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Tarq posted:After a few hundred hours of playing X3 I'm immune to bad voice overs. I'll see you on the other side! Aaaggggh!
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Aug 24, 2013 19:11
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| # ? May 15, 2024 10:23 |
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You want split?
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Aug 24, 2013 19:13
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As a huge Freelancer fan back in the day, I always enjoyed that game's tradelane system for speedy travel. I haven't watched a ton of Rebirth preview stuff, but I hope the Rebirth system is as convenient, quick, and fluid as Freelancer's was.
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Aug 24, 2013 22:49
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Hakkesshu posted:The character models look so freaking bad the game would be improved by their absence. Otherwise I think that looks rocking. The facial animations, or lack thereof, are the horrible part.
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Aug 25, 2013 04:47
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Watching the video...man that flight model.... I really hope it's modable but I seriously doubt it. Game had everything going for it and then I see that 
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Aug 25, 2013 16:45
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Why would you doubt it? These are the crazy Germans we're talking about, they do state that they will have full mod support, just that they can't put up any documentation until the game is released. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a ship mod released within the first month.
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Aug 25, 2013 17:00
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Man, I saw all these complaints and was worried, but I think it looks great! Epic enough to be, well, epic, but just quirky enough to be an X game. I'm getting really excited for this except for the part where it bends my computer over its knee.
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Aug 25, 2013 17:04
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The flight model in the X games has always been kinda wonky and not very realistic.Samolety posted:Man, I saw all these complaints and was worried, but I think it looks great! Epic enough to be, well, epic, but just quirky enough to be an X game. I'm getting really excited for this except for the part where it bends my computer over its knee. My only concern is a very buggy release. I bought X3 Reunion the day it came out and it was a total mess that crashed a lot. I was so excited for that game though and I loved it anyways. Was willing to be patient for the patches that eventually fixed the game, but it was frustrating.
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Aug 25, 2013 17:05
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What the hell happened to the Khaak between TC and AP?
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Aug 25, 2013 18:06
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Slickdrac posted:What the hell happened to the Khaak between TC and AP? There was a plot in TC where the Argon made a taskforce to fight them, their staging grounds were destroyed and they have since disappeared.
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Aug 25, 2013 18:13
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Which is good because Khaak beam weapons were the most terrible idea ever and made combat a horrible unfun losing proposition with them.
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Aug 25, 2013 18:17
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I don't even understand what peoples expectations for flight model are in a space shooter. Certainly realism is not desirable...
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Aug 25, 2013 22:46
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DancingMachine posted:I don't even understand what peoples expectations for flight model are in a space shooter. Certainly realism is not desirable... I can't think of any space shooters that get even the basics of space flight correct. It would be really unfun if they did to be honest. Like just one example out of many; if you made coming to a stop in space be realistic, you know how much of a nightmare it would be? It's super simple in the X games, and uses some sort of magic to make it happen, you can't do that in reality.
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Aug 25, 2013 22:52
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DancingMachine posted:I don't even understand what peoples expectations for flight model are in a space shooter. Certainly realism is not desirable...
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Aug 25, 2013 22:53
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Flight model looks fine. Are people having problems with the ship auto-aligning to the ecliptic plane after you let go of the controls or something? Because that's how Freelancer did it and anything that hews closer to how silky smooth ship control was in that game is aces in my book. Plus, all you have to do is look at how close that Katana was able to maneuver next to the capital ship in the Gamescom demo without crashing to see how much flight AI has improved; that ship would've been paste in X3.
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Aug 25, 2013 23:01
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Independence war was pretty good in that sense. I think most people would mean a model that recognises there is no atmosphere and that once you start moving you don't stop unless a reverse force is applied, kind of like mini-KSP with lasers. It would be crazy awesome if there was gravity from planets, stations or capitals but that's probably not as big a game changer in terms of the flight experience. edit: wrong quote
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Aug 25, 2013 23:51
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I said come in! posted:I can't think of any space shooters that get even the basics of space flight correct. It would be really unfun if they did to be honest. Like just one example out of many; if you made coming to a stop in space be realistic, you know how much of a nightmare it would be? It's super simple in the X games, and uses some sort of magic to make it happen, you can't do that in reality. Since there's very little gravity, there's also very little g-force. There's also no need for any aerodynamics since there's no aero to be dynamic in. Ships in space are able to move extremely quickly and could accelerate with little effort because of that. Since militaries have a silly habit of going with function over form when it comes to killing dudes, all the fancy designs and racial (or country) tweaks aren't going to be very prominent. Real battles in space will likely involve a mass of blobs firing high energy projectiles instead of making a bunch of pew pew noises while firing their lasers. The energy required to make a rock hurt like hell is just way more efficient. Modern shuttle handling and physics isn't necessarily a good benchmark because they're space taxis that have to break free of gravity, relatively at least. Asking for realism in a space game is kind of silly because, just like any other realistic simulator, it's going to have niche appeal instead of wide appeal. I'm not trying to argue with you since I agree completely. I just like imagining what the future of space will be like compared to what we think would be funner. It's like how medieval games generally need to throw in a bunch of dragons and elves and people are dying young because of something a lot worse than a fever. That said, a realistic space shooter would be awesome. Blast of Confetti fucked around with this message at 00:14 on Aug 26, 2013 |
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Aug 26, 2013 00:10
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I'm fine with fighters/drones feeling a bit arcadey (or even just feeling like an aerofighter instead of being in space), because otherwise they're kind of pigs to fly. It would be nice, though, if bigger ships had a bit of weight to them. In the demo video the entire ship seems to turn immediately no matter where you're waggling it, which doesn't feel right given the size of the ship you're flying. Freelancer did this better where you'd move the mouse where you wanted to be pointing and the ship would turn at its own pace to align with that.
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Aug 26, 2013 00:28
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Realistic physics would be awful. When I press Z to take the throttle to zero, I want my ship to do what a boat would do and slowly come to a stop. I don't want to have to apply the perfect amount of reverse thrust juuuuust right to do the same thing. Same goes for turning. I want my ship to bank like it's being turned by ailerons on the wings of a plane, so when I let go of the stick, it stops turning. vvv Having little thrusters on the ship doing that as just an animation thing would be fine with me too, so long as I didn't have to actively control them. GreatGreen fucked around with this message at 03:06 on Aug 26, 2013 |
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Aug 26, 2013 01:10
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GreatGreen posted:Realistic physics would be awful. When I press Z to take the throttle to zero, I want my ship to do what a boat would do and slowly come to a stop. I don't want to have to apply the perfect amount of reverse thrust juuuuust right to do the same thing. Same goes for turning. I want my ship to bank like it's being turned by ailerons on the wings of a plane, so when I let go of the stick, it stops turning. A non bad way to do this is explain the AI is doing it and have animations for the thrust. I don't think any human will ever be expected to ease the thrusters if humanity ever gets to the point of people traveling around space in personal ships. Basically it would control the same but an animation would demonstrate what is actually happening.
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Aug 26, 2013 02:01
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Doesn't Evochron Mercenary have Newtonian physics which you can turn off, having your ships fly more like the X ships do, only taking thrusters to kill extra motion as you turn?
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Aug 26, 2013 04:18
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GreatGreen posted:vvv Having little thrusters on the ship doing that as just an animation thing would be fine with me too, so long as I didn't have to actively control them. The seemingly instantaneous response of the ship is understandable given the flight environment we'll be thrust into, but did strike me as a little weird as well.
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Aug 26, 2013 05:08
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I guess AP is just as stable as TC and Reunion ever were with a few mods added on. At least I only invested a week this time before it become unplayable from crashing every time I tried to have a battle with something bigger than an M6. I can't even find the crash log file.
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Aug 26, 2013 05:17
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GreatGreen posted:
Many of the fighters in X3 have exactly that.
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Aug 26, 2013 05:25
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DancingMachine posted:I don't even understand what peoples expectations for flight model are in a space shooter. Certainly realism is not desirable... I like the X3 one a whole lot and I am sad to see that they are now defining up and down.
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Aug 26, 2013 05:42
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Didn't X3 already have up and down defined? I swear there's an option to automatically orient your ship to be "upright" when you're idling, but it's turned off by default.
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Aug 26, 2013 05:51
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Slickdrac posted:I guess AP is just as stable as TC and Reunion ever were with a few mods added on. At least I only invested a week this time before it become unplayable from crashing every time I tried to have a battle with something bigger than an M6. It's hard know whats causing crashes once you start adding multiple mods. Anything listed in the OP should play nice together, but there are some mods that conflict and some that are just plain broken.
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Aug 26, 2013 06:33
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Unimpressed posted:Independence war was pretty good in that sense. Real newtonian physics are just totally incompatible with the space dogfighting game that 99% of people want. I can think of a great idea for a space sim that's got realistic newtonian physics, but it'd play a lot more like submarines than airplanes. The Cheshire Cat posted:Didn't X3 already have up and down defined? I swear there's an option to automatically orient your ship to be "upright" when you're idling, but it's turned off by default. I'd predict that if you are playing Rebirth with a 3-axis joystick with a hat switch, it will play exactly like previous X games. Pitch, yaw, roll on the stick, and either use the hat for directional strafe or WASD keys. My real question is if the AI can use strafe now, or at least do better at predicting shots when the player is strafing.
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Aug 26, 2013 06:37
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I don't really have anything that would effect IS combat besides MARS. All I have on there is Bounce, Improved Races, MARS, Cheats, Complex Cleaner, Free Jump, and a complex hub mod.
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Aug 26, 2013 06:46
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3 posted:Are people having problems with the ship auto-aligning to the ecliptic plane after you let go of the controls or something? It does take away some of the charm of a space game, in my opinion. Hopefully there will be some way to disable it.
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Aug 26, 2013 07:06
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Slickdrac posted:I don't really have anything that would effect IS combat besides MARS. Just to make sure, you're using this version of improved races, right? There are a bunch of versions and the older ones might be problematic. Other than that I doubt its any of those mods or scripts giving you problems. I have all them except for free jump installed and don't get crashes very often. You might have better luck posting about this on the Egosoft forums, they are pretty helpful.
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Aug 26, 2013 08:19
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Yeah, it's that version. I don't even have that actually enabled yet since I'm still going through plot. I think it's something weird going on with ships blowing up to large AOE missile explosions. There's no chugging, all is smooth and then it just freezes all at once. I'm going to try enabling/disabling a few things. I have a save that's crashing me within a minute or two fairly consistantly. I thought there was some log file dump that could be checked out though? That'd make things easier.
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Aug 26, 2013 08:34
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GreatGreen posted:Realistic physics would be awful. When I press Z to take the throttle to zero, I want my ship to do what a boat would do and slowly come to a stop. I don't want to have to apply the perfect amount of reverse thrust juuuuust right to do the same thing. Same goes for turning. I want my ship to bank like it's being turned by ailerons on the wings of a plane, so when I let go of the stick, it stops turning. 
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Aug 26, 2013 08:44
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X2 had 0 inertia, and wasn't a fun dogfighting model for it.
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Aug 26, 2013 09:41
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It was amazing for strafing runs of large ships though. The worst realistic space physics experience I had was with Frontier, where I bought a supermassive freighter, tiny engines and tried to slowboat it between trade hubs, except my lovely ship could never plot a decent intercept path nor had enough power to catch up with an orbiting planet. 
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Aug 26, 2013 09:50
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There was a space game that used a standard Newtonian physics model: Terminus. Was a pretty fun game but there were certainly lots of crutches/systems in place to help you control poo poo. The cool part was you can turn all that off.
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Aug 26, 2013 10:17
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Having computer compensation to explain why your ship handles like an airplane is also a good explanation for having a general speed limit - the computer has a "soft" speed limit beyond which it can't keep control of the ship adequately. Of course if you turn it off you can accelerate well past that - but good luck changing course without slowing down first!
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Aug 26, 2013 10:46
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orphean posted:There was a space game that used a standard Newtonian physics model: Terminus. Elite. You spent a week boosting at 20g's to intercept a ship and then combat consisted of zooming passes at each other while you painted lasers on each other's hulls. There are a variety of flight models you can go for in a space sim and all of them are valid depending on the kind of atmosphere you are going for. None of them can be described as 'realistic'.
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Aug 26, 2013 11:20
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Aside from the auto orientation, I don't see that much of a difference from the other space games like Tie Fighter and Freelancer. Didn't the AI also auto orientate in the older X3 games anyway?
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Aug 26, 2013 11:49
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LP97S posted:Aside from the auto orientation, I don't see that much of a difference from the other space games like Tie Fighter and Freelancer. Didn't the AI also auto orientate in the older X3 games anyway? Yea, for the capital ships. After awhile fighters would be aligned all sorts of ways.
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Aug 26, 2013 15:46
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