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 weapon stores is why.
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Aug 2, 2013 16:39
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Mr. Nice! posted:This article was pretty cool, imo http://www.defence.pk/forums/air-warfare/169261-f-16-vs-f-18-navy-test-pilots-perspective.html Ya that was neat. 
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Aug 2, 2013 17:04
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Mr. Nice! posted:So there's no love here for the F-18 even though there's more in service than any other individual platform and almost as many as all AF fighters combined? If it was so awesome why did the F-16 beat it in the first place, then go on to have over FOUR TIMES as many airframes built? Also, someone implied the F-16 line was closed or something...not only is that not true, the USAF still makes small buys to counter all the lawn dart incidents. Mr. Nice! posted:This article was pretty cool, imo http://www.defence.pk/forums/air-warfare/169261-f-16-vs-f-18-navy-test-pilots-perspective.html Awesome article, but only a Hornet pilot would praise the F-16's fuel economy. Edit: V That's one of my favorite games...I wish I still had the cd for nostalgia-gaming. Godholio fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Aug 2, 2013 |
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Aug 2, 2013 17:27
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Yea the F-16 is a popular export fighter. It's also quite popular with mercenaries, if my childhood was accurate.
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Aug 2, 2013 17:31
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Fun story: For some reason I was over at one of the fighter squadrons at Tyndall...I'm guessing I was getting my gear to get an F-15 ride. Anyway, a flight of TDY F-16s had just finished fighting an F-22 and the pilots were talking. Their squadron commander was on the mission, and was exceedingly proud of himself because he actually killed the Raptor. On the downside, it was after all four of them had already died BVR and the F-22 killed his wingman againin the merge...
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Aug 2, 2013 17:36
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Godholio posted:If it was so awesome why did the F-16 beat it in the first place, then go on to have over FOUR TIMES as many airframes built? I don't know if the F-16 had 4 times as many airframes built over their entire lifecycle or not, but they certainly do not have 4 times as many in active service. According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_United_States_military_aircraft there are 840 16Cs and 163 16Ds for a total of 1003 F-16s in active service. The marines have 229 F-18s and the navy has 433 hornets and 488 super hornets. That brings the F-18 total to 1150.
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Aug 2, 2013 17:50
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holocaust bloopers posted:fighters and fighter culture is loving stupid qtiyd This needed to be quoted. Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Also whoever posted those Crusader pics without this fails. Came here to post that. The Last Gunfighter. Nostalgia4Infinity posted:A lot of diagnosis was handled by a drat computer that didn't work right half the time It worked half the time for you? drat, y'all must've had the good jets.  holocaust bloopers posted:Yea the F-16 is a popular export fighter. It's also quite popular with mercenaries, if my childhood was accurate. That game Mr. Nice! posted:I don't know if the F-16 had 4 times as many airframes built over their entire lifecycle or not, but they certainly do not have 4 times as many in active service. You can't count the SH and the Bug as one lump sum...they are two distinct aircraft with cosmetic similarities. The engines, structure, avionics...basically everything that actually "makes" a fighter are different. They share the same designator because it was more politically convenient in the '90s to sell Congress on a "development" of an existing fighter as opposed to buying a new one, and the Navy desperately needed a new fighter design because of the NATF and A-12 programs self destructing. Also Super Bugs are fine as long as your target is within 400 nm of the carrier or you have ready access to a shitload of USAF tankers. Unfortunately that kind of limits the flexibility of the CSG...like a lot. I will give props to the Navy for going for an "affordable good enough" option after the NATF and A-12 programs imploded and almost destroyed Naval Aviation, but make no mistake, the SH is the product of some very serious compromises that were driven by expediency. e: Also there are a SHITLOAD of F-16s in foreign service. Like seriously, the production line has been cranking them out (still in production by the way) for over two decades and the total number produced is just under 5,000. The legacy Hornet did not sell nearly as well overseas, and while the SH has made some inroads it has a looooong way to go before it's anywhere near the Viper. e2: The reason there are so many in service with the USN/USMC is that they have basically standardized on one tactical aircraft...the Hornet and SH do it all: fleet defense BARCAP, CAP, strike escort, strike, interdiction, CAS, NTISR, everything. The USAF has five designs for that, including two that are dedicated solely to air The Hornet/SH are basically the epitome of "jack of all trades, master of none." iyaayas01 fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Aug 2, 2013 |
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Aug 2, 2013 18:03
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Ya didn't the Navy pull a fast one over Congress with the E/F model?
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Aug 2, 2013 18:09
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holocaust bloopers posted:Ya didn't the Navy pull a fast one over Congress with the E/F model?
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Aug 2, 2013 18:16
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grover posted:Where they bought a much-needed new aircraft for a reasonable price from a well-managed program? Yeah, they totally scammed congress. No, he's talking about how it was sold to Congress as an upgrade, rather than a new airplane.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:19
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grover posted:Where they bought a much-needed new aircraft for a reasonable price from a well-managed program? Yeah, they totally scammed congress.  Yeah, don't mistake me, I'm not slamming the SH, it's been about the lone success story from the US tacair portfolio over the past 20 years, and I've said before that I think the USN should buy more of them in addition to/in place of the F-35 (also make the loving USMC buy some instead of SLEPing their ancient legacy Hornets that are well past their last legs). I'm just saying that the SH has some pretty serious flaws, many of which are a result of its rushed/truncated development process, so making it out to be the best thing to hit tactical aviation since sliced bread is probably more than a bit of an exaggeration.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:22
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Super Hornet doesnt have lasers; therefore, it loses out that crucial Grover vote.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:26
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Mr. Nice! posted:I don't know if the F-16 had 4 times as many airframes built over their entire lifecycle or not, but they certainly do not have 4 times as many in active service. Even if we cheat and consider the Hornet and Super Hornet together, more than twice as many F-16s have been built and most are still flying. I can't find a good number for Super Hornet production, but it's closer to 500 than 600...even if we say 600, that gives the Hornet family about 2,080 airframes vs the Viper's 4,570 (as of April last year). Edit: Also, the Super Hornet (and the original) are ugly as gently caress. I said it. 
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Aug 2, 2013 18:26
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sJriejnqtM
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Aug 2, 2013 18:27
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I don't know if it's recommended for everyone, but don't watch the cops shooting the dog video. 
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Aug 2, 2013 18:29
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lol raptors are rad did you hear this story about one getting all these fake kills that never happened
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Aug 2, 2013 18:31
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One of my friend's dad used to fly phantoms in vietnam.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:32
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One of my friends dad's used to beat him.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:34
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One of my friend's dad is dead.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:35
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Godholio posted:Fun story: For some reason I was over at one of the fighter squadrons at Tyndall...I'm guessing I was getting my gear to get an F-15 ride. Anyway, a flight of TDY F-16s had just finished fighting an F-22 and the pilots were talking. Their squadron commander was on the mission, and was exceedingly proud of himself because he actually killed the Raptor. On the downside, it was after all four of them had already died BVR and the F-22 killed his wingman againin the merge... Realistically how likely are BVR shots like that ever going to be? If you're China or whomever and you're going to war against a bunch of F-22s, the first thing you'd do is make sure it looked like the skies were full of 747s or something that would ensure pilots would have to make sure they weren't about to recreate KAL007.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:36
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One of my former Congressmen flew Phantoms in Vietnam and now he's in jail for bribery.
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Aug 2, 2013 18:47
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The correct answer to sexiest jet is anything with a Marine pilot. 
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Aug 2, 2013 18:49
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So if the Super Hornet is the only half way decently managed fighter program in recent American history, does that mean Boeing is the least poo poo aerospace defence contractor, or was it a matter of luck? For pictures, these were taken by a friend when we visited the Netherlands only naval base, they invited our student union because they're desperately short on engineers apparently. One of our 4 submarines undergoing maintenance I think:  Minehunters:  Amphibious ships:  Frigates: 
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Aug 2, 2013 19:08
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F-18 vs F-16 fight can go on for days, but no one disagrees: Blue Angels are way better than the Thunderbirds. QTIYD     
Wasabi the J fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Aug 2, 2013 |
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Aug 2, 2013 19:12
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NWS that poo poo bro.
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Aug 2, 2013 19:15
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 Pilots are crazy.
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Aug 2, 2013 19:33
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EBB posted:
Huh? IDK what you're talking about.    
Wasabi the J fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Aug 2, 2013 |
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Aug 2, 2013 19:39
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The one thing missing from that first photo is a long trail of sparks left by his giant pair of brass balls scraping the tarmac.
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Aug 2, 2013 19:44
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Godholio posted:Even if we cheat and consider the Hornet and Super Hornet together, more than twice as many F-16s have been built and most are still flying. I can't find a good number for Super Hornet production, but it's closer to 500 than 600...even if we say 600, that gives the Hornet family about 2,080 airframes vs the Viper's 4,570 (as of April last year). And not only is the airframe still in production (i.e. they still have orders to fill) but they still are getting new orders. With the orders they have now the line will be open until 2017, and there are still several countries that are considering placing additional orders. Have a heritage flight picture, i.e. 70 years of air dominance (click for huge): 
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Aug 2, 2013 19:46
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P-51 still looks good.
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Aug 2, 2013 19:47
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EBB posted:
You don't say. 
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Aug 2, 2013 19:51
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The Angels were doing some of this poo poo in F4's http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=063_1342453764
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Aug 2, 2013 19:54
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iyaayas01 posted:And not only is the airframe still in production (i.e. they still have orders to fill) but they still are getting new orders. With the orders they have now the line will be open until 2017, and there are still several countries that are considering placing additional orders. Those pictures always amuse me because I imagine the jets are right around stall speed while the P-51 is firewalled. I know there's a large overlap in the flight envelope for all four of those planes but it still amuses me to think about. holocaust bloopers posted:P-51 still looks good. drat straight it does.
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Aug 2, 2013 20:12
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drgitlin posted:Realistically how likely are BVR shots like that ever going to be? If you're China or whomever and you're going to war against a bunch of F-22s, the first thing you'd do is make sure it looked like the skies were full of 747s or something that would ensure pilots would have to make sure they weren't about to recreate KAL007. The odds are better than you think, provided we're taking the conflict seriously to employ the way we train (ie, lots of systems like AWACS/Rivet Joint, etc). There's no guarantee, and it obviously depends on the political situation and where the fight is. AlexanderCA posted:So if the Super Hornet is the only half way decently managed fighter program in recent American history, does that mean Boeing is the least poo poo aerospace defence contractor, or was it a matter of luck? Pure luck. Read up on the USAF's attempts to get a replacement aerial tanker since the 1990s. Edit: Despite living on military bases my entire life and going to the airshow almost every year, I've never seen the Blue Angels. Their jets are ugly as sin, though. And all the pictures posted in here are things the Thunderbirds do as well, so if you're gonna make the claim, back it up. 
Godholio fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Aug 2, 2013 |
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Aug 2, 2013 20:14
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Godholio posted:Edit: Despite living on military bases my entire life and going to the airshow almost every year, I've never seen the Blue Angels. Their jets are ugly as sin, though. And all the pictures posted in here are things the Thunderbirds do as well, so if you're gonna make the claim, back it up. I've seen both teams numerous times over the course of 20 years, since I was a child, and the Blue Angels were consistently lower, faster and tighter. When the Angels do formations, there's almost no movement; it's as if they're attached by rigging. They also, in the shows that I've seen, do more passing maneuvers. 
Wasabi the J fucked around with this message at 20:37 on Aug 2, 2013 |
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Aug 2, 2013 20:34
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The Marines need a flight team. They should fly some old as poo poo outdated bird, spend more time washing it and touching up paint than flying, get a far too small budget, and brag about how they do pull ups before they get in it everyday.
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Aug 2, 2013 20:40
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Wasabi the J posted:The Angels were doing some of this poo poo in F4's It's more impressive when you realize how much worse the F11F-1 Tiger's were at the same maneuvers and it's pretty much what they developed the modern routines using
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Aug 2, 2013 20:43
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gleep gloop posted:The Marines need a flight team. They should fly some old as poo poo outdated bird, spend more time washing it and touching up paint than flying, get a far too small budget, and brag about how they do pull ups before they get in it everyday. The Blue Angels uses Marine pilots, they're still Dept of the Navy.
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Aug 2, 2013 20:49
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gleep gloop posted:The Marines need a flight team. They should fly some old as poo poo outdated bird, spend more time washing it and touching up paint than flying, get a far too small budget, and brag about how they do pull ups before they get in it everyday.  ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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Aug 2, 2013 21:03
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Fat Albert is pretty badass.
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Aug 2, 2013 21:04
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