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Oh wow I forgot all about that promo where DB, Punk & Ryder were all together as the champions. That really was great. And I'm sure if Ryder did any of that in-ring stuff, he'd get yelled at by agents. That's not the role they want him in, they want him out there getting squashed then looking sad when Eve slaps him. Like the guy isn't great in ring, but if anything he has proven that he knows what to do with his gimmick from his web show. I'm sure he would looove to bring that over to his role on Raw.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:48
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Kiwi Bigtree posted:He should strut around the ring. Break a hold if his hair gets messed up. Stop wrestling to hit on a girl in the front row. Something that sells his character as a Jersey Party boy. Problem is "Jersey party boy" isn't really a babyface gimmick.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:49
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Karmine posted:Problem is "Jersey party boy" isn't really a babyface gimmick. Then he should hit on kids in the front row, it would make their night just like when Bret Hart handed out the shades
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Apr 17, 2012 16:50
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Karmine posted:Problem is "Jersey party boy" isn't really a babyface gimmick. Too Cool were loving over and the difference between Too Cool and Zack Ryder is era. Not much else. And seriously, people need to get out of this concept that there are some gimmicks that can't be a "babyface" gimmick or a "heel" gimmick. Anything can be a babyface gimmick.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:52
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Lone Rogue posted:Too Cool were loving over and the difference between Too Cool and Zack Ryder is era. Not much else. Babyface racist gimmick in EWR killed my promotion.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:54
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Lone Rogue posted:Too Cool were loving over and the difference between Too Cool and Zack Ryder is era. Not much else. They danced with a fat guy. If Zack Ryder started dancing with Brodus Clay then we'd be in business.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:55
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Karmine posted:They danced with a fat guy. If Zack Ryder started dancing with Brodus Clay then we'd be in business. And we've suddenly found the way to save two careers.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:56
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Lone Rogue posted:Too Cool were loving over and the difference between Too Cool and Zack Ryder is era. Not much else. How would you play the Million Dollar Man/JBL/Del Rio aristocrat gimmick as a babyface?
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Apr 17, 2012 16:58
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Lone Rogue posted:Too Cool were loving over and the difference between Too Cool and Zack Ryder is era. Not much else. Too Cool won a lot and was booked in storylines where they stood up to the McMahon-Helsmley regime. Zack Ryder loses all the time and is booked in storylines where he is in love with a woman who takes advantage of him. I'm coming off as some Ryder superfan, which I'm not, but I just don't understand people blaming the guy when it's clearly the WWE ruining yet another midcarder.
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Apr 17, 2012 16:59
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flashy_mcflash posted:How would you play the Million Dollar Man/JBL/Del Rio aristocrat gimmick as a babyface? The less we can encourage fantasy booking the better.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:00
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flashy_mcflash posted:How would you play the Million Dollar Man/JBL/Del Rio aristocrat gimmick as a babyface? Play him like Mr. Scrooge after the Three Ghosts. He now uses his enormous wealth to screw over heels.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:02
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triplexpac posted:Too Cool won a lot and was booked in storylines where they stood up to the McMahon-Helsmley regime. I don't deny the wwe has done a terrible job with ryder. My problem is the prevailing assumption its done ro punish him for getting over.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:07
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I don't know what would be worse: this booking being a punishment for Ryder, or WWE thinking that this is actually helping him in the long run
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Apr 17, 2012 17:09
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flashy_mcflash posted:How would you play the Million Dollar Man/JBL/Del Rio aristocrat gimmick as a babyface? Warren Buffett
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Apr 17, 2012 17:11
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triplexpac posted:I don't know what would be worse: this booking being a punishment for Ryder, or WWE thinking that this is actually helping him in the long run The Kane thing was awful but I do not mind the Eve stuff. The whole appeal of Ryder is that he is kind of a wripwreck style lovable loser. He SHOULD be getting pushed around by a cruel woman and falling for it.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:14
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triplexpac posted:I don't know what would be worse: this booking being a punishment for Ryder, or WWE thinking that this is actually helping him in the long run Booking him as punishment. If they are truly trying with him and failing, at least they are trying. If this has all been one elaborate way to punish a guy who got over against the wishes of WWE Creative and made light of it to get even more popular then that's a symptom of a terrible company. I'll never understand it either. If I'm writing storylines for a wrestling program and one of the guys gets over on his own, shouldn't I be happy I now have another guy to push? I don't have to keep going back to the well? There's room for creativity? It's so loving ridiculous.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:16
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Lone Rogue posted:Booking him as punishment. If they are truly trying with him and failing, at least they are trying. If this has all been one elaborate way to punish a guy who got over against the wishes of WWE Creative and made light of it to get even more popular then that's a symptom of a terrible company. If you're writing storylines for WWE they are probably getting thrown out/heavily edited beyond your original idea/someone else is taking credit for them and you are made fun of for being so stupid by your boss.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:19
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Lone Rogue posted:Booking him as punishment. If they are truly trying with him and failing, at least they are trying. If this has all been one elaborate way to punish a guy who got over against the wishes of WWE Creative and made light of it to get even more popular then that's a symptom of a terrible company. Their current booking style is pretty much book 5 guys strongly at the expense of everyone else on the roster. It's like if you're not getting more than 10% of the airtime of a show you're in the running to job to someone who does. So I could see where they'd be annoyed that a guy they were going to offer up as a sacrificial lamb to one of their poster boys suddenly gets more over than 90% of them and now they look bad if they job him out so they've gotta push him. But gently caress them for actually being dicks about it.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:22
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Oatgan posted:If you're writing storylines for WWE they are probably getting thrown out/heavily edited beyond your original idea/someone else is taking credit for them and you are made fun of for being so stupid by your boss. Also the person who makes the final decision is legitimately a crazy person.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:24
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In the Attitude Era, the writers were much better at showcasing a guy's strengths and masking his weaknesses. If he wasn't a super awesome wrestler, have him in mostly sketches and vice versa. Yes, it's great to have someone who is an all-around amazing performer in every aspect, but that just doesn't happen. These days, it seems like the writers find a guy, see what he's worst at and put the spotlight on that weakness, thus making it impossible for the fans to take them seriously.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:38
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Writer Cath posted:In the Attitude Era, the writers were much better at showcasing a guy's strengths and masking his weaknesses. If he wasn't a super awesome wrestler, have him in mostly sketches and vice versa. Yes, it's great to have someone who is an all-around amazing performer in every aspect, but that just doesn't happen. Two problems: Since then they've closed down OVW and opened FCW, which is terrible at training guys, and the focus on TV has shifted onto big guys who most likely are meat-head bodybuilders or college football drop-outs looking to try something for easy money. Vince loves these guys for some reason and never, ever, ever wants them booked even looking the slightest bit weak. So what you wind up with is bullshit no one buys, like a seasons technical wrestler getting utterly bamboozled by his opponent's total mastery of moves like the bulldog, body strikes, and flying shoulder blocks.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:47
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TNA and WWE both have guys in their employ that are there just to protect their spot, do as little work as possible, and collect a paycheck. The only difference is that in WWE's case most of them tend to be behind the scenes people, whereas most of TNA's are in front of the camera.
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Apr 17, 2012 17:49
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Grandpa Pap posted:TNA and WWE both have guys in their employ that are there just to protect their spot, do as little work as possible, and collect a paycheck. The only difference is that in WWE's case most of them tend to be behind the scenes people, whereas most of TNA's are in front of the camera. And yet, which one has more power over booking their respective company?
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Apr 17, 2012 17:57
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triplexpac posted:Then he should hit on kids in the front row... 
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Apr 17, 2012 19:05
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Karmine posted:They danced with a fat guy. If Zack Ryder started dancing with Brodus Clay then we'd be in business. give it a month ot two....
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Apr 17, 2012 19:09
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Internet turning on Ryder is a sad display of just how much the WWE controls even "smark" reactions with their booking. If you think the brawling -> boot -> rough ryder formula match they've given Zack on Raw is the best he can do you should go watch some ECW matches.
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Apr 17, 2012 20:08
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Writer Cath posted:In the Attitude Era, the writers were much better at showcasing a guy's strengths and masking his weaknesses. In the Attitude Era the WWF didn't have writers.
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Apr 17, 2012 20:49
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HulkaMatt posted:In the Attitude Era the WWF didn't have writers. Vince Russo would disagree with you, sir. 
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Apr 17, 2012 20:52
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HulkaMatt posted:In the Attitude Era the WWF didn't have writers. yes it did
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Apr 17, 2012 20:52
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So...who DID Gene LeBell ever beat?
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Apr 17, 2012 20:59
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CobiWann posted:So...who DID Gene LeBell ever beat? Seagal.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:00
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CobiWann posted:So...who DID Gene LeBell ever beat? Peter Maivia BAN DICKEYE posted:yes it did look man it had bookers!!!!!!!!!!!
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Apr 17, 2012 21:08
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LightsGameraAction posted:Don't know if you've noticed, but Santino has actually been allowed a decent amount of offense in his matches, to come off as dominant, and to win repeatedly. Three things they haven't given Ryder in months. Santino is also a surprisingly good wrestler outside of the whole comedy schtick.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:14
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No he's actually a pretty awful worker.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:16
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Santino was horrible in OVW when his character was basically Russian Taz.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:18
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Santino I will say is really good at hitting all of his signature spots and has good timing. Other than that though hasn't shown anything when it comes to a serious match.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:22
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Has Santino ever had a serious match?
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Apr 17, 2012 21:23
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When he first won th IC title off Umaga his charcter was basically "happy to be here and rock the IC belt", and those matches were boring.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:24
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Lloyd Boner posted:Has Santino ever had a serious match? OVW where he was terrible, then his early run after the debut upset win. He got exposed early on so he moved into comedy after a few weeks.
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Apr 17, 2012 21:25
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Cardboard Box posted:No he's actually a pretty awful worker. He has an MMA background at least. I really wish they'd have done more with Kozlov's SAMBO background. (I thought Santino was alright in OVW.  )
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Apr 17, 2012 21:28
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