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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:The torqueless wonder in a W123 doesn't seem like a phenomenal idea to me (but I assume you are joking). I know! It doesn't seem to make sense at first blush, but the OM616 from the 240d makes less than 100ft-lbs of torque and the F20c makes 153ft lb. Now I know the shape of the area under the curve is more important than the size of the peak, the OM617 makes all it's torque at roughly 7rpm, the F20c doesn't break 100 until 7000rpm, but consider this as well; the S2000 curb weight is 2,800 pounds, the 240d is only 3,050 pounds. That's like one extra fat guy in the seat. Additionally I have to wonder how much of that weight is from the iron-block iron-head mechanically-injected diesel engine. I haven't found weights, but the OM616 has got to outweigh the F20c and if someone said it was 200lbs difference, I'd believe them. I'm only joking in so far as I don't currently have the money to complete my stupid ideas, but perhaps by January I could afford a summit attempt of mount stupid. trouser chili fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Jul 13, 2012 |
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Jul 13, 2012 20:54
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trouser chili posted:I haven't found weights, but the OM616 has got to outweigh the F20c and if someone said it was 200lbs difference, I'd believe them. Google suggests around 785lbs for the OM617 with the manual trans and 460 for the F20c, again with a manual. That's with all the accessories mounted on both. I don't think your ideas are any dumber than my stupid desire to put a Renesis with straight pipes in my '89 740 wagon. 
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Jul 13, 2012 21:07
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You know what you must do. A 240D with an F20C. It even rhymes.
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Jul 13, 2012 21:10
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Splizwarf posted:Google suggests around 785lbs for the OM617 with the manual trans and 460 for the F20c, again with a manual. That's with all the accessories mounted on both. Yeah, the OM617 is going to be a bit heavier than the OM616 though, since it's got a whole extra cylinder in the line and a turbo bolted to the side of it. Still, it's a start. The only planning-stage problem remaining at this point is final drive. The MB diff is 3.69:1 and the S2000 diff is 4.10:1. Using the MB diff is the easier solution, as one must only have a driveshaft fabricated to connect the output of the Honda trans to the MB diff, easy-peasy just pay money to custom driveshaft shop, they're everywhere around here. Attempting to install the Honda diff into the MB chassis is fraught with complications, also they're kinda weak. Now I thought that maybe I'd make up the difference in the tire size, after all the stock MB 14-inchers are tiny compared to the s2000 16's. But I did the math on the tires, 195/70/14 on the MB, 225/50/16 on the back of the s2000 and wouldn't you know it, the difference is only .3mph at 60mph indicated.
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Jul 13, 2012 21:37
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BRZ is released for sale on Monday, price starts at 37,150 but most of interest is that the car is ONLY sold online. You have demonstrators at selected dealerships but you buy online, nominate a dealership to pick up from, where accessories are added etc. A WRX starts at 39,990. Dunno why you would get the BRZ when the 86 starts at 29K
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Jul 13, 2012 23:47
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Cat Terrist posted:BRZ is released for sale on Monday, price starts at 37,150 but most of interest is that the car is ONLY sold online. You have demonstrators at selected dealerships but you buy online, nominate a dealership to pick up from, where accessories are added etc. That's a lot of money to what essentially is a different front end, headlights and badging. Subaru are stupid.
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Jul 14, 2012 00:44
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8 grand? What the gently caress? The difference in canada is 1300 from the FRS to the base BRZ, or 3300 for the sport-tech. I heard my first BRZ at decent throttle yesterday, passed me going the other direction at a stoplight. It sounded pretty good.
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Jul 14, 2012 01:01
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Got a call from my local Scion dealer that they had an FRS available, but couldn't get out of flippin work in time to test drive it before they sold it.  I'm not trying to buy one right now, but I'd really like to test drive one to see if it'll feel suitable for DDing so that I can start preparing to order one.
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Jul 14, 2012 03:56
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Laserface posted:That's a lot of money to what essentially is a different front end, headlights and badging. Subaru are stupid. As I've been saying the BRZ doesn't fit into Subaru Aust's idea of a car lot and they aren't going let this thing touch their halo car Confession time - I've been reconsidering a Toybaru. And it's due to a ratty old Series II RX7 that I've gotten back into for a DD for a bit. Sure the Mazda has foul fuel economy, it's old but when I have the keys to the 07 WRX and I make a beeline to the RX7 anyway something is going on. Over the years we have tweaked the ratty 7's handling so it's quite a precision tool when it has it's real suspension in it. Tiny brakes but they are good enough. Lots of nolathane through the suspension, the steering shows it's a 30 year old car but you feel in general connected to the road. At the same speed in corners, the RX7 feels like it has all the time in the world to change its line, the WRX's are blunt force bludgeons that beat the corner into submission. As much as I said the BRZ isn't a car I would like for a DD, sprinting the RX7 home shows I don't have the average commute - I live in the mountains, there's plenty of roads to have a fang on. With the WRX you feel like you have beaten the poo poo out of the road and stolen it's wallet, any dickhead can do that. The RX7 feels like you have snuck up, thieved everything and vanished before anyone noticed if you have the skill to carry it off. BRZ definitely comes from the stealth theft school of handling plus it has made an impression on me as a better RX7. *sigh* I suppose I need a bigger garage anyway.
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Jul 14, 2012 04:41
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You can always wait a few years and see if the Alfa-RoMazda is gonna be any good 
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Jul 14, 2012 05:05
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Piano posted:You can always wait a few years and see if the Alfa-RoMazda is gonna be any good Or he could buy the BRZ and if he doesn't like it change to the Alfa-RoMazda  Or the S1 that Audi is never going to make
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Jul 14, 2012 05:07
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Just got back from the Toyota dealer here in Sydney and after test driving the 86, immediately fell in love with it. So I placed an order for the base model GT and it could be January 2013 before I get it.
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Jul 14, 2012 08:05
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Crustashio posted:8 grand? What the gently caress? The difference in canada is 1300 from the FRS to the base BRZ, or 3300 for the sport- The difference is nowhere near that due to different pricing methods, spec levels and options. When you compare like with like or as close as you can get, it's more like $1500
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Jul 14, 2012 13:40
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The pricing gap between USA and Canada is quite impressive. I can't think of an import that gets that close... Subaru are usually horrible with pricing Canadian models. I fully expect the price gap to be revisited next MY - better get one now.
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Jul 15, 2012 02:40
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Are you seriously suggesting they're going to jack up the price of the Canadian BRZ for the next MY? It's already overpriced for what you're getting, raising it further is going to guarantee no one buys one. The whole reason I would be getting one is that I have most if not all the features of the GTI without paying GTI prices. If they jack up the price and the MK7 turns out to be cheaper than the MK6 GTI, then I have no incentive to buy a BRZ. Plus a lot of car mags are saying the GTI will finally get a full mechanical update including a replacement of its aging engine with a new 260HP version. It'll definitely have more torque than the BRZ if the outgoing 2.0L TFSI is anything to go by. Taking all this into account raising prices on the BRZ just doesn't make a drat bit of sense. I don't think anyone wants a 2-dr sport coupe bad enough to pay close to 40k when they can get much better options for that money.
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Jul 15, 2012 04:13
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If you give a poo poo at all about which set of wheels power your car, or how your car handles, GTI vs BRZ is not a legitimate comparison.
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Jul 15, 2012 05:59
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:If you give a poo poo at all about which set of wheels power your car, or how your car handles, GTI vs BRZ is not a legitimate comparison. That's too black and white. The GTI outhandles a lot of boring rear end cars. It's not the most cost effective way to get good handling for its price, that's all.
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Jul 15, 2012 06:52
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So the launch of the Aus BRZ was... interesting. Most of the details managed to leak out beforehand including the new (for Aus at least) idea that the car would only be sold online via the website, with the launch date being today (Monday) and only ~200 cars available in the initial shipment So 12am ticks over and sure enough the subaru.com.au website is updated with all the usual info. You could book a test drive at a dealer but still no way to "buy" the car Then it leaked out that the actual buy section would be online at midday. So the subaru website starts getting hammered with 10 minutes to go and eventually goes down completely. Apparently there was some scrambling to [change hosts/internets stuff i dont understand], meanwhile dealers are screaming on the phone at HQ with customers standing there cash in hand... Eventually nearly an hour after the official midday launch the website slowly comes back up. I managed to get through fairly early and placed order 00136 but couldnt finalise it as im leasing through work and didnt have all the details sorted in time Needless to say the initial shipment is all gone and any further orders likely wont arrive until next year...
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Jul 16, 2012 06:39
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Confusion? I'm not buying a brz and even I was aware 12pm was the sale time. Obviously there was going to be a huge clusterfuck as with any online purchasing system that is for something In Limited supply, but it was clearly stated in a number of news articles. Anyway, not surprised they dropped the ball as its obvious that Subaru Oz are doing everything in their power to limit the exposure this non-AWD Subaru gets.
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Jul 16, 2012 07:35
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Laserface posted:Confusion? I'm not buying a brz and even I was aware 12pm was the sale time. Obviously there was going to be a huge clusterfuck as with any online purchasing system that is for something In Limited supply, but it was clearly stated in a number of news articles. I don't see why it's a big deal, literally no one is going to cross shop a BRZ with any other vehicle on Subaru's lot. People who want more power will just buy a WRX/STi. Being in a niche market only helps you so far, this could be a good thing for Subaru, bring people that otherwise wouldn't step on their lot. I'm more offended that Toyota decided that it needed to be a Scion in the USA, so the Toyota president literally says "Hay wtf no sports car for Toyota, let's make one" Proceeds to make one and then put a Scion badge on it in arguably their largest market. If I ever get one rebadging will be the very first thing I do.
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Jul 16, 2012 16:47
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My guess is the same reason that Subaru AU is all up in arms. Only in this case, Toyota wants to stay being known as a beige box wholesaler.
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Jul 16, 2012 17:01
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Saw my first FR-S today. Somebody in my apt building bought one. Looks like they got all the options too, "whiteout" paintjob, factory scion bumper sticker. AZ plates, I think the guy traded in his corvette, there used to be one out in the lot with AZ plates that vanished... 
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Jul 16, 2012 17:14
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Koirhor posted:I don't see why it's a big deal, literally no one is going to cross shop a BRZ with any other vehicle on Subaru's lot. Oh you are soooooooooooo wrong on that one mate.
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Jul 16, 2012 21:55
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According to this: http://www.ft86club.com/?p=1941 All the BRZs going to Australia this year are already sold.
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Jul 16, 2012 22:06
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Someone posted the sparkplug change procedure from the FSM and it looked, well like a massive pain in the arse. The whole motor has to be lowered and the exhaust disconnected and a bunch of stuff moved about, are all subies that difficult to do a plug change on? edit:                15 pages to document something like changing plugs seems a bit ridiculous but i'm guessing this is just moderncars.jpg track day bro! fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Jul 17, 2012 |
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Jul 17, 2012 00:24
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a big fwiggen terd posted:The whole motor has to be lowered and the exhaust disconnected and a bunch of stuff moved about, are all subies that difficult to do a plug change on? Sweet jesus, that's like 4th gen F-body bad. No engine dropping with the Imprezas. Edit: Actually that doesn't look too bad IF you have a lift, hoist and non rusty bits. Bulk Vanderhuge fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Jul 17, 2012 |
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Jul 17, 2012 00:40
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a big fwiggen terd posted:Someone posted the sparkplug change procedure from the FSM and it looked, well like a massive pain in the arse. The whole motor has to be lowered and the exhaust disconnected and a bunch of stuff moved about, are all subies that difficult to do a plug change on? Jesus ! wonder how much the book time is on that ?
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Jul 17, 2012 00:40
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a big fwiggen terd posted:Someone posted the sparkplug change procedure from the FSM and it looked, well like a massive pain in the arse. The whole motor has to be lowered and the exhaust disconnected and a bunch of stuff moved about, are all subies that difficult to do a plug change on? No, that's just boxerengine.jpg
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Jul 17, 2012 00:48
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I was laughing at the ridiculousness of "17) Tie the joint pipe to the front crossmember using string" until I got to the part of having to lift the engine.
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Jul 17, 2012 00:54
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Holy loving poo poo! I no longer have any interest in this car. What the gently caress were they thinking?
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Jul 17, 2012 01:12
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I'd be surprised if you can't skip some of those steps.
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Jul 17, 2012 01:25
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Yeah but you only have to replace them every 60k miles. Manual here: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8374 Schedule on page PM-3
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Jul 17, 2012 01:26
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Not even 100K mile plugs? I am sorry I ever cursed changing your plugs LT1 c4 corvette. You were not the bitch I said you were.
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Jul 17, 2012 01:45
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jamal posted:I'd be surprised if you can't skip some of those steps. Fair enough in most cases like these people find clever workarounds on owners forums and such. Do modern sparkplugs realy last for 60k miles?
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Jul 17, 2012 01:46
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a big fwiggen terd posted:Do modern sparkplugs realy last for 60k miles?
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Jul 17, 2012 03:33
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That is pretty terrifying to me as all my cars only use the last two steps.
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Jul 17, 2012 03:39
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Lots of people and forums said the WRX plugs had to be done with moving the engine around and I believe the handbook says that too. In fact the job turned out to be a great deal easier that anyone told me.
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Jul 17, 2012 03:57
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Edmunds is complaining about the lack of aftermarket wider wheels. What are the drift guys' builds using?
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Jul 17, 2012 04:29
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Probably custom spec wheels. Not hard to do if you're a drift team that wants a truck full of 'em for spares. Though I'm no wheel fitment expert, I thought the offset was similar to the Impreza/WRX - 5x100 hubs plus +52 offset should be able to get you into a 17x9 at least.
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Jul 17, 2012 04:31
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Crustashio posted:No, that's just boxerengine.jpg Yeah, it doesn't seem that much different from any other Subaru.
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Jul 17, 2012 04:39
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