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Deviant posted:So my $500 car needs a $500 repair, thus, I'm on the market. I wouldn't buy a used car on a 60mo note. 5 years is a long time for a used car without a warranty (after a couple of years). Note that even with a $500 repair on a $500 car, it may be worth keeping if the car is otherwise in good shape, if that is your only motivation. There is very little difference between a 2010 Mazda 3 and a 2004-2009 except that you don't get the weird rear end grin on the 2010. I'd probably prefer a pre-2010 to a 2010. The RX-8 has been covered. You need to buy an RX-8 from someone who drove it like it meant to be driven and check the oil often (and changed it frequently). They consume oil by design -- an RX-8 that isn't consuming oil would be broken. If you can't check your oil frequently, don't own one. And don't buy an automatic. The WRX has some well documented piston issues. The newer ones are worse than the older ones. The sentra is a bland mobile in the years you're looking at.
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Dec 28, 2012 01:13
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Proposed Budget: 5-7000 cash New or Used: Used Body Style: Smallish wagon How will you be using the car?: Commute, long trips, moving things, might end up sleeping in it every once in a while but I'm kind of short so that's easy. Luxury features are unimportant. I'll take cloth over leather any day. What aspects are most important to you?: In order from most important to least.. Available as RWD or AWD Available with a manual transmission Something enjoyable to drive, I care about handling over speed but it shouldn't be sluggish Reliability / low cost of ownership, assuming I keep up on preventative maintenance. It'd be nice to have something decently fast, or able to be decently fast with some tasteful mods. An interior that gets the most out of the space EX Subaru wagon interiors) No giant boat cars, for example an a4 wagon is just the right size, the a6 wagon is too big for me. Have an odd love for rear facing back seats but this one's a long shot. Don't mind tracking down rarer cars, for the right car I will travel basically anywhere on the west coast. ... MPG isn't too important Import/domestic doesn't matter function>form but it shouldn't be ugly Don't just tell me to buy a WRX they sell for a lot in the northwest and I'm not going to find one with a clean title and under 200,000 abused miles. If there REALLY are WRX's out there, tell me where I can find them. I live in the USA Right now I would like to buy a ~2000 manual a4 avant wagon with quattro and the 1.8t (am I right that the 1.8T outperforms the v6 with a few mods?) but there has only been one of them around my price in WA/OR in the past three months and someone bought it before me. It was low miles, stock, and really clean too. Ugh. Any other models I would be interested if I like the a4 avant? Drunken Lullabies fucked around with this message at 03:16 on Dec 28, 2012 |
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Dec 28, 2012 03:14
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In order for you to get into a 2000 Audi A4 Avant, the Reliability concern needs to be the lowest thing on the ladder. Seeing how it's the 4th thing on the most important list, it needs to drop to like 10th place to be a serious contender.
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Dec 28, 2012 05:17
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Look, if you're set on a 2000 A4 with the 1.8t, just go ahead and buy one. Nothing anyone posts here is going to convince you otherwise so let's just move the thread along.
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Dec 28, 2012 06:02
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Throatwarbler posted:Look, if you're set on a 2000 A4 with the 1.8t, just go ahead and buy one. Nothing anyone posts here is going to convince you otherwise so let's just move the thread along. AI meets BFC: Please reaffirm my stupid idea to buy an old unreliable European car. I swear someone posts in here every week asking if they should buy a $5000 Euro with reliability as one of their things of concern. There is a book called "The Dog and Lemon Guide" a couple of New Zealand auto journalists write every year that has run downs on many popular cars with the main focus being reliability, safety and value for money. In the entire 2010 edition (There must be like 1000 reviews in it) there might be 3 Euro cars that get better than average marks for reliability.
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Dec 28, 2012 06:24
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Just go look at JD Power rankings every year. Least Reliable Car Manufacturer: Volkswagen Highest Customer Satisfaction: Volkswagen
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Dec 28, 2012 07:14
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Then recommend me a wagon? I'm not set on it, it's one of the only awd+manual+wagons in my price range.
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Dec 28, 2012 09:23
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I currently drive a 1988 BMW 528E. It has had a few problems in the past. I've driven it for over 8 years now, and it's probably around 320K miles. The odometer broke at 284K, so I'm estimating the mileage. I purchased it when it was in it's early 200K miles, probably 210K to 220K, I don't remember exactly. Right now I'm having some sort of electrical problem with it that I can't diagnose. I purchased the car for $900 initially, and over the course of 8 years, I've spent around $5000 on repairs total, not including maintenance that I do myself (brakes, oil, filters). I'm going to be calling the mechanic tomorrow for a quote to see if they might know what it is. My question is, at this point in time, would it be easier to go for a used car that is checked out in terms of maintenance and quality? Or should I just keep fixing my old BMW? The old BMW runs great, it just has intermittent problems every 6-12 months. If I were to look at getting another car, it would be a used Honda Civic or used Toyota Corolla. I'm particularly looking at Honda Civics, I know the 1990s ones were very good quality and incredibly reliable. Some information that is filled out according to the OP: Proposed Budget: Around $3000.00 New or Used: Used Body Style: 4 Door Compact Sedan How will you be using the car?: Traveling from Point A to Point B (mainly commute and running errands) What aspects are most important to you? Reliability, cost of ownership/maintenance, and MPG. (in that order) Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
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Dec 28, 2012 09:38
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^^^^^^^^ Focus with anything but the base engine (Zetec, Duratec, or PZEV only). The newest and best condition one you can find. Drunken Lullabies posted:Then recommend me a wagon? I'm not set on it, it's one of the only awd+manual+wagons in my price range. $7000? 2005 Legacy Wagon (NA motor). Kind of unicornish, but they're out there if you look (unlike the GT). When you do find them, they're much cheaper than the outbacks. SOHC pre-2005 Legacies will mostly be fine too, though head gaskets can be an issue there (but not as often as in DOHC motors). If you fond an older legavy with a recent HG job (on both sides with revised, or even better STI, gaskets) you'll be just fine. Even a BMW x-drive wagon would be less of a disaster than a B5 A4. nm fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Dec 28, 2012 |
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Dec 28, 2012 09:56
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nm posted:^^^^^^^^ I've never dealt with Fords before. You're saying that I should avoid Zetec, Duratec, and PZEV? Those seem to be the only models that I can find on Craigslist, or it's not listed.
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Dec 28, 2012 10:47
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Ideal Paradigm posted:I've never dealt with Fords before. You're saying that I should avoid Zetec, Duratec, and PZEV? Those seem to be the only models that I can find on Craigslist, or it's not listed. No, those are the ones you want that are not the base engine, which is the SPI, or Split Port. This clunker: http://www.focushacks.com/images/engines/EngineSPI.jpg
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Dec 28, 2012 10:54
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nm posted:^^^^^^^^ The Impreza was also a true wagon in previous generations.
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Dec 28, 2012 14:38
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nm posted:I wouldn't buy a used car on a 60mo note. 5 years is a long time for a used car without a warranty (after a couple of years). To respond to these points in somewhat order: - I'm leaning more towards 48 now. - The car is in 'rough' shape all around. Body damage, interior is falling apart, rough ride. All around, I'm just 'eh' on fixing it. - I'm flexible on the year, the '10 is just what i've been looking at, and they seem to be similarly priced. - The RX8 was really more of a 'Ooh, that's neat!' look. I don't have the dedication to keep it set up right. - Same with the WRX.
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Dec 28, 2012 16:27
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:The Impreza was also a true wagon in previous generations. I said small wagon, so the Impreza works. That's what I would be buying if a single one had come up under 7k in the past 6 months here (Been searching for those for a while, I just helped a friend buy a newer I've found a few 05 legacy wagons, but they all have title issues. Drunken Lullabies fucked around with this message at 20:16 on Dec 28, 2012 |
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Dec 28, 2012 20:12
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Ideal Paradigm posted:The old BMW runs great, it just has intermittent problems every 6-12 months. I vote for sticking with your old BMW. For $3000, you can find something like the suggested Focus that is much newer, for sure. But I think you should expect any $3000 car to have an intermittent problem - read: a maintenance item costing a few hundred bucks - every six months or so. Getting a manual transmission will help, getting your car inspected before you buy it will help too, but you're looking exclusively at cars with a lot of miles on them and that means stuff is going to be wearing out periodically. Heater cores, suspension components, fuel pumps, radiators, etc.; plus the usual maintenance items (tires, belts, brakes, fluids). Your BMW at least you have the service records and knowledge of what's already been fixed or replaced. You've put $5k into new parts and stuff in the last few years - and of course, don't think of it as if it's worth that, sunk cost fallacy etc., but you will at least know that that stuff has been done. With a $3k used beater you buy, it will be harder to know unless you can find someone with complete service records for the car (unlikely but it does happen sometimes). Mind you, maybe you're sick of your car made in 1988. Maybe it's time for a change. A new (to you) car can be a fun thing to do regardless. Just... I'm not sure you're going to save all that much on maintenance and parts, assuming you're not paying a large premium for BMW service compared to domestic. e. Oh yeah: Phone posted:Just go look at JD Power rankings every year. As Noted VW Apologist Forums Poster Leperflesh, I feel I should step in here and make a point. Cars these days are way, way more reliable than they used to be like 20 years ago. Just as the old-timey rule-of-thumb "change oil every 3000 miles" is obsolete, but still thrown around all the time, and also "honda or toyota, they're the only truly reliable cars" is also thrown around all the time still but isn't really true any more: people shopping for cars generally put way more emphasis on reliability than they should, anymore. Any new car sold in the US today should go for 200k miles at least. Gone are the days when manufacturers routinely sold cars with 50k mile expected lifetimes. Timing belts on collision heads are fading away. Auto transmissions frequently last the full life of a car, especially if the fluid gets changed two or three times along the way. Cars are cleaner, more efficient, safer, more powerful, and more dependable than ever before. To quote J.D. Power themselves, from their 2012 Dependability Study press release: quote:Strong initial quality of 2009 model-year vehicles--which were produced during one of the toughest years for the automotive industry--has translated into historically high levels of vehicle dependability in 2012, according to the J.D. Power and Associates 2012 U.S. Vehicle Dependability StudySM (VDS) released today. So yeah. VW isn't at the top of the list (although it isn't dead last either) for reliability. But reliability is (or should be) decreasing as a major or the most important factor when considering a vehicle purchase. One should of course still consider significant known problems with individual models of car, especially on the used market. But factors such as safety, fuel efficiency, comfort, capacity, utility, driving characteristics, and even styling should (in my opinion) usually be considered ahead of a marque's general reputation for reliability when buying a car made in the last, say, 5 to 8 years. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 21:12 on Dec 28, 2012 |
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Dec 28, 2012 20:53
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Right now, it seems that the problem could be as bad as the wiring loom needing replacement or the starter. If the wiring loom needs replacement, it will be upwards of $1000.00, would that be worth keeping the old BMW?
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Dec 28, 2012 23:10
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It sounds like you're not doing the work yourself (and replacing the entire wiring loom doesn't sound like much fun so I can't blame you). Is it the case that all of the wiring is rotten, though? Or is it that there's a short somewhere and your mechanic would rather replace the loom than try to find it and fix the one wire causing problems? To answer your actual question, though: I dunno. Doing this $1000 service probably isn't going to significantly increase the resale value of the BMW. If the work is done well, it'll mean no issues with the wiring in the next several years. But replacing the whole loom might also introduce a new issue if there's a mistake made somewhere, and that's completely possible (depending on how complex the wiring loom is on this car, which I don't know). $1000 is less than $3000, though. Nobody can predict perfectly how much your BMW is going to cost you in the next two or three years; you can maybe look up averages, but your car isn't necessarily average. And more importantly, how much per year will the $3000 car you buy cost you? Again, hard to say, but $1000 a year wouldn't be outrageous as a starting point. So it's kind of a difficult judgement call. I'm mostly just trying to make sure you understand that it's not a clear-cut decision. At least not when you're thinking about $3000 used cars. If your budget was more like $6k to $8k, I'd say you can get a used car which is much more reliable/costs less per year. That's kind of a sweet spot in used car-buying, assuming you avoid luxury cars, exotics, and classic/collectable cars. With a car that isn't in one of the above categories, you can find examples at $6k to $8k which have reasonably low miles, lack of horrible rust, and will mostly just need routine maintenance (tires, fluids, filters, brake pads) for the next few years. At $3k, though, you're looking at old beaters. And you already have an old beater. It's much harder to be sure you're "trading up" at this price point.
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Dec 28, 2012 23:29
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CornHolio posted:1. READ THE OP! 1) Done 2) I don't think I need a recommendation because I'm pretty sure I have what I want picked out, but if you feel the need to tell me I'm an idiot and go with what you recommend, please, be my guest. EDIT Upon second read this previous line may seem snarky. I don't mean it to be, I'm looking for serious advice because I don't know exactly what I'm doing with such a big purchase. 3) Live in U.S. Hello! I've already posted in the BFC forum because I didn't know this thread had moved, but they were kind enough to point me in the right direction and answer some of my questions. Now I want to get input from you guys to see if I'm doing anything blatantly wrong. For the past eight years I have owned the same car. At the beginning of 2005 I purchased a 2002 Pontiac Grand Prix SE 3100 for ~$10,000 at 59,000 miles. She has been kind to me beyond words for how irresponsible I was with taking care of her. In those eight years I've put on 70,000 miles and that includes a trip from Iowa to Seattle and back, moved me to Kansas, taken me to Texas and back, and now to Michigan. However, she's tired now and deserves a break. I've ran her ragged and didn't take as good as care as I should have and we're at the stage where all four wheel bearings are going, and the transmission is going. Total fixing cost for that would sit around $3000, and then I wouldn't know how long I'd get till the next big thing on her. Over the years I have already put ~$5000 into her for breaks, coolant leaking, a transmission fix (not replacement). Which means the total cost of her was ~$15,000 which is just under $2000 per year and getting about 10,000 miles on her per year. This summer I'm going to have to drive from Michigan to Seattle and work there, and then back to Michigan in August to finish up some school. For the last year and a half I've been thinking about putting my girl to bed and getting a new one, and this upcoming drive has finally pushed me over the edge into taking the plunge. When I first started looking at cars I did a ton of research. Since I'm the type to drive a car for years and years without feeling that itch to change I went looking for reliability as my number one driver. Part of that is because I have family all over the place and taking a nine hour drive to see any one of them is not rare. Because of that I settled on Hondas, Volkswagons, and Subarus. Deciding I didn't like the Honda styles I narrowed it down to two, and then I didn't like the lack of utility from the Volkswagons I was down to Subarus. I decided on a Subaru Outback Sport because I liked them the most and they offered the positive consumer reports I wanted out of a car. Also, I have been driving automatic and want to go back to manual. Which people have criticized since I'm going to be living in a big city environment (Seattle area or another metropolis). I don't know how much that will affect me since I did learn driving with a manual at age 12, and I miss it. After coming to figuring out I wanted a Subaru I went to the dealership and test drove some cars. They tried to offload some used ones on me, but considering that the 0-3 year used Subarus are just a few thousand less than a new car I decided that purchasing new for all the warranties and to 'fo-sho' knowing the history of the car the couple thousand was worth it. I loved the cars I drove, but suddenly had to move to Michigan and it was too soon to buy a new car so I put it off for school. Now in 2013 they have just released the Crosstrek which comes in manual and is pretty much the Outback Sport of the late 1990's that I fell in love with and an extra 8.5" of ground clearance. Perfect for me since I see myself hanging out in the mountainous ares of the Pacific North West as much as my job will allow me. I was worried about it being a new car and the quirks that come with it, but that was settled when I heard that this one comes from the Japanese plant which is the same area that the Sports come from, and their history is impeccable as far as Consumer Report goes. This is the car I want and the justification I had for coming to this decision. I know this is a nebulous question, but I'll try it. Do you see any problems with my reasoning for this car? Now to the nuts and bolts. The car (2013 Crosstrek - orange color) with the options that I want comes to $23,103 on the website, at the dealer they gave me a quote of $23,152 and the extra $49 is labor. Checks out. They are trying to get me to do this thing that costs $400 that is a "clay polishing" of the paint to help it stay nice over the years. Supposedly they take a very fine clay and polish it into the car to make the paint very smooth so dirt will just glide off it. Over in the BFC forum they said this procedure is bullshit, but I'd like your opinion on this. They're giving me $1000 for trade in value on my old girl, and considering I didn't tell them about the problems with the transmission and wheel bearings I'm quite happy with this number. The "Documentary Fee" is $190 and I don't know what this is, taxes are $1,401.96, and license and fees are $47. This brings it to a total of $24,189.96 (with the clay polishing). I was planning on doing a $10,000 down payment, and financing the rest at 3.9% for 72 months which is $221.71 per month. I'm doing this just to keep low costs for the rest of school and then I'll be able to pay it off very quickly after I graduate and go to full time work. The questions I'm looking to get answered are: 1) Do you see any problems with my reasoning for this car? 2) I intend to own this car for >10 years and I figure the price is fair where I'll get a price of ~$2,000 a year again. Is this a good price point? 3) What's up with this clay polish stuff? 4) Do you see any area that I have missed out on as far as covering all the bases? 5) Is my reasoning that this will be a good, reliable car since it's from the same factory sound reasoning even though it's a completely new model? 6) Is the financial plan of getting some payments and then paying it off after I have a job reasonable? 7) What, if any, advice can you get on getting them to lower the price? 8) Was this post too long? Thank you all so much for your help, and thanks to the BFC people for telling me that they moved this thread! Earth fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Dec 28, 2012 |
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Dec 28, 2012 23:49
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Well, I just bought a 2013 Crosstrek so I'm probably uniquely qualified to answer questions about it. 1) Do you see any problems with my reasoning for this car? Buying a new car isn't necessarily the most reasonable thing, but I can't argue against it since the Crosstrek was exactly what I wanted and I bought it new. It'll almost certainly be a very reliable car as it's mostly an impreza with more ground clearance. I believe it's been for sale in other markets for a while so it's not totally new either. 2) I intend to own this car for >10 years and I figure the price is fair where I'll get a price of ~$2,000 a year again. Is this a good price point? The price looks a bit high to me, you should find out what dealer invoice is on the thing. What options did you get? $2000 a year major maintenance costs seems high for most used vehicles though, so I don't know if that's the best watermark for you to be using to justify something new. I drove a Jeep Cherokee with 160k miles on it for a few years and I didn't hit that, nor did I on any of the other used cars I've owned with fewer miles. Unless maybe you're counting things like oil changes and tires and whatnot. Buying a car new is almost never going to save you money over used. That doesn't mean you shouldn't buy one, but it's not something you're going to be able to sell as the 100% logical financially responsible choice. 3) What's up with this clay polish stuff? Bullshit. You do clay bar cars to get stuff off of them after they've been driven a lot, but this is just silly. Same with any extended warranty bullshit they try to sell you. 4) Do you see any area that I have missed out on as far as covering all the bases? Sounds like you hosed up your current car through shoddy maintenance, don't do that again? The car being known for reliability isn't going to make it so you don't have to take care of the thing. 5) Is my reasoning that this will be a good, reliable car since it's from the same factory sound reasoning even though it's a completely new model? Mentioned above. 6) Is the financial plan of getting some payments and then paying it off after I have a job reasonable? I'll let the more financially smart folks answer this, but you should make sure there are no pre-payment penalties, and shop around for good rates if need be. 7) What, if any, advice can you get on getting them to lower the price? Step one is going to be finding out what dealer invoice is on the options you want. 8) Was this post too long? Waaaaaay too long.
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Dec 29, 2012 00:12
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OK wow yeah that's a long post even by my verbose standards. I'll address a few things:Earth posted:I've ran her ragged and didn't take as good as care as I should have and we're at the stage where all four wheel bearings are going, and the transmission is going. Wheel bearings are cheap and easy to replace. You don't say whether your car was an auto or a manual, nor do you describe exactly how the transmission is "going," but it's possible that your $3000 estimate is correct, or wildly off. I assume your estimate is from a reputable independent mechanic, and not from a dealership, right? quote:Total fixing cost for that would sit around $3000, and then I wouldn't know how long I'd get till the next big thing on her. Over the years I have already put ~$5000 into her for breaks, coolant leaking, a transmission fix (not replacement). Which means the total cost of her was ~$15,000 which is just under $2000 per year and getting about 10,000 miles on her per year. You never know how long it is until another "big thing" affects a used car, that's true. But the two really expensive things are 1) replacing an auto transmission and 2) replacing the engine. If there's nothing really wrong with the engine, then replacing the transmission should in theory mean no more large ($2k+) expenses in the near future. And bear in mind that often an old engine can be fixed without total replacement, especially if you're diligent about oil changes and catch any sudden change in condition quickly (suddenly burning or leaking oil, for example). quote:This summer I'm going to have to drive from Michigan to Seattle and work there, and then back to Michigan in August to finish up some school. For the last year and a half I've been thinking about putting my girl to bed and getting a new one, and this upcoming drive has finally pushed me over the edge into taking the plunge. First; no, you don't "have" to drive from michegan to seattle and back: you could fly, and have your car shipped, and this may or may not cost more. But perhaps more importantly: what's the worst that could happen? If your car breaks down somewhere in the middle of nowhere, you'd have a bad day. Tow trucks, cell phones, repairs at a remote garage somewhere. But how much money is "avoid one bad day" worth? $1000? $4000? Because you're suggesting it's worth in excess of twenty thousand dollars, and I'd bet it isn't really. quote:When I first started looking at cars I did a ton of research. Since I'm the type to drive a car for years and years without feeling that itch to change I went looking for reliability as my number one driver. Part of that is because I have family all over the place and taking a nine hour drive to see any one of them is not rare. Because of that I settled on Hondas, Volkswagons, and Subarus. Whaaaat. No, dude, no. I'm a Noted VW Apologist but even I would never claim a VW is in the top three for reliability. Honda has such a reputation, but is no longer a clear leader across all its cars (which is to say, several other makers are doing as well as Honda these days). Subaru is in the middle of the road: it's behind the top Japanese makers in reliability (Honda, Toyota), probably about in line with the mid-tier (Subaru, Mazda, Nissan) and maybe ahead of the least-reliable Japanese maker (Mitsubishi). Roughly. But, read up five posts for my screed on why reliability shouldn't be one's first criterion for picking a new car anymore. So I'm more just saying your reasoning here makes little sense, rather than saying you definitely shouldn't buy a Subaru. quote:Deciding I didn't like the Honda styles I narrowed it down to two, and then I didn't like the lack of utility from the Volkswagons I was down to Subarus. What does "utility" mean to you? I suspect you mean "off-road capability" in which case you're absolutely right, Subaru has a deserved reputation for excellent AWD across its whole range of vehicles. And VW does make an SUV but it costs too much. But. You listed "reliability" as your first and most important factor, and you didn't mention "offroadin'" at all. Why is this suddenly important to you? quote:I decided on a Subaru Outback Sport because I liked them the most and they offered the positive consumer reports I wanted out of a car. Also, I have been driving automatic and want to go back to manual. Which people have criticized since I'm going to be living in a big city environment (Seattle area or another metropolis). I don't know how much that will affect me since I did learn driving with a manual at age 12, and I miss it. Going to a manual is a good plan, in terms of (very-)long-term reliability, since they're cheaper to fix or replace than an auto. But other than that, yeah, inching along in traffic and negotiating steep hills is usually a lot more pleasant in an auto, unless you just really enjoy rowing through gears all the time and using the handbrake to avoid rolling backwards into the rear end in a top hat who is crowding your rear bumper at a steep uphill stop sign. But yeah if you want a manual, go for it, it's fine. quote:After coming to figuring out I wanted a Subaru I went to the dealership and test drove some cars. That is good. But have you test-driven anything else? If not, you are comparing a new car to an old used car and that's not fair for deciding which new car you would actually love. Maybe you should not worry too much about how much off-roading you'll be doing in the mountains of the Pacific Northwest (really, how many logging roads do you think you'll be negotiating? Because if you're just talking about ski trips and car camping, you can get by with literally any car at all. The roads are plowed and at most you might have to put on chains occasionally.) quote:They tried to offload some used ones on me, but considering that the 0-3 year used Subarus are just a few thousand less than a new car I decided that purchasing new for all the warranties and to 'fo-sho' knowing the history of the car the couple thousand was worth it. You don't seem to have negotiated on price for any of these cars. You need to understand that a used car on a dealership lot always has a sticker price that represents a hilarious profit for the dealer. The assumption is that you will haggle. I think you should assume that you can get 10% off at a minimum, and if you negotiate hard you can often do even better. New car prices are more fixed but still often negotiable. You can contact several dealers, send them the specs you want, tell them you're checking with several dealers, and ask for their best price. Play them off against each other. This is not shady, it's quite common these days. quote:Now in 2013 they have just released the Crosstrek which comes in manual and is pretty much the Outback Sport of the late 1990's that I fell in love with and an extra 8.5" of ground clearance. Perfect for me since I see myself hanging out in the mountainous ares of the Pacific North West as much as my job will allow me. Again, how much offroading do you really expect to be doing? Have you ever done it, ever? The SUV Mythos has been constructed by highly-paid advertising geniuses for the last 20+ years, but it always was and still is 98% bullshit. This is not to say the Crosstrek isn't a capable vehicle - it is - but it's incredibly rare for an owner of a high-clearance offroad-capable SUV to ever see anything worse than a few miles of gravel or a couple inches of snow. Which can be handled adequately by any car with a functional suspension. And the other 99.9% of the time it spends on the road, you are paying for compromises (weight, fuel efficiency, perhaps safety, ability to park on the street, etc.) made to give you that unused capability. quote:I was worried about it being a new car and the quirks that come with it, but that was settled when I heard that this one comes from the Japanese plant which is the same area that the Sports come from, and their history is impeccable as far as Consumer Report goes. I don't think this is meaningful. Cars are mostly made by robots and it doesn't make a lot of difference what country the robot lives in. Much more important is the design decisions made, the quality of parts used, and to what extent the maker has cut corners on the above two things in order to improve profit margin. Subaru has a deserved reputation for reasonable quality, so I don't fault you for picking one, but I don't think that your "same factory" factor has much meaning. quote:This is the car I want and the justification I had for coming to this decision. I know this is a nebulous question, but I'll try it. Do you see any problems with my reasoning for this car? This may be unfair, but I think you picked the car you want from a combination of aesthetics (you liked the look of the Outback Sport, which I can understand because I have always liked it too) and fantasies about rugged outdoorsmanship and the majestic peaks of the fabled West. I think you've done a great job of rationalizing that decision with mostly spurious logic. I think you want a new car, and don't want to just buy a 6 year old, $8k to $10k car that would do everything you want for half the money, and that's OK, but you should be honest with yourself about it. quote:Now to the nuts and bolts. The car (2013 Crosstrek - orange color) with the options that I want comes to $23,103 on the website, at the dealer they gave me a quote of $23,152 and the extra $49 is labor. Checks out. No it doesn't! That's MSRP! Don't pay MSRP for a new car unless it's one of the (very few) cars that are in such demand dealers can't keep it on the lot. I don't think that's the case here. quote:They are trying to get me to do this thing that costs $400 that is a "clay polishing" of the paint to help it stay nice over the years. Supposedly they take a very fine clay and polish it into the car to make the paint very smooth so dirt will just glide off it. Over in the BFC forum they said this procedure is bullshit, but I'd like your opinion on this. It's total bullshit. You can go to Autozone and buy a clay bar kit for $30 or less. And the clay is for removing poo poo that's stuck in the clearcoat: rubbing a clean car with clay does not "protect" anything or smooth the paint or anything like that. quote:They're giving me $1000 for trade in value on my old girl, and considering I didn't tell them about the problems with the transmission and wheel bearings I'm quite happy with this number. What does kbb.com (Kelly Blue Book) say your car is worth, in "fair" condition? Because trade-in value is usually poo poo. If you insist on going through with this, you're much better off selling your car private-party and then applying the cash to your down payment. quote:The "Documentary Fee" is $190 and I don't know what this is, taxes are $1,401.96, and license and fees are $47. quote:I was planning on doing a $10,000 down payment, and financing the rest at 3.9% for 72 months which is $221.71 per month. And now we've come to the crux of it all. $10k down is very reasonable. A 72 month loan is NOT A GOOD IDEA holy poo poo! If it's going to take you six years to pay off this loan, it's probably the case that you just can't afford it at all. loving hell. You especially don't want to have a six year note on a brand new car while you're a student moving to a new town. The thing is, you have a much, much better option open to you. Buy the best car to suit your needs that your $10k can afford, own it outright from Day 1, and have no car payments at all. Yes, that means no Crosstrek. But I'm sure you can find an Outback for that amount. Probably it'll be 8+ years old and have 100k miles or so on it. That's OK. It'll be good for another 10 years, assuming you do the necessary routine maintenance, which will very most definitely cost you far far less than $221.71 a month. Or you could try buying a car that is actually among the very top in reliability. Since the 2013 Crosstrek is a brand new design, there's no reliability data for it. Subaru has a decent reputation, but is by no means at the very top. quote:1) Do you see any problems with my reasoning for this car? Noted above. I think you've mostly just rationalized the new car you really want, but can't quite afford. quote:2) I intend to own this car for >10 years and I figure the price is fair where I'll get a price of ~$2,000 a year again. Is this a good price point? No. To begin with, once you factor in interest on your six year note, you're paying 24,189.96 plus $1,747.86 in interest = $25937.82 just for the car. Your insurance will be much more expensive than for an older used car. For much of the life of the loan, you will be in a situation where a total loss would pay off the loan but not much extra, so a large chunk of your $10k down payment is going to disappear into the aether during the first year of ownership. But more importantly, you will still have to change the oil, replace tires, filters, brake pads, and so on, and once it's out of warranty you will be out a certain amount every year replacing parts as they wear out. Granted it'll be less per year on a brand new car than your current beater, but not so much less than you actually save money compared to continuing to drive your current beater: and definitely more than if you bought a decent $10k car. I think a $10k used car, picked from among the most reliable makes/models available at that price, should cost you maybe $500 a year on average over the following ten years (possibly less), for a total of $1500 a year in costs... but also be worth $2k or so at the end of the 10 years, so if you sell it, you're more like $1300 a year. You should also consider fuel consumption. Your Crosstrek gets EPA city/highway driving: 25–27/33–36 mpg which is decent for a car of its size, but if you picked a Honda Civic with a 4-banger you could do a lot better and save even more money. And as I mentioned before, insurance. Insuring a brand new car in a city ZIP code is going to cost you a whole lot more than a used one. You better factor that into your budget! I bet it's at least a thousand bucks a year more expensive, maybe more depending on your driving record. quote:6) Is the financial plan of getting some payments and then paying it off after I have a job reasonable? NO. Pay for things with money you have now, and assume an income that you have now. The future is uncertain: you may not get that job you're hankering for, or it might not pay as well as you hoped. You might find a new opportunity that you'll love, but at a lower pay rate. Maybe you'll fall in love and get married and have kids! Six years is long enough for any of those things to happen. Don't tie yourself to a six year car loan based on your hopes and dreams. The BFC answer is to buy things that you can afford now. The AI answer is to follow your dream and get the dream car you dreamt about and drive it fast, of course. But AI isn't about financial prudence, it's about car enthusiasm. One more thing. Stop putting double-spaces between every drat sentence. This is something people did back when typewriters all used monospaced fonts, but modern fonts use variable spacing, meaning, they already add extra space after a period so you don't have to. Your double-spaces just add "rivers" of whitespace flowing through your blocks of text. Notably, SA is actually removing them when it processes your post! Studies have shown double spaces between sentences is actually harder to read and distracting and also makes people like me sperg out in inappropriate ways, such as when someone is just posting on a comedy website forum. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Dec 29, 2012 |
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Dec 29, 2012 01:14
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Most points were already covered, but I just want to say that as a very outdoorsy person that lives in the PNW (skiing, backpacking, sport and alpine climbing, etc.) you absolutely do not need a Subaru or an SUV or even AWD to accomplish any of those things. Ski areas are typically very well plowed and even when they aren't it's never more than 6-8 inches of mush on very rare ocassions. Good tires are far more important than the car's drive configuration when it comes to adverse weather conditions. I am a very regular skiier and I drive a relatively low, RWD car to the mountains. Just last weekend at Crystal there was about 4-6 inches of packed snow and ice in the parking lots and lots of cars of all drive configurations were getting stuck due to having crap tires. With snow tires, my car didn't have any issues at all. In my dozens and dozens of ski trips I've never gotten stranded. Forest service and logging roads are almost all closed in the winter, and even if you are a daredevil not even a prepped Subaru will stand a chance on them and their tens-of-feet of snow drifts. In the summer pretty much any car can handle them just fine - seriously, I drove a 95 Miata on miles and miles of forest service roads just fine. Subarus are decent cars and if you want one for whatever reason then great, but there's a widely held grave misconception here in the region that a Subaru (or similar) is a necessity for an outdoorsy lifestyle (or even for driving in the rain  ). In most circumstances AWD just adds cost, weight, and complexity while lowering fuel economy without offering any real tangible benefit. There are many other cars that offer similar utility while having better gas mileage, better reliability, and better driving dynamics.
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Dec 29, 2012 01:43
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Yeah, listen to the above dudes. I chose the Crosstrek because I wanted: good enough ground clearance and departure/approach angles for minor off roading, decent cargo capacity, easy mounting for a hitch, a manual transmission, decent on road handling, and a Subaru  . I spent a good three months researching and test driving vehicles before settling on the Crosstrek. It'd be hard to make a compelling case for it based on purely objective measures, but it ticked the right boxes for me and I've always wanted a Subaru.
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Dec 29, 2012 04:05
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Deviant posted:Yeah, I'm definitely not going to approach them with the payment number first, that's simply a conversation for this discussion arena. As someone who is most likely buying a Mazda 3 in the next couple months, and so has been doing quite a bit of research, let me just mention something. I'm not sure how important gas mileage is to you, but the pre-2012 Mazda 3s generally get mediocre at best gas mileage (25-ish combined. In 2012 the introduced the Skyactiv models (what I will be getting). It's essentially the same power, if not a bit more, but (again, just from research, mostly anecdotal) they consistently get 28 city, 40 highway. With factory incentives, you could probably pick up a leftover 2012 for not much more than your used 2010, and definitely less than 20k.
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Dec 29, 2012 04:40
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One last question, I was thinking about it and if my selection is really limited for a wagon, and I was planning on getting a project/drift car (probably z3) would it be a horrible idea to buy it now, DD it, buy a nicer and more reliable wagon later this year, and turn the first car into a project a few years later? I was going to get the wagon first because I'm living in month to month places (tired of bad roommates and 1 bed apartments start at 1300/mo here) but my parents just bought a brand new outback which I can now use for moves. Advice?
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Dec 29, 2012 04:51
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A z3 drift car is a horrible idea. If you're getting into drifting do a little research about what cars are good for drifting. A z3 is not one of them.
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Dec 29, 2012 05:24
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leica posted:A z3 drift car is a horrible idea. If you're getting into drifting do a little research about what cars are good for drifting. A z3 is not one of them. It's the car I learned on, but I agree I really don't know much, I just don't want a 240 or something you see every day. Something a little different. I like unique cars even if they aren't as ideal or cheap to work on. I guess learning on a z3 probably messed up my ability to drift a car that's more meant for the task. Also I'm biased because I really like driving that car in general. Are e30's any better? They're common but I like the aesthetics enough to forgive that. I should also note that "enough" power in this car is good enough for me, I'm obviously a newbie so I don't need to be going out and killing myself for the sake of fun. Drunken Lullabies fucked around with this message at 06:04 on Dec 29, 2012 |
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Dec 29, 2012 05:53
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Unless you wrench on cars as a hobby, I would not recommend drifting or any motorsport for that matter unless you have money falling out of your pockets. 240's are popular drift cars for a reason. Like I said, do some research then go to AI if you still have questions about drifting, this isn't the thread for that.
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Dec 29, 2012 06:13
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Drunken Lullabies posted:It's the car I learned on, but I agree I really don't know much, I just don't want a 240 or something you see every day. Something a little different. I like unique cars even if they aren't as ideal or cheap to work on. I guess learning on a z3 probably messed up my ability to drift a car that's more meant for the task. What kind of schedule would you be looking at for your "drift car?" And more power to you if you can hold a drift in something like the Z3. If you can afford 2 cars, one of which is just a toy, by all means go for it. At that point, there's no reason why you can't buy one car first and the other one when the right one comes along. If you're splitting your 5-7k budget, though, that's 2 cars that will need attention and work.
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Dec 29, 2012 12:09
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I would like some advice not just about car models but also the car buying process itself, which I have never really done. 8 years ago I bought a 1997 Honda Civic for which I paid cash to a private owner. I have spent the last 7 years in grad school scraping by and I am starting at a new job on Wednesday where the pay is much better. I had planned on saving for a car and paying off student loans for 6 months or so and then going out and buying a new-to-me-car with as much cash as possible. However, last night my car was stolen and has probably been stripped for parts in Mexico by now. I guess I'm buying a car sooner rather than later. My biggest problem is that I have no idea how to plan for buying a car without just paying for the thing outright and I'm not sure if I'm missing out on essential details on buying with a loan that would change my car buying strategy. In the most conservative sense, I do not need a car. I can walk to work but going to the grocery store would be a pain in the rear end, other entertainment options will be more limited and it will be more expensive (at the time of the trip but maybe not overall) to visit friends and family who don't live in Los Angeles. Here is my situation as it stands now: I have $2500 in cash in one of my rainy day funds (I don't want to touch the other, larger one) and I'm guessing I'll get another $1000 for the stolen Civic from the insurance company -that number comes from the conservative value on edmunds.com and then subtracting the deductible. So $3500 on hand. I have rental coverage for a $25/day for $750 total, so I have plenty of time to shop around and apply for loans or whatever it is I have to do. Also, some friends have loaned me a car until the claims adjuster calls me back to arrange everything. Here is what I was planning on doing in six months: Proposed budget: $15,000-$25,000 (my new salary is $73k/year) New or used: Used, I have never really thought of buying a new car. Body style: 4 door or hatchback (I was looking at Audi A3s) How will it be used: Driving to the grocery store, sometimes to work, running errands, monthly 250 mile round trip to friends and twice yearly 1000 mile round trip to family (in 8 years I put 90000 miles on my Civic) Most important to me: I don't want a shop hog, I plan to keep this car for at least 5 years so I want something that will be flexible (family or something, I don't know), I'm not interested in racing, moding or doing donuts in the snow TL;DR I can't make an informed decision about buying a new car because I haven't done it before
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Dec 29, 2012 18:51
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I would look into the Mazda3 sedan and 4 door hatch, you can get one with the new Skyactiv motor that is very fuel efficient (40mpg). IIRC Mazda also has 0% financing if you qualify. A Toyota Prius is also a good option if mpg's are more of a concern.
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Dec 29, 2012 19:27
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You could also try finding a used one and paying for it using a 1.49% check from PenFed (https://www.penfed.org/used-auto-loan/). I think it costs $20 or something to join, but they have great offers like this. Also, when the insurance company gives you a check, don't immediately cash it. Ask them if that's their best offer if you have done research and believe they low balled you. If you have local listings in hand (similar to the Civic you had), they should be able to raise the offer.
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Dec 29, 2012 23:03
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MickeyFinn posted:I would like some advice not just about car models but also the car buying process itself, which I have never really done. 8 years ago I bought a 1997 Honda Civic for which I paid cash to a private owner. I have spent the last 7 years in grad school scraping by and I am starting at a new job on Wednesday where the pay is much better. I had planned on saving for a car and paying off student loans for 6 months or so and then going out and buying a new-to-me-car with as much cash as possible. However, last night my car was stolen and has probably been stripped for parts in Mexico by now. I guess I'm buying a car sooner rather than later. I wrote a big rear end post about buying a new car if you click the ?. If I could walk to work you could never loving persuade me to buy a car. My daily rate for car rentals is somewhere around 40/day. That covers a lot of out of town trips. Zipcar is cheap, too, and that amount of money also covers a huge number of cabs.
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Dec 30, 2012 00:58
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I have never owned a car before, though I do have a lot of driving experience with a spotless record. I used to have a lovely job but lived close enough to work and cabs were cheap enough that I didn't need a car. However, I recently moved to California for a new well-paying job and am looking to buy my first ever vehicle in a few months. I'm 25 and live ~1.5hrs from the San Francisco Bay Area. Proposed Budget: $12,000 to $17,000 New or Used: Used, preferably Certified Pre-Owned Body Style: 4 Door, Compact, Hybrid How will you be using the car?: Primarily to travel to the SF Bay Area when needed for meetings, in addition to personal trips, so roughly 3-4 times a month. I telecommute from home, so I don't need to travel to get to work. Otherwise, it'll be used in town for normal activities like grocery shopping, going to the gym, errands, etc. I don't care about luxury gizmos or such, though heated and/or leather seats are always nice if not too much more. What aspects are most important to you?: Reliability, MPG, trunk size (needs to store 1 or more large suitcases for weekend stays for 2 people, but this isn't a huge or required factor) I will have ~$3000 for a down payment by the time I actually am ready to buy a car, and have been looking at either the 2007 Toyota Prius or the 2009 Honda Civic as possible options. There doesn't seem to be too much of a spec difference between the two, but if there's a better option for my needs, it'd be appreciated.
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Dec 30, 2012 09:25
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Krittick posted:I have never owned a car before, though I do have a lot of driving experience with a spotless record. I used to have a lovely job but lived close enough to work and cabs were cheap enough that I didn't need a car. However, I recently moved to California for a new well-paying job and am looking to buy my first ever vehicle in a few months. I'm 25 and live ~1.5hrs from the San Francisco Bay Area. Amtrak California (I assume you're in Sacramento or Stockton. Driving into SF sucks. A lot. Particularly parking) Get a prius over a honda. Toyota's hybrid system is flawless. Honda's is not. Do not waste money on a CPO prius. It is basically the most reliable car Toyota has ever made. Just get a PPI from a dealer. You don't need a fairly useless extended warranty, especially as the hybrid drive system is covered for 120k mi or something. That said, if you're just driving 600mi per month, I'd ditch the whole hybrid thing. This is a 7200mi a year. At $4 gal the difference between a prius and something getting 20mpg is $72/mo assuming a super optimistic 50mpg. Between 30mpg and a prius is $32/mo. I'd buy an $8k Mazda 3 (~30mpg), non hybrid civic, or something and enjoy the extra money in your pocket every month. nm fucked around with this message at 10:05 on Dec 30, 2012 |
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Dec 30, 2012 10:00
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nm posted:Amtrak California (I assume you're in Sacramento or Stockton. Driving into SF sucks. A lot. Particularly parking) Modesto, actually. Company provides the parking so I'm not worried there and I've made the trip already; wasn't terrible. The commute is actually to San Mateo and not SF proper, and there's a company shuttle from our San Mateo office directly to HQ in SF. Good to know about the Prius/Honda hybrid differences, and the CPO stuff, thanks. The travel type I mentioned is an average estimate, but I do have several multi-state road trips planned over the next few years, as well as inter-state visits a bit. Should have mentioned that in the first post, sorry. I'll check out the Mazda, and the non-hybrid Civic in addition to the Prius. Any particular year for the Mazda 3 you'd recommend?
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Dec 30, 2012 10:41
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Pester posted:Proposed Budget: Up to $1300. As was already mentioned, for 1300 you're looking at different colours of lightly-polished turds. I bought a 3rd-gen Prelude (laughably far from the practical vehicle you're looking for) for $1300 a few years ago; after 2 months it needed a new clutch and some other work that cost $1500 (I paid, because... uh... I had a reason at the time). Anecdote, but basically you can't buy a car for less than about $2000 unless you are or have reliable free access to a good mechanic. poo poo will break that will cost as much as the car did in short order. Having said that, gambling on a heap to see you through a few months or a few specific purposes ("I need to move two states over", "My friends are in a band and need a drummer for three weeks in May", etc.) is always at least an adventure, that at minimum leads to entertaining stories later on.
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Dec 30, 2012 12:53
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Leperflesh posted:OK wow yeah that's a long post even by my verbose standards. I'll address a few things: quote:Wheel bearings are cheap and easy to replace. You don't say whether your car was an auto or a manual, nor do you describe exactly how the transmission is "going," but it's possible that your $3000 estimate is correct, or wildly off. I assume your estimate is from a reputable independent mechanic, and not from a dealership, right? quote:You never know how long it is until another "big thing" affects a used car, that's true. But the two really expensive things are 1) replacing an auto transmission and 2) replacing the engine. If there's nothing really wrong with the engine, then replacing the transmission should in theory mean no more large ($2k+) expenses in the near future. And bear in mind that often an old engine can be fixed without total replacement, especially if you're diligent about oil changes and catch any sudden change in condition quickly (suddenly burning or leaking oil, for example). quote:First; no, you don't "have" to drive from michegan to seattle and back: you could fly, and have your car shipped, and this may or may not cost more. But perhaps more importantly: what's the worst that could happen? If your car breaks down somewhere in the middle of nowhere, you'd have a bad day. Tow trucks, cell phones, repairs at a remote garage somewhere. But how much money is "avoid one bad day" worth? $1000? $4000? Because you're suggesting it's worth in excess of twenty thousand dollars, and I'd bet it isn't really. quote:Whaaaat. No, dude, no. I'm a Noted VW Apologist but even I would never claim a VW is in the top three for reliability. Honda has such a reputation, but is no longer a clear leader across all its cars (which is to say, several other makers are doing as well as Honda these days). Subaru is in the middle of the road: it's behind the top Japanese makers in reliability (Honda, Toyota), probably about in line with the mid-tier (Subaru, Mazda, Nissan) and maybe ahead of the least-reliable Japanese maker (Mitsubishi). Roughly. quote:What does "utility" mean to you? I suspect you mean "off-road capability" in which case you're absolutely right, Subaru has a deserved reputation for excellent AWD across its whole range of vehicles. And VW does make an SUV but it costs too much. quote:Going to a manual is a good plan, in terms of (very-)long-term reliability, since they're cheaper to fix or replace than an auto. But other than that, yeah, inching along in traffic and negotiating steep hills is usually a lot more pleasant in an auto, unless you just really enjoy rowing through gears all the time and using the handbrake to avoid rolling backwards into the rear end in a top hat who is crowding your rear bumper at a steep uphill stop sign. But yeah if you want a manual, go for it, it's fine. quote:That is good. But have you test-driven anything else? If not, you are comparing a new car to an old used car and that's not fair for deciding which new car you would actually love. Maybe you should not worry too much about how much off-roading you'll be doing in the mountains of the Pacific Northwest (really, how many logging roads do you think you'll be negotiating? Because if you're just talking about ski trips and car camping, you can get by with literally any car at all. The roads are plowed and at most you might have to put on chains occasionally.) quote:You don't seem to have negotiated on price for any of these cars. You need to understand that a used car on a dealership lot always has a sticker price that represents a hilarious profit for the dealer. The assumption is that you will haggle. I think you should assume that you can get 10% off at a minimum, and if you negotiate hard you can often do even better. quote:Again, how much offroading do you really expect to be doing? Have you ever done it, ever? The SUV Mythos has been constructed by highly-paid advertising geniuses for the last 20+ years, but it always was and still is 98% bullshit. This is not to say the Crosstrek isn't a capable vehicle - it is - but it's incredibly rare for an owner of a high-clearance offroad-capable SUV to ever see anything worse than a few miles of gravel or a couple inches of snow. Which can be handled adequately by any car with a functional suspension. And the other 99.9% of the time it spends on the road, you are paying for compromises (weight, fuel efficiency, perhaps safety, ability to park on the street, etc.) made to give you that unused capability. quote:I don't think this is meaningful. Cars are mostly made by robots and it doesn't make a lot of difference what country the robot lives in. Much more important is the design decisions made, the quality of parts used, and to what extent the maker has cut corners on the above two things in order to improve profit margin. Subaru has a deserved reputation for reasonable quality, so I don't fault you for picking one, but I don't think that your "same factory" factor has much meaning. quote:This may be unfair, but I think you picked the car you want from a combination of aesthetics (you liked the look of the Outback Sport, which I can understand because I have always liked it too) and fantasies about rugged outdoorsmanship and the majestic peaks of the fabled West. I think you've done a great job of rationalizing that decision with mostly spurious logic. I think you want a new car, and don't want to just buy a 6 year old, $8k to $10k car that would do everything you want for half the money, and that's OK, but you should be honest with yourself about it. quote:No it doesn't! That's MSRP! Don't pay MSRP for a new car unless it's one of the (very few) cars that are in such demand dealers can't keep it on the lot. I don't think that's the case here. quote:It's total bullshit. You can go to Autozone and buy a clay bar kit for $30 or less. And the clay is for removing poo poo that's stuck in the clearcoat: rubbing a clean car with clay does not "protect" anything or smooth the paint or anything like that. quote:What does kbb.com (Kelly Blue Book) say your car is worth, in "fair" condition? Because trade-in value is usually poo poo. If you insist on going through with this, you're much better off selling your car private-party and then applying the cash to your down payment. quote:And now we've come to the crux of it all. $10k down is very reasonable. A 72 month loan is NOT A GOOD IDEA holy poo poo! If it's going to take you six years to pay off this loan, it's probably the case that you just can't afford it at all. loving hell. You especially don't want to have a six year note on a brand new car while you're a student moving to a new town. quote:The thing is, you have a much, much better option open to you. Buy the best car to suit your needs that your $10k can afford, own it outright from Day 1, and have no car payments at all. Yes, that means no Crosstrek. But I'm sure you can find an Outback for that amount. Probably it'll be 8+ years old and have 100k miles or so on it. That's OK. It'll be good for another 10 years, assuming you do the necessary routine maintenance, which will very most definitely cost you far far less than $221.71 a month. quote:Or you could try buying a car that is actually among the very top in reliability. Since the 2013 Crosstrek is a brand new design, there's no reliability data for it. Subaru has a decent reputation, but is by no means at the very top. quote:Noted above. I think you've mostly just rationalized the new car you really want, but can't quite afford. Regardless, the plan isn't to wait all six years to pay it off, I just need manageable payments until graduation. quote:Granted it'll be less per year on a brand new car than your current beater, but not so much less than you actually save money compared to continuing to drive your current beater: and definitely more than if you bought a decent $10k car. quote:And as I mentioned before, insurance. Insuring a brand new car in a city ZIP code is going to cost you a whole lot more than a used one. You better factor that into your budget! I bet it's at least a thousand bucks a year more expensive, maybe more depending on your driving record. quote:NO. Pay for things with money you have now, and assume an income that you have now. The future is uncertain: you may not get that job you're hankering for, or it might not pay as well as you hoped. You might find a new opportunity that you'll love, but at a lower pay rate. Maybe you'll fall in love and get married and have kids! Six years is long enough for any of those things to happen. Don't tie yourself to a six year car loan based on your hopes and dreams. The BFC answer is to buy things that you can afford now. And here's where I want to say to everyone that will ever read this thread that I disagree with BFC. If you head in there they will sing the praises to the Rice And Beans diet until you have everything and are old and can't enjoy any of it. I've been Rice And Beans guy before, and at a certain stage in life it's good to be that guy, but people need to understand that the average person will have to take out a loan for a car and a house. I didn't have to take out a loan for my first car because I've worked since I was old enough to understand how to take directions. Things aren't lining up that way this time, and I'll have to take a loan because of the luck of timing. I'm okay with that, my future is bright, and the money won't be a huge issue. It's important to also note that with my current car, no girl is going to look at it and think positively of me, so this is me making an investment in the possibility of falling in love. ;-) quote:The AI answer is to follow your dream and get the dream car you dreamt about and drive it fast, of course. But AI isn't about financial prudence, it's about car enthusiasm. quote:One more thing. Stop putting double-spaces between every drat sentence. This is something people did back when typewriters all used monospaced fonts, but modern fonts use variable spacing, meaning, they already add extra space after a period so you don't have to. Your double-spaces just add "rivers" of whitespace flowing through your blocks of text. Notably, SA is actually removing them when it processes your post! Studies have shown double spaces between sentences is actually harder to read and distracting and also makes people like me sperg out in inappropriate ways, such as when someone is just posting on a comedy website forum. Seriously though, thank you for the criticisms. It has seriously helped out, and forced me to analyze the choices that I'm going to be making. I was very nervous about this big car purchase and these next two years since I grew up and have been very poor in life before, but now I'm feeling much better about this choice thanks to having to answer the hard questions. I don't know if these posts will help anyone with their decisions, but I hope they do. powderific posted:Yeah, listen to the above dudes. Guinness posted:Subarus are decent cars and if you want one for whatever reason then great, but there's a widely held grave misconception here in the region that a Subaru (or similar) is a necessity for an outdoorsy lifestyle (or even for driving in the rain If you have some suggestions I'd love to hear about these other cars you think are better in seemingly every way. (How's this for a long post?) EDIT I've thought about it with regard to the money, and Leperflesh is right with regard to the uncertainty of things. There is the possibility of not getting that job, and failing out of college. Thinking about that I remembered this line: "As you all know, overconfidence is man's greatest enemy." I'll keep your uncertainty in mind when thinking about what I'm going to do, because you are right. This next year and a half could really screw me, and I'll have to be diligent to keep moving forward in a good direction. It's also prudent to keep in mind that all of life is uncertain and you just have to make the best decisions you can with the information available at the time. Thanks again for your advice and critique. Sincerely. Earth fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Dec 30, 2012 |
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Dec 30, 2012 18:04
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Krittick posted:Good to know about the Prius/Honda hybrid differences, and the CPO stuff, thanks. The travel type I mentioned is an average estimate, but I do have several multi-state road trips planned over the next few years, as well as inter-state visits a bit. Should have mentioned that in the first post, sorry. I'll check out the Mazda, and the non-hybrid Civic in addition to the Prius. The savings on a non-hybrid will still be worth one extra fill up for every road trip you plan. Hybrids might be able to get 5 more miles to the gallon on the highway more than fuel-saving compacts. Highway driving is their weakness. Earth posted:What?!?! No dude, no. As an accomplished engineer... ;-) Seriously though jokes aside, I am an accomplished engineer, and I have had a lot of experience for my age. It is unquestionably meaningful what facility a car comes from because different facilities have different cultures and personalities. I've been in good shops and bad shops that make the exact same thing and there are measurable differences. Knowing what I know about how things are built and designed, it's important to me. quote:Also, the reason that I have Volkswagens as reliable is because of the diesel engine. Diesels properly cared for will last longer than gas ones as far as I (and my engine engineering friends) understand, and according to Consumer Reports Volkswagen does have good years and bad years. A diesel engine is but one component in reliability. It won't factor into your entire dash not working when you turn the car on, and it won't help with the soft control arms and bushings in the suspension. You can of course set your own metrics for reliability. kimbo305 fucked around with this message at 07:32 on Dec 31, 2012 |
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Dec 30, 2012 18:20
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kimbo305 posted:
Yes because regular gas engines are just snapping crankshafts and windowing engine blocks left and right, unlike my superior German Dee-sssel  . Meanwhile nothing ever goes wrong with the ludicrous diesel emissions control equipment or the million PSI fuel system or the turbos, because it's a VW after all. Good thing too since VW mechanics who know how to fix diesels are on every street corner competing to keep prices reasonable.In other words "How to spot a VW Apologist 101". I can't wait when European emissions standards catch up with US ones and regulate diesel passenger vehicles out of existence. Throatwarbler fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Dec 30, 2012 |
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Dec 30, 2012 18:53
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Krittick posted:Modesto, actually. Company provides the parking so I'm not worried there and I've made the trip already; wasn't terrible. The commute is actually to San Mateo and not SF proper, and there's a company shuttle from our San Mateo office directly to HQ in SF. I also forgot the Honda fit. I'd take the fit over modern Civics, I think it drives better. Also, Modesto, I'm sorry.
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Dec 30, 2012 19:31
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