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peak debt posted:It's not hard to convince somebody bout somethinh they pretty much already believe in. Xykon was already pissed off about wasting time on sidequests before they teleported in, after losing a gate by minutes due to Redcloak's fault it didn't take much to push him on. And dont forget Xykon has pretty terrible Int and Wis. Redcloak manipulates him all the time too. He's one pf those powerful people who consider themselves much cleverer than they are, those are quite easy to trick, until they find out by accident at which point you probably want to be far away... Don't mistake Xykon taking the easy path for Xykon being manipulated. He's shown time and time again that he isn't someone that can just be led by the nose.
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Jul 26, 2013 21:20
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Who What Now posted:Don't mistake Xykon taking the easy path for Xykon being manipulated. He's shown time and time again that he isn't someone that can just be led by the nose. Of course he isn't. He doesn't have a nose. And neither does anyone else in the OotS world
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Jul 26, 2013 21:38
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Who What Now posted:Don't mistake Xykon taking the easy path for Xykon being manipulated. He's shown time and time again that he isn't someone that can just be led by the nose. He has yet to wise up that the gate ritual will not give him any control over the Snarl, the rifts, or anything else.
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Jul 26, 2013 21:52
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Cat Mattress posted:He has yet to wise up that the gate ritual will not give him any control over the Snarl, the rifts, or anything else. He may not realized it yet, but he's taken actions in the past indicating that he doesn't trust everything Redcloak's told him about it. Otherwise, he would have never given his half to Tsukiko for her to figure out what was up with it. And when Redcloak mentioned that Tsukiko had Xykon's copy of the arcane half of the ritual when he killed her, Xykon lied about having given it to her. So he's canny enough to realize something's not right, even if he doesn't specifically know just what it is yet.
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Jul 26, 2013 22:07
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Xykon's character can be summed up with the phrase "There's a big difference between not knowing and not caring".
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Jul 26, 2013 22:15
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Also (SoD spoiler) he enchanted the MitD to eat Redcloak and spit out his holy symbol if Redcloak ever betrays him. That's going to be a hell of a thing.
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Jul 26, 2013 22:22
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W.T. Fits posted:So he's canny enough to realize something's not right, even if he doesn't specifically know just what it is yet. Given that Xykon's philosophy is very much 'Live in the moment', he probably also doesn't care much. Going by his monologue about power, which I think is one of the greatest things about the entire comic, what Redcloaks wants to do isn't really that important to Xykon, only what he is actually able to pull of matters in the end. So for Xykon, knowing that Redcloak has some secrets is more than enough preparation to deal with water the actual scheme turns out to be in the end. It's also interesting that Xykon has nothing to lose, especially when compared to Redcloak. His motivation for the entire endeavor basically boils down to 'Might as well' and maybe a sense of hurt pride after the loss of his phylactery and I wouldn't be surprised if this will bite Redcloak eventually in the rear end.
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Jul 26, 2013 22:26
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Carrasco posted:Also (SoD spoiler) he enchanted the MitD to eat Redcloak and spit out his holy symbol if Redcloak ever betrays him. That's going to be a hell of a thing. Redcloak still has Xykon fooled. His phylactery isn't anywhere near where Xykon thinks it is - and I would assume Redcloak put it in a place where if Xykon is ever destroyed again he has control over whether he is allowed to regenerate again or not. I highly doubt Xykon knows about this, he'd never tolerate Redcloak fooling around with his phylactery, if he'd know he'd probably imprison Redcloak and start murdering one Goblin after the other until he got it back. And the ritual doesn't do what he thinks it does, although I'm less certain whether Xykon is really in the dark about this. He may be well aware of it and just doesn't consider it important until he does have a functioning gate.
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Jul 26, 2013 23:33
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greatn posted:I think he's talking about when V fell into a spike pit and was knocked out for however long was convenient to the plot. I agree. It was literally THE WIZARD WILL BREAK THE PLOT REMOVE THE WIZARD. Though even there he set it up with that awesome Familicide reveal. And they were in a trap filled pyramid, so it was hardly a DeM.
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Jul 26, 2013 23:37
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peak debt posted:Redcloak still has Xykon fooled. His phylactery isn't anywhere near where Xykon thinks it is - and I would assume Redcloak put it in a place where if Xykon is ever destroyed again he has control over whether he is allowed to regenerate again or not. I highly doubt Xykon knows about this, he'd never tolerate Redcloak fooling around with his phylactery, if he'd know he'd probably imprison Redcloak and start murdering one Goblin after the other until he got it back. It's back around Redcloak's neck.
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Jul 26, 2013 23:44
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Alchenar posted:It's back around Redcloak's neck. No, the diamond-shaped one is Redcloak's backup holy symbol. Xykon's phylactery is round.
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Jul 26, 2013 23:55
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I think Xykon is hedging his bets that he can simply overpower Redcloak at any time, which is why he isn't taking a more active role to counter any of Redcloak's schemes. Even though be does have a few contingencies like with the MitD and probably a few more.
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Jul 27, 2013 00:11
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Who What Now posted:I think Xykon is hedging his bets that he can simply overpower Redcloak at any time, which is why he isn't taking a more active role to counter any of Redcloak's schemes. Even though be does have a few contingencies like with the MitD and probably a few more. Contingency is the right word; xykon has that spell on his list. He can have a bunch of spells prepped and ready to go when and if Redcloak turns. Although Redcloak is getting quite powerful. Clerics have a bunch of extra powers intended just to gently caress with the undead. He doesn't need to be equally powerful as Xykon. Just close. And he's always narrowing the gap.
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Jul 27, 2013 00:42
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Enervates will rip that power gap wide open again. It worked against a caster more powerful than Redcloak is now too.. Spoilers for Start of Darkness stuff.
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Jul 27, 2013 00:55
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peak debt posted:And the ritual doesn't do what he thinks it does, although I'm less certain whether Xykon is really in the dark about this. He may be well aware of it and just doesn't consider it important until he does have a functioning gate. There's a planet inside the rifts. The ritual doesn't do what anyone thinks it does.
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Jul 27, 2013 00:56
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Who What Now posted:Enervates will rip that power gap wide open again. It worked against a caster more powerful than Redcloak is now too.. Ah but Redcloak now has a ring that protects him against level drain. He got it from Tsukiko. Basically the inevitable Redcloak and Xykon throw-down is the single event I'm looking forward towards most in this comic.
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Jul 27, 2013 00:59
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gently caress. Yes.
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Jul 27, 2013 01:04
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Dr Pepper posted:Ah but Redcloak now has a ring that protects him against level drain. He got it from Tsukiko. I expect at least two evil monologues. Maybe a soliloquy.
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Jul 27, 2013 01:19
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After the "The dead aren't people, they are tools" monologue, I certainly hope so.
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Jul 27, 2013 01:32
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jng2058 posted:The Order could end up putting Elan's plan into effect Don't forget, apparently Elan's plan depends partially on Durkon!
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Jul 27, 2013 05:26
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jng2058 posted:EDIT: Long-term bet. I'll bet you that when the newly created Rift expands it will do so below the water-line and start flooding the desert, turning Windy Canyon into a river and radically altering the ecosystem of the Western Continent.
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Jul 27, 2013 06:41
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BrainWeasel posted:Don't forget, apparently Elan's plan depends partially on Durkon! That doesn't mean it wouldn't work! Vampy Durkon helping out the Order at a crucial time seems exactly like the kind of dramatic twist Elan would appreciate.
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Jul 27, 2013 07:03
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BrainWeasel posted:Don't forget, apparently Elan's plan depends partially on Durkon! He just said he needed his help when Durkon got back, not for the actual plan itself. They got it done like a few strips later.
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Jul 27, 2013 07:07
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My Lovely Horse posted:Pretty good idea, I was going to try and shoot it down by saying Azure City isn't experiencing any negative side effects so far from the air above it being sucked into space, but then I realized it's kind of a big assumption about how space works in D&D fantasyland. And without the elves having a stranglehold on the livable land, and the other races not having to live off the scraps, that rather removes the need for constant conquest. It would essentially pull the rug out from under Tarquin's feet. ..Eventually.
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Jul 27, 2013 07:43
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Johnny Aztec posted:And without the elves having a stranglehold on the livable land, and the other races not having to live off the scraps, that rather removes the need for constant conquest. It would essentially pull the rug out from under Tarquin's feet. ..Eventually. Eh, without lots of magic, it wouldn't make anything long-term livable. You can't grow crops with saltwater. A small sea in the middle of the continent would generate a little more rain, but probably not enough to grow crops in most places. And since the seawater (but not the salt) is constantly evaporating, and being replaced with more salty water from the rift, over time the sea is going to get saltier and saltier, and eventually they won't be able to fish for food there anymore. Imagine something like the Salton Sea or the Aral Sea, only worse; since those are getting fed by (fertilizer-polluted) freshwater, instead of literal (but per Roy, not littoral) saltwater. Of course, this IS a world with magic, but I have no idea what the numbers are and whether it would be cost-effective to have a jillion clerics chain-casting "Purify Water" or a jillion mages chain-casting "Gate" to the Plane of Water or something. (I'm also assuming that the ocean is salty - but I think I remember somebody talking about that? Maybe the paladin with the shark mount?)
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Jul 27, 2013 09:55
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The thing is, the ritual is something that The Dark One gave to Redcloak. And Redcloak knows full well there's a risk of unravelling all of reality with it. So The Dark One probably isn't deceiving anyone because it isn't like there's anything worse it could be that would make Redcloak refuse his mission.
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Jul 27, 2013 10:54
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sebmojo posted:I agree. It was literally THE WIZARD WILL BREAK THE PLOT REMOVE THE WIZARD. The most annoying part to me was mere pages earlier Roy was like "Ok, this time we all stick together no matter what, no splitting the party, alright?" And then V runs off and Roy is immediately "Whatever, I don't want to deal with this." Of course, being an rear end in a top hat is in character for him, but basically everything bad that's happened to them in the pyramid is his fault for not giving a poo poo. I bet when V shows up Roy is going to blame him for everything though. greatn fucked around with this message at 12:45 on Jul 27, 2013 |
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Jul 27, 2013 12:41
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 NEW COMICThings aren't going to well.
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Jul 27, 2013 19:52
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I'm awestruck by the pace we're moving at here, this is tremendous.
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Jul 27, 2013 19:58
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Looks like they can really only wait for the elemental to disappear, it doesn't look like Haley and Belkar are going to any real damage here.
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Jul 27, 2013 20:00
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I could very well see Rich giving us a TPK (minus possibly V). It's one of those things that just happens at one point or another in d&d, and it'd fit in wonderfully with the current thread of the Order being screwed in every conceivable way.
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Jul 27, 2013 20:17
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Roy's got a natural 18 Str stat, right? Not counting his Belt of Giant Strength or whatever, correct? Goddamn, the guy who rolled Roy just got naturally beautiful stat rolls.
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Jul 27, 2013 20:19
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Alchenar posted:The thing is, the ritual is something that The Dark One gave to Redcloak. And Redcloak knows full well there's a risk of unravelling all of reality with it. So The Dark One probably isn't deceiving anyone because it isn't like there's anything worse it could be that would make Redcloak refuse his mission. Actually, this raises an interesting point. Redcloak wasn't around when Dorukon's Gate was destroyed. He spent time investigating the Azure City Rift, but we don't know if he looked into it like V's familiar did and saw the world within it. And just now, he and the rest of Team Evil left without inspecting the remains of Girard's Rift. All of Redcloak's info on the Rifts and what lies within comes directly from the Dark One. But (SoD Spoilers) the Dark One wasn't around for the destruction of the first world and the imprisonment of the Snarl. He only learned about the existences of the rifts when one of his priests found one and brought it to his attention. The Dark One then went and got the full story from Tiamat and Rat, and based his Plan around that information. But do we know if the story he got from Tiamat and Rat was the truth? And looking at this latest strip, things just keep going from bad to worse. Let's hope something happens here soon to turn things around for the Order. 
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Jul 27, 2013 20:51
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Slashrat posted:I could very well see Rich giving us a TPK (minus possibly V). It's one of those things that just happens at one point or another in d&d, and it'd fit in wonderfully with the current thread of the Order being screwed in every conceivable way. Or, alternatively, V comes back at the most dramatically appropriate moment and wipes the floor with the enemies the Order is facing off with, plus Nale's team. ...Why do I suddenly get the impression we might be seeing another Soul Splice in action for hir to save the Order and teleport them out of the desert?
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Jul 27, 2013 21:14
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Regalingualius posted:Or, alternatively, V comes back at the most dramatically appropriate moment and wipes the floor with the enemies the Order is facing off with, plus Nale's team. Unlikely. What does V have to offer the fiends now?
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Jul 27, 2013 21:20
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sebmojo posted:Unlikely. What does V have to offer the fiends now? Well, if V's out of the picture, their remaining Roland Jones fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Jul 27, 2013 |
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Jul 27, 2013 21:26
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sebmojo posted:Unlikely. What does V have to offer the fiends now? ...An extension on the time they can already take possession of hir body?
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Jul 27, 2013 21:57
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*shishkabob!*
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Jul 27, 2013 22:58
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Am I the only one thinking that opening the coffin is setting something up? Did we see the corpse before (I think we did but can't check as I'm on my phone- but what would the odds be on something previously overlooked suddenly being useful)?
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Jul 27, 2013 23:24
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fallingdownjoe posted:Am I the only one thinking that opening the coffin is setting something up? Did we see the corpse before (I think we did but can't check as I'm on my phone- but what would the odds be on something previously overlooked suddenly being useful)? I thought so too, but looking back there doesn't appear to be much noteworthy in there, Haley searches it in the next comic as well.
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Jul 27, 2013 23:28
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