|
ImpAtom posted:I had more fun with every game you mentioned there, including Mystic Quest. I would argue each one is mechanically superior to FFVIII and the only contest the stories have is a race to the bottom. Even you're basically saying that it's fine as long as you don't actually be critical about it, which isn't something you should ever have to say about a great RPG. No, I said the aspects a lot of people deem bad aren't game-ruining, they're just being overly critical. It does a lot of things right. Enc-None? Gimme. No need to grind EXP? Awesome. The worst thing I consider about FF VIII is its steep learning curve, but once you get the hang of it, you've probably already broken the game. EDIT: Azure_Horizon posted:Like usual, I don't agree with this assessment. Its good aspects begin and end on Disc 1, aside from a couple music tracks here and there and Esthar's design. I can't put it above any other game in the franchise for losing all steam 25% in. 
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 00:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 20:29 |
|
|
I feel like calling FFVIII's learning curve steep is like saying a kid's pool has depth. The game has tutorials for everything you need to know, and aside from some bullshit hidden mechanics that don't really have much of an effect on anything, you can learn all you need to know either from the first desk terminal or inside the game menu. VVV On top of that, by making Enc-None a feature you SHOULD have on at mostly all times, what else is there to do besides be subjected to the worst jRPG plot ever? Azure_Horizon fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Sep 30, 2012 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 00:38
|
|
|
Pyroxene Stigma posted:No, I said the aspects a lot of people deem bad aren't game-ruining, they're just being overly critical. It does a lot of things right. Enc-None? Gimme. No need to grind EXP? Awesome. The worst thing I consider about FF VIII is its steep learning curve, but once you get the hang of it, you've probably already broken the game. You're praising it for being a game where you can and should avoid all the combat. I guess I just can't see how that meshes with being a good game. I'm not trying to be insulting I just don't get it. Why is it a good game because it allows you to skip playing most of it?
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 00:38
|
|
|
Azure_Horizon posted:what else is there to do besides be subjected to the worst jRPG plot ever? It's like you've never even played a Tales game! Seriously though, people have different tastes and that's why every game is the worst game in the series. This topic doesn't go anywhere interesting when its constant reiterations why X game is totally the most horrible one for real totes!
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 00:52
|
|
|
Bear Sleuth posted:It's like you've never even played a Tales game! Especially when we could all safely agree that game is XI but for some reason we won't.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 00:53
|
|
|
Bear Sleuth posted:It's like you've never even played a Tales game! Tales' games at least stick to a point for most of the game. Azure_Horizon fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Sep 30, 2012 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 00:55
|
|
|
I liked VIII because it tried to do some different things with the game mechanics and I thought the world was one of the more interesting ones in FF. XI and XIV should just be called "Final Fantasy Online" or w/e and it bothers me that they're part of the main series.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 01:10
|
|
|
Bear Sleuth posted:Yes! I hope you are playing one of the remakes because what are you even doing?! It works like this: first rank is targeted 50% of the time, second 25% of the time, and the back two spots are targeted 12.5% each. Rotating the heroes through the top rank is a more effective method of mitigating damage than healing or spending thousands of gold on armor. It is the number one secret trick to successful and non-grindy approach to the game. Alternately just put a Fighter in front and keep his armor up to date and every monster in the game will hit him for 1 damage until the Undersea Shrine. FF1 is seriously way easier than 2 and 3 unless you make a total nonsense party or something.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 01:15
|
|
|
Azure_Horizon posted:Tales' games at least stick to a point for most of the game.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 02:51
|
|
|
Endorph posted:Tales games at least usually have a couple of likable characters. No joke I didn't like a single character from 8. Except maybe Laguna, and also I liked Edea when I was 14 and was all "hey, check out those CG boobs. Nice". Of course, that doesn't quite cut it anymore. Worst Cid in the series, though. At least you got to kill Cid Raines twice.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 03:20
|
|
|
Hit or miss Clitoris posted:Worst Cid in the series, though.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 03:30
|
|
|
Hit or miss Clitoris posted:No joke I didn't like a single character from 8. Except maybe Laguna, and also I liked Edea when I was 14 and was all "hey, check out those CG boobs. Nice". Of course, that doesn't quite cut it anymore. Worst Cid in the series, though. At least you got to kill Cid Raines twice. I kind of liked XIII's Cid. He reminds me of Peter Banning from Hook.  VIII really had a poo poo story, but I think having the major characters all grow up together in the same orphanage could've made a great plot element in a better game, but with the characters knowing and remembering it and not having GFs suck their memories out or whatever. But I did like some of VIII's characters, just not the ones who got the lion's share of the screen-time.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 03:47
|
|
|
CloseFriend posted:My least favorite Cid is the one from XII, since if memory serves he's the only Cid who is actually willingly, persistently inimical to the party. I prefer to think that Al-Cid is the game's true Cid.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 03:53
|
|
|
VIII had all the ingredients of a highly unique and entertaining experience, but they were mostly undercooked. Some are fun to fiddle with regardless, even if they're pointless in the end.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 03:57
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:You're praising it for being a game where you can and should avoid all the combat. I guess I just can't see how that meshes with being a good game. I'm not trying to be insulting I just don't get it. Why is it a good game because it allows you to skip playing most of it? Because I can get back to playing the card game faster. I loved that card game and the plot wasn't
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:04
|
|
|
Barudak posted:Because I can get back to playing the card game faster. I loved that card game and the plot wasn't It's weird, because I used to like the card game too until I found out just how you're supposed to play and manipulate it and realized it was just as much RNG bullshit as FFIX's card game.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:08
|
|
|
Azure_Horizon posted:It's weird, because I used to like the card game too until I found out just how you're supposed to play and manipulate it and realized it was just as much RNG bullshit as FFIX's card game. No card game, fictional or real, has ever been as much RNG bullshit as FFIX's card game.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:26
|
|
|
fount of knowledge posted:No card game, fictional or real, has ever been as much RNG bullshit as FFIX's card game. Fire up a copy of Culdcept Saga and prepare to begin swearing uncontrollably at the TV until you beg for the rigid logic and predictability of Tetra Master.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:31
|
|
|
8 is pretty much like 2, in that it deserves to be seen and discussed for how weird and inventive it is, but unlike 2 I'd say it's worth experiencing firsthand. I don't think it's a good game, either mechanically or narratively, but it's an interesting and different one to which I massively warmed up with the benefit of hindsight. When you're expecting the Next Great Final Fantasy it's a disappointment, but as one game in 13 main-series titles I don't mind it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:33
|
|
|
fount of knowledge posted:No card game, fictional or real, has ever been as much RNG bullshit as FFIX's card game. With the mechanics behind Triple Triad, I beg to differ.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:34
|
|
|
Think this is the point where I link this: http://www.tripletriadflashonline.com/en/inscription. No idea how well-known this site is, but just in case you guys don't know about it, there you go.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:42
|
|
|
Azure_Horizon posted:With the mechanics behind Triple Triad, I beg to differ. Triple Triad's mechanics are pretty reasonable. The rules are what is bullshit but they're reasonably controllable.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 04:51
|
|
|
Alright, I think I'm going to play through FF6 to the end (which I've never done oh god). What's the best version? SNES classic or GBA remake?
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:08
|
|
|
Stoat posted:Alright, I think I'm going to play through FF6 to the end (which I've never done oh god). Wildcard option, Awful Fantasy on PC. GBA though if you want to be a big baby and be able to understand the story, or what to do next or not have enemies/characters randomly die.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:09
|
|
|
Stoat posted:Alright, I think I'm going to play through FF6 to the end (which I've never done oh god). EDIT: I still miss the Vanish-Doom glitch, though. 
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:17
|
|
|
Stoat posted:Alright, I think I'm going to play through FF6 to the end (which I've never done oh god). The differences between them are very small. The GBA version has an expanded script, some bugfixes, and bonus content that's not really worth writing home about. The SNES version looks and sounds better, but the entire evasion stat does not have any effect and the truncated script may lack some compelling details or cause you to become bemused at transparent bowlderizations. If you're going to emulate, there's a patch somewhere that makes the GBA version sound like the SNES version.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:17
|
|
|
I've said it numerous times, but I honestly actually prefer the SNES's bugs for whatever reason. Sure, it's not true to the way the game was intended to work, but I dunno, I've always been a bit of a cheater when it comes to this kinda thing no matter how easy a game is. I feel kinda naked if I can't run the Vanish/X-Zone trick, haha.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:41
|
|
|
I gotta disagree with regard to the script anyway, FF6 is one of my favorite games and I really don't see what's unclear about the SNES version. The actual plot of the game is really simple and the motivations of the characters straightforward. Honestly tho it's a wash. Pick whichever console you're more comfortable with or have access to if you're playing a real copy. EDIT: I can't say this for a certainty, but it felt like the GBA version also did some numerical rebalancing (aside from bugfixes) that made physical attacks weaker. It doesn't matter much since a lot of characters just spam special abilities and it's not like the game is difficult either way.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:43
|
|
|
Bear Sleuth posted:Yes! I hope you are playing one of the remakes because what are you even doing?! It works like this: first rank is targeted 50% of the time, second 25% of the time, and the back two spots are targeted 12.5% each. Rotating the heroes through the top rank is a more effective method of mitigating damage than healing or spending thousands of gold on armor. It is the number one secret trick to successful and non-grindy approach to the game. I'm playing the original NES version. The GBA version is too easy and I don't own the PSX or PSP version.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:55
|
|
|
Zombies' Downfall posted:EDIT: I can't say this for a certainty, but it felt like the GBA version also did some numerical rebalancing (aside from bugfixes) that made physical attacks weaker. It doesn't matter much since a lot of characters just spam special abilities and it's not like the game is difficult either way.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:55
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Triple Triad's mechanics are pretty reasonable. The rules are what is bullshit but they're reasonably controllable. Considering the rules are intricately tied into the game, I'd consider it a TT mechanic as well, by definition.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 05:56
|
|
|
Zombies' Downfall posted:EDIT: I can't say this for a certainty, but it felt like the GBA version also did some numerical rebalancing (aside from bugfixes) that made physical attacks weaker. It doesn't matter much since a lot of characters just spam special abilities and it's not like the game is difficult either way. Most of the bugs in the SNES version work out in the player's favor, and take the form of neglecting to include some value in combat equations. As The White Dragon points out, one of them was that some relics that were supposed to penalize damage actually do so.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 06:26
|
|
|
Question for all of you… What are your feelings on the way weapons worked in XII? Specifically, I mean the way different weapons calculated weapon damage using different stats, e.g. daggers using the character's strength and speed; staves using the character's strength and magic; poles going against magic defense instead of physical; guns using purely stats from the weapon. Personally, I thought it was a really great way to keep different kinds of weapons relevant, and it gave the player actual reasons to give these weapons to a character besides, "I have to because of the guy's class." It actually really surprises me that the idea hasn't shown up in more RPGs. But what do you guys make of it? Bongo Bill posted:Most of the bugs in the SNES version work out in the player's favor, and take the form of neglecting to include some value in combat equations. As The White Dragon points out, one of them was that some relics that were supposed to penalize damage actually do so.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:01
|
|
|
I was fine with those weapon mechanics except for the random damage of... I believe it was Axes, could have been Hammers, too. That's a stupid mechanic and needs to die.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:04
|
|
|
CloseFriend posted:Question for all of you… What are your feelings on the way weapons worked in XII? Specifically, I mean the way different weapons calculated weapon damage using different stats, e.g. daggers using the character's strength and speed; staves using the character's strength and magic; poles going against magic defense instead of physical; guns using purely stats from the weapon. 'Course, part of the problem is that it makes for one hell of a balance issue. If a character has high Strength, sure, that's cool, all it does is affect your base attack with most weapons. However, if a character has a high Speed, they'll not only do more damage with a Speed-based weapon, but they'll even get more turns out of it provided that's your game's main turn frequency stat. You can balance it to a certain extent by changing the weapons' base attack power or increasing the CT for using your normal attack with them, but take that too far and you'll end up with a bunch of boring weapons that look different but basically act the same as long as you put them on the right characters. It's tough.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:08
|
|
|
Speed actually has only a very small effect on the ATB bar filling in FFXII. Charge time for attacks, modifiers like Haste and Slow, are far more important.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:16
|
|
|
CloseFriend posted:Question for all of you… What are your feelings on the way weapons worked in XII? Specifically, I mean the way different weapons calculated weapon damage using different stats, e.g. daggers using the character's strength and speed; staves using the character's strength and magic; poles going against magic defense instead of physical; guns using purely stats from the weapon. I thought it was pretty nifty; Matsuno games tend to have equipment mechanics like this, where different gear is useful in different ways, instead of a pure upgrade system. As TWD points out, the characters' stats aren't so different as to make a huge difference by themselves, but the three kinds of armor types complement the weapon types. Heavy armor provides extra strength, mystic armor gives extra magic power, and medium armor tends not to give much of either, but gives extra HP. A character using a strength-based weapon would probably want to use heavy armor, while a character using a weapon less reliant on strength may do better with the extra HP from medium armor. Of course, the armor classes have other strengths and weaknesses too; and throw in various element boosting, -halving or absorbing, status protections, etc. and there is a lot you can consider and min-max in the equipment options. Azure_Horizon posted:I was fine with those weapon mechanics except for the random damage of... I believe it was Axes, could have been Hammers, too. That's a stupid mechanic and needs to die. This was a bigger problem in games like FF Tactics, where you're dealing with small numbers and infrequent turns. Having used a bunch of the random damage weapons thanks to IZJS, I can say that they perform just fine, especially when you can swing them every few seconds. They also seem less inclined to screw you with low damage numbers than they did in Tactics. Schwartzcough fucked around with this message at 07:21 on Sep 30, 2012 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:18
|
|
|
Like all things FFXII, the International version makes the different weapon formulas much more notable and important. Example: The Katana uses MAG in its damage formula. As such, when they made the "Katana using class" (Because the first thing they did when making the IZJS classes was "What weapon is being used?") wear Mystic Armor Which boosts magic and has high magic resistance, but low physical defense. So the the Katana using Samurai class is a somewhat physically frail, but quick and powerful, physical attacker.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:21
|
|
|
I'm playing through FFXII right now and I like the different weapon mechanics. Since Vaan is sort of good at both magic and strength, I gave him a katana (uses magic and strength in its damage formula) and put on a magic hat with some heavy armor. Works pretty well but drat is that game a grind.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:27
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 20:29 |
|
|
Captain Vittles posted:I prefer to think that Al-Cid is the game's true Cid. Cidolfus on the street, Al-Cid in the bedroom.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2012 07:43
|
|
