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less than three
Aug 9, 2007



Fallen Rib

Verviticus posted:

Is there a fundamental difference between DSL and cable? I'm thinking of switching to teksaavy after realizing this Telus poo poo. Their cable's listed at 2.5 up and DSL at 2.0 up but I've never really understood the difference between the two. It seems via their website that both are available to me where I live.

DSL will have slightly lower latency, but that's about the only difference. Go with whatever works better in your area.

DSL has a private line to the CO, so the speed won't vary much during the day. If you buy a 25/2.5 DSL line and you get 17/1.5, it'll be close to that 24/7.

Cable is a shared bandwidth for all the houses connected up to the head end, so you get XXX mbit distributed to a neighbourhood. This causes your speeds to drop during peak times when everyone else is using Internets, but letting you beat DSL speeds at night off-hours when nobody is using it. Latency is slightly higher.

For most people, there isn't a big difference.

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Kachunkachunk
Jun 6, 2011
I always heard people winging that DSL has a smaller MTU due to PPPoE overhead, but I thiiink downstream routing and MTU sizes will ultimately govern what the connection eventually settles with (which might be even lower than 1492). Huge MTUs can introduce latency for time-sensitive stuff like VOIP anyway. The latency difference between good cable and DSL connections is probably not really worth losing sleep over either. On Cogecoland via cable we are getting 20ms in latency approximately. I haven't bothered to check our Teksavvy DSL connection. Of course my absolute worst times with latency were also on Cable, but there were... issues. Rogers is terribad and they don't really seem to care.

I also haven't seen cable oversubscription symptoms in a long time, but if you live in a very dense area, it's probably better to go with DSL to rule out the chance. But in the end I pretty much prefer cable because it's much simpler and can get you over subscribed rates fairly often in my experience.
I currently use cable and DSL in a multi-WAN setup. I found cable to be much easier to deal with overall.

My current problems about DSL:
- The additional troubleshooting of PPPoE and physical connectivity are both required if you're not going online for some reason.
- The requirement of a dry loop or phone line for DSL.
- If you have lovely or unclear house wiring (demarcation point), you're pretty much going to have to redo it all (you can get some tools to help isolate what pins go to each of your outlets in the house).
- I also didn't like it if the line was periodically crappy, it would sync down to a lovely speed and stay that way forever until you reset the DSL modem itself. Arguably, you should not have poo poo lines, but it happens.
- My Speedtouch 516 gargled balls and kept hanging/locking-up from overheating until I installed a cooling fan in it. Works nicely now with nearly no sync/line rate issues. I can't believe I had to resort to that, it's not even a hot room.

A note on line filters for DSL:
- Line filters are not required if you are using a dry loop. In our house, we don't have an actual phone line and rely on a dry loop for DSL. Instead of running a dry loop to all the outlets in the house, it runs pretty much directly to the modem (admittedly via d-marc, but on its own line/circuit, not feeding any other outlets).
- If you had a phone line, it has to run to the demarcation point. And from there, all your outlets in the house. You still have to put a line filter in on the wire you run from the demarcation point into the modem, however; this prevents telephones and other unexpected activity on the circuit from making GBS threads up your DSL connection.

You really do get what you pay for with DSL. I might go with it as my primary connection when I move into a [pre-construction] condo later (we might be getting fiber to the curb), it really depends mostly on the cap, then the speeds. MLPPP is something I considered but it's too expensive.
As mentioned, with Cable, you can occasionally get just a bit more than what you're paying for (say, 36mbit instead of the 30 you are paying for). You should go with whatever caps and/or speeds are better, really, and you'll learn to handle the idiosyncrasies of setup, troubleshooting, and maintenance in no time.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

I am still waiting on my teksavvy DSL firing up, but interestingly my Telus modem is still picking up a telus signal, although it is dog-balls slow.. as in 300 baud. Makes for fun browsing but better than nothing!

Regarding Cable/DSL, I have never used Cable, but I have been very happy with my DSL connection. The only issue I had ever had with Telus was their bullshit business practices, not quality of the product. I had a 25/5 DSL connection, and I always got extremely close to that regardless of time of day. Before my 25 service, I was on a 15 plan and it too was great. Constraints always seemed to be on the website I was visiting or network issues outside of Telus's responsibility.

If you go to the Canadian DSLreports forum, most of the connectivity issues seem to be cable problems. Not to say that DSL has no problems either, but the majority of problems do seem to be cable related. It could be because cable is more popular so there is more people to have problems. :shrug:

slidebite fucked around with this message at 19:19 on Feb 12, 2013

Acer Pilot
Feb 17, 2007
put the 'the' in therapist

:dukedog:

Does Telus offer Internet retention plans? I'm eyeing TekSavvy now but it'll still be $50 for unlimited 15/1 rather than $45 (not unlimited) with my homephone bundle at Telus. I'd still need to buy a modem, etc too.

less than three
Aug 9, 2007



Fallen Rib

Do people even use PPPoE for DSL anymore? Telus hasn't done it for longer than I can remember.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

KNITS MY FEEDS posted:

Does Telus offer Internet retention plans? I'm eyeing TekSavvy now but it'll still be $50 for unlimited 15/1 rather than $45 (not unlimited) with my homephone bundle at Telus. I'd still need to buy a modem, etc too.

Telus may give you a limited time discount of maybe $15 per month or something if you are lucky. Isnt the $50 tksvy package 25/2 though? I think thats what I am getting in Alberta.

Tagra
Apr 7, 2006

If you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.


slidebite posted:

The only issue I had ever had with Telus was their bullshit business practices, not quality of the product. I had a 25/5 DSL connection, and I always got extremely close to that regardless of time of day. If you go to the Canadian DSLreports forum, most of the connectivity issues seem to be cable problems.

About 10 years ago I switched from Shaw to Telus because Shaw hilariously mishandled an equipment malfunction in my area which led to three weeks of spotty internet access, including a three day window where the modem stayed red. I'd call them and ask for an update and every time Shaw headquarters would be like "There are no issues in your area. We will send a tech." and every time the tech would knock on the door, wearily tell me "it's still an equipment malfunction. I still can't do poo poo about it. We're losing a lot of customers." He looked like he wanted to lie down and die.

Then I switched to Telus and the service was so much better even without the equipment issues that I never looked back.

If only they weren't greedy assholes :sigh:

Acer Pilot
Feb 17, 2007
put the 'the' in therapist

:dukedog:

slidebite posted:

Telus may give you a limited time discount of maybe $15 per month or something if you are lucky. Isnt the $50 tksvy package 25/2 though? I think thats what I am getting in Alberta.

In BC, TekSavvy seems to be showing up as $49.99 for unlimited 15/1, Telus is just that awful here.

Been with Telus since the 90's, the service has been pretty reliable but this price hike/service cut is just outrageous.

Tagra
Apr 7, 2006

If you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.


Does anyone have experience with "ABC" in Northern BC? My mom used them for a bit because it was the only service she could get in an extremely rural area, and it was something like 50 bucks a month for 1.5mbps because of how they had to hook it up.

I'm hearing them on the radio a lot now talking about how you can save so much money by switching to them, but they seem to be charging 59.99 for 25mbps...

[edit] with a 200GB cap...

Tagra fucked around with this message at 03:46 on Feb 13, 2013

Nitr0
Aug 17, 2005

IT'S FREE REAL ESTATE

Tagra posted:

Does anyone have experience with "ABC" in Northern BC? My mom used them for a bit because it was the only service she could get in an extremely rural area, and it was something like 50 bucks a month for 1.5mbps because of how they had to hook it up.

I'm hearing them on the radio a lot now talking about how you can save so much money by switching to them, but they seem to be charging 59.99 for 25mbps...

ABC Communications is a wireless isp / telus dsl reseller. If you can get telus 25Mb/s then you can get ABC. It's just like getting teksavvy. If you live out the boonies where dsl is not available then they come put up cheap wireless equipment and cap you like crazy.

I own a wisp and compete with them in several towns. If your mom is in northern bc I might service one of her areas and can get her up to 10Mb/s. just be more specific.

Tagra
Apr 7, 2006

If you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.


It was outside of Fort Fraser, but she has passed away now. It was a bit of a struggle for her to get the service... there was something about needing a tower to be visible for it to work there and they had just installed a new one nearby which opened up the service.

Tagra fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Feb 13, 2013

Nitr0
Aug 17, 2005

IT'S FREE REAL ESTATE

Tagra posted:

It was outside of Fort Fraser, but she has passed away now. It was a bit of a struggle for her to get the service... there was something about needing a tower to be visible for it to work there and they had just installed a new one nearby which opened up the service.

Sorry to hear about your mom. Yep that is right in one of my service areas.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

First impression with teksavvy is not good. They hosed up on my address so telus rejected the hookup request and now they cant come by for a week. Good going guys. No internet other than my work phone for a week.

DarkJC
Jul 6, 2010
That's an issue with any ISP that's not one of the big three unfortunately. They're at the mercy of the big companies when it comes to support requests, which typically means a minimum 3 day wait time for any issue which requires a rogers/bell/telus tech.

vvvv FWIW: I've had no issues with Teksavvy, I'm sure once you're past the hookup stage things will be fine. I can definitely understand the frustration though, I was pretty worried I was going to go through something similar when I was switching over to Teksavvy from Rogers.

DarkJC fucked around with this message at 07:04 on Feb 13, 2013

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

Yeah, I am optimistic once I'm running all will be good. At least, that's what I am hoping for :ohdear:

VERTiG0
Jul 11, 2001

go move over bro

slidebite posted:

Yeah, I am optimistic once I'm running all will be good. At least, that's what I am hoping for :ohdear:

Yeah, when I got Teksavvy back in 2011 I had to wait 15 days for a Rogers tech to come and hook it all up, but that's because Rogers was being Rogers. They poo poo all over the resellers that way.

univbee
Jun 3, 2004




Yup, same problem here (even got a goon who worked for Teksavvy at the time to unfuck everything). Once it got hooked up it was pretty smooth sailing.

8ender
Sep 24, 2003

clown is watching you sleep
I'm in the process of switching from Teksavvy to Start Communications and wow are they on top of things. They've called me three times: first one to gather some info, and twice to just give me updates on my transfer.

The lady at Teksavvy seemed bummed about my cancellation. Customer since 2006. Sorry guys. :ohdear:

VERTiG0
Jul 11, 2001

go move over bro
What's your reasoning behind switching to Smart from Teksavvy?

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.
Fun Shoe
Just guessing but they service Cogecoland for cable and Teksavvy still doesn't despite years of stringing people along. At least now they've just said they can't make it work financially or some such thing.

8ender
Sep 24, 2003

clown is watching you sleep

VERTiG0 posted:

What's your reasoning behind switching to Smart from Teksavvy?

Speed. Start is on the new aggregated POI system with Rogers so they're able to get higher speeds in Ontario like 45/4. Teksavvy is on the non-aggregated system and the CRTC just ruled that Rogers doesn't have to speed match on that system. Teksavvy has been forthcoming with information on dslreports that its going to be end of year before they move everything over to the aggregated system.

I really have no beefs at all with Teksavvy, I just work at home a lot more now and the faster upload is really important to me. 45/4 mbit speeds over 28/1 would make a big difference for me.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

So, after the fiasco earlier this week with Teksavvy starting my service, I'm trying to stay on top of it with them for my "new" install scheduled for this coming Tuesday.

When I first went down this road with dumping Telus and going to Teksavvy, I started a thread on the Teksavvy support forum on dslreports as per their request to qualify my service. My OP clearly states my physical street address, mailing address and landline phone # (since it's DSL).

The first gently caress up with them is they transposed my address and Telus rejected it. My address is something like "Elm Street, North" and they submitted it as "North Elm Street". Fine, Telus are a bunch of dicks and people make mistakes. I've the one who has to live with it, but whatever.

So, now with my new date (which wasn't confirmed, a full week after my original install date) I get a post back from Teksavvy saying Telus rejected it too because of an incorrect #. They used my daytime contact # (cell) as my DSL service line #... even though my land line # is in my OP and I think I only gave my cell info as an alternate to billing when I set up my acct :psyduck:

Jesus christ guys, I understand accidents happen but holy gently caress.

VERTiG0
Jul 11, 2001

go move over bro
Don't worry about it, that's absolutely not indicative of their service once you've got it going. It'll still be better than Telus.

Volguus
Mar 3, 2009
I have Start.ca for 2 days now, switching from TekSavvy (after hearing about them on this very thread). My main reasons for switching was the 50Mbps speed. For me the 350GB cap is ok. Would love for such a thing to not even exists, but...hey in Canada, year of our Lord 2013, simply the technology is not there yet to eliminate such a childish restriction.

Anyway, the speeds seem to be fine. Didnt hit 50Mbps yet, but usually hovering around 42-48. The only problem with the switch was the fact that Rogers didn't bother to do the actual transfer for 24 hours. Those were painful 24hours without internet. Other than that... so far, so good.

some kinda jackal
Feb 25, 2003

 
 
Just found out the resell Cogeco in my area. If I wasn't getting TV/INternet in a bundle I would probably jump to start.ca :)

Tagra
Apr 7, 2006

If you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.


http://www.ipolitics.ca/2013/02/15/telus-reports-profits-up-22-8-in-q4/

quote:

VANCOUVER – Telus Corp. (TSX:T) has capped what its CEO is calling an “exceptional year” with an almost 23 per cent increase in fourth-quarter profit, fuelled by a six per cent increase in revenue.

"We have to raise prices to keep up with the rising costs and stay competitive" :qq:

[edit] I'm reading that Shaw is raising their prices at the same time but I don't think I saw that in this thread... is it also true?

[edit 2] Well there's certainly bitching about it! https://community.shaw.ca/thread/3591

Tagra fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Feb 15, 2013

ZShakespeare
Jul 20, 2003

The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose!
My Teksavvy experience was much better. I called up Shaw 30 days in advance and scheduled a disconnection, and then signed up with Teksavvy with a future connection date the day after. When the time comes, I bring my old modem back to shaw and plug in the new modem, and much to my surprise they activated it early so I didn't need to go without Internet access for an evening! Didn't even try to charge me extra.

priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.
Since I am planning on going with Teksavvy cable I may just keep the telus optik connected for some overlap. Also in case the cable has much crappier latencies I can just cancel it and endure the Telus experience.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

VERTiG0 posted:

Don't worry about it, that's absolutely not indicative of their service once you've got it going. It'll still be better than Telus.

I am certainly using that viewpoint as the light at the end of the tunnel. I borrowed a 3G USB stick from work so I am not screwed for the time being, but it obviously isn't a long term solution.


Tagra posted:

http://www.ipolitics.ca/2013/02/15/telus-reports-profits-up-22-8-in-q4/


"We have to raise prices to keep up with the rising costs and stay competitive" :qq:
As a shareholder of Telus, I am glad. As a customer of Telus, gently caress them.

Bamabalacha
Sep 18, 2006

Outta my way, ya dumb rah-rah!
Teksavvy has been nothing but awesome for us since we switched to them when we moved in June. We have the 18 Mbps down/512 kbps unlimited service and our speeds are almost always more in the 25/1 range, even at peak times. Plus their tech support and customer service are excellent.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

Latest update is Teksavvy has a confirmed Monday install date for me, which surprises me since it's earlier than the day they planned a couple days ago and also a holiday here. Only reason it must even be possible is telus works their service techs like rented mules or something.

So, here's to hoping this Monday we'll be rockin' out on our unlimited Teksavvy connection.

Also, been seeing some posts about "unlimited internets" on dslreports from some of the mainstream providers? Is the world going Topsy-turvey or something?

less than three
Aug 9, 2007



Fallen Rib
Looks like TELUS is now letting you know when companies file copyright claims against you.

quote:

We are writing to inform you that TELUS has received a complaint that alleges that your TELUS Internet Service account has been involved in copyright infringement. This complaint was traced back to your account based on the IP address used at the time of this activity.


At TELUS, we respect our customers privacy: we have not provided your personal account information to the complainant. It is TELUS policy to disclose such information to a complainant in this context only if ordered to do so by a court of law. Please visit http://about.telus.com/community/english/privacy for more information about our privacy practices.

We do, however, want you to be aware that this complaint was received by us and offer you the following information that may be of help to you:

If you are unaware of this type of activity originating from your account, you may wish to inquire with others who have access to your account.


If you are using a dial-up account, change the account password to ensure that only authorized users have access to it.


You may also want to check your system for viruses, which may explain why this sort of activity is originating from your account.


If the ADSL modem is connected to a wireless router, please make sure that only your authorized computers can connect to it and access the internet. For help in securing the wireless router, please contact the router vendor.


Below is an excerpt from the complaint that we received regarding your account. We include it in this notice in an effort to help you identify the activity that is in question.

Sincerely,

Brad

Internet Abuse Team
TELUS Communications
Email abuse@telus.com


**Please include your original email to TELUS in any replies.

IP Address: IP Address
Title: A TV Show currently taped on my Optik PVR
Distribution found at: 2013-02-14
Protocol: BitTorrent

The copyright holder alleges that at, they were able to connect to the IP address . This IP address was assigned to your connection at that time. During the connection they say that they found that portions of the file was actively being distributed from your connection. They conclude that as they were able to extract a portion of the file from your connection that their exclusive distribution rights are being violated. They are asking that the file sharing stops immediately. Please note, we can trace the IP address to your account. The actual file could be shared from any computer behind your router, including ones that connect wirelessly.

Should you want further information on the complaint, please reply to this email.

-~-~-

less than three fucked around with this message at 21:35 on Feb 16, 2013

Ensign Expendable
Nov 11, 2008

Lager beer is proof that god loves us
Pillbug
You didn't edit out all mentions of the show title.

Lemons
Jul 18, 2003

Their issue isn't that you have a copy of it, it's that you were distributing a copy of it.

less than three
Aug 9, 2007



Fallen Rib

Ensign Expendable posted:

You didn't edit out all mentions of the show title.

I don't care that much anyways.

edit: Whoops left my IP and time/date in there too.

priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.
I got one of those a while ago after I downloaded a digital copy of a movie I have on blu ray already. Now I just buy movies on iTunes instead, physical media is dead!

Worrisome though because streaming the HD lotr movies is about 27GB. Goodbye data cap!

Kachunkachunk
Jun 6, 2011
I have downloaded 1080p rips of movies I own on Blu-Ray as well. I would really prefer that physical media (and caps) both go away.

priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.
Sooooo shaw's 100Mbs plan is kind of tempting me, except the 500GB/month worries me. Streaming a lot of hi def movies from Netflix (spoofed into thinking I am in a super HD zone) and iTunes which add up significantly.

I'm being silly and the Teksavvy unlimited 25Mbps plan would be just as good but wow, 100Mbps to the home would be pretty impressive.

Definitely scrapping cable altogether though. I hope HBO offers an online subscription service for HBO Go so you don't need a cable hookup. Once I find some way to watch NHL playoffs online and Formula 1 races I won't need TV for anything!

Rawrbomb
Mar 11, 2011

rawrrrrr

priznat posted:

I hope HBO offers an online subscription service for HBO Go so you don't need a cable hookup.

Never going to happen.

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priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.
They do offer that in the Nordic countries iirc, and they've been positioning themselves more and more as competition for Netflix.. But I admit, it is a long shot.

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