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Archael posted:Story relevance and unique victory conditions aren't things I consider as requirements for the player to face a mini-boss or boss.
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Feb 14, 2013 23:41
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Archael posted:Story relevance and unique victory conditions aren't things I consider as requirements for the player to face a mini-boss or boss. For example, the miniboss at Finath is rather obviously one. But there are certain other enemies in that battle which are technically "unique," but aren't Immortal. They don't need to be. Also, it doesn't apply solely to those sorts of minibosses/bosses. Here is a generic Monk using Power Source in Chapter 4 (spoilers for a Chapter 4 battle obviously). Why does he need this? I believe he's also Immortal but I am not 100% sure of that.
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Feb 14, 2013 23:47
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Twiddy posted:You can either ignore the complaint, power down the enemies that don't feel like bosses, or make them more distinctive and boss-like. Either way, it is a legitimate complaint on the game design. Or you can change the player's expectations by modifying the story, but given that FFT 1.3 doesn't seem to want to do that, yeah, you're pretty stuck. WHAM BOSS OUT OF NOWHERE is a thing you can do to surprise the player, but it needs to be justified in retrospect (and it needs to obviously be a boss at the time, too). Otherwise you just end up confusing the player with uneven pacing.
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Feb 14, 2013 23:48
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Or you can change the player's expectations by modifying the story, but given that FFT 1.3 doesn't seem to want to do that, yeah, you're pretty stuck. Another thing to add to this is that some of your mini-bosses are random encounters. That means you have no real control over when you're going to run into them, meaning you can't honestly prepare for them. I remember rooting around Bariaus hill and such for small bits of grinding and such so I could complete chapter 2 in content and running into the Dragoneer or Warlock completely at random (sometimes I'd just run into pretty standard enemies). If you don't know a powerful mini-boss is coming, you can't adequately prepare for it. The strategy for taking on the Warlock is completely different from the strategy you'd employ to take out the Dragoneer. Not knowing which one it is before you go in really just makes it so you're either taking huge chances, or forcing a player to reload/use save states. I understand the desire to make FFT more interesting and challenging, and some of these fights do it better than others, but a lot of the time they come completely out of nowhere and dust the entire party with some pretty unfair difficulty spikes. The funny thing is, you could have made these mini-boss fights way more interesting by limiting them to Chapter 4 and/or the DD. I know a few are in Chapter 4 locations, but I think my point still stands. Peppering the map with areas that might as well be kill zones if you're not 100% ready for them not only kills pacing, but it kills enjoyment.
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Feb 14, 2013 23:58
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Twiddy posted:It doesn't matter what you call a boss, it matters what the players think is a boss. Exactly. That is why earlier I pointed out that the real issue here is bad communication, from the part of the mod, to the player as to what is a mini-boss and what isn't. Right now I think the only indicator is that they get stars over their heads if you knock them out (immortal flag). quote:If you don't know a powerful mini-boss is coming, you can't adequately prepare for it. quote:The strategy for taking on the Warlock is completely different from the strategy you'd employ to take out the Dragoneer. Not knowing which one it is before you go in really just makes it so you're either taking huge chances, or forcing a player to reload/use save states. If you see a ??? Warlock or ??? Dragoner, that should be more than enough of a flag for you to take it as a boss. Archael fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Feb 15, 2013 |
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Feb 15, 2013 00:03
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Archael posted:Right now I think the only indicator is that they get stars over their heads if you knock them out (immortal flag). I think the ??? bars is also a pretty decent clue (when it shows up)!
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Feb 15, 2013 00:08
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??? would be great, since it works for Zodiac bosses and other high value targets, except that ??? would also multiply any mini-bosses' HP and MP values by 10, so that's out. Maybe giving them a unique palette / color scheme would work. Nakar posted:Also, it doesn't apply solely to those sorts of minibosses/bosses. Here is a generic Monk using Power Source in Chapter 4 (spoilers for a Chapter 4 battle obviously). Why does he need this? I believe he's also Immortal but I am not 100% sure of that. Would it make it better if those units were painted red with jobs like "Master Monk" and "Master Samurai"? Archael fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Feb 15, 2013 |
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Feb 15, 2013 00:13
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Change their names to "Boss Monk/Samurai gently caress You" or something. Also I admitted defeat and installed content, Riovanes Castle 1 was just too much.
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Feb 15, 2013 00:26
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UmbreonMessiah posted:I think the ??? bars is also a pretty decent clue (when it shows up)!
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Feb 15, 2013 00:32
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Archael posted:I think if you have a solid team, you can take out any battle in the respective chapter that the player is on. Of course, running into a Warlock when you're out grinding for JP might suck, but I don't think that should be a reason to remove mini-boses from randoms. Does anyone go out looking for random battles except to grind JP? The original game taught players that the story missions are the harder ones where you bring your A game, and random battles are the easier ones you use to train. When the random battles become as hard or harder than the story battles, then there's nowhere safe to go make your team strong enough to survive battles. As far as immortal tags, they do seem to be pretty randomly assigned. I believe I griped earlier in the thread about the only random battle spot available between Goug and the Execution site- I think the only random battles you could run into was a pretty hard battle against a bunch of Green Chocobos, or a battle against a bunch of generics- all of whom were flagged as Immortal for no apparent reason. This was right after you get 2 fresh recruits with no skills. The best way to train fresh recruits is to feed them crystals, and it seemed like the generics were made immortal just to spite the player.
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Feb 15, 2013 00:46
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Charles Bukowski posted:Change their names to "Boss Monk/Samurai gently caress You" or something. quote:As far as immortal tags, they do seem to be pretty randomly assigned. For example, I'd like to remove immortal flag from all arena battle units, and there's some units later on in regular jobs but with immortal flags which don't make it clear what they are supposed to be, or why.
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Feb 15, 2013 00:51
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Oh I wasn't complaining, it isn't an angry "THIS IS BULLSHIT!" post, I'm just throwing in the towel on Extreme Difficulty mode. Now I can have a better time with Content, thank you.
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Feb 15, 2013 00:58
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Archael posted:??? would be great, since it works for Zodiac bosses and other high value targets, except that ??? would also multiply any mini-bosses' HP and MP values by 10, so that's out. If you gave them separate jobs, would it be possible to set their HPM and MPM low so that they have say 50HP/MP, then apply ??? stats to put them at 500? It would be rather redundant signals with ???, new job, color change, and immortal flag, but that might not be a bad thing. Does ??? apply any other conditions/effects that would make this sort of thing unfeasible?
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Feb 15, 2013 07:02
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???? stats probably multiply gear hp and mp.
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Feb 15, 2013 07:06
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dis astranagant posted:???? stats probably multiply gear hp and mp. Are there bosses that use the ??? stat and even HAVE gear? I thought it was only Zodiac monsters.
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Feb 15, 2013 08:20
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Full Battle Rattle posted:Are there bosses that use the ??? stat and even HAVE gear? I thought it was only Zodiac monsters. Normally, but 1.3 (and many other hacks) put that flag on some other stuff and they were talking about using it specifically on units that would probably have gear.
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Feb 15, 2013 08:21
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Archael posted:??? would be great, since it works for Zodiac bosses and other high value targets, except that ??? would also multiply any mini-bosses' HP and MP values by 10, so that's out. Oh, well crap. I didn't realize that ??? did that, I thought it just hid the stats. drat. That explains a lot. I think some other evident indicator as to what is supposed to be a "mini-boss" would be a good idea. Master (insert class name here) seems like a decent way to go about it. Also, I agree: there needs to be some trimming of what gets immortal flagged. It can get downright bothersome in arena matches or in that fight by Bariaus Valley.
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Feb 15, 2013 20:17
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UmbreonMessiah posted:Oh, well crap. I didn't realize that ??? did that, I thought it just hid the stats. drat. That explains a lot. Back when I did some experimenting with a Gameshark, I made a team of Zodiac Bosses. It was an interesting experience, as they had all these super-powerful attacks, but they only had like 50 HP because they didn't have the ??? flag applied. Definitely glass cannons, with pretty much everything able to one-shot them.
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Feb 15, 2013 20:32
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Schwartzcough posted:Back when I did some experimenting with a Gameshark, I made a team of Zodiac Bosses. It was an interesting experience, as they had all these super-powerful attacks, but they only had like 50 HP because they didn't have the ??? flag applied. Definitely glass cannons, with pretty much everything able to one-shot them. Yeah, by default the zodiac bosses have absolutely pitiful numbers for HPM and HPC because apparently challenge must be absent from the game.
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Feb 15, 2013 21:09
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Archael posted:Would it make it better if those units were painted red with jobs like "Master Monk" and "Master Samurai"? In general, though, that change would make them similar to the 'Elite Marksman' class that Algus had. Elite Monk/Elite Samurai? Would certainly make them stand out more in the battles they appear in, and most definitely scream HEY KIDS I'M A MIDBOSS to any player who actually makes it this far into the mod...and it is entirely possible that they don't. I like to think myself pretty good at FFT, but during the last LP of this mod, I got brickwalled at Golgorand. Then I improved and now I'm staring at endgame. Haven't done any sidequests like Reis/Beowulf, Deep Dungeon, etc By the way, I wanted to apologize for the Counter Magic fiasco from earlier in the thread. I did some playing and confirmed that it is LFT that does those crazy things like CMing Cures, Hastes, Protects, etc, not 1.3. It works as you've described earlier in the thread, and I'm quite happy with the results. Counter Magic'ing monster attacks is fun, but sometimes a little weak due to the monster's inflated MA scores. Elementally-aligned attacks can be boosted...but the best part is that it still has the possibility of backfiring hilariously on the player. Counter Magic Choco Quake vs. Green Chocobos is an excellent example of that and this totally got me wiped before, but the difference is that this is fair (my caster eating choco quake being my own fault) as opposed to countering my own Haste 2 and buffing half the enemy team instead.  I also want to say I'm probably doing this in the worst way possible. I didn't manage my levelling very well early in the game, but I managed the issue of enemies having superior equipment by making a party of thieves, using a little brute forcing, charming, and stealing everything I could get away with. Not ideal, but it worked for me. It evened out in late Ch.2 / early Ch.3, with my party having Ch.4 gear against the enemies Ch.4 gear. Moon Blades and Tidal Axes in early Ch.3 was certainly interesting to fight against (and then with, after some raging kleptomania)
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Feb 15, 2013 21:11
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My problem, Seiren, is that argument is questionable for the particular battle it's in. It's already got a boss, a named enemy with a special class, great stats, and an illegal setup that requires a strategy to contend with (none of which I have a problem with). His generics should be just that, generics (two are a special class but they're bizarrely enough not Immortal, which is perfectly fine). They're there to assist the boss enemy, not be bosses themselves. The boss is tanky and dangerous enough that he doesn't need his allies Power Sourcing him. Give him Power Source if you want, but let the bosses be bosses. Changing the name of the class doesn't justify it. Every enemy in a boss battle should not necessarily be a miniboss. That devalues the existence of the actual bosses. In fact, Chapter 4 more or less does this as designed in 1.3 because literally almost every battle has "special" or "miniboss" characters when it doesn't outright have an actual boss. In fact, I think every single battle bar possibly one in 1.3 Chapter 4 is a "boss" battle by Archael's definition. Now, there's a lot of those types of fights already in the chapter in vanilla, but most in 1.3 were just punched up and the generics strengthened a bit, with a small handful of annoying and silly exceptions. The boss units remain the stars, and they're the ones with the insane and dangerous abilities. And those "minibosses" that were added to fights that didn't previously have them are, by and large, exactly the same way, and that's great. But every now and then you get Immortal generics for no clear reason. If the stated purpose for Chapter 4 is that every battle is meant to be a boss-equivalent fight and all enemies in all fights will be packing full heat with no holding back, that's fine (although I think it's silly on a personal level) and there's nothing wrong with it mechanically. But saying those generics are "intended" to be special when in fact basically every fight is essentially "special" or can be argued as such is just pissing on my leg and telling me it's raining. It's a backhanded way of excusing the behavior while pretending nothing is different. Perhaps it is just a communication issue and the intent was there all along. However, if being special isn't special then I don't see what difference changing palettes or class names makes except to just warn the player that everything in Chapter 4 is an enormous poo poo-wrecker. That could just be a design philosophy issue and I'm just not understanding that Archael's position on the matter has always been that this sort of thing was supposed to happen. I disagree with it, but if that's what he meant all along then he's right that the mod does an extremely poor job sometimes of making it obvious which enemies are "special."
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Feb 15, 2013 21:41
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Quick question, does anyone know when the results of a poach are determined? (normal or rare item) After the poach? After the battle? When you get to the fur shop?
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Feb 16, 2013 02:08
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Mercurial posted:Quick question, does anyone know when the results of a poach are determined? (normal or rare item) After the poach? After the battle? When you get to the fur shop?
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Feb 16, 2013 02:12
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So, I'm at the start of chapter 4 of a run where I try to stay far below average level (7, 16, 23 for chapter ends) and while the start is sort of rocky it's the easiest 1.3 playthrough I've done. Using aoe spells to kill multiple units at a time helps keep experience gain down, and rod boosted Black/Summon magic is rather effective when enemy HP is lower than normal. Beneficial side effects of being below the curve is that enemy speed is lower making it easier to get off longish CT magic, and enemy gear is actually frequently below even shop quality which means they have less (or far less) HP and are easier to murder.
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Feb 17, 2013 17:46
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Episode 30: Aries Here we are, the big showdown, the grand duel, the staredown at high noon...  Our hero enters a room full of corpses, and one very live Templar.  We first met Wiegraf way back towards the close of Chapter 1, when he was acting as leader of the revolutionary Death Corps.  Prior to that encounter, we'd fought his sister, Miluda, twice, with the second battle ending in her death. Needless to say, he's been holding a grudge ever since.  Oh, and also he did that thing where he sold his soul to the Lucavi of the Aries stone.  The former idealist, ready to die for the revolution, has fallen awfully far.  It's hard to even say just how much of Wiegraf is left in there, and how much is Lucavi.  But before we can kill the monster, we've got to fight the man.  This is the first real duel in FFT; just our protagonist and Wiegraf, squaring off one-on-one.  Wiegraf's setup can change a little in each battle.  His reaction and support skills are variable, and depending on your plan of attack, can make for a relatively easy or very difficult fight.  He'll always be packing his own custom versions of Holy Sword and Punch Art, and within a specific level range, his gear will be the same, so Wiegraf won't break out anything too unpredictable, and honestly, he really doesn't have to. On top of great stats, boss defenses, and mountains of HP, the guy hits like a mac truck on steroids. Also of note is the Reflect Mail, which renders him basically immune to most spells in the game.  With all that in mind, our valiant hero starts the battle with a courageous retreat!  Prufrock here is set up with an Evasion tank. A shield, a mantle, and the Abandon reaction skill leave him incredibly difficult to hit with physical attacks. Both Holy Sword and Punch Skill are physical sets.  Basically, 9 out of every 10 of Wiegraf's attacks will fail to hit, giving Prufrock a ton of time to do whatever it is he needs to do.  And here's what he needs to do.  Accumulate, you may remember, boosts the user's PA by one point each time it is used.  So we've got a ton of turns, and a skill that makes us stronger every turn. I'm sure you can figure out how this works.  Wiegraft will keep throwing Sword Skills into Prufrock's crazy Evasion.  Prufrock will keep pumping up his PA with Accumulate.  On the off chance that an attack does sneak through...  ...a Chakra or two easily heals up the damage.  Since Accumulate now has a charge time (it was instant in vanilla), the AT will occasionally come up such that Wiegraf would get a turn while it is charging.  Instead of doing anything that round, it's best to simply wait.  Even Punch Arts like Earth Slash and Wave Fist can't break through Prufrock's iron guard.  The jams, they are pumped.  Here's Prufrock's unarmed damage, at 30 PA. Enough to one-shot Wiegraf, but we can do better.  Here's 35 PA. Remember that the unarmed formula multiplies PA by PA, so the damage doesn't scale linearly.  And here at 40 PA, we've well exceeded the damage cap. Triple 9's ya'll.  Booya! Man is that ever satisfying.  Well yeah. In fact, we improved right before your eyes!  As per usual, when dropped, Wiegraf teleports away.  Prufrock is getting almost as sick of this poo poo as I am.  No matter where the duel ended, the game places the main character right here, which is where he'll start the next phase of the battle.  We were having it out, and I was kicking your rear end!  With Wiegraf's human form defeated, the power of the Aries stone makes itself manifest.  Once again, the demon Velius stands before us.  This time, the rest of our motley crew is in to back us up.  Unlike Queklain, however, Velius isn't content to leave this a 5-on-1 fight.  Three Archaic Demons warp in. We've already seen their Dark Magic skillset in Yuguo Woods, and they have the stats to back up their powerful spell attacks.  The objective for this mission is to defeat Velius. While it's not necessary to take out his Archaic entourage, their high AoE and single-target damage potential means it's a drat good idea.  Up first to the plate is Prufrock. Now, a thing you may or may not know about this battle: everything from the first sequence (the duel) carries over to the second sequence (the fight with Velius). HP totals, status effects...  ...and stat boosts.    Marche is up next, and well...  ...yeah, Marche is here too. Don't get me wrong, this is pretty good damage, but...well...Triple 9's ya'll.  Velius has access to the Fear skillset, like all Lucavi, which includes a bunch of nasty status attacks with 100% hit rates.   As an AoE 100% Confusion, Loss makes for a helluva opener.  Now, you're probably wondering exactly why you're seeing Prufrock cave in yet another skull of an ancient demon with his bare hands. The reason goes something like this: if you end the duel with the AT thinking your hero is up next, it will stick him up at the top with a full bar when the Lucavi fight begins.  Mustadio is back to a Chemist for this battle, precisely because of that nasty Fear skillset that Velius is packing.  In addition to Confusion, he can also throw out instant Petrification, so having somebody on deck to take care of those crippling affliction is a necessity.  Fluellen would just like to remind everyone that this is her damage without thirty-two turns of buffing. The three Archaic Demons bit the dust without casting a single spell, leaving Velius all on his lonesome in that 5-on-1 matchup he was hoping to avoid.  Agrias what are you doing? That is not how you win a fight.  Fortunately the doctor is in.  More turns for Prufrock means more turns seeing 999 damage pop up.  But seriously folks, that's completely unbuffed. Fluellen is a brick house.  Velius packs the somewhat mundane-seeming reaction Counter Flood.  What's absolutely not mundane are the damage numbers he can spit out with it. Keep in mind that Counter Flood fires against practically everything; it pays to choose attackers carefully. In addition to the damage, all the tiles in this battle have the very worst status procs: Stop, Petrify, and Frog.  This is Velius' main form of damage attack: a big-rear end Summon.  Cyclops has the second-highest damage modifier of any Summon in the game (only Zodiac beats it).  Coupled with Velius' crazy nasty MA, it hits drat hard. Mustadio is set up for full Magic Evasion, with an Aegis Shield, a mantle, and Abandon, precisely to keep him from getting gibbed by 'Clops.  Marche is helping!  Getting the Lucavi's damage under control can be a very smart move.  Three MA at a time isn't much, and to be honest it's really not necessary here (what with Prufrock hitting the damage cap) but in a 'fair' fight it would be vital to keep from dying to 'Clops round after round.  It also weakens the damage that Velius will do with his Counter Floods, which can make a strong offense a much more viable strategy.  Unfortunately, just one Mind Break isn't quite enough to save Agrias here, but hey, we can always pick her back up again.  Boom goes the dynamite.  Another thing to know about Velius is that he is loving fast.  Unlike Queklain, where it's possible to take a bit of a leisurely pace, you'd better come at Aries with guns blazing, because he's sure to do the same to you.  One good thing about this battlefield is that it is relatively spacious, so with judicious use of the super advanced 'spread-the-gently caress-out' strategy, it is possible to sandbag through much of the incoming damage.  Prufrock getting' all Bruce Lee up in here.  Another key difference between Queklain and Velius is that the latter actually does charge his big-rear end Summon spells, creating one of the very, very few situations in which Stunning Strike actually does, in fact, own.  Of course, there's still that pesky Counter Flood to deal with, but it's better than a faceful of Lich (which is what Velius was trying to cast).  More sandbagging! It's a bad idea to get so clumped up here, but the AT suggests that Fluellen will get a chance to book it before Velius can crush her with a spell (and gib Prufrock in the process).  Another Mind Break attempt, but this one ends in failure. Fortunately, there's no Counter Flood reprisal, so at least Agrias will live on.  Hey look, a Lucavi fight with crystals! (That don't come from the player's units!)  Fluellen certainly doesn't mind the free full heal. Were Velius to get his multiple hands on one of these suckers, he'd get 999 HP and MP back.  Mustadio says 'No' to casting Summons.  While he eats another Counter Flood for his trouble (putting him into critical health) Velius was charging a Cyclops that would have outright killed our favorite machinist, so it's still a net win.  Peep them trip nines one more time.  'Cause Fluellen is coming in for the finish.  The best part of killing Lucavi: they never see it coming.  With a flash and a bang, the demon explodes. Both Velius and Wiegraf are no more.  A young lady's scream is heard from another room! We've still got a rescue to perform!  But first, a little loot for our trouble. This is our first Knight Sword.  Agrias will love it. Speaking of young ladies and other rooms, Alma enters the conference room to find it full of broken, bloodied corpses.  Among them, the young Shrine Knight Izlude.  Even to the man who kidnapped her, the man responsible for bringing her to this nightmare place, Alma shows concern.   The player can almost feel sorry for young Izlude as well. He apparently had no idea what horrors the Zodiac Stones held.   Yes, Vormav, the father, transformed into a demon from Hell, slaughtered the son right alongside his enemies.   Betrayed by his order, his Church, and his family, Izlude now dies with only the woman he kidnapped to comfort him.   And she does, too. Alma is kind almost to a fault.   Before he passes on, Izlude manages to dig a Zodiac Stone out of his tunic.  Just as the boy dies, another man enters the scene.  It's Vormav, with not so much as a scratch on him.  I've always found it downright eerie how calm Vormav is about slaughtering legions of soldiers and innocents alike.  At this moment, Velius' death cry echoes through the castle, shaking it to its foundation.  Undaunted, the twisted Templar advances on Alma.  But as he draws close, one of the Holy Stones reacts!  And to Alma, no less. But why would an evil artifact be reacting to a young noble girl?   The answer to that question will remain a mystery, at least for now. Final Fantasy Tactics: where even the demons are hatching overcomplicated schemes!   With little more to-do, Vormav grabs Alma and tosses her over his shoulder. She's now been double kidnapped.   As the two warp away, though, she manages to drop the Zodiac Stone for her brother. Smart girl, that one. Next Time: the roof may or may not be on fire! -and- the exciting conclusion of chapter three!
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Feb 18, 2013 04:45
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Wiegraf used Ruins on me when I tried the Accumulate strategy. Did he not use it in this battle because you had an evasion set up or something?
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Feb 18, 2013 04:56
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Well that sure was a massacre. I would've thought 1.3 would have put a cap on Accumulate, similar to WotL's version.
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Feb 18, 2013 05:00
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Davzz posted:Wiegraf used Ruins on me when I tried the Accumulate strategy. Did he not use it in this battle because you had an evasion set up or something? Ruins are subject to evade and have less base accuracy than a damaging attack, so Wiegraf will skip them since they'll be 0% hit chance abilities against an evasion Ramza. Velius' AI can be gamed so you don't have to deal with his 100% hit status attacks by placing 2-3 people slightly spread out so only his summons can hit them. Then you just give those guys high (but <100%) magic evade and laugh. Using a dual wielder to knock down his brave (he only has 50) to nearly eliminate Counter Flood is probably better than trying to nuke his MA. He also takes a shitload of damage from magic with his 80 faith; a good/best compat OK with Spell Edges can Holy for several hundred damage a shot. Corvinus fucked around with this message at 05:21 on Feb 18, 2013 |
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Feb 18, 2013 05:15
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I've never noticed it before, but they gave Izlude a new character portrait for this scene. Nice little detail.
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Feb 18, 2013 13:29
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The strategy without Accumulate isn't too different, really. I went with an evasion setup in the first fight too, although I had Ramza pack a crossbow for reasons I cannot entirely fathom (I think to get around Counter). Main thing is to pack Precision. In my case I went with low-HP Ninjas so Velius would spend most of his time charging sure-kill summons, which could then be interrupted by Stunning Strike. Mocking Strike with Two Swords craters his Counter Flood quickly, and judicious Mind Ruin use keeps him charging summons on the Ninjas (who will still die) while ensuring everyone else is tanky enough to survive. Also, since Velius can't enter water it's possible to trap him next to the torches on the stairs. This keeps him well away from the crystals and creates a couple safe zones at the top and bottom of the map where he can't charge a summon. Velius can physically attack, but like Queklain he seems reluctant to do so. I think he only specifically tries if somebody's immune to his Fear skills and everyone's spread out enough that a summon can't hit two people or more and his MA is tanked. Still one of the easier Lucavi thanks to the fact that he charges, giving bonus damage and allowing for interrupts to waste his turns.
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Feb 18, 2013 15:36
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I can't believe the Accumulate strategy still works here. The Wiegraf/Velius fight was the only fight I really had trouble with in the base game because I didn't understand how overpowered Accumulate was in this fight. Then I talked to my friend who loves FFT and he told me to give it a shot and it made the battle feel very trivial. Velius looks like he still hits really hard though. Is there a tactic for beating Wiegraf without going high evade?
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Feb 18, 2013 17:26
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There are times when I've had to take the duel to the water. If the duel ends there, then Ramza can't get back up to where he usually goes for the Velius fight.
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Feb 18, 2013 17:27
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axeil posted:Velius looks like he still hits really hard though. Is there a tactic for beating Wiegraf without going high evade? Never tried, but if he starts with an elemental weapon you can wear a null/absorb item for that element and then a Judo Outfit to block KO. In the case that he has a non-elemental weapon, Judo Outfit + Jade Armlet to block KO and Stop, then either kill him with Geomancy or use Counter Magic on his Swordskills, and heal Ramza with White Magic or something.
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Feb 18, 2013 17:50
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axeil posted:I can't believe the Accumulate strategy still works here. The Wiegraf/Velius fight was the only fight I really had trouble with in the base game because I didn't understand how overpowered Accumulate was in this fight. Then I talked to my friend who loves FFT and he told me to give it a shot and it made the battle feel very trivial. Sounds like a smart guy.  My strategy was always Guts-Monk Ramza and I'd alternate Chakra and Yell until I was doubling or tripling my turns for each of Wiegraf's. Then I'd switch to alternating Chakra and Accumulate, and then try to one-shot Wiegraf and knock out Velius before he could completely murderate my party. I really lacked creativity. This was my strategy even in later playthroughs when I was trying to focus on more creative parties.
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Feb 18, 2013 18:46
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The only reason Accumulate still works is I'm not sure there's any buffs to boost PA/MA so you're kinda stuck with permanent shifts to them. The Bravery/Faith buffs don't exist until well after the game where the terms actually come from. An obvious way to make this balanced is to add Bravery/Faith buffs that multiply PA/MA by 1.5 or something and can wear off or be removed like any other buffs. But I don't think that's hackable.
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Feb 18, 2013 19:20
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Everyone always critizes Ramza's Squire class, but it's actually one of the best jobs to be in for a 1v1: Haste, Regen, +1 PA, Shields, Crossbows. Lancers kick rear end in 1v1's as well. lol he landed a 13% Split Punch for 204 damage on you. 
Archael fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Feb 18, 2013 |
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Feb 18, 2013 23:18
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Archael posted:lol he landed a 13% Split Punch for 204 damage on you. Immunity to Dead and element absorb might be an interesting strategy. I'm not sure what Wiegraf would do instead of swordskills. I think I used Squire for all the 1v1 duels in 1.3. Yell and Cheer Up are good complements to an evasion-based strategy. If any damage does get through, it generally regenerates back.
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Feb 18, 2013 23:51
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Nakar posted:Immunity to Dead and element absorb might be an interesting strategy. I'm not sure what Wiegraf would do instead of swordskills. In vanilla he tends to hit you with a lot of Punch Arts. Lancers don't seem like they would be that great in 1 on 1 fights in Tactics. If you go first, you jump and then they move, so you miss. If they go first, they probably hit you, then you jump and land, then they go and hit you again; which wastes the "invincibility" that is Jump's major attraction.
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Feb 19, 2013 00:51
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You have to pick your targets. All speeds being equal you will hit anyone with under 50 CT when you jump.
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Feb 19, 2013 01:03
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| # ? May 7, 2024 13:36 |
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Don't all these tactics mentioned involve hoping the RNG doesn't roll certain weapons or skills? I could have sworn Wiegraf has at least one physical weapon option. Like the one used in the LP, wouldn't that require Wiegraf not randomly having Concentrate? Tallgeese fucked around with this message at 01:15 on Feb 19, 2013 |
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Feb 19, 2013 01:10
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