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Megazver posted:http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/21693645/harmonia looks neat, I kicked in  if it makes it I doubt I will have trouble getting my monies worth.
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Aug 14, 2012 17:40
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XboxPants posted:I think devs really need to get the hint that Tim Schafer was a special situation, and in the real world you're not going to get funded with a wink & a promise, but no actual gameplay to show people what the hell they're actually funding. Hell, even if it's just mock-ups, just make something to show people. People need to understand that "pay us 5,000 to hang out with some guys you never heard of" isn't really much of an incentive at all.
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Aug 14, 2012 18:17
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This just went up: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/322438897/mercenary-kings Run & gun 2D platformer with really nice looking pixel art style. It's by the guys who made the Scott Pilgrim game and, more recently, Wizorb. Simplest way to describe it would be something like "Metal Slug with RPG elements". By that I mean stuff like vendors, weapon crafting, and mission systems. I've been following this for a week or two and frankly I think it looks pretty awesome. Best part is that unlike Project Lodus, they do have gameplay video. They actually have a working prototype from Dream.Build.Play with rough versions of most of the systems already in place. Check out that build here and see what you think: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jopRHhEnlVI
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Aug 14, 2012 18:47
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I loved Scott Pilgrim and Wizorb. These guys so far have a good track record in my eyes. I hope they get funded.
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Aug 14, 2012 18:58
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This cyberpunk thing just squeaked by its 50k goal with < 2 hours left.
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Aug 14, 2012 19:44
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TychoCelchuuu posted:This cyberpunk thing just squeaked by its 50k goal with < 2 hours left. Woah that was fast. Wasn't it at $28,000 an hour ago? Or am I remembering wrong?
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Aug 14, 2012 19:48
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A Meatslab posted:Woah that was fast. Wasn't it at $28,000 an hour ago? Or am I remembering wrong? 3 hours ago it was.
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Aug 14, 2012 19:50
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TychoCelchuuu posted:This cyberpunk thing just squeaked by its 50k goal with < 2 hours left. Hmm... quote:PLEDGE $20 OR MORE  At least they ain't bullshittin' you.
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Aug 14, 2012 19:51
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zenintrude posted:Hmm... (If they get a publisher)
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Aug 14, 2012 19:53
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Isn't it "getting shortchanged" if you donated specifically to get a game(this is a dumb reason to support Kickstarters, I know) but then don't get it? Jumping 20k in a few hours seems real shady, the way the donations were trending.
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Aug 14, 2012 19:56
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Obsurveyor posted:Jumping 20k in a few hours seems real shady, the way the donations were trending. If I had X amount of money in the bank and that was the amount needed to push me over the limit into funded territory and secure the already promised donations, you can best believe that I would be doing that... That is, if I were a shady as gently caress person. [edit] Is it pretty much established that Kickstarter is mostly full of scams and/or pipe dreams at this point, or is there not enough data to confirm this yet? I see that the backers list doesn't show how much a person paid, so it's possible that a person paid $20,000 and selected the $20 tier to make it look legit... but math don't lie, and the $113 average backer donation seems really loving unbelievable. For those playing along at home, DFA had a $38 per backer average. vvv Still not enough to yank all the ads vvv testtubebaby fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Aug 14, 2012 |
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Aug 14, 2012 19:58
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So, let's check back in on that Penny Arcade "pay us so we don't run ads" kickstarter, being that it has a mere 25 hours left. Oh it's at 480k. Only one word to say to that: Ugh. 
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Aug 14, 2012 19:58
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The most frustrating part of all this is compare the literal millionaires at PA with a multi-million dollar business basically making a KS so they can delete some jpgs out of their html site directory getting 480k for it to the Project Giana guys building a super awesome high-concept platformer complete with full demo and video currently at barely 60k or the Zombie Playground guys having a super awesome concept with alpha footage barely making their 150k goal. It's...pretty loving frustrating to say the least.
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Aug 14, 2012 20:06
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If it helps the people who gave PA money probably wouldn't have given those other people money.
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Aug 14, 2012 20:16
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zenintrude posted:Hmm... Yeah, I trust these guys to deliver on a complete game and not just gently caress around until they run out of money. quote:Garrett Schultz - Garrett has been a graphic and user interface design professional for eight years. A passionately creative person, he is actively involved in many fields of art and is equipped and excited to share his vision as Art Director. When not creating, Garrett enjoys gaming, discovering music, and finding inspiration (just check out his Tumblr!). Favorite Games: Thief: Deadly Shadows, Bioshock, The Mass Effect Trilogy.
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Aug 14, 2012 20:21
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Al! posted:Yeah, I trust these guys to deliver on a complete game and not just gently caress around until they run out of money. And I also don't understand your pessimism about their ability to deliver. I mean, really? You expect them to just gently caress around until they run out of money? What gives you any reason to think that they would do that? Except of course that this is what they've already done and what has driven them to Kickstarter. But I mean aside from that. Honestly maybe I shouldn't be dumping on this so much: the game might be really good. But really we've seen basically nothing, half of what we've seen is discouraging in its implications, and whether it will turn out good or not (or even loving get made) is basically unknowable at this point.
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Aug 14, 2012 20:37
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Obsurveyor posted:Isn't it "getting shortchanged" if you donated specifically to get a game(this is a dumb reason to support Kickstarters, I know) but then don't get it?  Speculation Station Warning Yeah, there's something really hosed up there. A spike like that, you might think someone donated a huge chunk, but there's only one backer over $400, at the $2500 tier. Almost all of the big reward tiers are completely unclaimed. So, it's all cool, right? There's been no obvious massive sudden donation. Well, here's the other problem. The average is all hosed up. As of yesterday, the average per backer was around $50-$80. So far today they've received 91 backers and $28,000. So, of the new backers, they're instead averaging over $300 per backer. Now, that would be fine on its own, it would just mean the big backers had been waiting until the end. Big problem, though. There have only been FIVE rewards claimed above $300. That's out of 91 high-roller backers. With a $300 average, there are either a ton of backers around the $300 level, or a smaller but still large number of backers at really high levels. However, there is only a SINGLE backer above $400. The other 90 backers from today would have still averaged $283, and there are still only 11 rewards claimed above $200. Sure, it's possible they decided they didn't want any of the fancy upper-level rewards. But what is STILL odd is that there is a $125 tier that would give you access to the private vertical slice, and it's only gotten claimed by 12 people. So even though these high-paying backers from today think this game is so great they want to invest hundreds of dollars, they're not interested in playing it any time soon. So we're left with a few situations. Either dozens of backers all flocked in today with hundreds of dollars each, and decided they only wanted one of the low reward tiers, or no reward at all. Or, a single, or small number of backers, donated many thousands of dollars each, and also decided not to receive any of the expensive rewards. That scenario would actually match up with the numbers pretty much perfectly - if you assume 1 person donated $20,000, the average shifts back down to $66, which is in line with what it was yesterday.
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Aug 14, 2012 20:39
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XboxPants posted:
EDIT: VV drat. The cyberpunk thing really is blatant. Shalinor fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Aug 14, 2012 |
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Aug 14, 2012 20:45
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TychoCelchuuu posted:This cyberpunk thing just squeaked by its 50k goal with < 2 hours left. It's never been more obvious that developers are sitting by waiting to make sure the Kickstarter is successful. They pulled 25k in ten seconds after struggling for weeks to make the same amount. Shalinor posted:I'm still convinced that Republique did the very same thing, they just masked it better. If you look at their KickTraq trend line, it has a few really strange vertical spikes that don't track at all with media attention. I think they just did a better job of hiding it / they broke their feed donations down into multiple bits instead. It wasn't just Republique. It's obvious that Hardcore Shooter did it as well.
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Aug 14, 2012 20:48
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Shalinor posted:I'm still convinced that Republique did the very same thing, they just masked it better. If you look at their KickTraq trend line, it has a few really strange vertical spikes that don't track at all with media attention. I think they just did a better job of hiding it / they broke their feed donations down into multiple bits instead. I'm not even sure how I feel about this. I guess it's the sneakiness about it that's troubling. Maybe something that would be really cool would be if there was a built-in system to opt-back into a failed Kickstarter and give your money even though it failed. Occupation posted:So, let's check back in on that Penny Arcade "pay us so we don't run ads" kickstarter, being that it has a mere 25 hours left. Eh, it just doesn't bother me if established creators use Kickstarters to move towards crowdfunding as an alternative revenue source. But I understand why people don't want them to do it on Kickstarter. Still kind of curious on your mindset, though. Like, would it have been okay if they were doing this with a new project? Like, let's say a well established TV or filmmaker wants to create a new TV series. They're well established enough that they could get it on network TV if they wanted, and people would be able to view that content for free in an ad-supported format. However, instead, they decide to pitch it as a Kickstarter, offering to give the show out for free online, no ads, if people want to pay for it instead. Or, a second situation, it's a current show instead of a new one. It's already on TV, but they decide to try moving online, ad-free, via Kickstarter crowdfunding. What would you think of these scenarios? Genuinely curious. Would they be better if there was another crowdfunding site that was for already-established projects that want to move to crowdfunding?
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Aug 14, 2012 20:55
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After a successful kickstarter, a week with no new information or updates is reasonable right? I mean, the moon intern developers are still tweeting about random crap so they're still alive and all
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Aug 14, 2012 20:57
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RentACop posted:After a successful kickstarter, a week with no new information or updates is reasonable right? I mean, the moon intern developers are still tweeting about random crap so they're still alive and all
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Aug 14, 2012 21:03
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Even the Double Fine and Idle Thumbs guys were saying that in all honestly if the kickstarter wasn't succeeding, they were going to find ways to embezzle money into it. I'm not sure I see what the problem is, in the end. It just means they have to put more of their own money on the line.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:06
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Occupation posted:The most frustrating part of all this is compare the literal millionaires at PA with a multi-million dollar business basically making a KS so they can delete some jpgs out of their html site directory getting 480k for it to the Project Giana guys building a super awesome high-concept platformer complete with full demo and video currently at barely 60k or the Zombie Playground guys having a super awesome concept with alpha footage barely making their 150k goal. What leads you to believe the PA guys are literal millionaires? Just because they have a million dollars in revenue doesn't mean they have a million dollars in profits. They have employees and expenses to pay. To call removal of ads from a for profit site 'simply deleting jpgs' is a huge oversimplification and you know it. By deleting those jpgs they are removing a massive source of capital and it's their right to see if readers are willing to supplement the income. Also, the kickstarter has paid for an extra multipage comic and will eventually reward some other web comic producer with the opportunity of a lifetime. The 'this project is more deserving of support than that one' game is stupid. It's a free market, and free markets make incredibly awful decisions every day. Personally I think that it's a shame that zombie playground made 150K when there are children starving in Africa (note: strawman.) In other news, less than an hour on defense grid 2. They're at 270 / 250 so they're funded, but not enough to actually make DG2. I think a bit more transparency here would be nice -- the stretch goals sorta make sense to me if you think about paying for the level design team while the real code monkeys work on a different project / new engine for DG2, but the way it's laid out is still pretty silly.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:07
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ExiledTinkerer posted:http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/21693645/harmonia A freaky combo of online tactical RPG, Roguelike aspects, and a raging obsession with old school Shining Force. Dev for this project here - don't want to derail the thread, but I just heard this was posted so I'll chime in real quick. The plan is to transfer all of the text-based stuff into the 3D view shown in the video. The game's been text-based forever, but I want to open it up to more than hardcore MUD/Roguelike players, so I'm transferring every feature to the new client one by one. That's not done yet, so the demo plays the classic text game with the new 3D maps rendered in the background. (I'd like to keep the text-based version in for nostalgia's sake, but maintaining both sounds like a pain, so we'll see.) Everything related to editing is server-side - The idea is that the server will come with the game so you can fiddle with all the content, mod it, and run your own. If people mod it, 3rd party servers will be accessible from a lobby screen so other players can check it out, like an exchange of sorts. But that's all theoretical at this point. The Kickstarter is mostly to hire someone for artwork, work full-time on the client for a while, produce all the playable content, and polish everything up.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:14
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NmareBfly posted:What leads you to believe the PA guys are literal millionaires? Just because they have a million dollars in revenue doesn't mean they have a million dollars in profits. They have employees and expenses to pay. Do you seriously think they run a highly successful website, have licensed their brand for multiple products (like the Penny Arcade Adventures series), and run two of the biggest conventions in the gaming industry and AREN'T making a serious income? If they aren't millionaires then they're either the most charitable people on the entire planet or they've got some really lousy accountants.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:18
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Synival posted:Dev for this project here In the video, I can see how you're trying to fit a smoothly-positioned character to the nearest tile, but it looks... I don't know, odd. Do you think you'll get that working better eventually, or is it more likely that you'd do tile-based movement longer term? (Personally, I have no issue with tiles, so long as you smoothly lerp from tile to tile instead of popping. Tiles are cool.)
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Aug 14, 2012 21:32
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I'm not sure I see what the problem is, in the end. It just means they have to put more of their own money on the line. If a project fails to deliver for whatever reason and people embezzled their money in it just to get the profits, that's a significant problem.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:38
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macnbc posted:Do you seriously think they run a highly successful website, have licensed their brand for multiple products (like the Penny Arcade Adventures series), and run two of the biggest conventions in the gaming industry and AREN'T making a serious income? Yeah, just for reference- back in 2003, when they got screwed over by whatever webmaster SA was using at the time, they were making something like one tenth of their expected revenue from ads alone and that was like 40k each a year or something like that. NmareBfly posted:
It really isn't, considering the level of effort to complete the project is literally deleting jpgs. Yeah, maybe those jpgs are a big source of revenue but the effort investment, itself, is deleting some images. As in: there is none. quote:By deleting those jpgs they are removing a massive source of capital and it's their right to see if readers are willing to supplement the income. So...what, I'm supposed to reward their courage in doing something that doesn't make any fiscal sense to make a philosophical "point" when they've been shown to be extremely morally...flexible in the past? quote:The 'this project is more deserving of support than that one' game is stupid. It's a free market, and free markets make incredibly awful decisions every day. Personally I think that it's a shame that zombie playground made 150K when there are children starving in Africa (note: strawman.) The "free market" argument is stupid. I'm not saying they don't have a right to run a bad kickstarter with overpriced tiers and a stupid endgoal that only barely produces a "product". I'm not even saying they don't have a right to be rewarded for running a bad kickstarter with overpriced tiers and a stupid endgoal that only barely produces a "product". I totally have a right to insult their stupid and awful kickstarter and get pissed that it gets rewarded when other, far more deserving kickstarters that actually need the cash don't get funded over the two rich geeks' vanity project to give the middle finger to the big bad advertisers. In which they need a million loving dollars to actually deliver what they promised in the first place. I just want to point out- they're about to collect 500k dollars for not doing what they stated they wanted to do. Just pointing that out.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:42
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Shalinor posted:We have summoned him! The plan is to let the player control the character as smoothly as possible and outline your current tile on the map while you move around. When you stop moving, you'll smoothly slide into the tile. For anyone who played it, Shining Force III is the model for all that. It'll probably take some trial and error to get the effect right - it's jerky in-game right now because it doesn't smoothly accelerate when sprites move, so that's on the list of things to fix along with the other million things. Alpha builds!  The real fun is going to begin as soon as the terminal window is finally ditched: client-side prediction, better inventory, chat management, yadda yadda.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:43
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Synival posted:Dev for this project here Has Minecraft given all indie devs the green light to make games that look horrible? This is a serious question and I'm not trying to poo poo on your project, it just seems like it's getting to be a thing now. quote:The Kickstarter is mostly to hire someone for artwork Hopefully this means that you think it needs to stop as well.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:44
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XboxPants posted:Eh, it just doesn't bother me if established creators use Kickstarters to move towards crowdfunding as an alternative revenue source. But I understand why people don't want them to do it on Kickstarter. Still kind of curious on your mindset, though. Like, would it have been okay if they were doing this with a new project? Yes, a full run of Automata, the comic strip, with one of the stretch goals being incidentally that the site becomes ad-free would've been fine with me. They aren't really producing a product and at the end of the day this KS "project" is a glorified charity drive. quote:Like, let's say a well established TV or filmmaker wants to create a new TV series. They're well established enough that they could get it on network TV if they wanted, and people would be able to view that content for free in an ad-supported format. However, instead, they decide to pitch it as a Kickstarter, offering to give the show out for free online, no ads, if people want to pay for it instead. Absolutely 100% fine with this. In fact, since I'm a huge TV buff, I hope at some point in the future a showrunner whose last name isn't Whedon decides to use KS in that way (although Freddie Wong already pretty much did what you described with VGHS). quote:Or, a second situation, it's a current show instead of a new one. It's already on TV, but they decide to try moving online, ad-free, via Kickstarter crowdfunding. I would be 100% fine with this and if anything endorse these developments as an extension of the intention of KS. The problem I have with the PA guys is they're taking a moral stand on this when 1) it's a dumb moral stand, ads are a part of life 2) they're pretending Adblock isn't a thing that exists and finally and most importantly 3) it's pretty hypocritical for them to assume they're totally moral and justified when their past, especially their recent past, shows them to have at least a lazy relationship with morality.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:48
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XboxPants posted:This just went up: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/322438897/mercenary-kings  Sold.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:49
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Fergus Mac Roich posted:
It's a very nice looking KS and I'm interested in it, but I'd like it to borrow (heck, even steal) significantly from PSO/MH like they said they'd like it to in their video. Basically I want it to be an online Metal Slug with loot.
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Aug 14, 2012 21:51
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zenintrude posted:Hopefully this means that you think it needs to stop as well. Yeah, virtually none of the art in the video is what I want to use. The character I'm using is something I whipped-up for demonstration. It bothers me when homebrew / indie games throw up programmer art and call it good, but good art is crazy expensive, so I get it. Still, bad sprites drive me nuts, and it turns me off from a lot of projects. So yeah, I want things to look good.
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Aug 14, 2012 22:01
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Synival posted:Yeah, virtually none of the art in the video is what I want to use. The character I'm using is something I whipped-up for demonstration. It bothers me when homebrew / indie games throw up programmer art and call it good, but good art is crazy expensive, so I get it. Still, bad sprites drive me nuts, and it turns me off from a lot of projects. So yeah, I want things to look good. Occupation posted:It really isn't, considering the level of effort to complete the project is literally deleting jpgs. Yeah, maybe those jpgs are a big source of revenue but the effort investment, itself, is deleting some images. As in: there is none. Alright, that's true that removing the ads will be easy enough that you could call it zero effort. Oh wait I forgot about that thing when they also have to make a year's worth of comics too That second situation that you said you'd be okay with (a TV show moving to crowdfunding for the next season) is identical to what PA is doing. XboxPants fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Aug 14, 2012 |
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Aug 14, 2012 22:04
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They were going to make the comics regardless if the Kickstarter failed or succeeded.
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Aug 14, 2012 22:05
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Harlock posted:They were going to make the comics regardless if the Kickstarter failed or succeeded.
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Aug 14, 2012 22:12
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Occupation posted:So...what, I'm supposed to reward their courage in doing something that doesn't make any fiscal sense to make a philosophical "point" when they've been shown to be extremely morally...flexible in the past? You're not supposed to, you're given the option to. It makes perfect fiscal sense -- what wouldn't would be to just remove the ads without supplementing the income. I'm not sure they're trying to make a ~point~ either. They just want to get rid of the ads but don't want to make less money. quote:In which they need a million loving dollars to actually deliver what they promised in the first place. You seem to think they promised something they didn't. "Leaderboard Ad Removed, $250k Goal" "All ads on homepage removed. $525k goal" The campaign has been totally transparent from the get go. Sure they wanted to get rid of all the ads, but they didn't make the goal for complete ad removal so they won't. I don't see the problem. Edit: Okay, maybe not totally transparent. Some stretch goals were hidden, some still are. But the main ones, about ad removal, were always displayed. NmareBfly fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Aug 14, 2012 |
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Aug 14, 2012 22:15
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XboxPants posted:
Oh wait that's what you meant? Well, despite it being a literal impossibility with the current TV production model (unless they wanted to start like a ten million dollar ks, and even then it probably wouldn't be enough), no, I wouldn't really be cool with a showrunner or production studio trying to crowdfund a season they were gonna bankroll anyways.
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Aug 14, 2012 22:16
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