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Neo_Crimson posted:These are wonderful and I demand you post more of them. Lousy shot, but it's the best I could find.  Sasha would rather steal ingredients than make soup with nothing but onions.
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Aug 10, 2013 04:24
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Am I the only one who actually sympathise with Bert and Reiner? It seems like most people say they should die and that Mikasa being ice cold to Historia's pleas is awesome. There is much more about the human titans that we don't understand. Despite what they've done, they seem to have justifiable reasons for doing what they do, and I find myself siding with them instead of Mikasa.
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Aug 10, 2013 05:17
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icarocovenant posted:Am I the only one who actually sympathise with Bert and Reiner? It seems like most people say they should die and that Mikasa being ice cold to Historia's pleas is awesome. I find it very, very difficult to sympathize with them. They're basically war criminals. But even worse because we don't know anything about the reason that they did what they did, and they have thus far refused to explain it. They caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people. Next to that, any motivation or personal torment is going to seem pretty insignificant. I do not think there could really be any justification that would sit well, with me anyway. So yeah I've kinda been rooting for Eren to kill the poo poo out of 'em. If the author wanted me to sympathize with them, he should have made their actions less monstrous. Like if they had just cannibalized some babies or serial murdered some teenagers.
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Aug 10, 2013 05:26
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Please remember Bertholdt attacked a second time, AFTER becoming friends with everyone. So there's gotta be a super loving good reason for it, or he's just a big fat steamy jerk
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Aug 10, 2013 06:13
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icarocovenant posted:Am I the only one who actually sympathise with Bert and Reiner? It seems like most people say they should die and that Mikasa being ice cold to Historia's pleas is awesome. I've also had a feeling that their motive will end up being something pretty legitimate. Keep in mind that many more civilians have been killed in real life wars by the side that we look at historically as being morally justified.
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Aug 10, 2013 06:19
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I think the reason Bert and Ernie were willing to betray their friends is because the royal family or wall cult or both, whoever is in charge of everything, is the cause of the titans and has a cure to titan-itis. If they could find that cure and get rid of the titans then sure, it would be worth doing what they're doing.
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Aug 10, 2013 06:22
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I can't think of any good way to justify what Bert did. He let thousands of people die in a horrifying way. Obviously he did it for a reason he thinks is important but it'd be really loving hard to make one that didn't just paint him as a total monster. Even something like the survival of his people somehow depending on the extinction of humans wouldn't work, since the vast majority of humans have no idea what is going on. He's basically only killing civilians and "soldiers" that don't even know what they are even fighting for other than survival. How the gently caress am I supposed to feel sorry for someone that does that? I'm gonna assume the writer won't expect us to sympathize with them at all.
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Aug 10, 2013 06:25
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AradoBalanga posted:Titan!Armin's face....I swear I've seen it somewhere before. This is going to bug me for a while. Reminds me of one of the Doctors.
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Aug 10, 2013 06:25
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Internet Kraken posted:I can't think of any good way to justify what Bert did. He let thousands of people die in a horrifying way. Obviously he did it for a reason he thinks is important but it'd be really loving hard to make one that didn't just paint him as a total monster. Even something like the survival of his people somehow depending on the extinction of humans wouldn't work, since the vast majority of humans have no idea what is going on. He's basically only killing civilians and "soldiers" that don't even know what they are even fighting for other than survival. It's possible that the way things were going humanity was inevitably going to be killed in some cataclysmic event within the walls, and it was a desperate bid to mobilize the people before whatever catastrophe was slated happens and the unprepared humans are slaughtered simultaneously. Edit: or it turns out that the wall is actually a giant transmutation circle
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Aug 10, 2013 06:33
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Internet Kraken posted:I can't think of any good way to justify what Bert did. Lordgenome was right, RIP humanity's protector  TheKingofSprings posted:Edit: or it turns out that the wall is actually a giant transmutation circle And remember those tunnels under the city? Awww yeah.
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Aug 10, 2013 06:37
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Mio Bison posted:Lordgenome was right, RIP humanity's protector 
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Aug 10, 2013 07:44
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They should capture Bert and Reiner alive and torture them for information. Obviously only using methods that don't actually cause any wounds. I still don't get why they don't just put the priest guy on a rack until he talks.
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Aug 10, 2013 07:48
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Liquid Dinosaur posted:They should capture Bert and Reiner alive and torture them for information. Obviously only using methods that don't actually cause any wounds. I still don't get why they don't just put the priest guy on a rack until he talks. Assuming that torture doesn't work any better in the world of Attack on Titan than it does in real life, all that this would accomplish is maybe getting them some wrong information.
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Aug 10, 2013 07:52
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icarocovenant posted:Am I the only one who actually sympathise with Bert and Reiner? It seems like most people say they should die and that Mikasa being ice cold to Historia's pleas is awesome. Same here. I speculated last chapter that the cult/humanity was abusing the Titans somehow (making walls out of them) and they've rebelled.
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Aug 10, 2013 08:04
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ArchangeI posted:RAMPANT SPECULATION: **also speculation** The Titans are... the Heartless? That seems like a pretty big stretch to me. People don't become Titans after being attacked by them (usually. I'm looking at you, Eren). Titans are light, but they don't just poof into thin air-- they still rot, just quickly. There are ways to convert people into Titans, so I don't think them being spontaneously generated fits either. I also doubt the Titans as a whole are intelligent enough to actually do something like that, seeing as how they're more akin to a force of nature than an organized faction. That goes for all theories, really-- I do think the walls are meant to be a prison for humans rather than a defense, but I can't see the dumb-as-a-rock normal Titans doing that. My guess is that it was a faction that has control over Titan power, but not actually the Titans as a whole group. I wouldn't mind a "magical" origin for the Titans, though, as long as it fits within the context of the series. You gotta admit they're pretty scientifically bizarre, so having them be at least somewhat supernatural in nature wouldn't be too rulebreaking. Could also have some interesting implications about what the Titan Formula Eren's dad used on him actually is. For instance, if you consider that maybe the Titans' existence is due to someone trying to synthesize something supernatural without a full understanding of what it is. (The ape titan, perhaps?) I dunno. The details don't all mesh for me yet, so my guessing is just as much guessing as anyone else's. Lessee... as for Bert and Ernie, they're going to have to give one hell of a good reason for doing what they did if they want any sympathy. Being sad about it isn't good enough, neither is "just following orders".  Also those false preview images are the best thing. I kind of... half want Titan Mikasa to be an actual thing just to be able to see exactly how muscly she is in comparison to Titan Eren.
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Aug 10, 2013 08:30
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AradoBalanga posted:Titan!Armin's face....I swear I've seen it somewhere before. This is going to bug me for a while. Maybe it's an Ao Oni reference? Armin's Titan form, I mean
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Aug 10, 2013 08:49
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icarocovenant posted:Am I the only one who actually sympathise with Bert and Reiner? It seems like most people say they should die and that Mikasa being ice cold to Historia's pleas is awesome. We've covered the Bert/Reiner angle pretty thoroughly, so I'll chime in on Mikasa. She's doing the right thing, however skewed her perspective. Regardless of their ~enigmatic motives~, these people are trying to kidnap Eren and Ymir has decided to help them do that and so long as they continue in their attempt to kidnap Eren they are the enemy. Mikasa is strong but not so strong she can hold back safely while fighting three Titans. If the Titans want the others to help them, they should start by surrendering. Until then, the humans can only fight. Historia is unfortunate because she's stuck in the middle of a situation she doesn't understand. She's biased to Ymir in the same way Mikasa is thinking of nothing but Eren right now. Her best move would be to try and get Ymir to give it up because Mikasa will not and cannot back down on this one. Of course, all that's gone up in smoke at the end of the chapter and everyone now has to deal with a Titan rush.
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Aug 10, 2013 12:13
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icarocovenant posted:Am I the only one who actually sympathise with Bert and Reiner? It seems like most people say they should die and that Mikasa being ice cold to Historia's pleas is awesome. I do too, but it might be because the pair are actually dealing with conflicted emotions and duelling objectives and seem to have an ounce of depth and are intriguing and aren't just idiots/psychos/robots/fodder like Eren/Mikasa/Armin/everyone else.
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Aug 10, 2013 12:26
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It's easy to come across as intriguing when your actions don't make sense without further information that has yet to be disclosed.
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Aug 10, 2013 13:13
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Noone has commented on Bert saying "The Opposite..." When Christa goes on a rant asking Ymir if she is being threatened by Bert and Ernie and thats why she is doing this... Could this mean that Ymir is actually in charge of what is going on with those 3?
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Aug 10, 2013 14:43
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He's referring to the last issue when Ymir threatened to transform and stall them unless they picked up Christa
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Aug 10, 2013 14:52
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Last fake previews that I believe were missed: 
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Aug 10, 2013 14:57
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Attack on Ti T-ON. Looks like they got a different artist entirely to draw this fake preview. Also, Idol-Mikasa jump-kicking never fails to bring a smile to my face.
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Aug 10, 2013 15:09
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davidHalestorm posted:Maybe it's an Ao Oni reference? Armin's Titan form, I mean
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Aug 10, 2013 15:13
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That Ao Oni titan seemed more deformed that the usual titan. Perhaps he was transformed from a baby/toddler in Connie's village? Also he wasnt actually killed by monkey titan, you can see him in the panel where Mike gets eaten, and you see him again during the castle Utgard chapter. ... And when I checked the chapters to confirm myself I found another titan doing his impression of the goddess Venus. http://www.batoto.net/read/_/113340/shingeki-no-kyojin_v8_ch35_by_tdx/23 http://www.batoto.net/read/_/135631/shingeki-no-kyojin_v9_ch38_by_tdx/34
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Aug 10, 2013 17:37
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Ugh, I forgot about that guy. Is it just me or have the titans that have been showing up in this past arc been waaay more deformed and ugly than usual? And do you think that's just a stylistic choice on Isayama's part, or does it mean that that Monkey Trouble isn't very good at titanification? Liquid Dinosaur fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 19:44
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That'd explain the immobile one on Connie's house.Liquid Dinosaur posted:No, there's already been an Ao Oni titan. It was the one that Bigfoot Titan killed for disobeying orders.
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Aug 10, 2013 20:12
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i think he was on a field experiment with his powers. he seemed to be very keen on learning as much as he could about everything human on his incursion.
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Aug 10, 2013 20:25
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What this discussion is really making me wonder is if all titans come from turned humans, or if there are different subdivisions of titan. So far, we have the vanilla titans, the abnormal/aberrant titans, titan shifters, people-turned-titans-that-aren't-shifters, and ape titan. There's definitely some overlap between some of those categories, but trouble is I'm not sure which goes where. One theory that came to me was that maybe Titans that can move at night can do so because they still have a human component? The titan shifters seem to be able to move at night, otherwise Bert and Ernie's plan to wait til sunset to keep moving wouldn't work. Likewise, the ones that attacked Castle Utgard came from within the unbreached wall, where we saw Connie's village apparent titan-ification happen. Normal Titans aren't found to have people bits flying out of them when you cut out their nape, and they also don't move at night. Perhaps they're solar-powered because they ran out of person fuel? I do wonder about the stylization of the more recent Titans. Knowing the author it could very well be intentional. (And would be creepy as gently caress if Ao Oni titan turned out to be a converted baby  ) Kinda makes me wonder why we've only ever seen a handful of skinless titans, too-- just the shifters and what looked to be the one in the wall. Skin manipulation is a trait we've only ever seen Shifters use, so could it be surmised the wall titans are people?
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Aug 10, 2013 21:45
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LightningKnight posted:so could it be surmised the wall titans are people? I assumed we took this one for granted. Even if the Wall Cult or whoever can snap their fingers or flip a switch or something that can make a titan go wall against their will, there's no way they'd be able to make the walls such a distinct circle shape unless the wall titans were standing that way on purpose, and the only titans we've seen display intelligence have later turned out to be human titans with two exceptions, Ape and that one that thought someone was Ymir. The second one's likely to have been a human at some point since it thought someone human, not titan, look like Ymir, and Ape could go either way as far as I see it so far.
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Aug 10, 2013 22:23
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New Theory: The titans were created as a weapon by the royalty inside the inner most wall for some kind of world war. The titans basically wiped out humanity except for the people behind the wall so that the royalty could have absolute power. They built the wall and knew that they would be completely safe from the titans, however, some survivors of the war found a way to harness the titan power and are attempting to destroy the people in the inner-most wall. This could explain why the wall is made of titans and why there are people outside of the wall. Could also explain why Burt and Ernie won't just explain themselves to the protagonists. Maybe Eren's father discovered what was really going on and that's why he disappeared.
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Aug 10, 2013 22:31
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Sasquatch Titan is the inventor of titan technology and Eren's father, he created titanforms using Atlantean technology because he wanted to live forever, his real name before the collapse of human civilization was Sir Isaac Newton
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Aug 10, 2013 23:16
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Flavahbeast posted:his real name before the collapse of human civilization was Sir Isaac Newton This is still my favorite anime reveal ever.
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Aug 10, 2013 23:36
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I was re-reading the manga again and I came across this page and... I'm sorry.
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Aug 11, 2013 00:45
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Thoren posted:I don't want this spiritual hocus pocus explanation for the titans. I want something tangible and real. The series is pointing to that so far, with Eren & the Basement and Yamir stating that she gained her powers through Bert and Reiner's comrades. 
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Aug 11, 2013 01:29
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Flavahbeast posted:Sasquatch Titan is the inventor of titan technology and Eren's father, he created titanforms using Atlantean technology because he wanted to live forever, his real name before the collapse of human civilization was Sir Isaac Newton Schwarzwald posted:This is still my favorite anime reveal ever. ...I suggest that anyone who doesn't already know what this is referencing not Google it. You guys are lucky that I'm immune to spoilers.
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Aug 11, 2013 03:01
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dirty nub posted:New Theory: The titans were created as a weapon by the royalty inside the inner most wall for some kind of world war. The titans basically wiped out humanity except for the people behind the wall so that the royalty could have absolute power. They built the wall and knew that they would be completely safe from the titans, however, some survivors of the war found a way to harness the titan power and are attempting to destroy the people in the inner-most wall. This could explain why the wall is made of titans and why there are people outside of the wall. Could also explain why Burt and Ernie won't just explain themselves to the protagonists. Maybe Eren's father discovered what was really going on and that's why he disappeared. They went from being on top of the food chain in a civilization advanced enough to make giant magic flesh-mechas to being in charge of a bunch of uneducated peasants, confined to a tiny scrap of land, deprived of most critical natural resources. The walls wouldn't be keeping them safe, they'd be permanently condemning them to a pre-/early industrial age level of development. If this ends up being true, then AoT is just a cautionary tale of the Republican Party. Also if Bert and Ernie had any real evidence or even hunch to go on, they could have either spread rumors among the populace or just straight up told Erwin that the royalty/cult are Literally Hitler. In fact, they could've done this at any time, especially after joining the Recon Corps. Instead, they breached the walls on two separate occasions and gave the extermination of mankind as their reason, unprompted. What reason could possibly be worse than that? TL;DR: Bert and Ernie, even if they are being played like puppets, had a reason for their genocidal plan that doesn't boil down to For the Greater Good or (human) mental illness. From their perspective, it was a good reason, and it suddenly disappeared somewhere between Trost and now.
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Aug 11, 2013 03:14
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I marathoned the manga so I don't quite remember but did the anime skip over the scene where Eren is in a well or is that in a flashback coming up?
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Aug 11, 2013 03:45
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It's a flashback, I thought they had skipped over 'turning into a titan just to pick up a spoon'( ) too, but nope it'll probably be at the end of the next episode or at the start of the one after that.
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Aug 11, 2013 03:48
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Well the latest anime ep does extreme justice to annie's curbstomping of the recon corps.
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Aug 11, 2013 04:40
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