|
Lemonus posted:The trail to freedom started with Proposition 8: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perry_v_brown SCOUTS won't grant the right for gays to marry until all but 12-18 states have already granted that right of same sex marriage either through their own courts, SCOUTS changing civil unions in marriage (due to Brown v. Board) or through ballot initiatives. Reason being is because there were only 17 states with forced segregation when Brown v. Board was ruled and Lawrence v. Texas only changed the laws in 13 states and SCOUTS doesn't like to overturn a majority of states laws, but instead only drags the few holdouts up to the rest of the countries standards. Best case really is for Prop 8's overturning to apply only to the 9'th circuit, but more then likely it will rule that people can't vote to take away someone's right the courts already granted them (which was basically the 9'th circuit ruling) and it's overturned only in California. A Winner is Jew fucked around with this message at 09:26 on May 12, 2012 |
#
?
May 12, 2012 09:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 03:23 |
|
|
UltimoDragonQuest posted:Nobody has managed to re-ban marriage. Maine did
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 15:33
|
|
|
Wow Rand Paulquote:At the Iowa Faith & Freedom event, Paul mocked President Obama’s remark that his view on marriage was evolving. “Call me cynical, but I didn’t think his views on marriage could get any gayer,” he said.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 16:19
|
|
|
Rand then snorted, spat on the floor, and told the reporter to stop hitting himself.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 16:46
|
|
|
"Barack Obama is gay as hell" - a sitting US Senator
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 17:23
|
|
|
Pornographic Memory posted:"Barack Obama is gay as hell" - a sitting US Senator It's happened. We have reached the truest distillation of the GOP. lol ur gay  *votes to defund abortion clinics* loving sluts..
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 17:35
|
|
|
Riptor posted:Maine did Maine's marriage law never went into effect, though. Similarly, neither Washington's nor Maryland's marriage laws would go into effect until after the referenda this November.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 18:24
|
|
|
Barry Convex posted:Maine's marriage law never went into effect, though. Wow, I didn't realize that. Thanks!
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 18:43
|
|
|
Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:Wow Rand Paul The man who votes for freedom*! *Freedom only applies to the following groups...
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 19:04
|
|
|
How the hell can you guy's have your President come out for this while our defacto, atheist, female and foreign born Prime Minister has an issue with it? What the hell is happening?
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 19:26
|
|
|
Twatworth posted:How the hell can you guy's have your President come out for this while our defacto, atheist, female and foreign born Prime Minister has an issue with it? 
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 19:59
|
|
|
B B posted:Text of the memo is here: Oh god some of the comments on that thing. quote:With all do respect, do gays work? Do the gays pay bills? Do the gays buy gas? Now I know the gays are the newest, well not new, but one of the mostly highly protected elite classes in the the US today, but they still crap like the rest of us and have similar worries I take it. So instead of voting with your heart, how bout your head, or better yet, you're wallet. How's that been working out for you these days? quote:
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 20:13
|
|
|
Strudel Man posted:American Exceptionalism. Your country is one giant headfuck to those of us lucky enough not to live there. What you guys do make no sense whatsoever.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 20:17
|
|
|
I don't think Bush or Obama did crack. My impression is powdered cocaine is the thing at Harvard.
|
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 20:18
|
|
|
Twatworth posted:Your country is one giant headfuck to those of us lucky enough not to live there. What you guys do make no sense whatsoever. This is insightful and a viewpoint never before expressed on these forums!!!
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 20:31
|
|
|
Armyman25 posted:I don't think Bush or Obama did crack. My impression is powdered cocaine is the thing at Harvard. Yea it's funny in his insane 'HOW DARE YOU THINK I'M A BIGOT' rant he assumed the black dude did crack. They both did blow like, a couple times.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2012 23:00
|
|
|
Rhode Island gov. signed an executive order to recognize all out of state marriages. This is great because the law used to be that anyone passing through or employed in RI had their CT/MA same sex marriage temporarily downgraded to a civil union. The marriage and improved civil union bills are still winding through the legislature. UltimoDragonQuest fucked around with this message at 22:02 on May 14, 2012 |
|
#
?
May 14, 2012 21:07
|
|
|
UltimoDragonQuest posted:Rhode Island gov. signed an executive order to recognize all out of state marriages. Wait, so if you got married in a state that recognized same sex marriages, and then moved to Rhode Island, your marriage was automatically changed to a civil union? Even if you went back to the state you were married in? Or did RI just only recognize the marriage as a civil union for their purposes?
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2012 21:46
|
|
|
LeftistMuslimObama posted:Wait, so if you got married in a state that recognized same sex marriages, and then moved to Rhode Island, your marriage was automatically changed to a civil union? Even if you went back to the state you were married in? Or did RI just only recognize the marriage as a civil union for their purposes? The second one; Rhode Island can't affect how Massachusetts would see your wedding done in Massachusetts
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2012 21:51
|
|
|
So Colorado turned to poo poo. Civil union bill somehow got sent to a 4th committee where the Republicans finally managed to kill it, including one with a gay son. Ice cold!
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 03:03
|
|
UltimoDragonQuest posted:So Colorado turned to poo poo. Yeah. Sucks hard. I have no less than 4 gay people on my team at work who were cheering this on. Maybe next time guys 
|
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 03:19
|
|
|
Oh gently caress no. Seriously? That's total bullshit! Oh gently caress you, Republicans. gently caress you, gently caress you, gently caress you, ar;auhfg;ofh! 
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 05:07
|
|
|
It's alright, once their generation dies it'll be a nonissue. I wonder if it's possible to find a bookie somewhere who'll give me odds on the Republicans voting themselves into complete irrelevance in the next ten years?
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 07:25
|
|
|
Steak Flavored Gum posted:It's alright, once their generation dies it'll be a nonissue. I'm sorry, but that is almost painfully naive. Bigots have no problem making little bigots in their image. Just type "human being" or the homophobic keyword of your choice into Facebook's search by everyone and see how the next generation is perfectly fine with hating gay people.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 09:31
|
|
|
Gorilla Salad posted:I'm sorry, but that is almost painfully naive.  2010 and 2011  2012  Sorry for the inconsistent charts but Gallup is inconsistent with what they provide.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 09:56
|
|
|
Gorilla Salad posted:I'm sorry, but that is almost painfully naive. I think gay marriage is one of those things that is getting better with time. However, issues of race and most likely other LBGT issues are probably still in the shitter in terms of the newer generations.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 10:47
|
|
|
Oh, I don't doubt for a moment things are getting better. My issue is with the mistaken idea of "Wait for your parents to die and we'll be living in wonderland" that I see a lot of from young people. Racism, sexism and homophobia are all miles ahead of what they were in the previous generations, but when you have institutions like Liberty University and Liberty Academy indoctrinating kids from the beginning of their secondary education to the end of their tertiary with hateful right-wing bile, it's not just naive to stand by and hope that things work themselves out, it dangerous. My point is that we need to keep pushing. Because if we don't, they'll push back.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 14:37
|
|
|
This is an article I thought was perticularly interesting: http://www.salon.com/2012/05/14/our_real_first_gay_president/singleton/ Essentially, the article is attacking the notion that things always get better, using James Buchanan (who apparently was gay!) as an example - things can, and did, get worse for gay people in our history.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 15:16
|
|
|
evilweasel posted:This is an article I thought was perticularly interesting: http://www.salon.com/2012/05/14/our_real_first_gay_president/singleton/ Yeah, he is fighting against a Whig interpretation of history (The notion that we always move forward as time goes on.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 15:29
|
|
|
evilweasel posted:This is an article I thought was perticularly interesting: http://www.salon.com/2012/05/14/our_real_first_gay_president/singleton/ Oddly enough the thing that stuck out the most was that maybe I should shave my facial hair.  But really people who see marriage as inevitable are looking at the tail end of decades of fighting and legal battles and saying that it is inevitbale, just assuming history marches towards equality.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 15:49
|
|
|
The article does have some good points but I think it is being quite dishonest in suggesting that there was any sort of tolerance for gays in any period of US history before the start of the gay rights movement in the 70s. It is true that gays before WWII had it much better than they did in the post-WWII to 1960s period but that's only because in that period gays were the subject of widespread state sponsored witch hunts and harassment. Before then the anti-gay laws were enforced more sporadically but there was never any real societal acceptance or even acknowledgement for gays in this time. In the time of Buchanan the word "homosexual" wasn't even in use and they weren't recognized as a class of people, there was just the act of sodomy which was considered a terrible thing even though you were less likely to be thrown in prison for doing it at that time than in some other periods of American history.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 15:59
|
|
|
MaxxBot posted:The article does have some good points but I think it is being quite dishonest in suggesting that there was any sort of tolerance for gays in any period of US history before the start of the gay rights movement in the 70s. It is true that gays before WWII had it much better than they did in the post-WWII to 1960s period but that's only because in that period gays were the subject of widespread state sponsored witch hunts and harassment. But isn't that the entire point of the article? It literally was better in 1844 than post WWII because there weren't witch hunts for sodomites. Its not that those years were idyllic, just that It Gets Worse(tm)
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 16:05
|
|
|
Shalebridge Cradle posted:But isn't that the entire point of the article? It literally was better in 1844 than post WWII because there weren't witch hunts for sodomites. Its not that those years were idyllic, just that It Gets Worse(tm) I just think it's being dishonest in trying to suggest that "the nation" knew and tolerated that fact that Buchanan was gay. The reality is that the concept of sexual orientation didn't even exist at the time and if you had suggested that Buchanan had sex with men you'd probably be labeled as some sort of monster. It was really more ignorance and circumstance rather than tolerance that allowed Buchanan to exist as a gay man without being locked up.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 16:13
|
|
|
Isn't this throwing out a very excluded middle? It seems that things for humanity have improved overall for almost any metric you want to use, even if there are localized backswings here and there. Given the choice of living 100 years ago or 100 years from now (or any either arbitrary amount of time away from now), I doubt many people, even LGBT folks, would choose going back to going forward.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 16:14
|
|
|
Shalebridge Cradle posted:But isn't that the entire point of the article? It literally was better in 1844 than post WWII because there weren't witch hunts for sodomites. Its not that those years were idyllic, just that It Gets Worse(tm) Right: the message I took from this wasn't that things used to be great, it's that the idea that our history is an unbroken march from bad to good is a complete myth. Things weren't perfect back then but they were much better than they were later on. I think the inevitability argument for gay marriage has a lot going for it because it's not based on any myth-making so much as it's based on solid demographics, but it's important to remember that it's because of that demographic trend. It's not just we always get better.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 16:14
|
|
|
whydirt posted:Isn't this throwing out a very excluded middle? It seems that things for humanity have improved overall for almost any metric you want to use, even if there are localized backswings here and there. Well yeah but that has more to do with antibiotics and industrial farming than anything. And even then thats just the first world.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 16:24
|
|
|
Gorilla Salad posted:I'm sorry, but that is almost painfully naive. I think you're being painfully negative. Even among young evangelical Americans a lot of this poo poo is dropping away, and in mainstream America support for equality is growing across the board especially among youths. No poo poo there are shitheels out there that want to make life difficult, but they're like the Tea Party: a whole lot of press but not nearly as much representation backing them as you might think. Things will work out.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 19:02
|
|
|
Steak Flavored Gum posted:I think you're being painfully negative. Even among young evangelical Americans a lot of this poo poo is dropping away, and in mainstream America support for equality is growing across the board especially among youths. No poo poo there are shitheels out there that want to make life difficult, but they're like the Tea Party: a whole lot of press but not nearly as much representation backing them as you might think. Yeah, but the point is things work out because people are actively working to make them work out - the progression of society towards equality, tolerance, freedom, etc, are not things you can take for granted. There's always people pushing back against what might be considered "progress", and they have to be fought, always, because if you don't, it's perfectly possible they can cause society to backslide.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 19:16
|
|
|
I am not saying that people should stop fighting for it, I'm saying that there is no chance that it won't happen within our generation, so keep your heads up and don't be so negative about temporary setbacks. poo poo'll fall shortly. Besides it works in our favor eventually anyway because every single time the Republicans go and do this poo poo, another check mark is placed in the history books for the demise of the party's relevance... not that Democrats haven't hosed poo poo up pretty hard, themselves. I can't wait for DoMA to get repealed and constitutional ban or not in these states, they'll be forced to recognize gay marriages from other states anyway. Suck on that, assholes.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2012 19:22
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 03:23 |
|
|
Steak Flavored Gum posted:I am not saying that people should stop fighting for it, I'm saying that there is no chance that it won't happen within our generation, so keep your heads up and don't be so negative about temporary setbacks. poo poo'll fall shortly. The hippies of the 60's turned into the Reagan voters of the 80's. Is it likely that 20 years from now people will be more accepting than they are today? Yeah, sure. But fewer people fighting every day for equality is a good way to make a lovely future more likely than it should be.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2012 04:34
|
|
