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akadajet posted:You're within the window of time where it's easiest to get your foot in the door at a development company. Interviewers looking for college hires are going to assume that you have limited experience and will cut you more slack accordingly. Not doing development for a year is going to raise some eyebrows and you're going to have to explain why you went IT instead. second this
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Jan 9, 2012 14:47
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I'm looking for some advice. I graduated in '09 with a BA in English (  ), and the economy obviously hosed me pretty hard. After bouncing around rather aimlessly for about two years, I got incredibly lucky and managed to snag an entry-level job at a software company working in IT/Tech Support. One of the benefits of my new job is tuition reimbursement, and I am thinking very seriously about heading back to school for computer science, since it would definitely allow me to move up in my current job and I am pretty certain I would be happier overall pursuing this line of work. I also already have my foot in the door of a software company where I am generally pretty happy.I have to be at my company for a year before I am eligible for tuition reimbursement, so I can start taking classes in Spring '13. I am in the D.C. area, and I am mainly looking at GWU right now (at least for the pre-reqs), as it's pretty decent and I could get there on the metro in about ~10 minutes. In terms of the actual education, though, I only have an introductory Java class from when I was an undergrad. So, I am obviously going to have to do some undergrad-level work initially. I guess my first question is: should I complete the coursework required of a BS in computer science, or should I complete the requirements to apply to a Master's program and then go that route? From what I have seen on various academic advice threads, folks tend to dissuade people from going after second bachelor's degrees on account of funding issues. My company will be paying for the vast majority of my continued education, though, so I am not going to be putting myself into a huge pile of debt if I go the bachelor's route. For most of the Master's programs in my area, I'd need the following classes to be eligible to apply: Computer Organization, Organization of Programming Languages, Data StructuresDesign and Analysis of Computer Algorithms, Calc I/II, Linear Algebra. I guess my main issue is that I know people with a BS in computer science take many more classes than that, and I'd hate to miss out on classes that the typical undergrad comp sci student takes and enter a Masters program at a lower level than some of my peers. So, should I try to go through most of/all of the undergrad curriculum at one of the local universities, or just get the pre-reqs for a graduate program and apply? Beyond that, I'd also appreciate some insight into what I should be doing to get ready for the program. Right now, I've mostly been focusing on Python (I also have a bit of experience with Java). I've read through several intro-level books, and I'm almost finished with MIT's Introduction to Computer Science and Programming; after I finish that, I'm planning on learning a bit of Scheme and working through MIT's Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs course. Beyond that, I'm just writing as many programs as I can, solving as many Project Euler problems as I can, etc. Are there any books you CS grads wish you had read before starting your studies? Anyway, this is getting long, so that about wraps it up. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.  TL,DR: English major seeks advice for pursuing additional degree in comp sci Edit: If this is in the wrong place, let me know and I'll move it. B B fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Jan 9, 2012 |
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Jan 9, 2012 15:13
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B B posted:I'm looking for some advice. I graduated in '09 with a BA in English ( I'm in a very similar position and you look back a page or two you'll see very relevant advice that was given to me. My advice, and the advice I've received from others is: 1. Don't get a second bachelors. If you must get a degree, the do the masters option and take the deficiency classes. I doubt you'd really be that far behind someone who completed a CS degree after finishing those classes. 2. Preparation: I really, really like the Youtube series that Stanford offers for their first three classes in their CS department. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8&feature=relmfu They use ACM libraries which I think is sort of stupid, but I guess they probably know better than I. The first three courses will also take you through a few of the major languages, at least Java (CS106A), C++ (CS106B), Python, C (I think this is for CS107), and a couple others I think (also in CS107). They're all focused on programming methodology, though, not the languages. CS106B specifies that it's a course in programming, not C++, and learning C++ is just incidental. 3. I got a lot of really good advice to not worry about the degree. Take the classes that are relevant, get a lot of experience with open source projects, and become a capable programmer. If you're a good programmer and can prove it then I hear getting jobs isn't hard at all. That said, you (and me, also not coming from a CS degree) are at a fair bit of disadvantage. As you've seen from this thread there are places that won't even look at you, and other places where the candidate with the CS is definitely going to have a leg up. It doesn't mean it's impossible, it's just that you have more work ahead of you than usual.
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Jan 9, 2012 21:17
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I have an upcoming interview with Google and Amazon. I think I have a general idea of what to expect (CS questions, brain teasers, soft. eng questions, etc.) but would like an advise or some input that is not trivial from some of the goons who may have gone through the interview process with them or actually gotten hired.
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Jan 10, 2012 02:08
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akadajet posted:You're within the window of time where it's easiest to get your foot in the door at a development company. Interviewers looking for college hires are going to assume that you have limited experience and will cut you more slack accordingly. Not doing development for a year is going to raise some eyebrows and you're going to have to explain why you went IT instead. Thirding this. All postings for bigger companies that I've seen require specific industry experience unless you're a recent grad. From experience, I would not accept a non-dev job unless that's where you see yourself in the long term. Currently un-loving myself from a similar situation. pr0metheus posted:I have an upcoming interview with Google and Amazon. I think I have a general idea of what to expect (CS questions, brain teasers, soft. eng questions, etc.) but would like an advise or some input that is not trivial from some of the goons who may have gone through the interview process with them or actually gotten hired. Can't speak to Google, but Amazon's two phone interviews were 10 minutes of talking about my resume, 45 minutes of coding on collabedit and 5 minutes of questions for the interviewer. Both my interviewers were extremely nice. The questions they asked were pretty hard - both were stuff you'd expect in a 2nd/3rd year CS midterm or exam. Know your data structures inside and out. I'm pretty rusty on mine and I'm pretty sure that's what screwed me. Seriously just go back over your CS notes and you'll probably be fine, especially if you have a Google interview (lots harder to land). I had to write a recursive function that finds the average of all sub-nodes of a graph type situation. I hadn't done recursion in years. That was painful.
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Jan 10, 2012 02:29
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So the hardest question was to write a simple Depth First Search?
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Jan 10, 2012 03:30
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pr0metheus posted:I have an upcoming interview with Google and Amazon. I think I have a general idea of what to expect (CS questions, brain teasers, soft. eng questions, etc.) but would like an advise or some input that is not trivial from some of the goons who may have gone through the interview process with them or actually gotten hired. I went through the whole Amazon and Google interview processes. The phone interview are kind of the same. Here is a problem, write some code. With Amazon I had two phone interviews, with Google one. The problems in the Amazon interviews were math-heavier. Since I suck at math, I was not able to complete the problem in the second interview. My on-site interviews were completely different too. Amazon was a lot about high-level OOP and systems design (we talked about how the Kindle backend works). I wrote many, many whiteboards full of Java code. Google was all over the place. Short questions. Little code to write. More to think about algorithms. In general, the individual interviews at Amazon seemed to follow a general trend while the interviews at Google were disconnected and every interviewer just did whatever he felt like. Of course all of this depends heavily on what teams you are interviewing for and who your interviewers are.
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Jan 10, 2012 04:05
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pr0metheus posted:So the hardest question was to write a simple Depth First Search? That was part of it, but there were a bunch of other factors. The fact that you picked up on that right away tells me you'll do fine. Another related tip from experience. If some company offers you the opportunity to work in a "custom in-house programming language" run the other way. It melts your brain and makes you unable to recognize simple CS201 stuff.
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Jan 10, 2012 04:23
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My Advanced Algorithm Design and Implementation syllabus seems to cover literally everything I've seen asked in interviews (I just got it recently). The text we're using is Intro to Algorithms. Seems like this class is going to be tremendously useful. I start next week, pretty excited.
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Jan 10, 2012 04:55
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Good Will Punting posted:My Advanced Algorithm Design and Implementation syllabus seems to cover literally everything I've seen asked in interviews (I just got it recently). The text we're using is Intro to Algorithms. Seems like this class is going to be tremendously useful. I start next week, pretty excited. Intro to Algorithms by who?
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Jan 10, 2012 06:02
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ancient lobster posted:Intro to Algorithms by who? Is there any other?
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Jan 10, 2012 06:08
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kitten smoothie posted:Is there any other? Well, yes--like the one I got stuck with--so it was worth asking. Thanks.
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Jan 10, 2012 06:24
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I took an elementary data structures/algorithms course and I wish I had this text. Might've gotten an A. 
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Jan 10, 2012 06:28
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CLRS is, to me, a better reference than a tutorial - I've been studying using The Algorithm Design Manual and it's been pretty helpful for me. It's part algorithms textbook and part data structure cookbook, which gives it a different flavour than a lot of other books I've seen. It's really well written and has some genuinely interesting/funny bits in it.
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Jan 10, 2012 07:34
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No content but I get your Forums name now and it rules.
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Jan 10, 2012 07:39
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Dijkstracula posted:CLRS is, to me, a better reference than a tutorial Agreed. DPV's Algorithms is not nearly as comprehensive as CLRS, but it's a great text and wonderfully short. Also, there's a version of it nigh-identical to the print version that's available for free.
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Jan 10, 2012 19:05
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Otto Skorzeny posted:Agreed.
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Jan 10, 2012 19:58
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Last semester, I got 2 offers. I put in my 2 weeks for the one I'm working now. Is there a protocol for seeing if the one I turned down has room for me?
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Jan 10, 2012 20:19
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it is posted:Last semester, I got 2 offers. I put in my 2 weeks for the one I'm working now. Is there a protocol for seeing if the one I turned down has room for me? SMTP.
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Jan 10, 2012 21:11
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shrughes posted:SMTP. with failover to POTS
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Jan 10, 2012 21:13
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it is posted:Last semester, I got 2 offers. I put in my 2 weeks for the one I'm working now. Is there a protocol for seeing if the one I turned down has room for me? eh, two joke answers so I guess I'll balance this one out. I'd suggest just emailing the first level POC (HR person?) and asking if they're still looking to fill the/a position. Don't email whoever you interviewed with if it's a team/dev lead of something. The POC will either know that there's a hiring freeze or they'll ask the person you interviewed with what they think.
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Jan 10, 2012 21:24
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I'm in my last semester of a CS degree and due to circumstances beyond my control, I haven't been able to even so much as apply for any internships, let alone work for anyone. Now that I'm looking, it seems most/all internships want a "returning student". How difficult is it convince HR to give me a pass on that? Is there a legal reason for this or is it a preference thing?
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Jan 12, 2012 14:22
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ManlyWeevil posted:I'm in my last semester of a CS degree and due to circumstances beyond my control, I haven't been able to even so much as apply for any internships, let alone work for anyone. Now that I'm looking, it seems most/all internships want a "returning student". How difficult is it convince HR to give me a pass on that? Is there a legal reason for this or is it a preference thing? Personally I've never seen that before on any internships I've looked at, but what's the harm in applying? e; Welp, either I'm a masochist, retarded, or just too subservient. I just sent my resume out to about 20 recruiting agencies in the tri-state area. Partially looking for work, partially as a ploy to help my current employer (a hiring agency) find other recruiters to steal to work for us instead. Sab669 fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Jan 12, 2012 |
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Jan 12, 2012 15:00
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ManlyWeevil posted:I'm in my last semester of a CS degree and due to circumstances beyond my control, I haven't been able to even so much as apply for any internships, let alone work for anyone. Now that I'm looking, it seems most/all internships want a "returning student". How difficult is it convince HR to give me a pass on that? Is there a legal reason for this or is it a preference thing? Why specify an internship? Have you considered just looking for full-time instead?
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Jan 13, 2012 20:09
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Should I go ahead and order DPV's Algorithms? Seems like a lot of you guys are pretty big on it and more references are better than less. (I have a lot of time on my hands..)
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Jan 14, 2012 08:33
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Good Will Punting posted:Should I go ahead and order DPV's Algorithms? Seems like a lot of you guys are pretty big on it and more references are better than less. (I have a lot of time on my hands..)
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Jan 14, 2012 09:38
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How badly did I gently caress up this FizzBuzz-style question? I was nervous as hell since I've never had a real, in-person programming interview question: http://tomjakubowski.github.com/2012/01/18/babys-first-fizzbuzz/ quote:Iterate over the integers from 1 to 100 inclusive. For each integer: if the integer is evenly divisible by 3, print "foo"; if the integer is evenly divisible by 5, print "bar"; if the integer is evenly divisible by 7, print "baz"; otherwise, print just the number. (put all output for each number on its own line) code:
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Jan 19, 2012 06:35
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Deus Rex posted:How badly did I gently caress up this FizzBuzz-style question? Looks right to me.
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Jan 19, 2012 06:41
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code:
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Jan 19, 2012 07:41
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Woops...hosed up on my Microsoft phone interview for a summer internship and didn't make it. I guess it's for the best since their location is inconvenient for this summer and I wouldn't have been able to do it even if I had gotten in. Anyways I'm a freshman in computer science, anyone have any advice on what to do over the summer? I don't really want to sit on my hands and not do anything. Are there any good open source projects for a total novice who only knows Java, should I learn a new programming language? It's pretty difficult finding internships as a freshman. Thanks for the advice in advance.
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Jan 20, 2012 00:59
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Akarshi posted:Woops...hosed up on my Microsoft phone interview for a summer internship and didn't make it. I guess it's for the best since their location is inconvenient for this summer and I wouldn't have been able to do it even if I had gotten in. Just make your own fun projects or as you said try to join some open source project and contribute. What I found useful is doing short algorithmic challenges, however. Check out sites like https://www.topcoder.com or projecteuler.net or a lot of acm judge websites. A lot of those problems are every challenging but those sites also contain a lot of tutorials and explanations. This will not only help you learn your favorite language better but also boost your mathematical and algorithmic as well as general problem solving skills.
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Jan 20, 2012 01:31
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This has been my biggest problem with programming. Yea, I've learned all this stuff in school but I can't think of any practical way to apply it in my spare time to add to my portfolio.
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Jan 20, 2012 02:58
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I've been helping my team with resume vetting. Setting aside how 3/4 of applicants are mainland Chinese/Indians (tough for them to stand out), it amazes me how people with great looking resumes bomb our IQ test. This is pre-contact with anyone on our team; we have them take an online 3rd party IQ test. An inexplicable number of people coming from top CS/engineering schools/with a good work pedigree getting sub-50 percentile for the test. W T F.
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Jan 20, 2012 03:55
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Have you taken it?
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Jan 20, 2012 04:43
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shrike82 posted:I've been helping my team with resume vetting. What is your IQ test? Is it programming question or some bullshit "logic" puzzles and weird spacial ones?
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Jan 20, 2012 04:46
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^^^ God, I'm so bad at those spatial IQ test questions. I guess I'll never be employed in the highly competitive industry of drawing patterned paper that folds into boxes.shrike82 posted:I've been helping my team with resume vetting. What's the URL? Personally, I couldn't care less if someone is "smart" in any measurable way other than being able to write bad-rear end code, as long as they're passionate about writing software, fit in with the rest of the team and regularly bathe. New Yorp New Yorp fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Jan 20, 2012 |
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Jan 20, 2012 04:48
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shrike82 posted:I've been helping my team with resume vetting. have you ever considered that perhaps an IQ test is not a software development test and there may not even be much of a correlation between the two?
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Jan 20, 2012 06:06
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I have no idea what IQ tests measures but the logic puzzles I have seen from some are too ambiguous for true engineers to take seriously. Also those spacial problems are weird.
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Jan 20, 2012 06:31
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shrike82 posted:An inexplicable number of people coming from top CS/engineering schools/with a good work pedigree getting sub-50 percentile for the test. W T F. And you think the problem is with the candidates?
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Jan 20, 2012 06:36
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shrike82 posted:I've been helping my team with resume vetting. An IQ test? Why the gently caress wouldn't you give somebody a coding test? Millions of congenitally bad programmers can pass an IQ test. Also there are tons of low-IQ CS graduates from "top" CS/engineering schools. There are tons of people with a good work pedigree who can't write a loving program. A large proportion of MIT's CS grads that you'll encounter don't "get" recursion. There are lots of people who'll crap together several shards of a MySQL database in PHP and tell you they're an expert in "distributed filesystems".
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Jan 20, 2012 07:49
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