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I read a couple strips from the link posted above, and Malacks dialog is really awesome in hindsight. Here, the second panel is amazing knowing what Malack is.
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Aug 21, 2013 14:53
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Brannock posted:Hmm... any chance that Tsukiko will get Miko "raised" as some kind of blackguard? Slightly different circumstances.
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Aug 21, 2013 14:58
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You guys are forgetting that this story isn't about Tarquin. It's about Xykon, the gates, and the end of the world. Which means that he and the Empire of Blood are going to get left behind, just as the Azure City survivors and the Thieves guild were.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:00
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MikeJF posted:It would have had no narrative purpose to have existed at all if it wasn't going to come back into play. Although I've forgotten what and when this comment was - does anyone have a link to the strip? I thought it was more along with "dealing" with Tarquin, which could be interpreted in a number of different ways.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:03
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Glory of Arioch posted:This is something I've noticed about Tarquin -- when he's getting his way or things are under his control, he folds his arms behind his back. It's his tell. We never did get much of an idea why Nale hated Malack so much, did we? I always assumed it was because Dad left Nale early to go adventuring/empire-building with Malack - essentially choosing Malack over Nale - and that really stuck in Nale's craw, but that's still just supposition.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:25
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So the Linear Guild all just basically died... except for the Kobold. Wonder if that bureaucrat will somehow kill Belkar.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:34
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J Detan posted:New Comic!
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Aug 21, 2013 15:34
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ASMR Yodeling posted:Slightly different circumstances. Same bad idea. When Miko died, her story was over, showing us that there can be strife between the good guys, even if they are nominally on the same side. Bringing her back as a blackguard would not have been that interesting, because it would remove that conflict from her character. It's the same with Nale. He had been played out after Elan beat him back in Azure City, the reason he worked in this arc is because Tarquin was thrown into the mix, giving the whole thing a very different dynamic. Sure, Nale would keep his own motivations, but it wouldn't really bring anything new to the story, because we already saw how it turns out. His story is over. What could have been interesting was confrontation with his mother, but he'd have to be alive for that.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:35
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Lurdiak posted:I think it's kind of clear by Nale's final words that what he wanted all along was to be free, but that's kind of difficult to do when your dad's a lawful evil control freak. Pretty much. Just a cog in one of Tarquin's schemes indeed. I find it interesting that people still consider Tarquin a "goood" father or a "loving" father.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:40
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FMguru posted:We never did get much of an idea why Nale hated Malack so much, did we? I always assumed it was because Dad left Nale early to go adventuring/empire-building with Malack - essentially choosing Malack over Nale - and that really stuck in Nale's craw, but that's still just supposition. Nale grew up with Tarquin and his gang as surrogate parents. Malack was also implied to be his tutor. I'm pretty sure he had a pretty lovely childhood and Malack was likely the worst element.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:46
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Hypocrisy posted:Pretty much. Just a cog in one of Tarquin's schemes indeed. Lucius Junius Brutus, who executed both of his own sons for treason, has been a role model for millennia. Funny coincidence that Tarquin is named after his enemy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarquinian_conspiracy
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Aug 21, 2013 15:46
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e X posted:Same bad idea. When Miko died, her story was over, showing us that there can be strife between the good guys, even if they are nominally on the same side. Bringing her back as a blackguard would not have been that interesting, because it would remove that conflict from her character. Maybe, but Sabine's story is still going, and Sabine and Nale are inexorably linked. She must react.
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Aug 21, 2013 15:53
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I just realized. Thog will replace belkar when he dies. Maybe. They fill the same party role precisely. Immature, melee oriented, comic relief evil characters. Thog even has a history of working with the order. Tarquin can't use a defeated arena champion. Thog lost his friends. The strip alluded to the fact that Belkar can't be replaced with just another halfling ranger. It makes too much sense. The only reason it might not happen is that 5 protagonists is plenty. ikanreed fucked around with this message at 15:58 on Aug 21, 2013 |
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Aug 21, 2013 15:56
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ikanreed posted:I just realized. Thog will replace belkar when he dies. No. Thog murdered several friends of Roy's girlfriend. Roy would kill him before he'd ever get a chance to speak.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:07
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my dad posted:No. Thog murdered several friends of Roy's girlfriend. Roy would kill him before he'd ever get a chance to speak. Not if they're a man down and Thog's the only one who will/can help.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:11
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MikeJF posted:Maybe, but Sabine's story is still going, and Sabine and Nale are inexorably linked. She must react. I'm feeling a cut to the fiends/V in a strip or two tops.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:30
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my dad posted:No. Thog murdered several friends of Roy's girlfriend. Roy would kill him before he'd ever get a chance to speak. I think the whole "let's recruit vampire Durkon" thing effectively put the question to rest. Roy will recruit just about anyone as long as he thinks he can keep them in line or at least out of trouble. Hell it's basically the only reason he's kept Belkar around for so long. Thog isn't known for his smarts and Roy's already manipulated that trait to his advantage once before, who's to say he can't do it again.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:38
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ikanreed posted:It makes too much sense. The only reason it might not happen is that 5 protagonists is plenty. And the whole Roy hating him thing.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:42
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MikeJF posted:Maybe, but Sabine's story is still going, and Sabine and Nale are inexorably linked. She must react. Yeah this is why I'm 50/50 on if Nale will actually stay dead. Sabine's central character arc right now is her obvious conflicting loyalty between her bosses and Nale. Nale just dying ends it... really anti-climatically.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:46
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Not if they're a man down and Thog's the only one who will/can help. thog hate talky man. thog not help talky man or not-nale. EDIT: Penis Ouija posted:As much as I think OotS as a whole wouldn't suit the medium, I really want to hear "If I win, I get to be a king. If I lose, I get to be a legend." voiced, because goddamn it's good. I'm just not sure whose voice would do it justice. Christopher Lee, Alan Rickman, Samuel L "Mothafuckin'" Jackson...
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Aug 21, 2013 16:51
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sfwarlock posted:Alan Rickman What? No. "Legend" needs to be emphasised, not monotone. Raúl Juliá would have been the best. 
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Aug 21, 2013 16:56
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Dr Pepper posted:Yeah this is why I'm 50/50 on if Nale will actually stay dead. Having Nale under her control would solve that dilemma while allowing her to continue loving him. It suits the characters perfectly well and is interesting enough, I would say. Though I don't think they'd have a whole guild to go along with it. Probably just showing up when the fiends make their move. Her, Nale, V's body and the imp does not a Linear Guild make.
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Aug 21, 2013 16:58
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terminal mehmet posted:Raúl Juliá would have been the best. Yes, that's the voice I've been hearing whenever I read Tarquin's lines. It fits soooo well. 
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Aug 21, 2013 16:59
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Cliff Racer posted:Having Nale under her control would solve that dilemma while allowing her to continue loving him. It suits the characters perfectly well and is interesting enough, I would say. Though I don't think they'd have a whole guild to go along with it. Probably just showing up when the fiends make their move. Her, Nale, V's body and the imp does not a Linear Guild make. Well if she was in charge it would make sense the Linear guild would direcetly be working for the 3 fiends, whom seem to have some pretty good pull in hell. Their plan is so important that even gods are willing to allow massive duck ups (like killing a third of the black dragon). I'm sure they could get a spellcaster.
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Aug 21, 2013 17:28
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Well that happened.  So what exactly happens to neutral evil souls when they die, anyway? If I remember right, lawful evil, you get turned into a lemure and have options for advancement, potentially even before getting turned into a lemure depending on how you play your cards. Chaotic evil, you get turned into a dretch and can advance if you're strong and cunning enough. But I don't remember WotC ever printing any material on what happens with neutral evil souls.
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Aug 21, 2013 17:40
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W.T. Fits posted:Well that happened. If you were particularly evil, you get sent to Carceri to be imprisoned and tortured. If you're clever enough to escape, you can potentially advance into a fiend. If you are only incidentally evil, you get sent to Hades, where you are stuck as a depressed shade until you collapse into plane-stuff.
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Aug 21, 2013 17:47
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Alchenar posted:You guys are forgetting that this story isn't about Tarquin. It's about Xykon, the gates, and the end of the world. Which means that he and the Empire of Blood are going to get left behind, just as the Azure City survivors and the Thieves guild were. But Tarquin doesn't realize that! That's his fatal flaw. He thinks, and therefore acts, as if he's the main villain in Elan's story. But we're really in Roy's story, and therefore Tarquin is just a secondary villain, and may get swept off screen at any moment. Just as Nale's arrogance took him down here, I'm eagerly awaiting the same thing happening to Tarquin. That said, Raise Dead is a thing. Sabine has less than 24 hours on her banishment, then can head back in and get to work on stealing Nale's body for that very purpose. Hell, Tarquin may be counting on that, knowing he has to kill Nale publicly in front of his army and Laurin to maintain his authority but willing to let Nale sneak out the back on the corpse cart to call it quits between them. Or the next strip may see Tarquin applying his genre awareness and doing something to gently caress up Nale's chances at coming back from the dead to thwart that very thing. On the other other hand, it occurs to me that Tarquin is the kind of father who thinks getting murdered and spending a few days in hell is the equivalent of being sent to your room...
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Aug 21, 2013 17:59
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he just said last strip that villain vs villain was too much of a tossup, he is plot aware enough to know that him going after Xykon wouldn't be a good idea.
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Aug 21, 2013 18:08
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jng2058 posted:
You know before this post I was 100% in the "Nale isn't coming back to the land of the living" wagon, but this theory sounds about the way Tarquin would handle a situation.
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Aug 21, 2013 18:12
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reignofevil posted:You know before this post I was 100% in the "Nale isn't coming back to the land of the living" wagon, but this theory sounds about the way Tarquin would handle a situation. Except Nale isn't in on it and would likely be pretty pissed at Tarquin after coming back. Tarquin isn't in the business of letting enemies that he doesn't have control over run free if he can help it. He is Evil after all.
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Aug 21, 2013 18:25
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But he does have a soft spot for his children... and doesn't feel threatened by Nale anyway.
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Aug 21, 2013 18:40
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I see this as the final give up. Think of the situation where a family tries to help a drug addicted son or somesuch. They provide opportunities, look the other way, eventually the betrayal is too much and they need to wash their hands. Tarquin reached that point with Nale, he didnt deal with Nale as a son, but man to man which is what Nale wished. Nale just didnt pay attention to his current situation. Plus he removed an obstacle from Elan's path which is still helping. Narratively Tarquin killed Nale so Elan wouldn't be faced with that down the line; pragmatism again.
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Aug 21, 2013 18:49
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Parts Kit posted:That and given the high body count of this particular arc that it isn't unreasonable to think Thog is dead under the rubble. Thog is alive. They mention him here. Nale requests him to be returned but Dad said nope. Or at least my reading.
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Aug 21, 2013 18:58
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Thog is alive. They mention him here. Nale requests him to be returned but Dad said nope. Or at least my reading. That strip always bothered me slightly due to Sabine's suddenly getting pushy about Nale being leader. It's like, they're completely at Tarquin's mercy (as that very strip shows with him talking down Malack), and she thinks it's a good idea to start giving orders? That's... Well, I guess it's Nale-level obliviousness, so, hm. Also, you can read that that way re: Thog, but I see it more as Nale having hope that Thog's still alive and asking; Tarquin could be refusing to raise him as much as he's saying "sorry, no". Or just not telling Nale that Thog's dead; I don't remember if Nale ever actually saw that happen or not, so Tarquin could just be skirting the issue.
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Aug 21, 2013 19:13
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Roland Jones posted:That strip always bothered me slightly due to Sabine's suddenly getting pushy about Nale being leader. It's like, they're completely at Tarquin's mercy (as that very strip shows with him talking down Malack), and she thinks it's a good idea to start giving orders? That's... Well, I guess it's Nale-level obliviousness, so, hm. To be fair they spent a month or two in hiding trying to make sure dear old dad doesn't find them and given how close they are I'm sure Sabine's heard how Nale feels about his Dad and vise-verse. Sabine's always been super protective of Nale, and it makes sense for her to instantly lash out against Tarquin if she thinks he's trying to do the poo poo Nale still hates him for. It's not obliviousness as much as it is passion.
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Aug 21, 2013 19:32
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I just had a thought... Could Sabine, say, strike up a soul splice deal with the Fiends to get unbanished right now and reave one hell of a bloody vengeance on Tarquin and his men? Or would she be incapable of that due to her physiology or whatever else might prevent it?
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Aug 21, 2013 19:43
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greatn posted:But Elan has a secret plan to It's only a plan to "yes, no, sort of" defeat Tarquin. Because the thing that inspired him was Roy saying "find a sense of family among your people who are good", I think that means he's going to ask Haley to marry him, and get Durkon to perform the ceremony.
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Aug 21, 2013 19:47
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Regalingualius posted:I just had a thought... She's only a succubus and I doubt the fiends would go for a soul splice unless it directly benefited them. And her throwing down on Tarquin is probably pretty irreverent to their plans.
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Aug 21, 2013 19:48
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Naramyth posted:She's only a succubus and I doubt the fiends would go for a soul splice unless it directly benefited them. And her throwing down on Tarquin is probably pretty irreverent to their plans. Of course there's that. I was more wondering if it's even possible for it to happen. Though I kind of wonder what Sabine could offer up as payment, considering she's already working under them.
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Aug 21, 2013 19:53
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Regalingualius posted:Of course there's that. I was more wondering if it's even possible for it to happen. Though I kind of wonder what Sabine could offer up as payment, considering she's already working under them. No. She's hardlocked to her plane of origin till the Holy Ward wears off. Straight up Banished.
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Aug 21, 2013 19:59
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