|
I am also reading Bonehunters, and passed that part a day or so ago. As far as I can tell, he was chilling in Darujistan with the rest of the survivors of Coral. Still not exactly sure what's going on, but I think he has ascended and even Apsalar asks him that. I'll have to double-check what his mission was again, because he found and pulled Apsalar and the two ghosts-inhabiting-skeleton-bird-bodies from the shadow realm in the middle of the ocean. He was on a boat.
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2012 02:50
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 3, 2024 20:51 |
|
|
pakman posted:I am also reading Bonehunters, and passed that part a day or so ago. As far as I can tell, he was chilling in Darujistan with the rest of the survivors of Coral. Still not exactly sure what's going on, but I think he has ascended and even Apsalar asks him that. I'll have to double-check what his mission was again, because he found and pulled Apsalar and the two ghosts-inhabiting-skeleton-bird-bodies from the shadow realm in the middle of the ocean. He was on a boat. Is that After she meets with Urko in his tower and now she's going to cross A'rath Straight? Because that's literally exactly where I am right now, she's just about to go into the Shadow Realm and cross it
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2012 04:48
|
|
|
It was! That was a pretty cool scene. Now, I'm going to speculate about something, someone please feel free to shoot it down: Scillara is pregnant, right? Well, I'm pretty sure the dude that knocked her up was that guy that was going to execute her, that she stabbed while he was boning her. Thus, with the setup of the dead seed stuff in Memories of Ice, she has a child of the dead seed in her. Right? Wrong? Completely off?
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2012 06:11
|
|
|
As for some of your other questions, Paran knows Tavore is the Adjunct. As for Felisin, he knows about what happened there too, though Tavore doesn't.
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2012 06:25
|
|
|
Stew Man Chew posted:But even with the interminable slog, it's a relief to come back to Erikson after reading Return of the Crimson Guard. Erikson does the (occasionally infuriating) things he does Well, Esslemont can't even manage that. He made the turgid/skirling/ochre prose tripsy and stuttering. I dunno if I'm going to bother with more Esslemont, although (huge spoiler) I really enjoyed the treatment he gave the long and difficult battle in which Laseen died. Stonewielder can probably safely be skipped since it adds very little of worth to the series unless you're just dying to know what Kyle (he actually develops into a decent character...) and Iron Bars are up to. It has its moments but also includes lots of very pointless plot threads that, like Erikson's later books, really should have gotten some good editorial treatment. Plus the payoff isn't great - there's one or two huge mysteries you're dying to know all throughout the book and they just never get answered and most likely never will. It's a huge book but the story really feels only half-finished as important stuff was left out while unimportant worthless plot threads (the one giant guy or whatever in the completely tangential rebellion plot) take up too much space. Orb, Scepter, Throne on the other hand is probably in the top 5 or so of all Malazan novels by either author. I really liked it. I think it would work well in a first readthrough as a change-of-pace between Dust of Dreams and The Crippled God to really drum up anticipation for Erikson's finale. Esselmont is improving as an author with every book, I'll give him that.
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2012 20:12
|
|
|
I haven't read any of the Esselmont books yet, and I'm just starting Dust of Dreams (Seems promising so far) hopefully there is some cool stuff with the K'Chain Che'Malle from the intro. The Malazans are also already more interesting than they were in Reaper's Gale. Would the thread recommend reading one of the Esselmont books before going on to TCG? On the subject of future books, I'm sort of worried about the prospect of a Tiste Andii TRILOGY. I liked Toll the Hounds, but only because there was some balance between the three main plot arcs. An Andii trilogy sounds like it would just be a competition to see who could be the most morose. Anomander Rake was amazing, I especially liked how Erikson built up his reputation by having other characters talk about him while he was "off stage" instead of focusing on him all the time, but with him gone the Andii are going to be pretty dull (except maybe Silchas Ruin?) On the other hand the Karsa trilogy will be the best thing ever. I will be glad to WITNESS
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2012 15:26
|
|
|
MaterialConceptual posted:I haven't read any of the Esselmont books yet, and I'm just starting Dust of Dreams (Seems promising so far) hopefully there is some cool stuff with the K'Chain Che'Malle from the intro. The Malazans are also already more interesting than they were in Reaper's Gale. Would the thread recommend reading one of the Esselmont books before going on to TCG? Its an Andii prequel, about young Anomander I think, if that helps
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2012 18:55
|
|
|
MaterialConceptual posted:Would the thread recommend reading one of the Esselmont books before going on to TCG? If you're going to do this, read OST and ignore the others. If you haven't read RotCG (and Stonewielder? I forget) then some of the plot points with Kiska and Leoman won't make sense, but they're largely unimportant anyhow. Most of the plot focuses on Darujhistan.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2012 20:13
|
|
|
I'd say RotCG ties up some of the lingering stories brought up from Deadhouse Gates to The Bonehunters, so it is useful in that regard. It's also not a bad read, all in all, so probably worth doing to stick with the overarching Book of the Fallen storyline.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 02:08
|
|
|
CrazyLikeAMadDog posted:I'd say RotCG ties up some of the lingering stories brought up from Deadhouse Gates to The Bonehunters, so it is useful in that regard. It's also not a bad read, all in all, so probably worth doing to stick with the overarching Book of the Fallen storyline. Huh, okay. I can't say I was really dying to know what happened to Leoman and company after they burnt down that city but I guess I might check it out.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 02:21
|
|
|
MaterialConceptual posted:On the subject of future books, I'm sort of worried about the prospect of a Tiste Andii TRILOGY. I liked Toll the Hounds, but only because there was some balance between the three main plot arcs. An Andii trilogy sounds like it would just be a competition to see who could be the most morose. Anomander Rake was amazing, I especially liked how Erikson built up his reputation by having other characters talk about him while he was "off stage" instead of focusing on him all the time, but with him gone the Andii are going to be pretty dull (except maybe Silchas Ruin?) Dust of Dreams and Crippled God both got me hyped on the Anomander trilogy. I was lukewarm about it until those two books.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 02:49
|
|
|
I can't make up my mind on what to think about Karsa as a character. One one hand, he comes off as a mindless, blood-crazed barbarian, and on the other, he sometimes has moments of insight that come out as brutal honesty, but these moments of insight seem a little forced. The last Karsa POV I read in Bonehunters is when he's going off towards the Jhag Odhan with the inventor/witch. I'm not quite sure what his "quest" is at this point. I just finished the part where [spoiler]Leoman escapes with L'oric and the Queen of Dreams who has picked a new Sha'ik, and the buildings filled with olive oil have just collapsed. I really, really like the Mappo and Icarium and the Quick Ben and Kalam chapters, as I am aching to know what happens. Kalam, Quick Ben, and Stormy are were just helped by Cotillion trying to get into one of the Moon Spawns in the Imperial Warren. Mappo and Icarium just got ambushed by something in the abandoned Moon Spawn.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 06:02
|
|
|
pakman posted:I can't make up my mind on what to think about Karsa as a character. One one hand, he comes off as a mindless, blood-crazed barbarian, and on the other, he sometimes has moments of insight that come out as brutal honesty, but these moments of insight seem a little forced. The last Karsa POV I read in Bonehunters is when he's going off towards the Jhag Odhan with the inventor/witch. I'm not quite sure what his "quest" is at this point. This is exactly where I am right now, everyone's underground and they just ate all the honey that's making them all trip and have visions of their gods or something? And apparently it's Jaghut in origin? The whole scene prior was extremely tense and nerve-wracking though 
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 07:41
|
|
|
pakman posted:I can't make up my mind on what to think about Karsa as a character. Karsa comes across to me as a mixture between the "noble savage" archetype and that of a Ulysses-type clever hero. He has the outsider's perspective on civilization, and he doesn't like what he sees. That is nothing uncommon when it comes to generic barbarian characters, but what makes Karsa special is that he is not powerless in the face of civilization (Like for example Mappo's people were). He learns from his experiences, and develops and increasingly sophisticated understanding of the world. There is also actually a conceivable chance that he could sweep down with a horde of giants and destroy civilization. Most "noble savage" stories (Think The Last of the Mohicans or The Last Samurai) end with the noble savage's people being defeated and the inevitable triumph of civilization being affirmed (With a wistful sense of nostalgia for the lost wild age). Some "noble savage" stories have the "savages" fighting off the civilized people and restoring the separation of the two worlds (Think Avatar). The thing about Karsa is that he threatens to invert the typical "noble savage" story, with the "savage" world destroying the civilized world instead of the other way around. I think this is part of what makes him a compelling character.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 08:02
|
|
|
MaterialConceptual posted:Huh, okay. I can't say I was really dying to know what happened to Leoman and company after they burnt down that city but I guess I might check it out. Not a lot (any?) of Leoman in RotCG. You do find out more about : DH spoilers the Wickans after the Chain of Dogs, and D'ivers and Bonehunters spoiler the Claw, Laseen and Mallick Rel after the Bonehunters visit to Malaz City .
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 13:35
|
|
|
MaterialConceptual posted:Karsa comes across to me as a mixture between the "noble savage" archetype and that of a Ulysses-type clever hero. He has the outsider's perspective on civilization, and he doesn't like what he sees. That is nothing uncommon when it comes to generic barbarian characters, but what makes Karsa special is that he is not powerless in the face of civilization (Like for example Mappo's people were). He learns from his experiences, and develops and increasingly sophisticated understanding of the world. There is also actually a conceivable chance that he could sweep down with a horde of giants and destroy civilization. I think the most compelling thing for me about him so far is how he's progressed from where he's first started, and he is just as honorable of some of the other characters we get to see, just in a completely different way.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 17:31
|
|
|
FYI, I'm going with a little experiment and read The Forge of Darkness as it comes out, even if I only finished reading Midnight Tides. Erikson says that one shouldn't need to have read the main series in order to read this new book.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2012 20:26
|
|
|
Can one of the people who were using a kindle or whatever to lookup how many words appeared in a particular book, look up the word 'geas' in Bonehunters? It seems like it's been used A LOT in this book, after not having used it before at all, that I can remember.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2012 05:21
|
|
|
Yeah I read books. posted:look up the word 'geas' in Bonehunters? Usual: GotM: 0 DG: 0 MoI: 2 HoC: 0 MT: 0 BH: 8 RG: 2 TTH: 2 DoD: 6 TCG: 2 Seems again a thematic thing.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2012 07:17
|
|
|
Abalieno posted:Usual: Ah, I think it's something like what people were saying earlier, I'd never read the word before and had to look it up, so I think it just kind of lodged in my brain. Also can anyone get into my speculation I posted earlier? (About halfway through Bonehunters) : Scillara is pregnant, right? Well, I'm pretty sure the dude that knocked her up was that guy that was going to execute her, that she stabbed while he was boning her. Thus, with the setup of the dead seed stuff in Memories of Ice, she has a child of the dead seed in her. Right? Wrong? Completely off?
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2012 07:23
|
|
|
Yeah I read books. posted:Scillara is pregnant, right? Well, I'm pretty sure the dude that knocked her up was that guy that was going to execute her, that she stabbed while he was boning her. Thus, with the setup of the dead seed stuff in Memories of Ice, she has a child of the dead seed in her. Right? Wrong? Completely off? I think you have (MoI+BH)Scillara and Stonny mixed up. In Capustan Stonny stabbed the guy that raped her. You'll have to RAFO for more on that. I've almost forgetten but I'm pretty sure Scillara was a camp follower during the Whirlwind in HoC and was used as a prostitute by that pervert mage.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2012 07:34
|
|
|
Also neither of those two things have anything to do with children of the dead seed, that was a thing very specific to (the women in) the army of the Tenescowri.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2012 08:11
|
|
|
Yeah I read books. posted:Scillara is pregnant, right? Well, I'm pretty sure the dude that knocked her up was that guy that was going to execute her, that she stabbed while he was boning her. Thus, with the setup of the dead seed stuff in Memories of Ice, she has a child of the dead seed in her. Right? Wrong? Completely off? i'm pretty sure that (HoC,BH)scillara's baby daddy is korobolo dom, who was quite alive during conception
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2012 21:19
|
|
|
Well, just finished Memories of Ice. Itkovian Hedge The Bridgeburners Whiskeyjack  gently caress Toc Tool  Duiker!? 
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2012 20:28
|
|
|
Bonehunters: I've read some pretty neat events in the past couple days. First of all, Iskaral Pust is pretty cool in that he went toe to toe with the D'ivers that the Nameless Ones released at the beginning of the book. I like him a lot. Did I miss something in the part where Fid's squad gets out of the city-beneath-the-city, and they make it back to the Fourteenth? I don't recall anything being said about the actual trip back, except that suddenly when Kalam, Stormy, Quick Ben, and Apsalar show up, they're all there. Did Mappo really get replaced, or was this just the action of the guy that ambushed them and is going to use Icarium to kill the D'ivers? Now that Mappo is "free" of Icarium after being healed, i think it will be interesting to see him go after him again and try to knock out Icarium while simultaneously disposing of the other guy. (I am terrible with names, sorry.) I am confused as to why Paran released the Deragoth (Hounds of Darkness), and also to what Hedge had actually done saying it wasn't easy but he convinced him. He's working against Paran now? And finally the end of the section where Heboric, Scillara, Cutter, and Greyfrong are unceremoniously slaughtered by two t'lan Imass. Nothing was said of Young Felisin, though. That whole storyline seems kind of pointless now, and I'm wondering why it was even in there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2012 21:16
|
|
|
pakman posted:Bonehunters: By now you can probably tell Pust is more than he seems. Fid's squad manages to get beneath the city during the explosion and they fail to get themselves out. However the Adjunct's army returns to Y'Ghatan and is found by either Grub or Sinn (I forget which one). The Nameless Ones took it upon themselves to "guard" Icarium from everyone else. Mappo was one such guardian but since he's become a friend of Icarium the Nameless Ones wanted to replace him. The Diver's were summoned in the beginning to separate Mappo and Icarium so Taralack Veed (thank you Google!) could take his place as guardian. In the past, the Diver's were pretty much unstoppable, and the Deragoth were the only ones who could face them on equal footing. When Paran finds out the Diver's are active again he assumes the Deragoth would be needed to bring them under control and so he releases him. I don't exactly remember why that the T'lan showed up there but those two are on the Crippled God's side. RAFO.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2012 22:16
|
|
|
^Clearing some things up above: The Felisin storyline isn't over and the slaughter wasn't pointless. Faradan Sort and Sinn desert the 14th to go looking for survivors. They find the squads trapped under the city and they all decide to catch up with the 14t. On the way they meet with Kalam, Quick, and Apsalar. I think they just eventually catch up with the 14th, but it could be some scouts find them instead 5ive fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Jun 10, 2012 |
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2012 23:32
|
|
|
I think I should have worded my statement differently. I know that Sinn and the Captain went to find Fid's squad, but I just don't remember how they caught back up to the 14th. I guess they could've just walked back and found them while on the march.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 00:10
|
|
|
5ive posted:^Clearing some things up above: Didn't they send Masan Gilani up ahead on horseback? I might be thinking of something else though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 00:11
|
|
|
Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was Masan that got sent.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 01:14
|
|
|
Crimson Dragoon posted:Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was Masan that got sent. Isn't this when Masan Gilani and her ample bosom kill or mortally wound one of the D'ivers segments?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 05:34
|
|
|
bigmcgaffney posted:Isn't this when Masan Gilani and her ample bosom kill or mortally wound one of the D'ivers segments? Yes it was! She manages to wound one of them too if I recall correctly. Man, I need to refresh my Malazan knowledge. It's been more than a year since I read Bonehunters.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 06:02
|
|
|
TimNeilson posted:Didn't they send Masan Gilani up ahead on horseback? I might be thinking of something else though. Masan gets sent ahead, but her horse gets killed when the D'ivers attacks her. She kills one and wounds another. Then the group meets back up with her and they catch up to the main army as they are waiting for their transport ships to pick them up
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 07:18
|
|
|
This is exactly the case. I hadn't read that far yet, and had just assumed that the Y'Ghatan survivors, Kalam, Quick Ben, and Apsalar had just made it back to the 14th. Instead, Kalam and Quick Ben and Stormy met up with the survivors, and sent Masani ahead on Apsalar's horse which get's killed by Dejim Nabrahl. She kills one of the D'ivers and severely cripples another when the Hounds of Shadow and/or Deragoth show up. The Hounds of Shadow kill the remaining three aspects of Dejim and carry the fourth one away in its jaws, presumably to Shadowthrone/Cotillion.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2012 13:15
|
|
|
Good new interview, mostly on mythology: http://thebreathlessquills.wordpress.com/2012/06/12/interview-with-steven-erikson/ quote:The pantheon also has a lot of common characteristics with antiquity’s religions. The distinction between Elder and Younger gods is one of them for example. Hood, the god of death, is very much like the god Hades/Pluto. His somber personality and realm reminds me a lot of the ancient god of the dead. Krul (elder god) and his creation of the warrens makes me think of Ouranos (also an elder god) who created the universe.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2012 19:18
|
|
|
That interview has a bunch of good things in it, and I've always liked the rational world-building that Erikson's done. But boy, that man sure seems to love his own  .
|
|
#
?
Jun 13, 2012 03:04
|
|
|
It's interesting how much stuff surfaces when you get the references straight. For example we know that Krul has been forgotten till he gets awakened in "modern times" in Darujhistan. We know he's in some way related to Burn, and we know his cult was about blood sacrifices. And if you look up Uranus in the wikipedia you find: quote:no cult addressed directly to Uranus survived into Classical times Or the fabric of the Olympus/warrens, where the gods reside. quote:the words khthonie and khthonios had a more precise and technical meaning in Greek, referring primarily to the manner of offering sacrifices to the deity in question. There's also this interesting bit that applies to gender. It works well to explain Burn, but may even play a role in what ICE is doing: quote:"there are male and female deities at every level. We generally find men associated with the above, the sky, and women associated with the below, with the earth, water of the underground, and the chthonic deities." Maybe at some point they'll tell us that Krul and Burn are lesbians 
|
|
#
?
Jun 13, 2012 05:58
|
|
|
Dalmuti posted:i'm pretty sure that (HoC,BH)scillara's baby daddy is korobolo dom, who was quite alive during conception (HoC) I haven't read it for a while, but the book definitely mentions the guy raping Scillara cumming in her as he dies. After the big deal they'd made about children of the dead seed in the previous book, it really felt that is where they were heading with it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 13, 2012 13:37
|
|
|
I had the distinct impression that the 'magic' took place in the women receiving the seed, not the men giving it. Since Scillara was not a believer in that religion I don't think it could have the same effect.
|
|
#
?
Jun 13, 2012 14:04
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 3, 2024 20:51 |
|
|
Esposito posted:(HoC) I haven't read it for a while, but the book definitely mentions the guy raping Scillara cumming in her as he dies. After the big deal they'd made about children of the dead seed in the previous book, it really felt that is where they were heading with it. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 13, 2012 20:05
|
|
