|
Dolemite posted:Just out of curiosity: So let's say after I brew my big beer and bottle it I'll have a yeast cake to harvest. At this point, the yeast will have been used brew a third batch of beer. At what point is the yeast not suitable for washing and harvesting? I'd imagine that after X amount of batches, the yeast will mutate enough from fermentations that it's too far mutated to produce good tasting beer. The general rule is to not reuse yeast from high gravity beers. If you wash and rinse, you should be able to reuse it for many generations, plenty of people go 15+ successive harvests. I normally just add distilled water to cake and do a mini-wash and keep the first decanting. I have 4 strains going since early 2011. 1968 was used in two 6%ABV porters and my 10.5% RIS. I harvested from the RIS and plan to reuse it, I don't forsee any problems.
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 19:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 03:20 |
|
|
Kegs and equipment just showed up. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 20:08
|
|
|
silver97232 posted:
Pardon my ignorance, but why not just push through the uncarbed beer through the picnic tap/bottling wand into bottles with carb tabs, and let the beer condition in the bottle, and forcecarb the balance? Why bottle after the forced carbonation?
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 20:26
|
|
|
Jo3sh posted:Sort of the opposite, actually - in Belgians, a lot of the character comes from the reproductive phase. This is actually true in a lot of strains, but it's especially true in Belgians. If you overpitch, the yeast will skip (or dramatically shorten) the reproductive phase and will get right to fermenting, and you miss out on the spicy, estery flavor you want. In short, overpitching can lead to bland beer - not so much off-flavors as lack of flavor. No kidding, I didn't know that the reproductive phase contributes flavors. I thought it was only the active converting of sugars to alcohol that did everything. Cool bit of knowledge to to pick up.  I guess it's time to check out some Quad recipes on Home Brew Talk. Definitely not looking to brew up a bland beer. tesilential posted:The general rule is to not reuse yeast from high gravity beers. Not using yeast from high gravity beers is also good to know. I assume that's because the yeast have been stressed from converting so much sugar into alcohol? Also stoked that I can use yeast for that many generations. That's going to add up to a lot of savings. P.S. Your stout you sent me home with at the Goon Meet is insanely awesome. Great chocolate flavors and the whole thing felt really balanced to me. --- One more yeast chat question: Do we have any brewers in here with bread / dough making experience? I'm planning to make some pizza dough this weekend and I'd like to actually use some of my harvested Belgian yeast instead of bread yeast. Has anyone ever baked with beer yeast? Does anything change in the process of baking versus bread yeast? If this works, it's going to feel pretty  having Belgian crusted pizza with my Belgian homebrews.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 20:41
|
|
|
Dolemite posted:I guess it's time to check out some Quad recipes on Home Brew Talk. Definitely not looking to brew up a bland beer. Look at rage-saq's post history in this thread. He's completely obsessed with brewing quads and I think he's linked his recipe archive at least once
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 20:46
|
|
|
Bleston Humenthal posted:Pardon my ignorance, but why not just push through the uncarbed beer through the picnic tap/bottling wand into bottles with carb tabs, and let the beer condition in the bottle, and forcecarb the balance? Why bottle after the forced carbonation? It's a bit more precise, reduces oxygen exposure, and who knows: maybe you want to send this beer into a competition, maybe you want to give some to a friend and you don't want to give your friend a growler they would have to drink within the next week and all at once. Maybe you only have a gallon or two left and you want to get it out of the keg for your next batch. etc. If you were kegging just to bottle that would be weird and too much effort
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 20:47
|
|
|
Docjowles posted:Look at rage-saq's post history in this thread. He's completely obsessed with brewing quads and I think he's linked his recipe archive at least once So beaten on this. I brewed a quad from his recipe and it loving rocks. Here's the recipe I derived from his: http://hopville.com/recipe/546097/belgian-dark-strong-ale-recipes/the-iconoclast
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 21:03
|
|
|
Darth Goku Jr posted:It's a bit more precise, reduces oxygen exposure Oxygen exposure should be the same or less, no? I guess I can understand wanting to bottle beer that's already carbed for the reasons you describe, but I don't know that reduced oxygen exposure is one of the reasons. If I know I want to give away some beer, I usually just do the process I described. I guess it does mean that you don't get a chance to taste it carbed before you give it away, but it works pretty well for me. As far as having a gallon or two left and needing the keg, I usually just drink it. Take one for the team and all. The wife is usually super impressed with my methodology.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 21:33
|
|
|
Bleston Humenthal posted:Oxygen exposure should be the same or less, no? No, a beer gun has a mechisim that blows CO2 into the bottle thus purging [practically] of all oxygen. quote:I guess it does mean that you don't get a chance to taste it carbed before you give it away, but it works pretty well for me. If it works well enough for you then don't let any of us idiots talk you out of it. But there are other reasons. To me the biggest is that my keg bottled beer lacks sediment that bottle conditioning creates. I don't need the yeast in the bottle to condition so it's simply cleaner. I don't have to worry about being careful when I pour. This is especially nice when I go to club or other meets where you're pouring ~1oz a person or less (the main reason I do any bottling these days). My clean sparking beers (that I cold crash) don't have to worry about being clouded up with the successive tilting and sloshing around in the bottle. But the most noticeable I think is consistency. Bottling form bottle to bottle isn't always carbed the same due to several factors.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 21:52
|
|
|
Jo3sh posted:Sort of the opposite, actually - in Belgians, a lot of the character comes from the reproductive phase. This is actually true in a lot of strains, but it's especially true in Belgians. If you overpitch, the yeast will skip (or dramatically shorten) the reproductive phase and will get right to fermenting, and you miss out on the spicy, estery flavor you want. In short, overpitching can lead to bland beer - not so much off-flavors as lack of flavor. so beer tastes better when yeasts gently caress in it? Is that what we're saying? chiz fucked around with this message at 22:02 on Jan 11, 2012 |
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 21:58
|
|
|
Dolemite posted:One more yeast chat question: Do we have any brewers in here with bread / dough making experience? I've baked a fair amount although I can't say I've used fermenter slurry in bread. Bread yeast and beer yeast are both S. cerevisae, so you might get something out of it, but bread yeast strains are selected for their ability to eat some longer sugars than beer yeast can. I would try a sample batch before I committed to doing it for guests or something. Worst case, you can chuck in a packet of active dry as well. chiz posted:so beer tastes better when yeasts gently caress in it? Is that what we're saying? Well, it's asexual budding, not sexual reproduction, so maybe it's more accurate to say beer tastes better when yeast wank off in the wort, but basically yes. Nice glass of yeast spoo you have there, pal.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2012 22:06
|
|
|
Ahahaha, okay, so I am not really a brewing newbie, but I made a pretty good newbie mistake. Was bottling MY GIRLFRIEND's first batch of beer and we forgot to put the priming sugar in! Jesus christ. Anyway the best approach to me right now seems to be to uncap and add a spritz of sugar to each bottle? It's an extract Honey Nut Brown ale from Northern Brewer. I have the 5oz bag of priming sugar, could I just dilute that like normal and then add equal portions to each uncapped bottle and then bottle again? Either that or just magically hope there were unfermented sugars in each bottle, or just say it's like an 'english pub style' and say it's not supposed to be carbonated??
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 00:59
|
|
|
Might be easier to get some carb tabs and use those.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 01:03
|
|
|
Yeah, short of an eye dropper I don't know how to ensure equal distribution. Is there a certain name brand I should look for, or is that just a generic thing most brew supply stores will have? How about the amount to put in bombers vs. 12 oz bottles?
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 01:12
|
|
|
global tetrahedron posted:Yeah, short of an eye dropper I don't know how to ensure equal distribution. Is there a certain name brand I should look for, or is that just a generic thing most brew supply stores will have? How about the amount to put in bombers vs. 12 oz bottles? I think the most popular brand is Coopers. Should have instructions on the package, but I would wager that you'll use twice as many tabs in a bomber as in a 12 oz.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 01:16
|
|
|
Jo3sh posted:Bread yeast and beer yeast are both S. cerevisae, so you might get something out of it, but bread yeast strains are selected for their ability to eat some longer sugars than beer yeast can. Next brewday I'm trying this. I usually make some bread or pizza dough with the spent grains anyway. Will report back.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 02:04
|
|
|
So it's been 1-2 months since I bottled my botched Russian Imperial Stout, which is now more of a Bittersweet stout thanks to some trouble with the wort. It actually came out still drinkable, and a few people of told me they really enjoyed it; however, I can't help but notice a sort of banana-y taste to it that comes along with the sweetness. It has been getting slightly more pronounced over time, but it's not necessarily an "off" flavor. Just unexpected, especially since the recipe was rather simple. Any idea what this could be? I haven't gotten any uneven or excessive carbonation so far, so it doesn't seem like an infection. Edit: Here's the recipe: Kraven Moorhed posted:6.6 lb. Dark LME Kraven Moorhed fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Jan 12, 2012 |
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 02:47
|
|
|
Kraven Moorhed posted:So it's been 1-2 months since I bottled my botched Russian Imperial Stout, which is now more of a Bittersweet stout thanks to some trouble with the wort. It actually came out still drinkable, and a few people of told me they really enjoyed it; however, I can't help but notice a sort of banana-y taste to it that comes along with the sweetness. It has been getting slightly more pronounced over time, but it's not necessarily an "off" flavor. Just unexpected, especially since the recipe was rather simple. What temperatures did you pitch and ferment at?
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 03:47
|
|
|
Also, what's the yeast?
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 04:01
|
|
|
Jacobey000 posted:Just because you buy shinny things doesn't exactly mean you aren't "as serious" as anyone else. I've got a 5gal pot, use a $5 bottle filler, do extract brewing still, but I still spend most of my waking hours reading about beer. Just because I don't have money to blow doesn't mean I'm not serious. indigi posted:Not really, if you're serious about bottling beer you'll tinker with your process, using whichever equipment you choose (the wand I use cost about ~$3 and the O2 absorbing bottle caps are an extra few pennies a go), til you get it right. Bottling isn't an all-grain/extract, cheap/expensive debate, packaging is the last step of the brewing process, the beer is vulnerable your only job is to get it in there without O2 or contaminants. If you read industry texts they focus a lot on packaging because it's so critical to long term flavor stability. Even when breweries bottle condition they still purge the bottles with CO2, often times twice before filling. There are places to skimp out on, my HLT is made from a $20 Rubbermaid trash can, my fittings are brass, but packaging is really important. O2 absorbing caps are great, but they only scrub oxygen out of the headspace, not the dissolved O2 that gets in the beer if you don't purge with CO2. You go through all the hassle(fun) of brewday, expense of a batch, through fermentation, conditioning, why not bottle in a way that protects your work?
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 04:24
|
|
|
I've bottled every single beer I've made with a tap and bottling wand and never had a problem. In fact everyone I know who still bottles uses the same method and we have never had any issues with oxidation or infection. I don't see how this makes us "less serious" about homebrewing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 04:46
|
|
|
silver97232 posted:Bottling isn't an all-grain/extract, cheap/expensive debate, packaging is the last step of the brewing process, the beer is vulnerable your only job is to get it in there without O2 or contaminants. If you read industry texts they focus a lot on packaging because it's so critical to long term flavor stability. Even when breweries bottle condition they still purge the bottles with CO2, often times twice before filling. There are places to skimp out on, my HLT is made from a $20 Rubbermaid trash can, my fittings are brass, but packaging is really important. I just use a picnic tap with a bottling wand (minus spring and tip) jammed into it. You are right that the beer gun works better, but if I was serious I could purge the bottles with co2 just using a length of hose and get the benefits of the gun without the $75 price tag.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 05:16
|
|
|
tesilential posted:What temperatures did you pitch and ferment at? Pitched at 70 and fermented between 68-72-ish. Fluctuation didn't happen too often and it was gradual as I kept it in a bathroom in my basement. As for the yeast, I must confess that I don't know. The sheet for the kit simply lists it as a sachet of yeast, and by the time I realized I should've recorded it the packet was long gone. It was a Brewer's Best Russian Imperial Stout kit if that helps at all.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 05:53
|
|
|
Kraven Moorhed posted:Pitched at 70 and fermented between 68-72-ish. Fluctuation didn't happen too often and it was gradual as I kept it in a bathroom in my basement. As for the yeast, I must confess that I don't know. The sheet for the kit simply lists it as a sachet of yeast, and by the time I realized I should've recorded it the packet was long gone. It was a Brewer's Best Russian Imperial Stout kit if that helps at all. If that is actual wort temp then it is just a little high. Anything over 68* and dry yeast is pushing it. I like to ferment most neutral ales at 62-66*, maybe hitting 68* after 24 hours of visible activity. Anything over 70* with generic dry yeast is very likely to produce off flavors you don't want. I'd expect you are tasting esters and fusel alcohols as a result of the warmer fermentation. Use a swamp cooler or something to get your temps a few degrees cooler, it makes a HUGE difference. If 68-72* was the ambient air temp then your fermentation was almost certainly very hot and that's why you are getting off flavors.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 06:03
|
|
|
silver97232 posted:O2 absorbing caps are great, but they only scrub oxygen out of the headspace, not the dissolved O2 that gets in the beer if you don't purge with CO2. You can purge with CO2 without a beer gun though
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 07:19
|
|
|
Honestly it's not necessary to purge with CO2 when bottling from the keg if you do it right. I do the bottling wand tube jammed into picnic tap method and have never had any problems. You just need to make sure you cap on foam. Fill the bottle slightly less than full then pull the bottling wand out and give it a few pulls to make the beer foam up out of the bottle. This makes sure all the oxygen is out. It takes some practice to get the fill level right but once you do it works great.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 08:11
|
|
|
tesilential posted:If that is actual wort temp then it is just a little high. Anything over 68* and dry yeast is pushing it. I like to ferment most neutral ales at 62-66*, maybe hitting 68* after 24 hours of visible activity. The temp I listed was for the fermenter via a stick-on thermometer. I also had another thermometer for ambient temperatures, and it was generally a few degrees colder. You do raise a good point though. My brew before this was kept at 65-ish for most of the time and came out perfectly. My cooling system was a pain in the rear end (needed to dump the water reservoir on the AC unit every 4-ish hours) so I did without it this time, hoping the weather would be cold enough to keep it low. Didn't think the change in temp would do as much as it did. This kit was a gift, whereas I normally get stuff from my local store which keeps a fridge stocked with yeast cultures. I'll try that next time in addition to tinkering with coolant systems. Swamp cooler might be the way to go. Speaking of next time, I'm currently trying to decide what to do for my next batch. Doing a barley wine is something I've always wanted to try and, since they take some extra time to age, I'd rather do it sooner than later; on the other hand, I still haven't made the jump to all-grain brewing. Would it be a wasted effort to try for one doing partial grain? If not, does anyone have an example of a recipe I could work with? The local store doesn't have a barley wine kit, only a toned-down English strong ale. They do, however, have quite the selection of ingredients. Kraven Moorhed fucked around with this message at 09:44 on Jan 12, 2012 |
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 09:42
|
|
|
Docjowles posted:Look at rage-saq's post history in this thread. He's completely obsessed with brewing quads and I think he's linked his recipe archive at least once Jo3sh posted:So beaten on this. I brewed a quad from his recipe and it loving rocks. Thanks guys. And whoa - the Iconoclast recipe looks awesome! I might just up and brew this! Jo3sh posted:I've baked a fair amount although I can't say I've used fermenter slurry in bread. Bread yeast and beer yeast are both S. cerevisae, so you might get something out of it, but bread yeast strains are selected for their ability to eat some longer sugars than beer yeast can. I would try a sample batch before I committed to doing it for guests or something. Worst case, you can chuck in a packet of active dry as well. Good point - I could buy a packet of baker's yeast to supplement the yeast from the slurry. I wonder if the Belgian tastes will come through enough if I use the two yeasts in the same recipe. wafflesnsegways posted:Next brewday I'm trying this. I usually make some bread or pizza dough with the spent grains anyway. Will report back. Make pizza dough from the spent grains?  How do you do that exactly? I didn't know that was possible! I can't stop thinking how cool would it be to bake with the yeast and dough from the same recipe!
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 19:54
|
|
|
Dolemite posted:Thanks guys. And whoa - the Iconoclast recipe looks awesome! I might just up and brew this! Full credit goes to rage-saq for the recipe. But yes, it is awesome.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 20:02
|
|
|
Dolemite posted:Make pizza dough from the spent grains? I don't know how wafflesnsegways does it, but I've also done this a few times. I figured the grains are just good for a bit of flavor and texture so I treat it like a seed addition to a regular bread. I make a fairly straightforward dough, then mix in the grain. It sort of ends up like a whole wheat so you also have to be careful about the husks tearing the gluten. It tastes good, but unfortunately my method really doesn't use that much of the spent grain. All the ideas about using it all went out the window the first time I did it and saw how much leftover grain I had. I've also thought about using beer yeast for bread but haven't tried it yet. I'm guessing it would take some experimenting, it would be interesting to see if you could get some of the banana/spice esters.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 21:18
|
|
|
This seems relevant since we're talking about reusing spent grain, I have it in my notes from previous HBthreads:quote:It took several tries before silver97232 and I got it right, but this is the final version we came up with:
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2012 21:46
|
|
|
I ordered a raspberry melomel kit from more beer and everything seems to be going well so far. I think it would be awesome to make it sparkling, but I have a pair of questions. 1 I know it says champagne style bottles if i want it heavily carbonated, but if i did the standard 4oz of corn sugar would that not be adequate carbonation? 2 Would throwing campden tablets into the secondary kill the yeast? I'm a ways out still but the directions don't seem to take sparkling mead into consideration so I can't tell if the process is the same no matter what. Definitely ordering compleat meadmaking either way.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2012 05:12
|
|
|
What I'm trying to say is, GWS could probably really use a winemaking/mead making thread, but I'm not the one to do it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2012 05:38
|
|
|
We had one before the purge but it seemed to mainly be people from here wandering in and out with two or three strange avatars popping up now and again
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2012 07:09
|
|
|
Darth Goku Jr posted:I ordered a raspberry melomel kit from more beer and everything seems to be going well so far. I think it would be awesome to make it sparkling, but I have a pair of questions. 1) In my experience, 4 ounces of priming sugar in 5 gallons is good for mild carbonation. If that's a level you like then by all means go for it. You'll need to bottle in beer bottles or other packages meant to take the pressure - regular wine bottles, for example, won't necessarily hold up, plus of course there's no way to get a pressure-tight closure on them. 2) I haven't used Campden tabs other than to pull chlorine out of brewing water, but it says here they are used to stop fermentation. I don't have a citation, but I hazily seem to remember that they don't exactly kill brewing yeast, but more or less put it to sleep. Someone with more winemaking experience than I have can chime in here, but I think that Campden tabs in secondary would run counter to your desire for carbonation. Without other, nonfermentable backsweetening, I think you can have dry, sparkiling mead or sweet, still mead, but not sweet, sparkling mead. Unless you kegged it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2012 15:42
|
|
|
Dolemite posted:Make pizza dough from the spent grains? I usually do pizza or focaccia or some other flatbread. I usually start with Peter Reinhardt recipes, swap out a fourth or a sixth of the flour for grain, and reduce the water since the grain is saturated. You can also add a little more yeast if you like, since the grain can sometimes prevent the dough from rising as much as it would otherwise.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2012 20:00
|
|
|
Does anybody have any pics of their homebrew setup?
|
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2012 03:36
|
|
|
Corbet posted:Does anybody have any pics of their homebrew setup? good call, I'd like to see this too. I think a lot of us new people would.
|
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2012 04:25
|
|
|
Corbet posted:Does anybody have any pics of their homebrew setup? My jam:  Yeah, it's pretty much one pot with couple buckets.
|
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2012 04:38
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 03:20 |
|
|
Corbet posted:Does anybody have any pics of their homebrew setup? It's not amazing, but here's what I've developed over three brews. Might be building another heatstick before doing a fourth, since I don't think my electric setup can currently handle the full 5 gallon boil I need for the oatmeal stout kit I have waiting and it's too loving cold to do it outside. Indoor Brew Setup: Not a great pic, taken during testing of my new home-built heatstick.  Outdoor Brew Setup:  Chilling:  Plus a pair of plastic buckets, a pair of glass carboys (got a sweet deal on some used ones), and the usual random gear mostly out of the same kit as the buckets. wolrah fucked around with this message at 05:09 on Jan 14, 2012 |
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2012 04:56
|
|
