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 Thief Gold is now on GOG, its first time in digital distribution, for ten bucks.
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Jan 31, 2012 13:36
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an_mutt posted:Romero created Daikatana but I don't think he was directly responsible with designing many, if any, of the maps. Those were the work of Kris Klie/his Quake playing significant other and whatever other poor saps he had running around the Ion Storm officed by the end of the game's development. There are a lot of people credited to Daikatana's level design. The main four were Stevie Case and three other people I've never heard of. Then there's a host of people involved in "Additional Level Design", whatever that means. Some of the names should be familiar to classic Doom fans - John Anderson, Iikka Keranen, Chris Klie, and Sverre Kvernmo.
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Jan 31, 2012 14:27
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Does anyone have a link for ZDL 3.1? Every single link available by google is dead. Or is there a better Doom frontend.
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Jan 31, 2012 16:25
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abagofcheetos posted:Yeah Romero and Carmack basically need each other, but for some reason haven't figured that out yet. Clearly we need to stage some sort of wacky surprise reunion scenario!
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Feb 1, 2012 20:07
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Sir Lemming posted:Clearly we need to stage some sort of wacky surprise reunion scenario! Now there's a summer feel-good buddy comedy film idea. One was a guru of engines, the other an advocate of design, torn apart by their conflicts. But this summer, they're getting the team back together! Martin Freeman and Nicholas Cage are: John & John! Coming summer 2012.
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Feb 1, 2012 20:13
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kmxexii posted:There are a lot of people credited to Daikatana's level design. The main four were Stevie Case and three other people I've never heard of. Then there's a host of people involved in "Additional Level Design", whatever that means. Some of the names should be familiar to classic Doom fans - John Anderson, Iikka Keranen, Chris Klie, and Sverre Kvernmo. IIRC the game went through a ton of level designers because Romero couldn't lead a gaming development team for poo poo. The first crew, John Anderson, Sverre, and the like created level layouts for quite a few of the levels, some of which survived in the final version. John Anderson in particular had some pretty neat Greece levels (like a Greek palace) that could've been pretty good if he stayed on the team and was allowed to polish them instead of handing them off to others to mutilate. Big problem here is that they were dicks to the art team (who were usually completely unfamiliar with game art) and that they really didn't know how to plan levels around the partners because the programmers barely started work on them. Second team with Iikka did work on 1999. IIRC this is where the level design starts to take a nosedive towards colored light and dickish level design, but it wasn't that bad. Third team with Stevie pretty much finished taking a huge dump on the levels. I'm pretty sure you can pin some of the shittier parts of the level design on this team. I still say that that, if Romero was willing to stay with the Quake 1 engine and/or be wiling to cut some things, like the partners, the game would've ended up on track and been a lot better. It'd probably be slammed at the time for not being top of the line, but I think it'd be respected a lot more down the line. Don't ask me how I know all of this.
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Feb 1, 2012 20:23
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stay off my page posted:Does anyone have a link for ZDL 3.1? Every single link available by google is dead. Or is there a better Doom frontend. Either google up ZDL Sharp or grab Quickly Launchering ZDoom from the OP.
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Feb 1, 2012 20:38
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Cobweb Heart posted:Having read Masters of Doom, I can firmly say that Daikatana happened because Romero went unchecked. He's a bit like George Lucas in that he has the potential to create fantastic work... so long as he has a team of people to put a stop to the twenty awful, overambitious ideas he has for every good one. The way I always heard it, Romero was a really, really good game designer who wanted to be a rock star. He didn't have the technology planned out, he didn't manage it correctly and he didn't market it properly. The game itself had some design problems but a lot of them were common around the time of Daikatana's release and I can't fault him too much for them, although somebody should have been telling him he was retarded. Most of this stuff doesn't actually reflect on how good he is at designing content for games, it was mostly an issue of him being a terrible manager.
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Feb 1, 2012 20:39
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NovemberMike posted:The way I always heard it, Romero was a really, really good game designer who wanted to be a rock star. He didn't have the technology planned out, he didn't manage it correctly and he didn't market it properly. The game itself had some design problems but a lot of them were common around the time of Daikatana's release and I can't fault him too much for them, although somebody should have been telling him he was retarded. Most of this stuff doesn't actually reflect on how good he is at designing content for games, it was mostly an issue of him being a terrible manager. Back during Wolf3D and Doom he was actually pretty good with tech. He was the one who made their in-house Doom editor and pushed the tech by making level design with things like stairs. It's when Quake was being developed that Carmack was clearly surpassing him, and that's when he went to full on game designer.
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Feb 1, 2012 20:51
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closeted republican posted:Back during Wolf3D and Doom he was actually pretty good with tech. He was the one who made their in-house Doom editor and pushed the tech by making level design with things like stairs. It's when Quake was being developed that Carmack was clearly surpassing him, and that's when he went to full on game designer. Sorry, I meant tech in the sense of what they were going to build Daikatana on, what computers it was going to target etc. It was designed as a project that would be out the door in less than a year IIRC and then they got behind so every update they had looked bad compared to the new tech.
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Feb 1, 2012 21:21
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I'm in a bad mood. Someone please assign me a random Doom mod and level set to play. Thanks. 
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Feb 1, 2012 22:42
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Chinook posted:I'm in a bad mood. Someone please assign me a random Doom mod and level set to play. Thanks. The Sky May Be with Beavis and Butthead sound pack.
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Feb 1, 2012 23:10
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treat posted:The Sky May Be with Beavis and Butthead sound pack. Okay, I'll find it. But I'm using Brutal Doom.  Edit: Rats, I can't get it to work. (The Sky May Be) Not supported by the current version of windows, etc. Running win7 64 bit. It's just an .exe file, not sure what to make of it. Chinook fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Feb 1, 2012 |
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Feb 1, 2012 23:26
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Chinook posted:I'm in a bad mood. Someone please assign me a random Doom mod and level set to play. Thanks. Reelism. Doesn't need a level set, just play it.
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Feb 1, 2012 23:41
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Chinook posted:Okay, I'll find it. But I'm using Brutal Doom.
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Feb 1, 2012 23:48
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So any upcoming FPSs to look forward to in the style of the classic games? Indie/Free/AAA it doesn't matter.
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Feb 1, 2012 23:52
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SaucyLoggins posted:So any upcoming FPSs to look forward to in the style of the classic games? Indie/Free/AAA it doesn't matter. Retro Blazer
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Feb 1, 2012 23:56
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treat posted:The Sky May Be with Beavis and Butthead sound pack. I did exactly as you said. That was pretty different. I didn't get very far, but I played for almost an hour. The music, sound effects, and general atmosphere were pretty out there. Beavis and Butthead helped to keep me sane, I think. I eventually "no clipped" (which was breaking the rules, you see), and the text on the top left said gently caress YOU!!!^^^^^^^^, which was sort of exciting. Dr Snofeld posted:Reelism. Doesn't need a level set, just play it. Thanks, this is good stuff.
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Feb 2, 2012 02:36
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Doom The Way Id Did has been updated! It does various tweaks and fixes, improves deathmatch support, and adds nice between-level intermission graphics like the original episodes.
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Feb 2, 2012 07:44
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The Kins you're my favourite thread OP. DTWID is by far the best map pack i've played.
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Feb 5, 2012 16:11
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DTWID is pretty great, but it makes me miss the Doom 2 'mid-tier' enemies all the more. They really went a long way to fleshing out the combat variety.
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Feb 5, 2012 18:02
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Dominic White posted:DTWID is pretty great, but it makes me miss the Doom 2 'mid-tier' enemies all the more. They really went a long way to fleshing out the combat variety.
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Feb 5, 2012 18:32
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Well i hope it is Doom 2 The Way Id Did Doom 1 instead because i dont like the city levels (i know it's been said already) but i agree, enemies and the SSG make up for that.
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Feb 5, 2012 19:13
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NovemberMike posted:Sorry, I meant tech in the sense of what they were going to build Daikatana on, what computers it was going to target etc. It was designed as a project that would be out the door in less than a year IIRC and then they got behind so every update they had looked bad compared to the new tech. Yeah, Romero hosed up just about every way imaginable. Daikatana's fate was probably sealed when Romero saw the Quake 2 engine running with colored lighting and decided to port their current work over from the Quake 1 engine. He thought the Quake 2 code would be similar and that porting their stuff would be relatively simple but he was completely wrong. Romero's time with Ion Storm is pretty much summed up by the story of the beautiful and expensive office space he rented for his team at the top of an office building, with a glass ceiling to let sunlight in. The programmers quickly built a tent city to shield their computers from the sunlight's glare so that they could see their monitors. Good intentions gone completely awry. The Dallas Observer had a great article that detailed the turmoil Ion Storm was going through before Daikatana was released. The Ion 8 had already left the company and gamers were watching Ion like they would a horrible car accident just to see how bad it would really get. You can read it here: http://www.dallasobserver.com/1999-01-14/news/stormy-weather/ Man, Todd Porter was a huge dickhead.
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Feb 5, 2012 19:44
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The Kins posted:Doom The Way Id Did has been updated! This is how I know a doom mod hit the mark: I play on Ultra-Violence and it's just as fun as the original game  . Thanks for this, Kins!
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Feb 5, 2012 23:15
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closeted republican posted:It's when Quake was being developed that Carmack was clearly surpassing him, and that's when he went to full on game designer. Quake was right when Romero left, and it was also when id games became really brown. They still played and felt really good because Carmack is really good at programming movement and physics as well as graphics, but they lost a lot of their personality. Tom Hall also left after working on Doom, so that probably contributed to id's creative decline too. There's probably a lesson in there somewhere given that after all the creative talent split up, they've never been able to make anything individually that was as good as what they made when they were together.
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Feb 5, 2012 23:43
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Boy Wunder posted:Yeah, Romero hosed up just about every way imaginable. Daikatana's fate was probably sealed when Romero saw the Quake 2 engine running with colored lighting and decided to port their current work over from the Quake 1 engine. He thought the Quake 2 code would be similar and that porting their stuff would be relatively simple but he was completely wrong. Romero's huge ego was pretty much the thing that killed Daikatana. If he would've been willing to compromise a bit on some of his goals, I think Daikatana would've turned out much better, even if it would've run on worse tech or whatever. quote:Quake was right when Romero left, and it was also when id games became really brown. They still played and felt really good because Carmack is really good at programming movement and physics as well as graphics, but they lost a lot of their personality. Tom Hall also left after working on Doom, so that probably contributed to id's creative decline too. There's probably a lesson in there somewhere given that after all the creative talent split up, they've never been able to make anything individually that was as good as what they made when they were together. I agree. After Romero left, it seems more like their games didn't have personalities. Say what you want about Quake 1 and it's sloppy design, but it has a lot more charm and personality than iD's later works. Quuke 3, in particular, gives the impression that the mindset behind it was "beep boop we must make an online FPS and fine tune it's gameplay to perfection", not the old, Romero-era "What if you put all of this cool poo poo from this totally rockin' comic book in a game and like you could blow up an ogre WITH A ROCKET LAUNCHER and HE TOTALLY MAKES SOME FUNNY SOUNDS WHEN YOU BLOW HIM TO PIECES??? HELL loving YEAH!"-type mentality. It's lack of personality is probably one of the reasons why I prefer playing Unreal Tournament 1 over it, even though Quake 3 has better balance and the like. closeted republican fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Feb 6, 2012 |
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Feb 6, 2012 06:43
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John Romero is a good designer, but I really think Tom Hall got the shaft in the whole iD saga. If you go and look at what he did in Rise of the Triad with a far more limited engine, it's pretty impressive. That game is incredibly creative with all of the tricks and traps. I think one thing that's missing from today's shooters is the sense of humour that Wolf3D, Doom, and ROTT had. It was a really dark sense of humour that I think a lot of people don't pick up on because Doomguy isn't like Duke, spouting one-liners. But little touches like that "you're-all-really-hosed-now" grin when Doomguy picks up the BFG or the hilariously violent death animations? Awesome. If you listen to Hall and Romero in interviews or follow them on Twitter, that humour is those guys. If Carmack, Hall, and Romero could get back together and put aside all the bullshit from the past, I think they could make something awesome again. To sum up: Hall and Romero need to stop making Facebook games and license a loving engine. Maybe Tech 5, but I have AMD cards so I hope not...
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Feb 6, 2012 07:11
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Gargonovitch posted:John Romero is a good designer, but I really think Tom Hall got the shaft in the whole iD saga. If you go and look at what he did in Rise of the Triad with a far more limited engine, it's pretty impressive. That game is incredibly creative with all of the tricks and traps. Funny you mention that; there's an interview with American McGee where he mentions the role humor played in creating Quake 1 and at iD in general while Romero was still around: quote:"Funny" is an adjective I would not have expected, could you elaborate what you consider funny in Quake?
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Feb 6, 2012 07:25
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Some glorious new gleam comes to Marathon Infinity with a completely revamped water set.
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Feb 6, 2012 17:57
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 Thief 2 is now on GOG!
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Feb 7, 2012 13:07
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Apparently Blauwe Vingers got released a while back. Possibly the most ambitious Aleph One game there is, it does things with the engine no one else ever has, turning it into a prodigious FPS RPG. The only downside is that it's only in Dutch.
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Feb 7, 2012 19:07
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The Kins posted:
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Feb 7, 2012 19:12
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Quatrefoil posted:If you haven't already played this, buy it NOW. Then finish it, download T2X, finish that, download a million fan missions and keep playing. So great. Oddly Thief is one of the few fps games that has legitimately scared the poo poo out of me, and it isn't even aiming for that goal O_o
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Feb 7, 2012 19:20
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Out of interest does anyone know why the SVN builds of GZDoom haven't been updated since the end of December? It used to be the norm for at least one new version a day so such a long time to pass is very strange.
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Feb 7, 2012 21:29
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victrix posted:Oddly Thief is one of the few fps games that has legitimately scared the poo poo out of me, and it isn't even aiming for that goal O_o Despite not "officially" making horror games, Looking Glass has always kind of had that knack. Parts of Ultima Underworld and both Thief games, decks 3 and 9 in System Shock, the entire game in System Shock 2... A large part of it is their use of lighting and sound, I think. They pay as much attention to that as they do to the graphics, if not more.
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Feb 7, 2012 22:11
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Some Blue Fingers impressions so far. Everything looks excellent and it's fun just looking around the levels even when there's no combat going on. The big compasses are level exits, get your exploring in before you get close to them. I have no idea what the plot is; angry red men are attacking me and my happy blue men. Everything seems to have very little health, an arrow or two tends to put a guy down quite nicely. I'm being handed a lot of weapons but mostly I just stick with the daggers, they're great for stunlocking. They seem to be going the M1 route with water: If it looks deep enough to swim, don't. At one point it offered me a choice of two different level exits so it seems there'll definitely be replayability.
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Feb 8, 2012 04:37
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Revised impressions: It's really short, really easy and really incomplete. It has a lot of potential, at least. 
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Feb 9, 2012 02:14
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Quatrefoil posted:(referring to Thief 2 on Gog.com) I would just empty quote this. This is the exact thing that everyone that enjoys stealth games need to do, the genre is very empty. In regards to custom content, Thief 2 is the Doom of stealth games. There are hundreds of user-made levels out there and they are still being made today. SolidSnakesBandana fucked around with this message at 02:20 on Feb 9, 2012 |
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Feb 9, 2012 02:18
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Hey, I uhh, removed the Strife link since it pointed to the FBI shut down website Megaupload. It isn't available anywhere else and isn't for sale, so feel free to replace it.
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Feb 9, 2012 02:32
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