Paedogeddon on the British Paedoisles - Paed Heath

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Paedogeddon on the British Paedoisles - Paed Heath

tithin: Nov 14, 2003; [Grandmaster Tactician]

marktheando posted:

Nothing has happened to Rupert though, he just threw a lot of other people under the bus, and I'm sure he will continue to do so until this all blows over. He's too rich and old and powerful to suffer any serious consequences like jail time. The absolute worst thing that can happen to him is that he will be forced to retire to spend more time with his billions.

Except that he's been able to hide behind plausible deniability up until now, ie, "I didn't know anything it was always someone else". He can't behind this now. That's proof that he himself knew, approved, and was pleased by the bribery of a us military official.

# ? Nov 19, 2012 22:58

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Apr 16, 2024 09:08

Rodatose: Jul 8, 2008; corn, corn, corn

In the last thread, I was wondering about possible US charges regarding the FCPA and did some research into how effective it's been:

"I checked to see if there were any updates from the families of 9/11 victims hacking allegations (that'd be the Milly Dowler story to get the public aware for the US), but nothing since the FBI announced it last August. With the DoJ investigation into the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act announced last summer, there's also nothing; that's a less-promising lead anyway because while the FCPA can fine corporations plenty."(Siemens got fined $1.6 billion(!) in 2008 for bribery charges), it does not have the best history with prosecuting individuals who work for US publicly-traded companies:[/quote]

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/28/business/for-wal-mart-lots-of-bribes-but-little-jail-time-common-sense.html? posted:

The Foreign Corrupt Practices Act, which outlaws the bribery of foreign officials by American executives, carries stiff penalties for those convicted: fines of up to $5 million and up to 20 years in prison.

So who�s likely to go to jail [over the Walmart de Mexico bribery scheme]?

No one, if past precedent is any guide.

...37 of the 57 companies involved in bribery enforcement actions from 2005 to 2010 settled bribery accusations and had no related individuals charged.

...That is not to say that no one has gone to jail for violating the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act. Albert J. Stanley, former chairman and chief executive of KBR, the global contracting concern that was once a subsidiary of Halliburton, was sentenced in February to 30 months in prison for a scheme to bribe Nigerian authorities in return for contracts to build liquefied natural gas facilities. Frederic Bourke, co-founder of the handbag maker Dooney & Bourke, was sentenced to one year and a day for his involvement in a scheme to bribe officials in Azerbaijan in a failed effort to take over the state-owned oil company. Last year, eight former executives of the German technology giant Siemens were charged with bribing Argentine officials in what the Justice Department characterized as �a stunning level of deception and corruption.� But the defendants live abroad and may never be successfully prosecuted in the United States.

I couldn�t find a case of an executive at a major American-based, publicly traded company who was successfully prosecuted and sent to jail. A majority of individual prosecutions appear to involve people of relatively limited means who are in smaller or privately held companies or who are officials in foreign companies based outside the United States, where there is little likelihood of a conviction. A typical case seems more like that of Gerald and Patricia Green, two Hollywood producers who were convicted of bribing the head of the Bangkok film festival. The couple was sentenced to six months in prison followed by six months of home confinement in 2010. At the time, Mr. Green was 83 years old and suffered from emphysema.

�It does appear that executives from U.S. public companies are not being pursued with the same vigor as individuals at private companies or who work on their own,� said Richard L. Cassin, founder of the firm CassinLaw and author of �Bribery Abroad� and �Bribery Everywhere.� �There are still a lot of enforcement actions against corporations where there are no indictments against individuals. The percentage of criminal cases against individuals is still very tiny.�

I've got two questions, though: did Murdoch deny knowing of any practices of paying officials, or was that just phone hacking? If the former...

Then if any kind of judgment is passed in the US that acknowledges the truthibility of that alleged e-mail where Murdoch acknowledges the practice of paying officials for information, will that have any consequences in evaluating his testimony in the UK?

# ? Nov 19, 2012 22:58

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

Tweet of the day

quote:

Wouldn't it be amazing if there was a 20 minute tape of someone laying out how the whole pants thing was done?

# ? Nov 19, 2012 23:49

Warrahooyaargh: Sep 15, 2007; Oh the mundanity

Brown Moses posted:

Tweet of the day

Is it too much to hope for that such a tape might actually exist?

At the moment it seems as if various papers are just re-running the 2005 story of the underpants picture without adding anything new. Are they just egging each other on to obtain and publish incriminating evidence?

# ? Nov 19, 2012 23:58

Byolante: Mar 23, 2008; by Cyrano4747

I hope that for my birthday that recording gets released. I have been a good boy all year!

# ? Nov 20, 2012 03:12

Hong XiuQuan: Feb 19, 2008; "Without justice for the Palestinians there will be no peace in the Middle East."

Is it wrong to want Murdoch to spend the rest of his life in prison?

# ? Nov 20, 2012 11:02

A Fancy 400 lbs: Jul 24, 2008

Yes. He's 81, the rest of his life isn't nearly long enough.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 11:08

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

The Daily Mail and Independent have picked up on the story, guess the mainstream press think there's something to it as well.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 11:33

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

Charges being announced at the moment:

quote:

Op Elveden: Andy Coulson and Rebekah Brooks charged in connection with payments to police and public officials
Rebekah Brooks and Sun reporter John Kay charged on suspicion of paying MoD officer �100,000 between 2004 and 2011

quote:

Charged on Op Elveden Andy Coulson, Rebekah Brooks, Clive Goodman, John Kay & MOD official Bettina Jordan Barber

quote:

Andy Coulson and Clive Goodman charged with alleged payment to public official in exchange for Buckingham Palace phone directory

Guardian live blog here.

quote:

Charge 1

Clive Goodman and Andrew Coulson, between 31 August 2002 and 31 January 2003, conspired together and with a person or persons unknown to commit misconduct in public office.

Contrary to s.1(1) of the Criminal Law Act 1977

Charge 2

Clive Goodman and Andrew Coulson, between 31 January 2005 and 3 June 2005, conspired together and with a person or persons unknown to commit misconduct in public office.

Contrary to s.1(1) of the Criminal Law Act 1977

Brown Moses fucked around with this message at 11:41 on Nov 20, 2012

# ? Nov 20, 2012 11:36

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

Here's the full charges

Andy Coulson & Clive Goodman

Charge 1

Clive Goodman and Andrew Coulson, between 31 August 2002 and 31 January 2003, conspired together and with a person or persons unknown to commit misconduct in public office. Contrary to s.1(1) of the Criminal Law Act 1977

Charge 2

Clive Goodman and Andrew Coulson, between 31 January 2005 and 3 June 2005, conspired together and with a person or persons unknown to commit misconduct in public office. Contrary to s.1(1) of the Criminal Law Act 1977

Bettina Jordan-Barber, John Kay & Rebekah Brooks

Charge 1

Bettina Jordan-Barber, John Kay and Rebekah Brooks, between 1 January 2004 and 31 January 2012, conspired together, and with others, to commit misconduct in public office. Contrary to s.1(1) of the Criminal Law Act 1977

[edit] All other uncharged suspects bailed to January 2013.

Brown Moses fucked around with this message at 12:07 on Nov 20, 2012

# ? Nov 20, 2012 11:51

zeroprime: Mar 25, 2006; Words go here.; Fun Shoe

So have some of these people started giving evidence against each other/other papers/people outside the immediate scope of the investigation in hopes of a plea bargain? I'd love to see the snakes turning on each other.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:07

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

zeroprime posted:

So have some of these people started giving evidence against each other/other papers/people outside the immediate scope of the investigation in hopes of a plea bargain? I'd love to see the snakes turning on each other.

I think the lower down the food chain they go the more likely that is, but Coulson and Brooks must realise they are facing a lot of jail time at the moment.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:08

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

zeroprime posted:

So have some of these people started giving evidence against each other/other papers/people outside the immediate scope of the investigation in hopes of a plea bargain? I'd love to see the snakes turning on each other.

I don't think US-style plea bargains are A Thing in the British justice system. You can negotiate about pleading guilty to some charges in return for having others dropped, but I think that's about it.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:10

Pozzo: Nov 4, 2009; What is like posting in a thread?
A Ballista, that's what!

Comstar posted:

In the words of Dark Helmet: Absolutely nothing.

Does anyone seriously believe that anything is going to happen to Rupert Murdoch?

Fat Guy Sexting posted:

Remember when this story first broke and everybody said 'nothing would happen' and from it there's a move towards greater press regulation, Paul Dacre making GBS threads himself, Rupert Murdoch confined to a racist twitter account and the News of the World got shut down?

You're going to have, in the next two days, an actual 'NewsCorp bribed US Official to commit War Crime' story with FOX and friends already infighting and breaking apart over the election defeat.

Is this question and answer in the OP yet? I've been lurking this thread and its predecessors for a year and a half now, and it seems every time something new happens or someone else gets drawn into it or the evidence mounts someone new springs up asking "But seriously nothing is going to happen right Brooks/Murdoch/Coulson/Bloo/Blah will never get charged/caught/questioned/punished/photographed in their pants"

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:23

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

Interestingly Brooks was working at the Sun at the period the 3rd set of charges cover.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:25

Hong XiuQuan: Feb 19, 2008; "Without justice for the Palestinians there will be no peace in the Middle East."

Brown Moses posted:

I think the lower down the food chain they go the more likely that is, but Coulson and Brooks must realise they are facing a lot of jail time at the moment.

There's no way Brooks could handle prison. I imagine she'll sing like a canary soon. How long before she vomits beans all over the place?

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:30

thehustler: Apr 17, 2004; I am very curious about this little crescendo

Vomits beans :lol:

Is that a saying?

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:31

prefect: Sep 11, 2001; No one, Woodhouse.
No one.; Dead Man’s Band

Hong XiuQuan posted:

There's no way Brooks could handle prison. I imagine she'll sing like a canary soon. How long before she vomits beans all over the place?

In the US, we have "country club" prisons for white-collar crooks. Does the UK have the ssme kind of thing?

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:34

Pasco: Oct 2, 2010

prefect posted:

In the US, we have "country club" prisons for white-collar crooks. Does the UK have the ssme kind of thing?

Yeah, Cat D open prisons.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:55

Small Strange Bird: Sep 22, 2006; Merci, chaton!

prefect posted:

In the US, we have "country club" prisons for white-collar crooks. Does the UK have the ssme kind of thing?

Yes; noted perjurer Jeffrey Archer was in an 'open' prison for a while, being allowed out to work and have home visits, but ended up abusing his privileges by having lunches with his Tory mates and was sent back to an actual prison.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 12:57

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

I've been rejected by the BBC journalism trainee scheme, loving sucks.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 13:27

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

Brown Moses posted:

I've been rejected by the BBC journalism trainee scheme, loving sucks.

You probably have too much integrity for the job imho.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 13:38

Plavski: Feb 1, 2006; I could be a revolutionary

Brown Moses posted:

I've been rejected by the BBC journalism trainee scheme, loving sucks.

gently caress, sorry to hear that. You're being noticed though, so your cachet will be large enough soon that someone somewhere will want to get you working for them.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 13:42

WastedJoker: Oct 29, 2011; Fiery the angels fell. Deep thunder rolled around their shoulders... burning with the fires of Orc.

Just noticed this on BBC website:

# ? Nov 20, 2012 13:45

Twisted Perspective: Sep 15, 2005; I've come to see you...

Brown Moses posted:

I've been rejected by the BBC journalism trainee scheme, loving sucks.

It's the BBC - your most important qualifications are what school you went to and your current post code.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 13:48

Rude Dude With Tude: Apr 19, 2007; Your President approves this text.

Twisted Perspective posted:

It's the BBC - your most important qualifications are what school you went to and your current post code.

And whether or not you can attract a youth audience.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 13:55

Hong XiuQuan: Feb 19, 2008; "Without justice for the Palestinians there will be no peace in the Middle East."

Brown Moses posted:

I've been rejected by the BBC journalism trainee scheme, loving sucks.

Guardian CIF was posting on Twitter looking for stories to commission - you could try thinking of something to write and submitting a summary to them to give you a kickstart. Get as much writing off your blog done as possible.

https://twitter.com/commentisfree/status/270817813684420608 <-- not sure they're inviting submissions or just ideas but get in touch with them anyway.

Also judging by your Twitter feed, you *must* have some contacts who can help you commission work or at least joint commission work - anyone from the beeb or other broadsheets. Have you considered asking @jackofkent to help you get an opinion piece in the broadsheets.

This way you can bypass the journalism trainee bit which would probably funnel you towards production and get acknowledged right away for your writing.

Hong XiuQuan fucked around with this message at 14:39 on Nov 20, 2012

# ? Nov 20, 2012 14:19

rejutka: May 28, 2004; by zen death robot

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad posted:

And whether or not you can attract a youth audience.

Ah, Jimmy got it arse about tit.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 14:34

prefect: Sep 11, 2001; No one, Woodhouse.
No one.; Dead Man’s Band

Brown Moses posted:

I've been rejected by the BBC journalism trainee scheme, loving sucks.

Condolences. Don't give up, though. You seem to have a knack for this kind of thing.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 14:37

Warrahooyaargh: Sep 15, 2007; Oh the mundanity

Payndz posted:

Yes; noted perjurer Jeffrey Archer was in an 'open' prison for a while, being allowed out to work and have home visits, but ended up abusing his privileges by having lunches with his Tory mates and was sent back to an actual prison.

... which says all we need to know about the Tories' willingness to turn a blind eye to wrongdoing if you're the right sort of chap.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 14:59

DaWolfey: Oct 25, 2003; College Slice

rejutka posted:

Ah, Jimmy got it arse about tit.

No, he got plenty of arse and tit.
(sorry)

# ? Nov 20, 2012 15:06

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

The Saddam pants story has now reached the Arab press as well, which will hopefully give it even more legs.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 20:50

OppyDoppyDopp: Feb 17, 2012

Zephro posted:

I don't think US-style plea bargains are A Thing in the British justice system. You can negotiate about pleading guilty to some charges in return for having others dropped, but I think that's about it.

You can get a SOCPA agreement (what used to be called turning Queen's evidence), but they're reserved for defendants prepared to help prosecute serious and dangerous offenders. The best anyone who has been charged with 'just' hacking phones can hope for is the judge taking their cooperation into account at sentencing (if they also admit it - blaming others without a guilty plea of your own would just be seen as a classic cut-throat defence).

# ? Nov 20, 2012 21:27

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

quote:

News Corp exposed to growing legal threat following charges for tabloid duo

The new round of criminal charges brought in the UK against former senior News International editors has once raised again the prospect that Rupert Murdoch's New York-based parent company may be prosecuted under US anti-bribery laws, and complicates the rehabilitation of his son James as a possible successor to lead the global media empire.

The charges brought against Rebekah Brooks, who ran Murdoch's newspaper holdings in Britain, Andy Coulson, former editor of the now defunct News of the World, and two other former News International employees exposes the parent News Corporation to possible action under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act. The FCPA exists to prosecute US-domiciled companies for acts of bribery and corruption that they might commit abroad.

An official of the British ministry of defence, Bettina Jordan Barber, also faces trial for allegedly receiving �100,000 from Murdoch's tabloid newspapers for information that led to a series of published stories. The allegation that money passed hands clearly falls within the legal remit of the FCPA.

Mike Koehler, professor of law at Southern Illinois school of law and author of the blog fcaprofessor.com, said the charges "would be hard for the Department of Justice and the Securities and Exchange Commission to ignore. We have been hearing allegations for a year and a half now, now we clearly have charges against high ranking officials at a foreign subsidiary," he said.

The new charges, and the allegation of bribery of a military official, come as a setback for News Corporation at a very sensitive time for the company. The media giant is preparing to split itself in two, separating the TV and broadcasting arm from the scandal-hit newspaper and publishing division.

The developments also bring to a crashing halt the recent perception in America that News Corporation had begun to recover its confidence after months on the defensive as a result of the phone-hacking scandal. Only on Monday, the New York Times ran an article headlined Clouds Lifting Over Murdoch, He's Out to Buy Again.

News Corp has largely shrugged off the scandal in the US, where its shares have risen over 34% in the last year. At News Corp's recent annual shareholder meeting in October, Murdoch comfortably saw off attempts to appoint an independent chairman to the company. James Murdoch has recently been tipped to head Fox Networks, the News Corp television division that includes its flagship Fox channel, home to The Simpsons and American Idol.

But the new charges will increase pressure on the company. Koehler said US authorities would be looking to see how high up the chain of command the bribery scandal reached. "The question will be what did James know and when did he know it," he said. Ultimately he predicted News Corp would reach a settlement with the Justice Department rather than go to trial, but he said that News Corp faced some uncomfortable investigations in the coming months.

The FCPA has two main components, one that relates to the bribing of foreign officials and another that relates to books and record keeping. It is often the latter that causes companies the biggest headaches. Characterising a bribe as "miscellaneous expense" is a serious offence.

"This latest news is an escalation of the FCPA case," said Koehler. But he said he expected the case could still take some years to be resolved.

The latest legal difficulties to hit News Corporation could also potentially have ramifications on its 27 TV licences within the Fox network � the real financial heart of the operation. Three of the licences are up for renewal, and in August the ethics watchdog Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (Crew) filed a petition with the US broadcasting regulator, the Federal Communications Commission, that called for them to be denied on the grounds that the company did not have the requisite character to run a public service.

Melanie Sloan, Crew's director, said the charges of the four former News International employees played into its petition. "News Corp argues that the conduct in Britain shouldn't matter here in the US, but the Atlantic ocean doesn't have cleansing properties � if Murdoch is seen to be unfit to run a global company in the UK, then he's unfit in this country, too."

In May, the UK Commons culture committee censured Murdoch in their report into the phone hacking scandal, saying that he was "not a fit person" to exercise stewardship of a major international company.

So far there have been no confirmed cases of News Corporation employees engaging in illegal activities within the US. This week the Daily Beast alleged that the Murdoch tabloids the Sun and the New York Post may have made payments to a US official on American soil in order to obtain a photo of a captive Saddam Hussein, the deposed Iraqi leader, in his underwear. News Corporation has denied the claims.

Mark Lewis, the UK-based lawyer who has represented many of the victims of News of the World hacking, has been investigating possible cases of data breaches within the US but has yet to issue legal proceedings.

# ? Nov 20, 2012 23:29

Mc Do Well: Aug 2, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

fuctifino posted:

You probably have too much integrity for the job imho.

They have Adam Curtis and they seem ashamed of him. No one wants real journalism these days

# ? Nov 20, 2012 23:40

The X-man cometh: Nov 1, 2009

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad posted:

And whether or not you can attract a youth audience.

You could point them here...

# ? Nov 21, 2012 00:48

HUGE PUBES A PLUS: Apr 30, 2005

It's behind a paywall, but WSJ has an article about News Corp and CBS in talks to merge book publishing businesses. CBS owns Simon and Schuster, News Corp owns Harper Collins.

# ? Nov 21, 2012 01:02

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

Alan Partridge on Hacked Off and Leveson

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2acBU66AYE

# ? Nov 21, 2012 13:01

Plavski: Feb 1, 2006; I could be a revolutionary

Brown Moses: Weapon Fetishist

Coming this winter to a twitter feed near you.

# ? Nov 21, 2012 16:30

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Apr 16, 2024 09:08

Brown Moses: Feb 22, 2002

Plavski posted:

Brown Moses: Weapon Fetishist

Coming this winter to a twitter feed near you.

Funnily enough that's the header on my CV.

# ? Nov 21, 2012 16:41

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Paedogeddon on the British Paedoisles - Paed Heath

«‹›99 »