developers drug those clusterfuck phones kicking and screaming into the wide world of AOSP, and now they are very good phones that can be purchased inexpensively secondhand and will run CyanogenMod very well. It is currently a great time to buy a Galaxy S 1, for many buyers. You can get them for a hundred bucks on craigslist because Samsung fooled a lot of people into signing horrible contracts for them, and those same people wanted a smartphone but accidentally purchased a hobby. Even better, you can avoid rewarding Samsung's bad behavior by not giving them money directly, which is a great thing. Take some of the money you saved and donate it to the EFF or to the specific developers who made the phone great.

If you are intent on signing a new contract and purchasing a new phone now, the only choices are iPhone 4/4S (depending on your needs), Galaxy Nexus, deeply-discounted CyanogenMod-friendly phones, and You Did It Wrong. This is universal.

Corte posted:

Could you point me towards where you get your information regarding Android phones so I can see which are more likely to receive support and updates over the next couple years?
Re: the Galaxy S II X, yeah, I'd avoid that poo poo like the plague unless it somehow emerges a year later as a favorite of the dev community. It's got the same mediocre DAC as the other SGSII phones (worse than iPods), and like EB! said, none of the aftermarket support. Buying it now would be very definition of buying a promise over a product, and Samsung is one of the last companies you want to make that bet with. The hardware is better than the Amaze's (as you observed); Samsung is really doing AMOLED displays well right now and it makes perfect sense to want one. I would advise just getting a different Samsung phone with an AMOLED display, because the II X is going to gently caress you.

If you actually need a high end phone now, your best is to cross-reference eBay completed listing values for the phones available to you, order a Galaxy Nexus from the UK (it will work on your carrier), and sell whatever turd Telus will give you for as much as you can to offset the expense. Because this is too much effort and expense for most people, a better bet might be to find a wireless plan that doesn't have a large subsidy built into it, switch to it, and then buy an inexpensive Nexus S or O.G. Galaxy S (Captivate/Fascinate/Vibrant) off of eBay/craigslist/HowardForums and load CyanogenMod on it. If you have to keep paying Telus for a contract plan with a subsidy built in (for some reason) then you'd want to collect-and-sell whichever of those devices will net you the most money, and still get a low cost phone like an O.G. Galaxy S with CyanogenMod -- which actually makes an incredible audio player; best Android audio player by a country mile -- while pocketing the difference.

If this is confusing, it's because this industry is loving disgusting.

kbar fucked around with this message at 11:16 on Nov 26, 2011

kbar
Aug 9, 2002

kalibar, on plans:

Meldonox posted:

Coverage being equal in an area, how in the hell do some of these companies manage to get away with being so much more expensive than the alternatives?

I can get a $30/mo plan with T-mobile for 100 minutes, 5GB data, unlimited text. That's perfect. I literally could not ask for better.
This is actually a really valid question, and I'm glad you brought it up. The $30 T-Mobile plan is kind of a game-changer because it caters to a more tech-savvy demographic who either (a) doesn't have any friends/family and uses no voice minutes anyway, or (b) uses some WiFi/VoIP solution for most of their long calls and therefore doesn't need many mobile minutes. I fall very squarely into the latter category, but the drawbacks of T-Mobile make it non-viable for me.

T-Mobile drawbacks:
  • The biggest for me is data coverage. In Colorado at least, T-Mobile's data coverage outside of cities is still really embarassing -- you're looking at EDGE data on pretty much any highway, and EDGE is basically useless at highway speeds. Even within cities, I found several spots where I was missing coverage that my friends on the other networks had it. This won't be a dealbreaker for everyone and coverage obviously varies greatly by location, but out here their UMTS was notably lacking (and their coverage maps don't tell an accurate story). Essentially, make sure it works for you.

  • No subsidy, so it's bring-your-own-phone. This is a good thing if you're willing to get yourself an older device secondhand (or even new-in-box from a reputable seller). But my share of a 5-line Verizon plan is $47.60/month for everything I need, and that includes a device subsidy which I would say carries a fair market value of $10.50/month (carriers will tell you it's worth $400, but they're lying assholes that generate slanted numbers to make signing a contract look like a good idea). So this'll vary by person, but for me, the T-Mobile plan is only $7.10/month less than what I'm paying now, and that includes a downgrade to a lesser-quality network in my area.

  • For a large majority of people, 100 total minutes is nowhere near enough. No "night minutes," no "weekend minutes," no "mobile to mobile minutes," no "fave five" minutes -- just minutes. You basically have to shift your usage pattern from "I have a cellphone" to "I am able to contact people in case of emergency." As an example, the lowest-volume user on my plan last month used only 47 "anytime" minutes but 283 total minutes. His bill on that T-Mobile plan would have been $48.30.

  • Compared to T-Mobile's no-subsidy "Value" plans which can be split with up to 5 people, the $30 plan is less impressive. On Value, you can cut out text messaging and use 2GB of HSPA+ data instead of the $30 plan's 5GB to whittle those plans down as low as $23/month+tax per line for a bigger minutes bucket (1000 anytime shared with free N/W).

The biggest thing is that T-Mobile offers less-expensive plans because they're sort of a lesser carrier. If they work where you need them to (and they work in a lot of places), they're pretty great. Given that you can import a pentaband Galaxy Nexus that's T-Mobile friendly, it's actually possible to even use them and have the best phone out there, so that's groovy as well.

The long and short of the other guys is that Sprint is basically a ripoff in almost any scenario, and Verizon and AT&T charge probably a little bit too much -- and if you're not using Google Voice for free texting, they charge way too much. AT&T's a better value for iPhone customers using GV, Verizon's got a solid 3G network and far and away the best deployment of LTE. AT&T will cost you $65/month for voice and 2GB, Verizon will cost you $70/month for voice and 4GB. Both carriers include a subsidy that's worth "about" $10.50/month, both carriers have many available employer discounts that can knock the price down a few more bucks, and both carriers will let you split plans up to five ways to maximize your savings.

If I had to issue a blanket statement I'd say that AT&T and Verizon are probably about a wash for value for most people and that T-Mobile is easily the better choice if they work well in your area.


Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:

I'm definitely not the expert most people in this thread seem to be, but if you don't mind not having a contract, Virgin Mobile offers $35 per month for 300 minutes, unlimited text, and unlimited data. I just dropped my expensive $48 per month, minutes-only AT&T plan, bought an LG Optimus V smartphone at Target at midnight this Black Friday (for $50), and signed on with Virgin Mobile. It seemed liked a great deal, and I've heard good things about them. Virgin uses the Sprint network, by the way.
The very existence of the Virgin Mobile deal is kind of cool, but it's sort of targeting a specific customer. The fact that you can get something as capable as an LG Optimus this inexpensively is a monument to how far we've come, but honestly, you couldn't pay me to use one of them when stuff like Nexus One, Nexus S, O.G. Galaxy S, HTC Incredible, and iPhone 4 are so inexpensive. The inability to activate whatever CDMA phone you want on Virgin is also a downer.

My friend in San Francisco spent a few months on Virgin with an Optimus V (after about a year on Sprint), and he had a lot of network-specific trouble that he didn't have on Sprint. Data went out for a few days at a time, support was nonexistent, and he had speed issues that he didn't have when he was paying Sprint proper. Our theory is that Sprint throttles the poo poo out of Virgin traffic or somehow delegates them it to second-class citizen status, but we don't have anything concrete to back that up. The plan is definitely an interesting proposition, but it's one that supposes you're "interested enough to have a smartphone," but "not interested enough to have a particularly good or reliable one." I struggle with the use case.

kbar fucked around with this message at 11:25 on Nov 26, 2011

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


kalibar posted:

The whole purchasing situation can be distilled into these options, and it's much simpler.
Whole post was fantastic but loved how you boiled it down there. From what I've read CyanogenMod so far is the thing to have if your phone won't be receiving worthwhile support. Unfortunately neither of the high end Android models provided by Telus are supported which is frustrating.

I'm becoming convinced that I need to go with the iPhone 4 8GB for $49 if CyanogenMod won't support one of those devices. That being the case I may have to determine if the $110 additional cost makes the 4S worth doing.

This whole experience makes me yearn for the Galaxy Nexus to be released sooner on Telus but then again it will likely still be costly with a three year contract.

kalibar posted:

I edited to address your stuff more specifically, not sure if you caught it.
Very helpful and thank you for addressing me directly. I do feel like I'm getting overwhelmed with the amount of information to sift through and understand. I found this thread in the CM forums that suggests work is being done to port CM to the T-mobile version of the SGSII which is similar to Telus' SGSIIX if it makes a difference: http://forum.cyanogenmod.com/topic/33547-samsung-galaxy-s-ii-t-mobile-sgh-t989/page__hl__samsung%20galaxy%20hercules__st__120.

I like your idea to grab the phone with the best resale value to sell and then pick up a cheaper, older, more reliable and officially supported Cmod phone but it does require extra effort on my part. Unfortunately I am stuck with Telus as a provider and their hardware options in terms of upgrading from my current phone. However the resale option does allow me to consider any phone that can be unlocked on the network instead of being limited to Telus' line of hardware.

Levin fucked around with this message at 11:46 on Nov 26, 2011

kbar
Aug 9, 2002

I edited to address your stuff more specifically, not sure if you caught it.

Levin
Jun 28, 2005


kalibar posted:

an O.G. Galaxy S with CyanogenMod -- which actually makes an incredible audio player; best Android audio player by a country mile
-----
If this is confusing, it's because this industry is loving disgusting.
Replied to your edit with my own but this stuck out at me. Your point that the Galaxy S is a superior audio player caught my eye but again I'm stuck with a model on Telus unsupported by CyanogenMod. I suppose I could sell off the model with the best resale value and hunt for a Galaxy S model that is supported.

Reading more it seems there is demand for official CyanogenMod support of the T-mobile SGH-T989 which is looking like it will get taken care of. It seems like the SGH-T989D is similar enough that it will be able to run any ports from the SGH-T989. I'm wondering if this news would change your opinion at all.

Edit: If this is a lot of work and/or too much of a headache the Nexus S is available on Telus which is CM supported and will likely receive an official ICS port quicker than anything else.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006

kalibar posted:

The very existence of the Virgin Mobile deal is kind of cool, but it's sort of targeting a specific customer. The fact that you can get something as capable as an LG Optimus this inexpensively is a monument to how far we've come, but honestly, you couldn't pay me to use one of them when stuff like Nexus One, Nexus S, O.G. Galaxy S, HTC Incredible, and iPhone 4 are so inexpensive. The inability to activate whatever CDMA phone you want on Virgin is also a downer.

My friend in San Francisco spent a few months on Virgin with an Optimus V (after about a year on Sprint), and he had a lot of network-specific trouble that he didn't have on Sprint. Data went out for a few days at a time, support was nonexistent, and he had speed issues that he didn't have when he was paying Sprint proper. Our theory is that Sprint throttles the poo poo out of Virgin traffic or somehow delegates them it to second-class citizen status, but we don't have anything concrete to back that up. The plan is definitely an interesting proposition, but it's one that supposes you're "interested enough to have a smartphone," but "not interested enough to have a particularly good or reliable one." I struggle with the use case.

I guess I'm kind of that guy. I didn't want the expense of an iPhone, either the up-front cost or the $80+ a month phone and data plan. Do you think I made a huge mistake, going with Virgin Mobile and the Optimus V?

ExcessBLarg!
Sep 1, 2001

Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:

Do you think I made a huge mistake, going with Virgin Mobile and the Optimus V?
If you regularly need between 150-300 voice minutes a month, VM is your best bet plan wise. The Optimus V is a bit dated these days, but if you're happy with the phone there's nothing inherently wrong with it.

And no, it can't be a "huge mistake". VM is contract-less prepaid so whenever you find the service inadequate and want to switch you just, well, switch. If anything, you might lose some cash if you purchased the Optimus V new, but if you picked it up new it's quite possible you could sell it on eBay for around the same amount you purchased it.

Super Aggro Crag
Apr 23, 2008




And, of course as always, kill Hitler.


I was playing around with my friend's new Droid last night and it finally convinced me to man up and get a real smartphone. I was looking at the Galaxy S II Skyrocket and noticed its only for AT&T so I might have to finally get off my family's family plan for T-Mobile and get this, if its worth it over the regular Galaxy S II. I know that the Skyrocket is 4G LTE while the regular one is not LTE. How much of a different does this make speed wise?

I don't make too many phone calls, yet I text a lot. I've had unlimited texting ever since I got my first cellphone. Is it true that only T-Mobile still offers unlimited texting? What would be a good plan for me if I do indeed switch to AT&T and plan on sending and receiving a lot of texts?

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003



Read everything kalibar posted above, as it applies to the Skyrocket, as well.

In terms of data speeds, LTE is faster in real-world use than T-Mobile's HSPA+ unless you happen to live in an area with their 42 Mbps network (LTE seems to see right around half that), and probably even then. AT&T caps data, though, so you can run through it pretty quickly at those speeds (T-Mobile throttles while AT&T charges you more).

As far as texting goes, you're not exactly right. Everyone offers unlimited texting, it's just that T-Mobile and Sprint include in your standard plan (in most/all plans, anyway). AT&T and Verizon charge $20 for the privilege. Verizon also offers 1000 texts for $10. If you're switching carriers, get a new number with the new carrier and port your current number to Google Voice. It'll get you free, unlimited texts on any smartphone (well, iPhone, Android, and WP7, anyway), as well as some other benefits, provided you're connected to data.

qalnor
Sep 22, 2003

my question implies my answer quid pro vis-a-ergo hoc hominem whores
So I've never had a smartphone before, just some lovely thing that only makes and receives cellular calls, but for one reason (peer pressure) or another (envy) I've decided to give in and am considering buying one. I've narrowed things down to AT&T or Verizon -- they seem to be about the same cost the way I'm likely to use them (AT&T is somewhat cheaper, but I get a corporate discount of 15% off the phone portion if I use Verizon and this puts it at about $5/mo more than AT&T). I'm leaning towards Verizon slightly because for roughly the same cost I'll get twice the bandwidth.

The reason for my immediate interest in getting on board with the 21st century is that Amazon is giving away the best phones for free. I haven't seen their deal mentioned here, but I tend to assume that's because most of you aren't new customers and it seems to be primarily aimed at harvesting the souls of people like me.

With that background information stated, I have two (2.5) questions:

1. Does anyone know anything wrong with the Amazon deal? I can't find anyone saying that there are any drawbacks to it, but like I said I also haven't seen a lot of people talking about it except as news items.

2a. Ignoring the OS itself is there any overwhelming reason why I should hold out for google's phone?

2b. Considering the OS issue is there an overwhelming reason why I should hold out for google's phone? (Waiting ~6 months is not an overwhelming reason, but if there's something I'm missing I do want to hear it).

Obviously paying $200-300 upfront isn't a huge deal compared to the cost of a contract over the course of a couple of years, but neither is it entirely insignificant.

Anyhow, thanks much in advance.

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003



1. The main drawback is that you have to be starting a new line. If you're already a Verizon or AT&T customer, you'd have to start a second line to get that deal.

2a/b. The main thing here is that it will always be the most up to date phone in terms of software (or will for the next year or so, at any rate - it might lag behind slightly when its follow-up is eventually released). This is actually a pretty big deal when you compare to other phones that you never know when or even if an update will come.

chiz
Sep 28, 2002
I live in Mass. USA, looking for a decent $25/$30 a month phone.

I don't really call a lot of people but I'd like to have phone and text capabilities. I saw one at a Cumberland Farms convenience store that I was gonna get, it's forty bucks, but are there better options as far as phones go?

I'd pay more for a better phone at the start but I'd really only like to pay about thirty a month

Duckman2008
Jan 6, 2010

TFW you see Flyers goaltending.
Grimey Drawer

chiz posted:

I live in Mass. USA, looking for a decent $25/$30 a month phone.

I don't really call a lot of people but I'd like to have phone and text capabilities. I saw one at a Cumberland Farms convenience store that I was gonna get, it's forty bucks, but are there better options as far as phones go?

I'd pay more for a better phone at the start but I'd really only like to pay about thirty a month

Check TMobile and Sprint coverage in your area.

TMobile has a $30 plann that is on unlimited text and data (internet gets slowed if you use a lot) and you can toss any phone you want on it, even smartphones. The catch is you buy the phone outright.

Virgin uses sprint towers (no roaming) and has a plan that is $35 a month, 300 minutes, unlimited text and data.

Oherwise, Net 10 uses either Verizon or AT&T, and is $0.10 a minute, $0.05 a text, and you can buy minutes in buckets of 300 ($30). Minutes last up to 3 months. If you are looking to text a lot i would go with TMobile or Virgin.

Qublai Qhan
Dec 23, 2008


In Xanadu did Qublai Qhan
a stately taco eat,
when ALF the spacerat,
ran through to talk--
Of cabbages and kings
And whether pigs have wings.
Hey just a quick question about phone plans... Is it somehow possible to get a prepaid plan on a smart-phone? I assume you'd have to buy the phone at full price or wait out the contract, but it seems like you could restrict the subscription to data since I don't think there are prepaid data plans, and get a prepaid subscription for the voice end but I don't actually know?

kbar
Aug 9, 2002

craigslist, Nexus S, T-Mobile prepaid, dance all night

ShimmyGuy
Jan 12, 2008

One morning, Shimmy awoke to find he was a awesome shiny bug.
Country/Provider: USA

Current contract status: None

Budget (phone/plan): $100-200/ $50-100

Features I know I want:
~I personally really would enjoy to have a smartphone, preferably a android.
~The more I can customize the phone the better.
~I plan on spending allot of time surfing the web/streaming off sites like pandora for music so a high data plan would be nice.
~Ability to put my own music on the phone and listen with reasonable quality.
~A camera with good picture quality, I would love to be able to finally take pictures of poo poo!

ShimmyGuy fucked around with this message at 07:46 on Nov 28, 2011

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Duckman2008
Jan 6, 2010

TFW you see Flyers goaltending.
Grimey Drawer

Ingenium posted:

Country/Provider: USA

Current contract status: None

Budget (phone/plan): $100-200/ $50-100

Features I know I want:
~I personally really would enjoy to have a smartphone, preferably a android.
~The more I can customize the phone the better.
~I plan on spending allot of time surfing the web/streaming off sites like pandora for music so a high data plan would be nice.
~Ability to put my own music on the phone and listen with reasonable quality.
~A camera with good picture quality, I would love to be able to finally take pictures of poo poo!

Here are your options:
Verizon: $39.99 for 450 talk, $30 for data equals $69.99. Data is capped at 2GB, although they were running a promo for 4GB of data recently. Texting is $20 for unlimite, don't pay this, just use Google Voice for free. Verizon easily has the best internet speeds.

ATT: $39.99 for 450 Talk, $25 for data equals $64.99. Data capped at 2GB. Same principle with texting. Both plans if you go over the cap its $10 per Gig.

Sprint: 69.99 EPRP, includes 450 mins, unlimited texting and unlimited data (no caps). Note that it includes unlimited calling to ANY cell phone, while those VZ and ATT plans only include calling to their respective members. Sprint data has been getting hammered lately, but honestly its been fine for me overall, and I stream music via RDio all day long while driving with few problems.

TMobile: check on them, I think its $60 and you get 2GBs of data, after that they throttle you. Their plans have changed so often its hard to keep up. If you don't call at all they have a $30 prepaid plan with 2GBs of data, unlimited text and 100 minutes.

Note: depending on where you work, you could get a discount on these plans (Sprint I already factored one in, its easy to get one there).

Phones!
Big Red: Galay Nexus. That is THE phone to buy, and would fit you perfectly

ATT: Actually not sure on them. Unlocked Galaxy Nexus if you can afford it.

Sprint: HTC Evo 3D or Samsung Epic Touch. Personally I still love the 3D.

TMobile: Newest HTC phone or unlocked Galaxy Nexus

Duckman2008 fucked around with this message at 14:06 on Nov 28, 2011

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